De You Missed The Colorblind Folks Again

[Brasten]

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/263785-new-ui-feedback-from-uiux-designer-visually-nicer-slower-to-use-more-clicks-to-do-the-same-task/#entry3071938

 

Seriously, they bugged you about the lockers often enough and you still kind of missed the finer point.

 

Please circulate this image to all your UI and environment designers.

 

 

 

[Tarudizer]

Maybe they are colorblind-people blind.

[Inquisitioner]

Considering all the current bugs and network related issues to top it off - I'd say they've got their hands full atm. But as someone who has several color blind friends, I can understand the frustration.

[Tulzscha]

Moved to the proper section.

[direcyphre]

Just as soon as lockers become relevant caches of valueable items...

[Varzy]

Considering all the current bugs and network related issues to top it off - I'd say they've got their hands full atm. But as someone who has several color blind friends, I can understand the frustration.

More than that, from a design point of view, inclusiveness of as many players possible should be a key consideration and be present at all stages in the development. I'm an architecture student, and "access" is a key concern. It's been drilled into my mind to consider how someone in crutches or on a walker or in a wheelchair or with a baby stroller might use my designs.

 

For videogames, co lour-blindness should be something the designers account for as a matter of course, not as an after-sight (forgive the pun).

[Blakrana]

For videogames, colour-blindness should be something the designers account for as a matter of course

This is more a problem with the industry as a whole, mind. The majority of people not being colour blind, the complaint is often completely lost on the normal person.

Normal Person typical response to colour blindness: OMG, what colour is this?

To wit, I have played a grand total of three games with a functional colour blind support mode: Team Fortress 2, FTL: Faster than Light, and Dust: An Elysian Tail. The wealth of games that never even give me any means to figure it out are...extensive.

Examples of the norm:

Metroid Prime: Hunters - I recall a rather embarrassing need to ask my Mum to tell me what colour things were in the final boss room so I could get the best ending. No, shapes were not a factor at all.

The First two Halo Games - Due to the Flood's Greenish colour and their propensity for 'Dark creepy' environments...I was physically incapable of playing either of those games to completion once I reached that point. The only Halo Games I've actually been able to fully play are ODST, Reach, and 4.

Games which allow for coloured text in chat boxes, like Phantasy Star Portable 2: I have -no- idea what you're saying if it isn't Red or Black text. Absolutely none.

Subversion (Colour Blindness is a plus):

Metal Gear Solid: Peacewalker - I am actually able to become a sniper with a mere pistol whenever someone is in ghillie suits. Stand out like a strange orangey blob in a jungle. It's almost cheating.

So, whilst I am in deep agreement with everyone here, I do feel it is important to point out this isn't just a failing on DE's part alone; this is a problem in the gaming industry as a whole, which is still to be addressed as a default, starting thing. 

And here, something for the non-colourblind who may be interested in some further reading.

http://www.gearboxsoftware.com/community/articles/1128/inside-the-box-adding-a-colorblind-mode-to-borderlands-2

Once colourblind modes become an industry standard, well, great. Especially if people can figure out a way to help our monochromatic brethren : /

[Varzy]

This is more a problem with the industry as a whole, mind. The majority of people not being colour blind, the complaint is often completely lost on the normal person.

Normal Person typical response to colour blindness: OMG, what colour is this?

To wit, I have played a grand total of three games with a functional colour blind support mode: Team Fortress 2, FTL: Faster than Light, and Dust: An Elysian Tail. The wealth of games that never even give me any means to figure it out are...extensive.

Examples of the norm:

Metroid Prime: Hunters - I recall a rather embarrassing need to ask my Mum to tell me what colour things were in the final boss room so I could get the best ending. No, shapes were not a factor at all.

The First two Halo Games - Due to the Flood's Greenish colour and their propensity for 'Dark creepy' environments...I was physically incapable of playing either of those games to completion once I reached that point. The only Halo Games I've actually been able to fully play are ODST, Reach, and 4.

Games which allow for coloured text in chat boxes, like Phantasy Star Portable 2: I have -no- idea what you're saying if it isn't Red or Black text. Absolutely none.

Subversion (Colour Blindness is a plus):

Metal Gear Solid: Peacewalker - I am actually able to become a sniper with a mere pistol whenever someone is in ghillie suits. Stand out like a strange orangey blob in a jungle. It's almost cheating.

So, whilst I am in deep agreement with everyone here, I do feel it is important to point out this isn't just a failing on DE's part alone; this is a problem in the gaming industry as a whole, which is still to be addressed as a default, starting thing. 

And here, something for the non-colourblind who may be interested in some further reading.

http://www.gearboxsoftware.com/community/articles/1128/inside-the-box-adding-a-colorblind-mode-to-borderlands-2

Once colourblind modes become an industry standard, well, great. Especially if people can figure out a way to help our monochromatic brethren : /

Thanks for all that info, I wasn't aware of a lot of that.

 

And agreed, it needs to be an industry standard. The more games that adopt this, the closer we'll get to that.

[Deus_X_Machina]

Probably the reason why the support for that is low?

The designers cant see what it looks like for colorblind people.

 

They can say: Oh that looks nice and creepy, and in that environment the player can barely see the enemy.

Now (when someone would try) to get that same feeling across to colorblind people...? Oh there are different kinds of them too?

=> Major effort to get the same effects.

 

Now, in some cases it would be possible to just use colors known to be able to be differentiated by most colorblind people. But only if the game has no PvP Aspects anywhere - because otherwise normal sighted people will use additional contrast to be better.

 

With rewards for best clans, new PvP, competing with other players in missions - there are PvP aspects in Warframe.

[DawnFalcon]

Probably the reason why the support for that is low?

The designers cant see what it looks like for colorblind people.

 

There are filters which can approximate it. (Which, to be clear, are *not* the same filters which colourblind end-users use)

 

(And I think you overestimate the effect -

 

Here's some of wow's filters -

 

Normal - http://i.imgur.com/r02cV.jpg

Protanomaly - http://i.imgur.com/MuS8P.jpg

Tritanopia - http://i.imgur.com/DoHKf.jpg

Achromatomaly - http://i.imgur.com/y1gwV.jpg

 

People rather expect, also, their colour range and you often get a headache while running a filter not suited for your vision

[Blakrana]

Probably the reason why the support for that is low?

The designers cant see what it looks like for colorblind people.

See, colour filters aren't actually the only solution. If we're going to talk the outright laziest design method to help out colour blind folks, then it boils down to a simple matter of adding distinct shapes to coloured objects to help drive the difference home. A lot of games actually use this method but it's more a general user advantage than purely colourblind players.

Symbols > Colours for information provision typically. A symbol looks the same no matter if you can see a rainbow or not...barring it is not made of rainbows or something

Simply add a symbol to something to denote it's 'state' and you're golden. For the sake of the Mini-map, Enemies being that Red hexagon thing whilst Allies are either blue dots or Lotus symbols is good enough. Colour is secondary; shoot hexagons, ignore the dots/Lotuses for the most part.

Whilst perhaps not the best idea for the UI, it could be possible to use the Astrological Symbols for the planets for example:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Astrological_symbols (Scroll to Meanings of the Symbols)

At a glance, then, we'd be able to just look at the map and know where we stand.

I can even tell you how to sort out the moons like Phobos: Take the Symbol for their parent planet and slap the moon symbol next to it. Pretty? No. But that is one possible way to address the issue without resorting to text. However, I suppose that may be lost on people who are unfamiliar with these symbols. Still...my point is, that's a way to solve the stated issue which doesn't require as much effort as maybe making a filter set up. An advantage though is that helps everybody in the end, not just colour blind people. That is a design strength

And, in general, if the designers aren't colour blind, could they not go to the Design Council or put up a 'Colour Blind Tenno requested for testing of new layouts' or some such?

Sure, okay, we're not a priority (this thread ended up on page 3 under everything else at time of writing) because, hey, we're 10% of the population on average. Nonetheless, that's something for Feedback that could certainly help the Art and UI teams; finding out what works for everyone. If not a colourblind mode filter, some symbols.

The end of the day, as colour blind gamers, we're pretty much given the short end of the stick, when it comes to usability derived from pure colour alone for information provision. Speaking honestly, I admit I never entertained the thought that this update would even attempt to cater for people with colour blindness. If it did, well, I'd have been utterly surprised.

No offence to any of the Dev team on that regard; like I said before, this is the gaming industry, which as a whole has demonstrated it doesn't prioritise/consider Colour Blind Modes until way after everything else. If ever.

I mean, speaking honestly? I would totally pay attention to a game that outright advertises itself for having inbuilt colour blind support methods. Because right now, that's actually a saleable feature. Even if it wasn't my kind of game, I'd spread the word for those who might.

And that's the problem at the end of the day; it's so rare, you could make money off of it if you do it.

Perhaps I am going on a bit too much at this point, but at the end of the day, the point is that it's really...quite straight forward to make a system, that doesn't rest solely on a player's physical ability to differentiate between wavelengths of light.

I don't want to pretend like I have all the answers, but I don't want to pretend there aren't quick easy solutions to colour blindness related issues. Symbols, shapes and the like are tried and true methods that work for everyone.