Why Do People Still Think The Daikyu Is Good?

[Ryusuta]

I'm seriously wondering. I've heard only a small handfull of arguments in its favor (or against it, in the case of not wanting buffs), and honestly, they don't seem very good.

 

 

1: "It's not a crit bow, it's a status bow." 

 

That just makes it the worst of both worlds. If you're going to use a status weapon, use something with an actual DPS so you can proc more than one thing a second. the lack of critical ability means that it simply lacks the killing power of virtually any bow except the Mk-1 Paris. 

 

2: "It doesn't need to be like other bows. Let it be unique."

 

Giving it a higher critical chance would NOT remove its niche, as it would still have advantages and disadvantages over the other bows. The Daikyu is an investment bow. You have a specific firing window - and consequentially a lower overall firing rate - but more benefit for that full draw. At least, there should be more benefit on paper, but the only "benefit" (which is arguable) is that the arrows don't arc. ...Yay.

 

But ignoring the comparisons to bows, more than enough people have already compared it to the Opticor, which is more flexible and more damaging overall. So even without comparing it to bows it's just not that great.

 

3: "Not every weapon needs to be end-game."

 

This might be one of the weakest arguments ever. First of all, that could be an argument against any weapon. Supra reload speed too low? "It doesn't have to be end-game." Machete the single worst weapon in existence? "It doesn't have to be end-game."

 

No one's saying the Daikyu HAS to be end-game. We're saying that for a dojo weapon, the lack of advantages compared to disadvantages penalizes you far more than rewarding you for using it.

 

4: "No, I was able to use it when I [anecdotal evidence ahoy!]"
 

If you were able to make it work for you, great. That doesn't make it good. Tactical Potato made a Youtube vid of his 8-forma Braton. Doesn't mean the Braton is suddenly the powerhouse metagame.

 

I'm sorry, it's just... the thing is gathering dust in my weapons list and I would really like to see it get just a LITTLE bit of love. 

Edited July 25, 2015 by Ryusuta

[Stratego89]

If you build and use it right, it can be amazing. I run 3 dualstat gas electric with serration, vital sense, split chamber, speed trigger, point strike- on my mirage. It's all about gathering enemies, keeping your distance, and hitting headshots consistently. If you can do that with the build I use, it devastates.

[Ryusuta]

If you build and use it right, it can be amazing. I run 3 dualstat gas electric with serration, vital sense, split chamber, speed trigger, point strike- on my mirage. It's all about gathering enemies, keeping your distance, and hitting headshots consistently. If you can do that with the build I use, it devastates.

 

See argument 4.

[-Amaterasu-]

Can one-shot people in conclave (depending on their frame) so it's pretty good for that

[Stratego89]

See argument 4.

Counter argument: You can't call a shotgun that absolutely mows down crowds at point blank crap just because you can't also snipe people from 100m with it. It's the same for the daikyu- it's called strengths and weaknesses. It's called BALANCE.

[Ryusuta]

Counter argument: You can't call a shotgun that absolutely mows down crowds at point blank crap just because you can't also snipe people from 100m with it. It's the same for the daikyu- it's called strengths and weaknesses. It's called BALANCE.

 

It's not balanced because the strengths don't make up for the weaknesses. It's weaker than the other bows (or Opticor) and modding for status is better left to weapons that can proc several enemies at once. It's the worst of both worlds. Again, if you could make it work for you, that's great. Doesn't make it good or balanced.

Edited July 25, 2015 by Ryusuta

[(PSN)theelix]

Why do you still think the Daikyu isn't good? It's a heavy damage puncture weapon with a low DPS, but high status chance. It ain't the Lato, it can hold its own in higher ranked missions without much trouble, or even fire rate mods.

 

If you're looking to metagame, as your counterargument in 4 would suggest, pick up a Boltor Prime and relinquish your other weapons. There is nothing fundamentally wrong with the weapon, and it's not at a strong disadvantage compared to all weapons. It's fun to use, provides a decent challenge, and is viable for most missions.

 

So, the Daikyu is good like most weapons are good.

[climatiseur]

I think its nature implies that it can deal strong power towards crit resistance units, considering very big and heavy units / structure, which is currently not that much (none?) in warframe.

 

However, as they are introducing the Grineer heavy machines guns, it may be that Daikyu can do something more than the other bows - maybe more pure damage towards those machine guns which might have heavy resistance towards crit (just a speculation)

 

 

 

Besides, I think your no. 4 seems a little bit problematic. If the weapon is doing good for some people but not you, maybe it's just not your type of weapons. You find it not usable, doesn't mean everyone else would feel the same. It is, to a certain degree, quite a subjective opinion. (of course if the weapon is obviously lacking behind, then the general opinion will show it. However, I think Daikyo is in the margin.)

 

 

Anyway, my opinion on the Daikyo is that, it hints a certain utility however the situation is currently not in the game. I think they could implement some elements that makes it more desirable to use in battle. 

[Monsterwithin]

Eh, I kinda agree with you. Though the bow is pretty powerful. Just It's fire rate is so slow, that if I miss my shot, I gotta wait such a while to charge up the next one.

 

Other then that, the long bow looks are cool.

[Jangkrik]

The only thing that is bad about Daikyu is its 3 type physical damage which dillute the proc table (especially puncture.)

[Monsterwithin]

Why do you still think the Daikyu isn't good? It's a heavy damage puncture weapon with a low DPS, but high status chance. It ain't the Lato, it can hold its own in higher ranked missions without much trouble, or even fire rate mods.

 

If you're looking to metagame, as your counterargument in 4 would suggest, pick up a Boltor Prime and relinquish your other weapons. There is nothing fundamentally wrong with the weapon, and it's not at a strong disadvantage compared to all weapons. It's fun to use, provides a decent challenge, and is viable for most missions.

 

So, the Daikyu is good like most weapons are good.

Though Opticor is better :)

[MrDar1o]

Again, if you could make it work for you, that's great. Doesn't make it good or balanced.

No? So what make it good?

And if it sucks for you it doesn't make it bad.

[Ryusuta]

No? So what make it good?

And if it sucks for you it doesn't make it bad.

 

The difference is, I SAID what makes it bad - comparatively low overall damage (due to low crit chance primarily), slow fire rate, and a benefit (proc chance) that really is better applied to other weapons.

Edited July 25, 2015 by Ryusuta

[Stratego89]

It's not balanced because the strengths don't make up for the weaknesses. It's weaker than the other bows (or Opticor) and modding for status is better left to weapons that can proc several enemies at once. It's the worst of both worlds. Again, if you could make it work for you, that's great. Doesn't make it good or balanced.

Compare a gas, slash, electric (aka damage) proc from the daikyu to one from the tysis. Certain status is better to be spammed out as quickly as possible (corrosive, viral, cold) and some benefit from higher damage and are basically worthless on high fire rate low damage weapons (gas, slash, toxin). The strengths DO make up for the weaknesses- people just aren't willing to try modding differently from everything else for once.....

[S3EK3R]

Proc is a joke. Single fire weapon should be raw damage or crit weapons. They are simply as proc designed weapons.

My Dread / Paris Prime / Opticor can do everything the Daikyu does, but better. It needs something to make up for it.

 

 

 

Compare a gas, slash, electric (aka damage) proc from the daikyu to one from the tysis. Certain status is better to be spammed out as quickly as possible (corrosive, viral, cold) and some benefit from higher damage and are basically worthless on high fire rate low damage weapons (gas, slash, toxin). The strengths DO make up for the weaknesses- people just aren't willing to try modding differently from everything else for once.....

 

Tell me what is the strength of the Daikyu? It won't proc what you want. It's all RNG based, and this high RoF weapons will ALWAYS be better as status weapons.

Edited July 25, 2015 by S3EK3R

[GinKenshin]

so what's the point of this again? just let people believe and play what and how they want

[Ryusuta]

so what's the point of this again? just let people believe and play what and how they want

 

The reason is that I LIKE the design of and idea behind the Daikyu - a bow in which you're more invested in each individual arrow - and I would like to see it get a little something extra so I feel more justified in using it. I'm not asking for the world, just a little something more than what it has.

[InoxMaximus]

yep i agree. daikyu need a doublet damage buff.

[----Fenrir----]

The sad thing is, that even as a status weapon the Dread beats Daykyu. The Daykyu may has more status, yet is crippled by 3 physical damage types so half the time it will proc something useless like "impact" or "puncture". Dread is basically only slash damage so it will either proc "slash" (the by far best physical damage proc) or the element/combo you put on it.

 

And one dual stat mod is enough to get the status chance slightly over 50% with Dread and then it's basically on par with a 100% status Daykyu that will proc something useless half of the time. Add in the higher fire rate and the ability to shot without charging and Dreads even beats Daykyu has a status weapon by a huge margin (not that I would recommend using a bow as a status weapon mind you!).

Edited July 25, 2015 by ----Fenrir----

[Paradoxbomb]

I know I heard someone suggest giving the Daikyu innate multishot (shooting a trio of arrows with each draw of the string) and/or some kind of AoE effect, which would honestly be a unique upgrade as oppose to a general damage boost. But I still agree that while the Daikyu is different from other bows and people should be allowed to enjoy it despite it's shortcomings, I personally can't see it as all that great of a weapon so long as you can't control what status effect it procs. Perhaps it should have been an elemental weapon, or just have one or two of the three physical damage types?

[Marthrym]

Yeah, making the Daikyu a status weapon was completely nonsensical.^^'

That and the draw mechanics that are quite restrictive... It could use a little help.

[bubbabenali]

Maybe puncture only and a high innate punch through for gas proc.

Or a 20% crit bonus while crouching.

[Hatzeputt]

The Daikyu is like a Corvette with 4 cylinder 100 hp engine, it looks good it even feel good when you lay hands on it but when you try it out on the streets it falls short, very short. 

Edited July 25, 2015 by Hatzeputt

[GinKenshin]

The reason is that I LIKE the design of and idea behind the Daikyu - a bow in which you're more invested in each individual arrow - and I would like to see it get a little something extra so I feel more justified in using it. I'm not asking for the world, just a little something more than what it has.

well, in the light of that, and since we already have 3 (or 2 >_>) bows solely on doing as much damage in one shot, what do you suggest the 'edge' the Daikyu should have? 

I feel just the same way, the design and idea is indeed awesome (I love this Asian bow <3) and I also agree that a status doesn't work all that well with it

so my question stays, what do you think it should be?  

[(PSN)MrNishi]

I'm not going to say Daikyu is better than Paris Prime, Dread, nor Opticor.

I think Daikyu could have been a more viable Status Bow if it had Slash Damage Only with 50% base status. Allowing for a straight Slash + Viral 100% status killer bow. High Armor is ignored by both Viral's 1/2 health effect and Bleed Dot ignores Armor....so it would have been great with no Impact nor Puncture to get in the way.

Miter can work as status build with 100% Slash and Viral, but those Impact and Puncture procs still dilute the preferred status.....Single shot low fire-rate weapons can still be Status weapons but only if we can force preferred status.

Plus Tenno would have access to a Slash Bow that was not locked away behind Stalker RNG.

Currently if using Meer Arrows....I think the Daikyu is the best looking bow and thus it is the bow I take to use. Plus Arcane Avenger allows Daikyu to crit more frequently....sunjective, I know.

Side-note....complaint.....all other bows deal more damage on Full draw.....Daikyu with no quick-fire should have had more base damage.....

(Like when Miter had 3x damage on Full charge shots....then was nerfedfixed...but they introduce Opticor and revised Velocitus with obscene Full charge damage.....then Daikyu with compartively low damage

-Yes Velocitus is Archwing but it did not need the 2 or 3 damage buffs it recieved it needed better hitbox and in game feel...which they did address.Much better than when Velocitus was initially released)