All Rifles Should Work Like Dual Decurion

[Holeypaladin]

So I was thinking on accuracy and recoil mechanics... and then realized that only one weapon in the game functioned like an automatic rifle.

 

That weapon being the dual decurion, archwing weapon.  For those of you who haven't used it, the dual decurion has perfect accuracy on the first shot, but the other shots spread from the initial target due to recoil.

 

This is in fact how real assault rifles work.  When firing semi-automatic, an aimed shot from the M16A2 battle rifle is accurate up to 550 meters against a human-sized target.  The first shot fired from the rifle will always hit where you're aiming with perfect accuracy at relevant ranges in Warframe, since there isn't a map in the game where you're shooting man-sized targets from more than 100 meters away.

 

The difference is, automatic fire has recoil, meaning shots fired after the second cause the round to spread from your initial aim point.

 

Assault rifles would feel much better if the first shot fired had perfect accuracy and all other shots had recoil applied to them.  This would encourage firing in controlled bursts at long-range targets rather than holding the trigger down indefinitely.  Heavy caliber should work according to its initial release, by adding additional recoil to the weapon rather than a flat accuracy reduction.  It wouldn't break the game in any fashion to do this, it'd just feel better for people familiar with rifles.

[Babce]

ahh remember when old gorgon did that lol people used it as a sniper 

[vaugahn]

Well, IRL even the first shot can be yanked off target by recoil. I don't think recoil should be a thing though, at least not in this game.

[Holeypaladin]

For the purposes of Warframe's short range combat... all rifles should essentially be able to snipe at the relevant ranges, it's just the snipers are more likely to kill the enemy in that first shot than, say, a braton.

 

And the first shot is only tanked off target by recoil in real life if you have improper trigger squeeze.  I would think a space ninja would have proper trigger squeeze.  There's already a recoil mechanic... there's just no need for spread AND recoil for rifles.  Pistols sure, but rifles should have just recoil.

Edited March 4, 2015 by Holeypaladin

[AdunSaveMe]

Recoil and accuracy in this game are just weird.

[(PSN)WiiConquered]

Well, IRL even the first shot can be yanked off target by recoil. I don't think recoil should be a thing though, at least not in this game.

Why? In my opinion, it's an underused balance agent in this game.

[bejuizb]

The old Gorgon (talking around U8) had this mechanic and DE nerfed it into the ground because of the weapon's versatility, but I loved the mechanic myself. I'd like to see it in other guns as well :D

[DeMonkey]

The only reasons dual decurion have that much recoil is because we're holding an assault rifle in each hand. Do you really think that whilst running around on the ground, technologically advanced space ninjas who can swing around great hammers like toys are going to be even slightly bothered by recoil?

 

Edit: The AA12 Shotgun is renowned for it's autofire and negligible recoil. And that's a modern day weapon, I highly doubt warframes future weapons will have any issue.

Edited March 4, 2015 by DeMonkey

[vaugahn]

Why? In my opinion, it's an underused balance agent in this game.

 

We're godly space warriors wearing hyper-advanced exoskeletons, I assume we can hold a gun straight.  IMO it's more of a thematic thing than a balance thing, and you could use small amounts of recoil to then emphasize how powerful a weapon was.

[Holeypaladin]

The old Gorgon (talking around U8) had this mechanic and DE nerfed it into the ground because of the weapon's versatility, but I loved the mechanic myself. I'd like to see it in other guns as well :D

Yeah, rather than removing it from gorgon, they should have applied it to all rifle-type weapons, like the soma, latron, braton, karak, etc.  Rifles are generally meant to be long-range weapons anyway, as opposed to the short range weapons like pistols, shotguns, and SMGs, so let them have the old Gorgon accuracy and recoil.

[(PSN)WiiConquered]

We're godly space warriors wearing hyper-advanced exoskeletons, I assume we can hold a gun straight.  IMO it's more of a thematic thing than a balance thing, and you could use small amounts of recoil to then emphasize how powerful a weapon was.

I'm sure we have less recoil issues than our Grineer or Corpus counterparts... but I sincerely doubt we're that strong. I think you're kind of underselling how powerful a gun is to fire.

Weapons like the Gorgon should definitely be high recoil, high DPS guns. The Soma could use some, and even smaller magazine weapons should have a bit. I'd only make some energy weapons completely recoil free.

[(PSN)IIIDevoidIII]

Do no rifles use this at all? I haven't paid attention to what uses it or not, all that much, but I know it exists on a few weapons.

If not, it would be an okay way to balance out some of the full auto with semi auto weapons.

[Rakshal]

Sounds like it would be an interesting mechanic.

[Holeypaladin]

Do no rifles use this at all? I haven't paid attention to what uses it or not, all that much, but I know it exists on a few weapons.

If not, it would be an okay way to balance out some of the full auto with semi auto weapons.

Well I pointed out the dual decurion... it's the only example I can think of.  Heavy caliber kinda breaks this too, since it was apparently considered "overpowered" at its initial release to be a recoil penalty and changed into an accuracy penalty because of recoilless weapons.  It could be an additive recoil penalty rather than percentage and balance out that way, though... by adding recoil to recoilless weapons.

[(PSN)IIIDevoidIII]

Well I pointed out the dual decurion... it's the only example I can think of.  Heavy caliber kinda breaks this too, since it was apparently considered "overpowered" at its initial release to be a recoil penalty and changed into an accuracy penalty because of recoilless weapons.  It could be an additive recoil penalty rather than percentage and balance out that way, though... by adding recoil to recoilless weapons.

I know the Akboltos do, but I cannot name others right now and be certain about it.

[Archistopheles]

ahh remember when old gorgon did that lol people used it as a sniper

Never. Forget.

Edited March 5, 2015 by Archistopheles

[direcyphre]

Personally, I believe recoil should be a concept relating to power, much in the way there is significant recoil on guns like Marelok and Lex. Certain other weapons might need some adjustment in this respect, but generally its a terrible idea to give everyone seizures for the sake of some sort of 'balance'.