Cleaning Warframe's Attic; "going Back And Polishing Older Weapons" Discussion Thread

[Aktriaz]

As much as we enjoy new content, I personally think some older weapons could use some love that has been diverted to pushing out new content. When issues fall under the Dev's radar, it's up to us, the community, to voice our opinions about them, and make suggestions of what would improve the problem.

 

What I'm asking for, is for you to pick a weapon that you think could use a change or buff, with a why and how, whether it be for lore or viability problems, or work and resources required to obtain it! Make your case!

 

This is NOT a nerf thread, and keeping feedback as positive as possible is my aim for this discussion, so rather than putting down someone else's idea, build off of it, or ignore it.

 

EXAMPLES:

Lanka should deal Radiation or High Puncture damage instead of Electrical because all Corpus ranged weapons are effective against either Infested or Grineer, dealing either mostly Slash, Puncture, or Radiation.

 

or

 

Spectra is arguably one of the worst secondaries in the game, and given the resources required to build this weapon, it is dreadfully under powered. Doubling it's damage and giving it 5m punch through would make this weapon usable IMHO.

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Now you try! Make suggestions and discuss, and please, keep it positive!

Edited April 21, 2014 by Actriaz

[Angius]

Agreed. We are getting stronger and stronger weapons, sometimes even original, while all of the Deras and Torids are laying in the back, gathering dust...

 

Though, last time DE decided to polish older weapons, Lato got nerfed, so...

[Hououza]

Given in Melee 2.0 all the old Melee weapons got looked at, it doesn't seem unreasonable to want all the guns to get the same treatment.

I think the big issue is status chance for a lot of old weapons, I admit I can't name them off hand but <5% seems poor given the importance of these effects in Melee 2.0

[Pie_mastyr]

I would like to skindo gram and fragor get touched up a bit. They are slow and don't build up combo's very quick, so you would think they would have high damage to balance it out like jat kittag but no :(.

 

Kunai, hikou and to an extent despair have kind of fell from the face of the planet since damage 2.0, and i would like to see a status buff or crit buff on them to take advantage of builds varying from "ELEMENTAL BULLET/KNIVE HOSE LOLOLOLOLOL"

 

Shotguns in general seem to lack the same crunch the used to (you know that feeling when you shoot a brakk or bronco point blank to the back of a corpus box-head). It may be an audio thing, It may be a statistical thing but i can't really enjoy the ordinary shotguns since drakgoon and phage stole the show, and brakk and detron blasted their way into our hearts.

 

Miter needs to have rifle ammo pool, higher firerate and a little less damage.

 

I would like to see ogris have a different firing mechanism, possibly allow non-full charge shots for a higher ROF, but with less explosion radius? Then it would be a bit more like bombards but without homing (maybe full charge fires a slow homing rocket :P?)

 

other than that just visual changes like embolist should have a plasma-esque liquid spewing out of the front (nozzle?), in addition to the gas. Although a range buff would be appreciated greatly :)

[Novocrane]

The one that bothers me is Hek (puncture shotgun) vs Boar, Sobek, & Strun. (impact shotguns) It's the ugliest gun, and I feel obligated to keep it for damage type, while I can ditch the other 3 for having Boar Prime & Strun Wraith. (almost true; I'm keeping Sobek because of the Day Of The Dead skin)

[Jiminez_Burial]

I think I have a few that could do with a buff.

Hind:  

The five round burst is a bit clunky.  Maybe decrease the time that each bullet in a burst takes to be fire after the previous.  Maybe also give it a innate punch-through of 0.2-3 Meters punch through.  I am a fan of burst weapons, but when 2 bullets, let alone 4 are wasted by hitting a corpse, ammo is depleted really fast.  The time the burst takes will also mean the recoil is a bit less noticeable, during the burst, but felt a lot when firing multiple bursts. 

 

Strun:

Given that this is a cheap credit weapon, given it a slight decrease in slash damage, but an increase in puncture.  The Braton MK-1 has mainly slash, the Braton has balance on the three.  Giving the Strun an increased focus on puncture means that a weapon attained early in-game is the option of 'specialized' game play.

 

Vulkar:

The Vulkar could use a slightly larger magazine size allowing a smarter approach to early game-play.  The low recoil and fire rate allow accurate shots, but the increased mag balances the lower damage it has.  The player would have to consider when to move with his cell, or hang back a bit while monitoring their reloads more.

 

Attica:

I know this is a recent weapon, but it feels a bit lack-luster in terms of what I though a crossbow weapon would be.  I can see this going a few directions.  The fire-rate could be increased slightly, with the reload and clip size increased, and the reload could be slightly lengthened.  The other option could be to decrease the clip size, give it a bit more damage, give it a charge function that increases the damage by 40%, but slows the time it takes to fire a follow up shot.

 

Torid:

We all know this weapon needs some love.  I propose that the way to improve it might include making the gas cloud affected by fire-storm, increasing the magazine size, decreasing the level of drop that the projectile has, increasing the time the gas cloud is present after impact, but making it so the player can take damage from the cloud, but not be proc'ed. This would give the Torid a usability increase while giving it it's own niche.  Ogris would be the 'blow everything to hell and back' weapon, while the Torid is a gas DoT version of the Castanas/Penta, but not having the leisure of deciding when to 'activate' the damage.

 

Kraken:

Simply, reduce the recoil.  Unless you have a mouse pad that reaches the very depths of hell, the second shot is going to reach the heavens.  Burst is meant to reward accuracy, so why is it that it's almost impossible to land both bullets?  The Lex has accuracy, but slower fire-rate along with a zoom.  The Vasto/Magnus have lower damage, better fire-rate, good accuracy and a nice reload.  Why then is the Kraken so useless.  Keep the recoil, but apply it after the burst is finished.  No damage change, no recoil change, no bullet spread change, but actually allowing the Kraken to have more than a 50% accuracy will REALLY help it.

 

Sicarus:

Decrease the reload time - that is all.

 

Jat Kittag:

It's a hammer with a jet engine, jet engines get thrust so planes can fly and cars driven on salt-flats can rip the drivers face off, so why does it feel like I am that science nerd, acne swamped momma's boy trying to kick-start a motor-cycle.  I move the kick the correct distance, I am putting my weight behind it, but why does it never actually work?  Speed.  The Jat Kittag has good damage, it just never actually gets there. (This applies to Scindo and Galatine (to a lesser extent) melees)  Maybe modifying the channel mechanic so a mod can convert the damage increase into an attack speed increase.  In a game where I gold plated rhino with fins on the side of his helmet can copter into a group of enemies and stomp the to death, a slow melee attack speed is the last thing someone wants.

 

Glaive(prime) and Kestrel:

The Glaive ans Kestrel should allow you to throw them while you have the melee equipped.  I propose that the stances stay the same, but when no stance is equipped, you are able to charge throw them while equipped.  Also, with the Glaive prime, giving it a small increase in range on its normal swings would be nice.

 

And that is all I will recommend at this time.  I am still tired, and I am sick of 15+ comments ninja-ering me when I started typing when there were no comments. XD

Hope everyone else is given a buff to their mentioned weapons, and thank you OP for raising this issue, it really does need to be looked at.

[(PSN)ElZilcho]

I don't necessarily want things buffed. I think power creep for profit is one of the problems DE has right now. Things keep getting better, but not really any more interesting. It's good incentive to get the next thing, but going from machine gun to machine gun+1 isn't really exciting.

 

Lanka: Add in puncture damage, keep just electric. Add linear scaling for crit chance on charged shots so that a fully charged shot plus a fully ranked point strike will always crit. You can make it radiation with the addition of a fire damage mod already, but you can also switch it over to corrosive or magnetic and I don't want to lose that. Now it's a railgun type corpus bow and it rewards accuracy and the ability to lead shots with high damage and cheaper elemental combos.

 

Miter: The first attempt at a grineer bow (before the drakgoon) was cool but not very practical. Needs a damage buff and higher punch through if it's going to keep using sniper ammo and to run on rifle ammo if it won't get those things so it can be spammed eviscerator-style more practically. The charge time and travel time are kind of offset by how cool it is and letting saw blades bounce around, but its crowd ability is awful. It already gains punch through on charged shots, but I want it to hit everything in a line. This should stay a raw damage weapon and not a crit weapon like the Lanka. The whole reason to get it is to saw everything like eviscerators do and you just can't do that.

 

Shotguns: Shotgun mods need to be improved. All of them. +90% damage here and +60% damage there is fine, sure, but weapons that are meant to be used close in and have damage falloff need to kill at close range. There isn't much I'd change about the guns themselves, but the mods could use some improvement, since they don't make it worth the risk of getting up on high level enemies to use them. It will make them stronger in their roles without letting them horn in on the domain of rifles and pistols.

 

Amphis: Innate electricity on everything. Come on. You're hitting them with the crazy electrified parts and it's not doing anything.

 

Clantech weapons should all come with at least 1 V polarity, if not that plus another polarity. That they all cost a forma and some come with no polarities at all is kind of BS.

Edited April 21, 2014 by (PS4)ElZilcho

[fatpig84]

Off my head right now.

=================

 

1) Ignis

It went from 125 to 150 and now 100 damage a second is this even acceptable ?

If 150 damage a second is too high (never mind the phage, which deals 330 dmg per bullet), then drop it down to 135 damage.

Or 13.5 damage per bullet.

 

 

2) Flux

Again another undeserved damage nerf.

Please return it to 200 dmg / second aka 20 dmg per hit.

Then give it innate 1m+ Punch through 

It has no crit unlike Synapse or the status prowess of the page Phage, so at least we give it Punch through to compensate.

 

 

3) Spectra

Is this a joke ? Again needs a buff like the Flux.

 

 

4) Lato

It's damage used to be 24.

Now it's 12.

 

You can figure that out.

More to come :)

[Noble_Cactus]

Basic shotgun mechanics need to be reworked. There's no reason to justify damage falloff when you have the Marelok, Boltor Prime, and friends running around doing the job of a shotgun far better than an actual shotgun can and more. Their status chance is also abysmally low, since it's roughly divided by the number of pellets. Tell me about the last time one of your elements procced on your Drakgoon; it's about once or twice a mission, or once or twice every 15 waves. Reverting the changes on both of these attributes would help shotguns regain some of their former respect while not placing them on the level of Boltor Prime or Penta (how could they?)

 

-

 

Meanwhile, we must be getting the defective Miters, because they are nowhere near as cool or as effective as the Eviscerator Miters. With some tweaks, the Miter could become a potent high damage crowd control weapon in close quarters, kind of like the bastard offspring of a bow that it is but actually worth using. A few changes:

 

- Change sniper ammo to rifle ammo. No idea why this hasn't been done yet.

- All sawblades have a slightly wider hitbox than they currently do. Not Glaive wide, but better than seeing the edge of the saw barely graze a Grineer's shoulder and not doing anything.

- Uncharged shots have heavy punch-through on enemies and Lancer shields, and can be fired very fast. Modded properly, they could be fired faster than an Eviscerator's! Maybe even make the Eviscerator fire speed the base value. Their strength and punch-through would be equivalent to that of the current charged shot.

- Charged shots, instead, would fire off a quick volley of 5 sawblades in a row, all of which have full punchthrough and fly faster than their uncharged counterparts. If you ever need to slice an entire line of enemies and have all of the projectiles swarm a room after, charge it up and let it fly.

- Charge time is quicker. Perhaps a little slower than the Drak.

 

-

 

Does the Attica count? It's been out for a couple weeks and it's already apparent that it's a very weak weapon.

 

...

 

Ah what the heck, I'll propose a rework anyway.

 

Currently, the Attica doesn't seem to have a role. It possesses the single-shot pattern and the low magazine capacity of a semi-auto rifle, the full-auto capabilities of an assault rifle, and the projectiles of a bow. And yet it uses all of these attributes poorly. The Attica is lodged into several different roles that don't form a coherent whole. It creates no context for itself within the larger framework of the Warframe arsenal.

 

At the same time, a few simple tweaks could help it become the balanced all-rounder crossbow that it was probably meant to be:

 

- Faster reload. For its damage output and mag cap, 2.8 seconds is painful. I could've sworn it was faster in the devstream, though I'll have to check later. Bump it down to around 2.0 seconds, if the following changes are taken into account.

- Higher damage. 50% crit maxed is fine if we refine its role as a repeater crossbow. But it really does need higher base damage if it wants to at least be a solid competitor.

- Higher mag cap. 8 is just really, really low for the reload speed and damage, as mentioned earlier. Maybe up to 20? Maybe not that much, that'd be absurd considering the size of the bolt box. But definitely more than 8 (10 maxed).

- Higher fire rate. Doesn't need to be dakka dakka dakka like the Boltor series, but as per its description of firing off a "quick volley" of bolts, we need at least a stream of bolts flying at the enemy.

- Improve bolt flight speed, enlarge bolt hitboxes, reduce bolt flight arc. Maybe similar to that of the Tysis. they're just so slow right now, and even if it became a oneshot machine, it'd still feel awkward to use if it kept the current bolt properties.

- For the love of Lotus the current firing sound is pathetic. A nice, heavy THUNK would be much more suitable for a crossbow, and would help make it feel more fun to use.

- Remove muzzle flash. Because why would a crossbow have muzzle flash?

- And, because some people really want it, let Thunderbolt be equippable on the Attica.

Edited April 21, 2014 by Noble_Cactus