Tier Exploit

[(PSN)Ariies]

In my recent support ticket, I was talking to [DE]Matt and he mentioned an exploit to raising and lowering a clan's tier. I'm not sure how or why someone would exploit that. Can some explain?

 

Also, what if there were rules in place to control such an exploit. A tier can be lowered or raised once every 30 or 45 days and can not be lowered during an event, or 14 days before or after the event. Given that the proper barracks has been destroyed or built and the clan's numbers match the tier size.

 

In my personal situation. I had 56 members in my clan, but now I'm down to 30 because of non active members. I would have liked to have lowered my tier size to match my members. It's unfair to my soldiers when competing in their class when only 30 out of the 56 are competing against a full size storm clan. I am not trying to sit here and complain. I just want to give my guys/girls a fair shot.

[Kthal]

They are concerned about a clan lowering it's tier multiple times, doing research for a fraction of the cost, then re-recruiting all the former members.

[Imaru]

Basically, if you could raise or lower your clan's rank, you could choose how many resources you would need for research and construction. After new gear is added, you kick every one, lower your clan's rank, donate the resources, re-raise the level, and re-invite everyone, getting the research for far cheaper than you should.

[Rydian]

For example if your clan is a Ghost clan, it will take 260 Oxium to research Zephyr.

 

If your clan is a Moon clan, it will take 26,000 Oxium instead.

[(PSN)Ariies]

They are concerned about a clan lowering it's tier multiple times, doing research for a fraction of the cost, then re-recruiting all the former members.

 

 

Basically, if you could raise or lower your clan's rank, you could choose how many resources you would need for research and construction. After new gear is added, you kick every one, lower your clan's rank, donate the resources, re-raise the level, and re-invite everyone, getting the research for far cheaper than you should.

 

I see. So what if the rules were set as I mentioned in the initial post? Wouldn't that change how this can be exploited? It may not stop it, but it could cripple the times they are able and would want to use this. If you are a storm clan with 100 members, they would have to kick 70 members to lower then wait the 30 or 45 days to build another storm barraks to invite those members back and wait even longer if there is an event at the end of the initial wait. That would discourage members to rejoin that clan.

[Kthal]

The question is, roughly how often is clantech research added to the game? If the forced pause is longer than that, then tricking around uptiers and downtiers is not worth it.

 

I would suggest a 7 day delay before downsizing after an upsize, and a 35 day delay before upsizing after a downsize.

(Clan can upgrade, but then reverse their decision after 7 days, but if they downgrade, they are stuck downgraded for a while.)

[(PSN)Ariies]

The question is, roughly how often is clantech research added to the game? If the forced pause is longer than that, then tricking around uptiers and downtiers is not worth it.

 

I would suggest a 7 day delay before downsizing after an upsize, and a 35 day delay before upsizing after a downsize.

(Clan can upgrade, but then reverse their decision after 7 days, but if they downgrade, they are stuck downgraded for a while.)

 

That's a great idea. However we want them to not take advantage of the downgrading. Downgrading gives them more advantage for lower resources. If they cared about clan numbers, they wouldn't be using this exploit.

 

Those who exploit this want to use a downgrading feature to get lower resources for building. They would have to expel members from their clan, destroy their barracks, DOWNGRADE, build what they want, UPGRADE, rebuild their barracks, and re-invite their expelled members.

 

We want to discourage players from doing this. With the times on your suggestion, it would just be a small matter of time before they upgrade. They still make off with the goods. Now the place to hit them is with the trade off. Members for Resources. Lets say they have a full size Storm Clan. Out of 100 members only 60 of them are truly active members. Well it would mean nothing to get rid of the non active 40, which leaves 30 members left to expel to reach a Shadow Clan size tier. 30 players is a lot and can make the difference between tier sizes.  You're gonna have 30 pissed off members who can not access labs because they were kicked. They will either move to a different clan or be forced to wait the full 30 or 45 days and of course the event wait times are in play.

[(PSN)Ariies]

I can understand why DE just did away with downgrading completely without giving rules for it a thought. However as the game became larger and has crossed platforms. The chance for exploit is there, but it wouldn't be hard for them to give it a second look. Some clans die out or dwindle and should have the option of stepping down from a higher tier to match their ranks. Its unfortunate for those clans to have to deal with a decision based on cheaters that always look for a loop hole.

[(PSN)Kamranos]

I can understand why DE just did away with downgrading completely without giving rules for it a thought. However as the game became larger and has crossed platforms. The chance for exploit is there, but it wouldn't be hard for them to give it a second look. Some clans die out or dwindle and should have the option of stepping down from a higher tier to match their ranks. Its unfortunate for those clans to have to deal with a decision based on cheaters that always look for a loop hole.

Right. My clan is up this creek right now. We had over 50 members and then the Destiny plague came through and left only a handful of us. Trying to redesign a dojo solo with the Storm clan costs can be tough. 

 

I wish they would conciser something along the lines of a "clan reset". An option the warlord has on the website to reset the clan & dojo to the beginning. Clan emblems stays and the resources used in the dojo are sent to the vault, but your clan is reverted to Warlord and an unbuilt dojo. It would be an option for people in my position who want a fresh start without having hundreds of hours wasted. 

[Kthal]

I wish they would conciser something along the lines of a "clan reset". An option the warlord has on the website to reset the clan & dojo to the beginning. Clan emblems stays and the resources used in the dojo are sent to the vault, but your clan is reverted to Warlord and an unbuilt dojo. It would be an option for people in my position who want a fresh start without having hundreds of hours wasted. 

 

Good suggestion, but with one alteration:

 

The refunded resources would be applied based on Ghost tier (the lowest?) costs, to prevent mass investments at a high tier, then reverting and re-researching at reduced costs using the now surplus materials.

 

I would also suggest a 50pl cost to discourage abuse.

[(PSN)Ariies]

Right. My clan is up this creek right now. We had over 50 members and then the Destiny plague came through and left only a handful of us. Trying to redesign a dojo solo with the Storm clan costs can be tough. 

 

I wish they would conciser something along the lines of a "clan reset". An option the warlord has on the website to reset the clan & dojo to the beginning. Clan emblems stays and the resources used in the dojo are sent to the vault, but your clan is reverted to Warlord and an unbuilt dojo. It would be an option for people in my position who want a fresh start without having hundreds of hours wasted. 

I started over on Friday. The members that was current before the reset, was sent a message asking who would rejoin. It was sad to see not only some low ranking members not rejoin, but some high ranking members not rejoin as well. I threw away hundred thousands of resources, millions of credits, and over 600 plat that was put into the dojo. It's cool though. It will weed out the real non players. Since I made my dojo when I first began warframe last November, I didn't have the amount of credits and resources I have now. Remaking this dojo is a cinch. That along with 4000 plat. 

[(PSN)Kamranos]

Good suggestion, but with one alteration:

 

The refunded resources would be applied based on Ghost tier (the lowest?) costs, to prevent mass investments at a high tier, then reverting and re-researching at reduced costs using the now surplus materials.

 

I would also suggest a 50pl cost to discourage abuse.

That is a good suggestion. All materials items destroyed during the reset would be reimbursed as Ghost clan costs. (so if you built your dueling room as a moon clan, you are only getting back ghost clan resources.)

 

 

I made an independent post talking about this idea where I suggested upwards of a 500p clan reset cost. 

 

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/339414-what-if-we-had-a-clan-reset-button/