Gorgon Family. Forgoten Family. Dead Family.

[Artekkor]

First of all i must say that i love the gorgons: they look awesome, they reload awesome, they sound awesome.

However... They are nearly useless in combat. Actually they ARE useful, but not in a way they should.

All stats and drawbacks that gorgons have are legit. Except for one... ACCURACY.

Accuracy on gorgons is so terrible that renders them nearly useless because you can't hit anything from MIDDLE range, making it only viable at close range.

WHICH SUCKS, because we have shotguns for that!

Not just that: accuracy simply doesn't make sense because gorgons have such a long barrel that it should provide accuracy of sniper rifles.

I can already see how some people will remember supra - the corpus sister of gorgons. "it has just as bad accuracy as gorgons".

Yes it does indeed. BUT! It deals 45 damage while gorgons deal only 25, which completely redeems all of supra's drawbacks.

Gorgons already have enough drawbacks to be not popular including recoil, reload speed, spin up and low damage.

Low accuracy is an overkill which just BRUTALLY MURDERS the whole gorgon family.

DE, i beg of you: buff gorgons accuracy to legit amounts of at least 28 (standart accuracy value used by most assault rifles). Just this simple change will finally make them usable again, while also different them from supra which just drowns enemies in high-damage projectiles.

Or do whatever you want, just BUFF THEM.

PLEASE ;_;

[GoSonic]

Supra got a great buff so hopefully we see one for the Gorgons in the future.

[PickleMonster21]

The only good Gorgon is a... actually, no. I can't finish this sentence.

[Artekkor]

Supra got a great buff so hopefully we see one for the Gorgons in the future.

Yeah, i never finished forma mine, but i can tell that supra's buff was awesome.

Now i wish same for gorgons, because i love their design.

Prisma Gorgon + Galatine looks like a legit combo, but gorgon is so bad, that you rather use galatine all the way through.

And it has like what, 6 formas in it? That's just sad to me.

Edited October 13, 2015 by Artek94

[Artekkor]

The only good Gorgon is a... actually, no. I can't finish this sentence.

Exactly. I can't even bring myself to start forma a wraith one, becausr i probably will never use it, or i will but will cry in the process because of how bad it is.

[PickleMonster21]

Exactly. I can't even bring myself to start forma a wraith one, becausr i probably will never use it, or i will but will cry in the process because of how bad it is.

Agreed. Like, I have a Soma Prime. Why would I want to downgrade?

[Artekkor]

Agreed. Like, I have a Soma Prime. Why would I want to downgrade?

Somas are Tenno' version of gorgon.

If prisma gorgon was at least 75% as good as soma prime or even normal soma - i would be happy.

Edited October 13, 2015 by Artek94

[MillbrookWest]

LMG's (and LMG's alone) should have a suppression factor, whereby enemies get an accuracy debuff within a cone infront of an LMG's fire direction.

 

Weapons like the gorgon, and Supra, can have really wide cones, which subsequnetly debuffs lots of enemies. An LMG like the soma can have a very small cone, affecting few enemies, thusly giving the soma it's first real negative trait in relation to other LMG's, and buff the other apparently useless LMG's to better the Soma in some aspect.

[PickleMonster21]

my 6 forma prisma gorgon is my main weapon. ill share my build tomorrow. that thing is no joke.

You need 6 Forma to make a Prisma Gorgon a viable option to take to a 10 minute survival on Mercury? Dayum.

[Artekkor]

my 6 forma prisma gorgon is my main weapon. ill share my build tomorrow. that thing is no joke.

I don't think i need your build, because it's not a problem to me.

My problem is that there are many WAY better weapons.

But my main complain is extremely low accuracy that should not be there, because of how long gorgon's barrel is.

[Artekkor]

LMG's (and LMG's alone) should have a suppression factor, whereby enemies get an accuracy debuff within a cone infront of an LMG's fire direction.

Weapons like the gorgon, and Supra, can have really wide cones, which subsequnetly debuffs lots of enemies. An LMG like the soma can have a very small cone, affecting few enemies, thusly giving the soma it's first real negative trait in relation to other LMG's, and buff the other apparently useless LMG's to better the Soma in some aspect.

I don't think that DE will implememt that... Because no one in FPS industry ever did. LMG's were always about insane DPS.

Gorgon family has a very terrible DPS especially compared to Soma Family and recently buffed Supra.

Hell, even Grakata which is SMG has better DPS as well as better fun-factor.

[ThePredicament]

It's a mid tier LMG, what do you expect? Besides, having a ton of accuracy and a bunch of recoil only means you're shot line will only climb up straight, instead of spread, that is a bad thing in full auto situations. Spool up time is Soma P accurate, so use that.

 

The only buff they should get is bigger ammo pools and slightly higher status chance.

[Artekkor]

It's a mid tier LMG, what do you expect? Besides, having a ton of accuracy and a bunch of recoil only means you're shot line will only climb up straight, instead of spread, that is a bad thing in full auto situations. Spool up time is Soma P accurate, so use that.

The only buff they should get is bigger ammo pools and slightly higher status chance.

I understand how normal Gorgon is low-tier but why on heaven prisma is? Which supposed to be an upgrade?

And i'm not even talking about heavy gunners who make gorgon look good: insane dps, perfect accuracy, barely miss anything.

Are DE implaying that heavy gunners are more skilled than us?

Edit: i also don't ask for a lot of accuracy, just for 28.

That will bring gorgon to accuracy level of Soma and i will be able to finally hit my targets now without getting to point-blank range.

Edited October 13, 2015 by Artek94

[MillbrookWest]

I don't think that DE will implememt that... Because no one in FPS industry ever did. LMG's were always about insane DPS.

Gorgon family has a very terrible DPS especially compared to Soma Family and recently buffed Supra.

Hell, even Grakata which is SMG has better DPS as well as better fun-factor.

DPS i kinda bad for gameplay. why have different weapons if they all have the same DPS? Granted, damage could indeed be looked at, but how does that make LMG's different? Suppresion gives LMG's something different to other weapons like bows, Pistols and teh like.

 

Besides, the gorgon (and all weapons for that matter) already draws a cone of fire when firing, on a technical level, implementing enemy suppression would require tweaking already existing systems. It doesn't matter what other FPS's do though, LMG's in Warframe, are LMG's in Warframe ;)

[Artekkor]

DPS i kinda bad for gameplay. why have different weapons if they all have the same DPS? Granted, damage could indeed be looked at, but how does that make LMG's different? Suppresion gives LMG's something different to other weapons like bows, Pistols and teh like.

Besides, the gorgon (and all weapons for that matter) already draws a cone of fire when firing, on a technical level, implementing enemy suppression would require tweaking already existing systems. It doesn't matter what other FPS's do though, LMG's in Warframe, are LMG's in Warframe ;)

And in Warframe they act exactly like assault rifles - damaging stuff, killing stuff owning the enemy forces...

Oh wait i talk about Supra and Soma, Gorgon can't do any of that unless you play Starchart low-mid tier planets.

Also having different weapons with same DPS is awesome, because this way you can use weapon you like aestheticaly without giving up power to more ugly ones (*cough* Braton Prime *cough*)

Edited October 13, 2015 by Artek94

[Vitalis_Inamorta]

You guys...

 

Okay, let me lay it out for you.

 

Yes, regular Gorgon sucks.  It's an old, low tier weapon in a world of high tier weapons and constant power creep.

 

Gorgon Wraith is a mid tier status weapon, nothing more, nothing less.

 

Prisma Gorgon actually does more burst and sustained DPS than the regular Soma.

(Wait what?)  Yes, and it also has severely reduced horizontal recoil, meaning that you'll have a lot easier time hitting most targets at longer ranges.  It also has higher accuracy rating (which is extremely misleading from one weapon to the next, by the way) than any other Gorgon.  Rule of thumb is that if your weapon's accuracy is above 10, that first shot will hit exactly on the bullseye.  If it's an automatic weapon subsequent shots use the accuracy stat to determine how "wild" the recoil will be, AKA it's going to ride up a little, but with really low accuracy, it might ride up a lot on one shot, then barely at all while shifting significantly to the right on the next, and so and so forth.  Accuracy also effects shots produced by multishot, so that's something, but it still won't affect them noticeably inside of 50 meters on that first shot if it's above about 10-12.

 

Okay, first off, you need to understand that Rifle Primary critical mods are overpowered as all hell.  How do you think the Soma, with a pathetic base damage of 10, (like half of the MK-1 Braton's damage...) suddenly becomes the most powerful primary in the game upon release?  35% crit chance and 3.0 crit damage combined with rifle crit mods that are insanely strong compared to crit mods for any other weapon type or class.  You have Point Strike, a mod that gives +150% critical chance out the door (more than any other mod in the game except Primed Point Strike, which is a primed mod for secondary weapons).

 

So, what's a viable balance of critical chance/damage for primary weapons (non-shotgun)?  15%/2.5  on the Latron Prime is faaar into the viable range, even though you would probably cringe at it on most any other weapon class.  How about the 10%/2.0 on, say, the Braton Prime or Quanta?  Turns out that they ARE crit viable, in fact the crit build is significantly better than the non-crit one.

 

Here is is:  10% x 2.0 = a 10% increase in average dps from the base stats.  Add on Point Strike/Vital Sense and you have 25%/4.4 = a 85% increase in average dps.  subtract the 10% you have un-modified, and it turns out that this is a 75% damage increase for the weapon from two mods (because of multiplicative math, critical mods actually do more in conjunction than if you added their isolated effects together).  So for this conjunction of crit mods, you could say that a Braton Prime gets a 75% damage increase from the main crit mods, or 37.5% per mod when used in conjunction.

 

37.5% sucks though, you say, compared to my 165% Serration and Heavy Caliber, my 90% Split Chamber, my 90% elemental mods, and even my 60 Speed Trigger.  Here's the thing, your weapon has 8 mod slots right?  So, Serration/HC/SC/Speed Trigger(or Vile Acceleration if you prefer) is only 4 slots used, then you come to the elemental mods, which don't work quite the same way.  Because there are so MANY of them, and they all work off of the damage stats of the weapon after base damage + damage mods + multishot + crit/damage, each additional elemental mod actually means that the next elemental mod will have less effect on the weapon's overall damage.

 

For +90% elemental mods, it goes like this, let's say that weapon damage is 100.  One 90% elemental mod makes it 100+90 of that element, or 190, a 90% increase in damage.  Add a second mod and it becomes 100+180 of the combined element, which is only a ~47.4% increase in the weapon's damage, because it isn't multiplying the damage from the other elemental mod(s).  Add a third mod and you get 100+ 270, which is only a ~32.1% increase in weapon damage.  Whoa... that's weaker than those crit mods...

 

So yeah, once you've got 2 elemental mods on a rifle with even 10%/2.0 crit chance, you'll get more average damage/dps out of adding the crit mods before adding any more elemental mods.

 

On top of this, a lot of guns outright can't use Heavy Caliber without becoming horribly inaccurate bullet hoses of 99.99% miss, and some don't really need a firing speed mod, or are actively harmed by it (hello galaxion.  Hello Amprex) because of their extremely high ammo consumption.  This will leave you from between 2-4 mod slots open where the critical mods will just be outright more effective/efficient than anything else.

 

Prisma Gorgon, with 15%/2.0 crit, is clearly a critical build weapon.  Between its mehverage base damage per shot, high firing rate at spool, massive magazine, and good crit stats, it will actually do more burst DPS and sustained DPS than a regular Soma (yeah Soma Prime still beats it, but not by much).  Really, the only downside to the Prisma Crit-Gon is the fact that it has that vertical recoil, which can make hitting those super-effective headshots tricky.  To be fair, The Prisma Gorgon takes a lot less of an accuracy penalty from Heavy Caliber than the Somas do, (don't ask my why, but accuracy stat is extremely misleading) meaning that if you already use Heavy Caliber on a Soma, you should be using the Prisma Gorgon instead.

 

Edit:  Oh yeah, and the Prisma Gorgon has the most accuracy of any Gorgon, blah blah blah blah.

Edited October 13, 2015 by Vitalis_Inamorta

[Artekkor]

^ I'm aware of all this, but low accuracy (even if the best of all gorgons) completely destroys the potential of crits, because you can't land headshots properly. Do you know why soma is so strong? Because it can land powerful critical headshots all the time anihilating enemies in seconds, because critical headshots get additional damage multiplier.

Prisma Gorgon does not crit properly, nor it is capable of landing stabile headshots, only through lucky spread.

Not to mention that soma is simply more range-efficient than Gorgon.

Tus it still outperforms prisma gorgon by a mile.

Also crit chance lower then 50% is S#&$. Me and RNG hate each other, and i do not trust my DPS to him.

Also i hate Heavy Caliber.

Everytime i put it on P Gorgon and see that one bullet hiting the wall 90 degrees from my aimsight - i feel bad and throw HC away.

And Even without HC P Gorgon is incredibly innacurate which, as i stated above, DOES NOT MAKE SENSE CONSIDERING HOW LONG THE BARREL IS.

Go to titanfall and look at titan's XO machine gun. It looks like gorgon, it works like gorgon, BUT IT'S SO ACCURATE that you can land critical shots on enemy titans with ease, which is the only reason why this weapon is still viable in battle.

Edited October 13, 2015 by Artek94

[viamont]

given the way the gorgon works...i would be perfectly ok if it had the damage of a heavy weapon...it already has an all over the place acuracy, the feel, the look...it just needs the gaittling like magazines at the sides...i wouldnt mind a decent damage boost for all the trade offs already mentioned by all you guys...dunno...perhaps from 25 going up to 40 would make it end game while keeping all the other stuff

[Artekkor]

given the way the gorgon works...i would be perfectly ok if it had the damage of a heavy weapon...it already has an all over the place acuracy, the feel, the look...it just needs the gaittling like magazines at the sides...i wouldnt mind a decent damage boost for all the trade offs already mentioned by all you guys...dunno...perhaps from 25 going up to 40 would make it end game while keeping all the other stuff

Agree, for so called heavy weapon it deals not enough damage

[Riot_Inducer]

The core issue with the gorgons really is their abysmal accuracy. Their damage is honestly about par with other full-autos of their tier but the accuracy ensures that it's pretty much impossible to actually achieve any theoretical DPS a Gorgon has outside of point blank range.

 

The issue I've run into with the Gorgons is that the accuracy is so bad that you have to compensate with "MOAR DAKA", that is crank up the fire rates so you can put enough lead in the air that it doesn't matter that most miss, enough hit to do usable damage. This however sets off a sort of chain reaction with all the Grogon's other supplementary stats, faster fire rate means that 90 round magazine goes away very quick and you're chewing through that 3-4s reload a lot more often than you would like AND you're burning through that reserve ammo incredibly quickly.

 

So in the end you've just got this conundrum where you either sacrifice half or more of your build for quality of life mods like reload speed, ammo mutation, magazine size, etc. or have a standard spread of damage mods making it a reasonable damage bullet hose that still falls behind comparable rifles due to most of its damage potential hitting the scenery around your target.

 

When it comes down to it either the Gorgons simply need better accuracy so you don't need to go through as many modding acrobatics to make their damage appreciable, or a higher base damage so that you aren't as disadvantaged by loading them up with QoL mods.

[Doothers]

As a fan of guns with huge magazines (I've used all of them) I can say the Gorgon is my least favorite.. I never found it to hit hard enough and the accuracy isn't too good. as for buffs I'd just say increase damage (slightly) and buff accuracy

[Radon086]

Still have acceptable performance after put into plenty formas. But personally, just can't bare the firing sounds for long period.  

[Pridesfury]

as an owner of a 7 forma prisma gorgon i can honestly tell you that aside from using it as a t4 120 minute vex chroma weapon where it absolutely shines as the almighty god of destruction at 50k per round at 13.4 rps your better off using a standard boltor.

 

gorgons damage and potentially multishot (yes i know of the multishot nerf settle down children) needs to wind up with its fire rate.

 

that said really OP? you realize i headshot single round shoot with it from over 80 meters right? a prisma gorgons accuracy is no joke and its recoils is so under control it vaykor marelock looks like an rpg when it recoils in comparison.

[Crewell]

I can understand then hate for the standard Gorgon. Even Gorgon Wraith is a little subpar these days. Prisma Gorgon however is a beast. Mine only has a couple forma in it (not the 6-7 like above) and it still performs well into higher level mission and enemies. The big key to that is it is a high crit impact primary so it cuts through shields. Slap on viral and watch enemies drop extremely fast with fairly decent accuracy. As mentioned above, it also is good at sniping targets. All the Gorgons have that going for them. Simple fact is while I love my Soma Prime, my Prisma Gorgon takes me further.

Edited October 14, 2015 by Crewell

[Weidro]

i persoanly prefer the normal gorgon over the other two

 

the gorgon wraith has a way too high firerate and as a result a terrible ammo efficency

ur pumping sooo mayn bullets in already dead bodys

and the prisma gorgon is even worse

 

but i rly like the normal version and i have to admit that i miss the old version of it

very early closed beta single shot sniper gorgon and wind up close range M.E.A.T. system (Massive Evisceration And Trauma)

good old times *sigh*

Edited October 14, 2015 by Weidro