Devstream 31 Does Not Bode Well, In My Opinion.

[SableSonata]

Development on Warframe has ceased. DE now works exclusively on Kubrow Tamagotchi.

 

No progress on parkour, stealth, balance, melee, mods, mod dilution, etc. 

 

 

The T4 dilution was explained as being the hardest-to-obtain parts from across the void so we'd have more places to obtain them (despite the tables on release being just T3 tables copied and pasted with one part switched out).

 

 

The idea to solve 'required mods' is to add new low-teir versions of said mods to give new players, rather than either just giving new players the required mods, or balancing them so they're no longer 'required'. More dilution.

 

 

Half the stream was dedicated to the Kubrow and how Kubrows are more complex and have more effort put into them than anything else in Warframe to date. Unless we get to play as the Kubrows, I don't get why they're getting more effort than the rest of the game.

 

 

Minor animation updates, possible new stance/weapon type (more mod dilution).

New Warframe if female - has a booby-trap power.

A bunch of conceptual ideas that are months, if not years away, and are almost certainly not going to live up to the hype.

Skybox for next tileset.

Alt-helm concept art.

Failings of Melee 2.0 UI - no word on making the melee system actually fit Warframe's pace; more combos that most people will never use because they're slow and immobile in a fast-paced, mobile game.

Enemy spawn rooms might get to the dojo but it's a lot of work - no consideration of making the training room standalone so that new players/non-clan players have access as well.

 

 

 

 

Really disappointing. It seems like absolutely no effort is being put into improving the core gameplay. Same janky movement system, no semblance of balance, no stealth, more melee stances instead of improving the melee system to make it fit Warframe's pace, no gameplay UI improvements. No improvements to trade/recruitment, lobby system, etc. No Codex improvement. 

 

More new content (and don't get me wrong, much of said new content looks interesting, at least), but no work is being put in to improve the core gameplay mechanics. 

 

Why is apparently no effort going into making the gameplay itself better? Surely you'll be able to keep more players the more they enjoy actually playing the game, rather than relying on brand-new content every week to draw players back (especially when said content is increasingly more difficult to obtain due to unaddressed void and mod dilution).

 

 

[PixalatedVortex]

Last time I checked working on a major thing in a game doesn't mean the development has ceased -_- 

[Senketsu_]

A huge chunk was dedicated to explaining the Newplayer experience. maybe there arent as many Core gameplay element that need changing. This is just ONE major update. the Kubrows are a huge core gameplay changer. 

[Casardis]

Really disappointing. It seems like absolutely no effort is being put into improving the core gameplay.

 

I liked parts of the stream, but I'm also concerned on some other points. I think it's not fair to say it outright that no effort is put into what you're saying because they do show the will to do it, and promised a few things that does indeed address that. Will it address everything at once? Of course not, but still something.

 

I feel they do try, but often, I also feel they put their focus in the wrong places when trying to do it, even though the community, or at least some of them, give extensive and supported feedback on the topic.

 

For example, "bandaid mods."

 

Scott commented on the concern of mods acting as bandaids, such as Handspring, and he responded saying that those mechanics are there for the sake of balance. Unfortunately, I completely disagree with that and I don't see how that's any kind of balance, since it mostly just restricts responsiveness in gameplay as well as avoiding the problems in balance in the first place.

 

If things like handspring made it into core mechanics, DE themselves would be able to balance gameplay and enemies out in a way that conforms to the new responsive system, potentially making more skill-based gameplay and actions.

 

I must say I'm very disappointed by this reasoning that "these mods are there for a reason." The only reason they are there is because there's a lack of responsiveness in what could have been gameplay based on the player control, not mod and RNG or percentage control. Though it's true devs shouldn't just listen to any feedback, but I think there's also a reason many people give "rage PMs" to Scott about this issue, as well as extensive, constructive feedback on them in the forums.

Edited June 20, 2014 by Casardis

[SignumCruxis]

Hey, hey guys?

Can we just give all these whiners everything in the game so the rest of us don't have to read topics like this?

 

Thanks in advance.

[Trouvo]

Mods, melee and balance were all talked about in the stream as well, for example, mod synergy with your frame

[WERElektro]

Now... personally I'm not that much hyped for Kubrows either -

 

But the majority of the Warframe community sure is!

And that's why they talk about Kubrows half of the time and put much effort into their development- because most players have high expectations on the Kubrows.  makes sense, no?

 

Seriously.... If I had to guess what the community wants the most atm, I'd say it's Kubrow dogs.

[Ventura_Highway]

Regarding the development of Kubrows, and how it seems they're being developed,

that's just how Warframe has been.

 

DE seems to have a preference for focusing down a few aspect of the game with every update.

This update we've had Dark Sectors and Melee

U12 was quite a bit of QOL, and the HUD update.

U11, damage 2.0

etc. etc. Don't worry too much about it.

[SmokinDevil]

People don't want to give up a bit of power just to add some survivability.

[Archistopheles]

They're putting the Kubrow before the cart? Sort to speak? Ha.

 

Sorry, one look at their little fuzzy faces, and I almost forget about the RNG and grind/time walls we are going to have to deal with to get the one we actually want.

[Beas7ie]

Last time I checked working on a major thing in a game doesn't mean the development has ceased -_-

True but if the most complex and advanced thing in the game is going to be the Damn space dogs then that's kind of a problem. The dogs are nice but I want better melee, I want sword and board, I want to be able to climb lephantis and stab him in the faces with my sword and board and I want Dragon. Along with the other fixes.

[Trouvo]

Now... personally I'm not that much hyped for Kubrows either -

 

But the majority of the Warframe community sure is!

And that's why they talk about Kubrows half of the time and put much effort into their development- because most players have high expectations on the Kubrows.  makes sense, no?

 

Seriously.... If I had to guess what the community wants the most atm, I'd say it's Kubrow dogs.

I am one of them excited for it XP , but yes marketing is just as important for streams as well, they obviously will never talk about every little thing they are doing at any given time, that would be a 24 hours stream at least lol

[OnnaJReverT]

Last time I checked working on a major thing in a game doesn't mean the development has ceased -_- 

yeah, that was an overstatement by OP, but he is kinda right that we see few efforts put where problems lie right now

[Kaotyke]

I've been reading a whole lot of people lately saying that keep saying DE needs to "stop doing X and work on Y".

 

The problem is, this seems to stem from thinking of DE as a singular entity, like one lonely person, coding everything all by themselves.

 

It's not.

 

There are multiple teams of multiple people working on every facet of the game.

 

Lucy is a brilliant animator. She is not really able to code drop table algorithms.

 

Skree is a brilliant level designer. He is not really able to perform weapon debugging procedures.

 

There's an entire sound team that just makes audio effects for the game. None of them have expressed any computer literacy at all beyond mad dj sound remixing talent.

 

Megan isn't really able to design new multi-layered AI sub-routines.

 

Rebecca isn't really able to smooth out physics engine instabilities.

 

This is just a fistful of people out of the 100+ employees at DE, all of them who are highly unqualified to work on a myriad of projects.

 

Are they downright fantastic at their actual jobs? Yes!

 

Will having them "stop doing" whatever it is they were hired to do, and instead work on w/e the heck YOU think is much more valuable than what they do actually get any progress out of them? Not really.

 

Could they be fired, and replaced with new employees who DO exactly what you want? Well, yes, but that is the swiftest way to shatter company morale, so you'll still see far less progress.

 

So, ultimately, Is there any way, shape, or form, that "stop X to do Y instead" even remotely makes the teeniest tiniest bit of quasi-logic? Not in a trillion years.

 

Yet, people keep saying it. Please don't.

 

It makes you look dumb. It's at least a tad demoralizing to the people at DE that read the forums only to hear that, in your eyes, their job is totally worthless.

 

There's absolutely no positive outcome, at all, whatsoever, from you saying this, except for whatever tiny fractional ego boost you got out of typing it. Honestly, you don't deserve that ego boost, so that's really a negative outcome.

 

Funny enough, as you are an individual, rather than a massive collective of teams of people, you, personally, DO have the option of "stop X and do Y instead". So, stop being a jerk, and be helpful instead.

 

Thanks.

 

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/235599-friendly-reminder/?hl=%2Bfriendly+%2Breminder

[VentiGlondi]

Last time I checked working on a major thing in a game doesn't mean the development has ceased -_- 

They focused on making something completely new despite the fact there are a ton of already existing things that need to be fixed.

 

This will probably result in even more problems.

[OnnaJReverT]

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/235599-friendly-reminder/?hl=%2Bfriendly+%2Breminder

while i agree with (nearly) all of that, the problem is that we see no progress being made on problems players face every match, yet are being bombarded by information about cute little puppies

[Katakuna]

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/235599-friendly-reminder/?hl=%2Bfriendly+%2Breminder

 

Threads like that should be stickied, for real.

[Ivell]

Remember this is still technically a beta and not a final version of the game. It is a work in progress and they are working. The best we can do is to support them and give them constructive feedback to work from.

[CrazyCatLad]

Well I respectfully 99% disagree with OP.

 

 

(1% being that I skimmed a few points and perhaps misread something)

[ShadowCore67]

You need to slow your roll. They're working plenty hard on the game. Just because they're not working on what you want doesn't mean "development has ceased". 

 

And they always have people working on that stuff. It's just not the focus of the next update.

Edited June 20, 2014 by ShadowCore67

[Sidathe]

yeah, that was an overstatement by OP, but he is kinda right that we see few efforts put where problems lie right now

They're probably working on and off on the problems when they can. Not every problem can be solved instantly. :P Sometimes you just need to take a break from punching a guy in the face for eight hours because they sneezed in your cereal bowl.

[(PSN)ELIT3_EXP3RT-01]

Kubrows personally dont appeal to me whatsoever, however everything cant please me I guess.

Edited June 20, 2014 by (PS4)ELIT3_EXP3RT-01

[SableSonata]

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/235599-friendly-reminder/?hl=%2Bfriendly+%2Breminder

 

I realize that, and I never asked for them to stop working on anything. My problem isn't that they're working on this or that, but that they don't seem to be working at all on many core aspects of the game. I haven't seen any work done on stealth, parkour, addressing balance, vaoid/mod dilution, etc. I'm not asking for them to stop working on anything; with a few exceptions, everything in the stream was pretty interesting. My issue is that they don't seem to be making any improvements to core gameplay, and instead are focusing on new content at the expense of it.

 

 

Mods, melee and balance were all talked about in the stream as well, for example, mod synergy with your frame

 

Talked about, yes, but no evidence of progress was shown. No example of improvements to the actual systems in question; just more content, or 'we'll look into it.' 

[es.iiden]

Remember this is still technically a beta and not a final version of the game. It is a work in progress and they are working. The best we can do is to support them and give them constructive feedback to work from.

this has irritated me for too long. the beta excuse doesnt work anymore and honestly its a really lame cop-out. when you are making money off a beta, that label should be thrown away because at this stage it means you are providing a complete service. If Beta is still tagged to this game then that means its not complete, or the "core" isnt there...

[Pendragon1951]

@Casardis I completely agree about the answer Scott gave, and if you take it a step further who in his right mind is going to give up a slot for Handspring when those slots are limited, am I going to take out Flow and put in Handspring, I don't think so. Getting knocked down has nothing to do with game balance, does it make me stronger if I get knocked down less, no! That's just flawed thinking.