Give Us The World Back [Img]

[notionphil]

The ship Navigation panel feels like a abstracted mission select menu instead of an actual chart of the solar system.

 

U14's Navigation revamp shrunk how big the world of Warframe feels by a massive factor.

 

This is both an atmospheric AND a gameplay issue.

 

Previously, with nothing other than mouse-dragging, I could see which nodes had groups forming, which faction controlled each and how busy each node is - across the entire gameworld.

 

Now, I require multiple clicks to dig in and out of disparate interfaces, first a meditation circle of planets then a stylized sub menu of "boxes" which are so abstracted that I don't even feel like I'm going anywhere. Are those locations or just names? Hard to tell anymore.

 

Selecting missions is more like playing scavenger hunt, with all the clicking and mouseover required just to find an active node. I've already seen most of the dark sectors, defenses etc go "dark" as players give the solar "menu" up in favor of recruiting chat. Almost all of them used to have active groups perpetually. It's not surprising that hiding missions inside of menus makes them less utilized.

 

For all of the impressive atmosphere DE crammed into the ship, they certainly removed an equal measure away from the world at large with the removal of the Solar Map. 

 

Give us the World Back

 

Keep the "navigation" screen essentially as it is now, but replace those level "boxes" with an actual network of nodes around each planet. Make nodes show activity/control as they used to (and mission type)! Give us some depth back.

 

Let us scroll between planets while "zoomed in" and "reconnect" the world as it once was. It felt like a place. Now it feels like a list.

 

The Liset + a real game world would make WF feel more grand in scope than its ever been. You made huge progress with U14 DE...this isn't the time to take big steps backwards!

 

Example

 

Below is a horrible doodle of my feedback, sorry, no time/access for photoshop at the moment: Would work nearly identically to what we have now, except we're replacing "menu boxes" with nodes that spatially relate to eachtother and the planet. Some could even be "on" the planet for ground missions. Also, nodes show faction, name, activity and mission type without mouseover/click. Rotating would spin entire structure, as now. Dragging would go to next planet.

 

Edited July 21, 2014 by notionphil

[ForgemasterHD]

+1

[noveltyhero]

Actually I proposed a change that will keep the current system but still make it efficient:

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/265419-how-to-fix-u14/

[CY13ERPUNK]

+1000 OP

 

U14 - one step forward, 37 steps back

 

IMHO notionphil and DiabolusUrsus both deserve awards for being the most reasonable/intelligent/rational individuals on the forums

 

i only wish that DE felt the same way... =/

Edited July 21, 2014 by CY13ERPUNK

[notionphil]

Actually I proposed a change that will keep the current system but still make it efficient:

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/265419-how-to-fix-u14/

 

If you read the OP, I'm not asking them to scrap the system.

 

I'm essentially asking for what you proposed, + make those boxes into things that look like nodes, so we can "feel" like they are locations instead of ..well boxes.

[Inquisitioner]

No. Because, the versions need to be the same for PC and PS4 and the game has officially made the console version its number one priority and the game mechanics are to be set around it entirely.

 

With that said, I agree.

[noveltyhero]

If you read the OP, I'm not asking them to scrap the system.

 

I'm essentially asking for what you proposed, + make those boxes into things that look like nodes, so we can "feel" like they are locations instead of ..well boxes.

I did read the OP, I must've misunderstood then :O

Hmm, I think if the "boxes" would display more information such as mission type and faction without having to hover over, they would be fine

[notionphil]

I did read the OP, I must've misunderstood then :O

Hmm, I think if the "boxes" would display more information such as mission type and faction without having to hover over, they would be fine

 

They would be better, but certainly not fine. DE just turned a living, breathing map into an abstracted mission select menu.

 

It's a step backwards if you're trying to make a world feel like a world.

[Davoodoo]

Amen to that.

[ScorchedIce]

You realize Hubs are still on the way, right?

To me it feels more vivid, things are going on in the universe now, instead of just planets spinning around and me floating in space.

[KairaSilvermist]

+1

[DiabolusUrsus]

Agreed.

The meditation circle, as you put it, is convenient for quick access. It's a little easier to jump to a planet than it was with the old star map, but the spatial arrangement of the constituent nodes makes zero sense to me. It also feels a lot more confined. I'd like to see a few changes go in:

1. Restore the moderately noticeable difference in scale of the various planets and other stellar bodies. Jupiter should be bigger than Earth should be bigger than Mars should be bigger than Venus should be bigger than Mercury. I know that if the scale were 100% accurate certain elements of the UI would be invisible or exceed the limits of the ship, so just a little bit of variation would be nice. 

 

2. Allow us to travel between regions without actually jumping into a mission. One of the biggest additions of the ship, the planetary backdrop, is really awesome to look at. It's beautiful. However it's restrictive to get a change of scenery if you don't quite feel like running a mission. So... let us warp around at our leisure! 

 

3. As you suggested, I'd like to see nodes turned back into actual nodes... perhaps arranged in an electron-cloud formation at different elevations on the new 3-D plane. 

 

4. Allow us to scroll between planets using the mouse-wheel when zoomed in, as we already have RMB+Drag for rotating the planetary view. Perhaps implement a quest or market item that would allow players to craft a "Map Console" like a military strategy panel depicting the solar system in a similar manner to the old Star-Map UI. This could in turn be expanded to allow travel between *gasp* different Solar Systems in future expansions of the game world. 

Edited July 19, 2014 by DiabolusUrsus

[Davoodoo]

You realize Hubs are still on the way, right?

To me it feels more vivid, things are going on in the universe now, instead of just planets spinning around and me floating in space.

Its issue with navigation itself, map simply provides less info and you need to point at it to learn about specific node.

[DalaiLlama]

I'm actually a big fan of the new system for its larger degree of interactivity.  With the hubs incoming, this new system may yet better fit what's to come in the future.

 

The system as it is now is not perfect nor in a full working condition, bugs are rife and connectivity between the planets is a large problem.  Personally I also miss seeing the number of parties active per node, as this would tell me which node was a respective hotspot for a certain reward.  But for a system that has been implemented less than half a week ago, there is still much room for growth.

Edited July 19, 2014 by DalaiLlama

[notionphil]

You realize Hubs are still on the way, right?

To me it feels more vivid, things are going on in the universe now, instead of just planets spinning around and me floating in space.

 

I don't know that hubs are still on the way. Can you confirm this?

 

Also, I'm not suggesting that they scrap the interface - I love the ship and the concept.

 

However, I'm asking that we don't have to dive in and out of menus to switch planets, that all relevant information is visible at a glance, and that locations are represented in a spatial way, not a menu format.

[-Hemorrhage-]

Change is scary. It will be ok . . . .

[Acos]

Disagree. I look out my window and see a giant planet and the void of space in front of me. I fly to a mission and actually watch my ship hyper-jump through space and then approach a Grineer galleon. If anything this update made the world feel much grander. It feels less like I'm just selecting a node and going to a pre-generated map. I mean, naturally that is still what is happening, but the scale feels bigger by actually visually placing me somewhere in the universe instead of just suggesting it through the star chart. 

Edited July 19, 2014 by Acos

[notionphil]

The meditation circle, as you put it, is convenient for quick access. It's a little easier to jump to a planet than it was with the old star map, but the spatial arrangement of the constituent nodes makes zero sense to me. It also feels a lot more confined. I'd like to see a few changes go in:

--

 

2. Allow us to travel between regions without actually jumping into a mission. One of the biggest additions of the ship, the planetary backdrop, is really awesome to look at. It's beautiful. However it's restrictive to get a change of scenery if you don't quite feel like running a mission. So... let us warp around at our leisure! 

 

My main issue with the med circle is that it already attempts to break spacial relationships between planets. I'm OK with it thematically as well as the "alerts" for each planet. that's fine.

 

Your #2 is a huge point, and while not really an "issue" so to speak, would really help expand the world.

[notionphil]

Disagree. I look out my window and see a giant planet and the void of space in front of me. I fly to a mission and actually have to approach it. If anything this update made the world feel much grander. It feels less like I'm just selecting a node and going to a pre-generated map. I mean, naturally that is still what is happening, but the scale feels bigger by actually visually placing me somewhere in the universe instead of just suggesting it through the star chart. 

 

 Please read the actual requests in the OP. I like all of those things as well.

 

 

  I'm not suggesting that they scrap the interface - I love the ship and the concept.

 

However, I'm asking that we don't have to dive in and out of menus to switch planets, that all relevant information is visible at a glance, and that locations are represented in a spatial way, not a menu format.

Edited July 19, 2014 by notionphil

[Aragon20]

+1000 like he said (Keep the "navigation" screen work essentially as it is now, but replace those level "boxes" with an actual network of nodes around each planet. Give us some depth back.)

 

event if u wanna play alert u must search the mission now , before was one click, .

 

and please do something about the load into the game, it take 1-2 minut now to get into the game ,and many player have the  same problem , i  havent that issue before update14 , thanks

[ForgemasterHD]

Change is scary. It will be ok . . . .

 I really hate people like you, you know that?

 

Understand this: It isn't change that angers us, it's what the change entails. currently, most of this update has done nothing but make the game feel less alive and less intuitive.

 

So please, quit acting like you're talking to a bunch of morons. We actually, kinda, maybe want to enjoy playing the game.

[noveltyhero]

They would be better, but certainly not fine. DE just turned a living, breathing map into an abstracted mission select menu.

 

It's a step backwards if you're trying to make a world feel like a world.

I sort of see what you mean. My biggest problem with new one is that the "solar system" doesn't feel like a solar system anymore, you don't see that familiar layout and it feels odd to call it a solar system now :S

[Acos]

 Please read the actual requests in the OP. I like all of those things as well.

 

"For all of the impressive atmosphere DE crammed into the ship, they certainly removed an equal measure away from the world at large with the removal of the Solar Map. "

 

Assuming you mean this part; Your entire argument centered around the idea that the revision to the start chart removed some aspect of immersion. I am pointing out that much more immersion was added, negating the need for the star chart to supply it. It is not an "equal measure". Immersion is vastly improved.

The old star chart did a poor job of immersion anyway. I never really understood where I was, or how I was looking at whatever it is I was looking at. The entire UI is centered around being more immersive, and the navigation panel gives us a very quick and direct way of understanding how we are interacting with the space around us. The old star chart was a very ambiguous suggestion, at best.   

Edited July 19, 2014 by Acos

[noveltyhero]

 I really hate people like you, you know that?

 

Understand this: It isn't change that angers us, it's what the change entails. currently, most of this update has done nothing but make the game feel less alive and less intuitive.

 

So please, quit acting like you're talking to a bunch of morons. We actually, kinda, maybe want to enjoy playing the game.

Most of the update? Only the UI which needs and will probably get some fixing and changes done. But the ship itself made the game feel more alive, it made you feel part of this persistent world where you are not alone and there are enemies everywhere, it gave life to planets, to AI and to lore. This update has done more good than bad and right now we are knuckling down on the bad >:D

[ForgemasterHD]

Most of the update? Only the UI which needs and will probably get some fixing and changes done. But the ship itself made the game feel more alive, it made you feel part of this persistent world where you are not alone and there are enemies everywhere, it gave life to planets, to AI and to lore. This update has done more good than bad and right now we are knuckling down on the bad >:D

You're discounting how annoying it is to simply stand on the ship. How annoying it is to enter the ship, and how the ship has tendencies to stutter. I like the concept of the ship, but not the practice.

 

Furthermore, I do think most of the substantial parts of the update are doing more bad than good. That said, this is a topic for another thread or even PM, if you want to discuss this further.

Edited July 19, 2014 by ForgemasterHD