Overall Warframe Ratings [Updated For 10]

[Volt_Cruelerz]

The following is a different take on the rating of warframes and how they compare than other methods have done.  

 

This post has been a long time coming as I wanted to max all frames before reporting this.  What I'll be doing is evaluating each frame on a scale of 1-5 stars for each ability and once again on its overall kit interaction.  I'm sure some will disagree, but hopefully this can draw attention more towards what needs help and what needs less.  For the record, I am not a proponent of "buff everything to Nova level."  I actually favor a nerf to her, but that's not the point of the thread.  I shall proceed alphabetically and shall put the sum of the stars (obviously 25 is perfect) up by the name of the frame.

 

Feel free to contribute feedback and if you disagree with something please provide a valid and cohesive argument for it.  Obviously the initial ratings are my own doing, but several are due to feedback by commenters.  I am aware I'm not an expert on every frame, so if you main a frame and have used several others for reference, please feel free to inform me of any disagreements in the ratings.  Just make sure to provide a logical argument explaining why what has already been posted is incorrect.

 

Part 1 - Ratings

 

Ash [13]

Shuriken ***

In terms of 1's, this really isn't bad at all.  It can deal high serrated blade damage and doubles its effectiveness at max level

 

Smoke Screen ***

Effective invulnerability from almost all enemies (screw you, Rollers!).  It can be used to revive an ally, gain instacrits, or just general play.  Obvious uses for stealth.

 

Teleport *

It teleports you to your target.  The only time this is really useful is if you're trying to get to a downed ally quickly which likely means you already cast your 2 so you aren't dead the moment you get to your ally.  Against enemies, you could just shoot them and for catching up, Ash is a fast frame.  It's just wasted energy.

 

Bladestorm ***

Never before has it been so easy to be productive in Warframe while texting your girlfriend.  Seriously though, it is a very powerful ability, dealing tons of damage to nearby enemies.  Sure, it isn't as fast as others, but that doesn't change its usefulness.

 

Kit ***

Overall, a very usable frame.  Nothing overly good or bad about him.  Just a good, solid frame with mostly decent abilities.  Decent stats make Ash viable in many situations.  He never really excels outside of stealth, but is still a frame that's never bad to have alongside.

 

Banshee [17]

Sonic Boom ****

Need breathing room?  Want to just send hapless enemies back?  Press 1.  Very potent crowd-control skill, downing anything that gets a little too close for comfort.  In terms of 1's, this ability is one of the best.

 

Sonar *****

Absolutely fantastic ability.  It promotes skill, teamplay, and is useful at all levels of play.

 

Silence *

Are you playing stealth?  If no, this is junk.  Even if you are, it's still terrible and simply not worth the energy because if you're that close to enemies, you could just kill them with a sneak attack or something.

 

Sound Quake ***

Effectively a long-duration stun, this ability can easily set up kills for allies or buy them time.  The damage is fairly standard.

 

Kit ****

A great teammate to have in every situation, Banshee can always find a role.  Assassination?  Defense?  Other?  She's got something she can throw at them to help the team.

 

Ember [13]

Fireball **

Improvement over the previous version, but still not much to write home about.

 

Overheat ***

While this used to be her most powerful ability, the skill is now not nearly as powerful as it once was.  Even so, 40% at max level is still a very note-worthy reduction in damage.

 

Fire Blast **

Decently high damage, but only on the perimeter ring.  Unless an enemy happens to stand 15 meters away from you for 10 seconds, they aren't getting that 1k fire damage.  They're probably getting 100.

 

World On Fire ***

Gives Ember something to do while she's charging in with Overheat on.  The damage itself is very high, capable of dealing 4800 fire damage to a single target if left alone.  It brings down enemy health so quickly that it is simply a generally useful ability.

 

Kit ***

While she has the whole "watch the world burn" mentality, the only really useful abilities are Overheat and WoF.  Fire Blast is only really useful on Infested Defense but falls off as waves pass.  Fireball is better, but still far from good.  She'll likely get a lot better with Armor 2.0.

 

Excalibur [18]

Slash Dash *****

Extreme damage? Check.  Serrated Blade?  Check.  Unlimited Targets?  Check.  Excellent movement?  Check.  Incredible power with use inside and outside of combat.

 

Radial Blind ****

It's a long stun for only 50 energy with a fast cast animation.  Great to have around at all levels of play, particularly high-level defens.

 

Super Jump *

With the addition of wallrunning several updates ago, this fell by the wayside.  Some suggested it deal damage upon landing.  Instead of making it part of SJ, DE made Heavy Impact a separate mod.  The mobility this offers is just not justified.  If you need breathing room, just press 2 and casually stroll out of there or hit 1 and kill things on the way.  It may give you more flexibility when using the Ogris, but Vauban's Vortex would fulfill the same role only better.

 

Radial Javelin ****

One of the original radial nukes, RJ is still a very potent ability, dealing tons of damage to enemies of any type given that it ignores armor.

 

Kit ****

Overall, a very good all-rounder.  Excalibur can deal tons of damage, CC, and has movement to spare.

 

Frost [14]

Freeze **

Upgrading this ability does effectively nothing and given that any health damage at all breaks the stun, all it does is take one unit out of the fight for a few seconds while you focus on others.  If you try to bring it down, it just snaps out of it and fires back.  Only possible use is when multiple heavies are approaching and you only have the firepower to bring down one at a time.

 

Ice Wave **

While decent damage for a 2, IW does nothing special.  It has a decently long range, but with the travel time considered, enemies could dodge it or they could be dead by the time it arrives.

 

Snow Globe *****

As if there were any question, this ability is at the top of the list and is what makes Frost the king of Grineer and Corpus Defense.  Blocks all incoming damage and even debuffs anything inside.  Incredibly powerful.

 

Avalanche ***

Standard damage with a mild CC during the cast time.

 

Kit **

While he does have Snow Globe, that's really about it.  Frost is taken on Endless Defense simply because he can press 3.  That's it.

 

Loki [14]

Decoy ***

While aggo is nice, the way aggro works in this game, it just doesn't do a whole lot or if it does, the decoy get's killed rather quickly.

 

Invisibility ***

Just as with Ash's SS, this is three stars.  See SS for explanation.

 

Switch Teleport **

This is largely what makes some Loki players a pain to play with.  It doesn't really do anything to confuse enemies since they always know exactly where you are and just gets you tossed into the middle of an enemy horde.  It does allow movement, but with wallrunning and Loki's high base speed, that isn't really necessary.

 

Radial Disarm **

Permanently reduce the damage capabilities of enemies.  There's not  much to say.  It's not really a hard CC, but it is very long lasting and so it is still useful.

 

Kit ***

Overall, a decent frame to have beside you.  Nothing special, but he does have tools which change the battlefield.

 

Mag [18]

Pull *****

A very powerful ability that has incredible damage for a [1].  Unfortunately, its teamplay value is now nothing aside from its ability to deal a ton of damage to everything in front of Mag.

 

Shield Polarize ****

While the defensive use of this is limited, the ability to deal such massive amounts of damage is stupendous.  Most importantly though, it scales with enemy shields, meaning that it will retain its effectiveness throughout different levels.

 

Bullet Attractor ***

By doubling all incoming damage, this has become a decent ability when used with low-accuracy weapons such as shotguns or the Supra, but for highly accurate weapons, this still effectively nullifies the effects of Sonar.

 

Crush **

While the helmet and Stretch can combine to make the range on this stupidly large, this ability simply becomes worthless at high-level play for anything other than crowd control and can make it more difficult at times to hit enemies.  Enemies that enter after the start are free to kill Mag during the casting animation.  That said, it is decent AoE CC.

 

Kit ****

She can be incredibly useful to a team in terms of damage output, but utility is something she currently lacks.  She also does not play well with high-accuracy teams.

 

Nekros [15]

Soul Punch ****

Armor-ignoring damage to the target as well as to the enemies behind it, a potential armor shred (supposedly it has it, but I don't know of anyone that's verified it), and CC all rolled into one.  Overall very very good.

 

Terrify **

In my experience, this simply does not function effectively.  I won't say it's complete garbage because somtimes enemies run away, but most of the time, they keep attacking their current target.

 

Desecrate ***

While this isn't an ability anyone really wants, its use as a support ability is undeniable.  When used with good timing with a Nova or Saryn, you can pretty well make it rain health orbs and ammo.

 

Shadows of the Dead ***

Not a bad ability per se, but it simply doesn't compete with several others at common levels.  At theoretical defense levels, this ranks up there with Chaos and Absorb, but otherwise, it is just a bit odd.  It also of course relies on the AI which is, well, problematic.

 

Kit ***

He has this odd support-sniper vibe which gives him a unique role as opposed to the pure-sniper Banshee.  He has a lot of CC and his ultimate makes him automatically prioritize high-value targets and just let allies kill off the regular mobs.  He's really not that bad.  He could be better, but he's actually not a bad frame with all things considered.

 

Nova [23]

Null Star ****

Guaranteed stagger and a fire-and-forget nature.  Not to mention, if you color them red, they're basically Mario Kart's red shells.  Damage is low, but the mechanics make up for it.  There's never not a reason to have these little things orbiting you.  They might just whack that Disruptor behind you to prevent you from losing all your energy.

 

Antimatter Drop *****

Limited only by the game's damage cap, this ability dwarfs most everything else and can obliterate pretty much anything in the game.  Two uses can wipe out Ambulas easily.  True, the mechanics are a bit wonky, but that doesn't change how incredibly powerful it is.  All incoming damage is multplied by 4 and then redistributed to everything around the impact.  Amazingly powerful.

 

Wormhole ****

The best team-travel ability in the game, Wormhole is effectively a group teleport that can send you all anywhere you would like to go.  I a lot of ways, it lets you play Portal in Warframe.

 

Molecular Prime *****

Ah.  At last we come to it, the reason Nova reigns supreme as the Queen of Warframe.  Double damage, slow, and chain-reaction explosions.  Incredible power and makes Nova useful at all levels of defense.  True, eventually the explosion damage will cease to be useful, but the effectively infinite range permaslow and double-damage buff components are still useful on wave 999.

 

Kit *****

She has attack/defense in 1, unimaginable power in 2 and 4, and movement in 3.  She's just stupidly powerful.

 

Nyx [19]

Mind Control ****

Instant, long-duration CC that makes an enemy fight for your side.

 

Psychic Bolts **

While this is capable of a lot of damage, it is held back by the homing AI.  While it is definitely better than it was before 9.8, there's still much room for growth.

 

Chaos *****

While not as instant as M-Prime, Chaos has the distinction of being the best ability in the game for upper level waves of defense.  Completely neutralizing enemy cohesion, they turn on each other and use their scaling weapons against each other's scaling health and armor.  Because this is such a hard CC, it can be used whenever something starts to go wrong to immediately relieve the threat.

 

Absorb ****

Now able to effectively attract enemy attention as well as reliably deal high damage, this ability is fantastic.  The only things preventing it from being 5 stars is the fact that Shade still nullifies it and there is no way to end it early in case of emergency which can be problematic as Nyx players tend to love their duration mods.

 

Kit ****

After the buff, Nyx is now significantly more well rounded and is now capable of much more than before.  She can nullify enemy damage and finally deal good damage back to them.  Overall, a very potent frame.

 

Rhino [22]

Charge ****

Lots of damage, good range, and no target cap.  Not as good as Slash Dash, but still a very useful and powerful ability.

 

Iron Skin ****

A hefty overshield and CC immunity for an unlimited duration and aggro.  This is what turns Rhino into a tank.  Sure, he's not invulnerable like he once was, but he is still quite powerful.

 

Roar *****

For teams heavy in non-AI or inaccurate weaponry, this is a great Sonar alternative as it applies to anywhere including headshots.  Very good team buff.  Even better, it can be used alongside Sonar for outrageous damage output.

 

Stomp *****

Good, long CC with good damage.  Overall, a very potent ability and one that is good to have on a team.

 

Kit ****

All skills are useful and his kit is solid.  He can support a team with CC, tanking, or damage amps.  Alternatively, he has the health and damage to go solo.  Great frame and well done DE.

 

Saryn [14]

Venom **

It simply isn't what it once was without the ability to stack.

 

Molt ***

See Loki's Decoy.  Same reasoning.  Molt also doesn't interact with her kit the way Decoy does with Loki's.

 

Contagion **

I just don't see the need to equip this.  Don't get me wrong, if you're going for a melee build, 75% damage amp is nice, but melee in the game as it stands has issues so you won't find too many people jumping at the chance to use this.  It's also not a team buff which means that only Saryn can capitalize on it.

 

Miasma ****

Until the addition of Antimatter Drop and M-Prime that resulted in Nova's coronation, Miasma reigned as the most powerful damage ability in the game.  Nearly instant cast time during which enemies are rapidly dissolved and has the benefit of multiplicative gains from strength and duration mods together.  Targets are also stunned for the duration.  The only drawback is its low range.

 

Kit ***

Bringing great damage and decent utility to the team, Saryn is a solid competitor for a slot in a team, but nothing altogether that special.

 

Trinity [20]

Well of Life **

While I still don't see a lot of need for it as health loss is generally not that important, the massive buff here does encourage health-tanking.

 

Energy Vampire ****

With energy seeming to be more sparse, this ability can really come in handy and is simply a lot better as it stunlocks the target while you get energy from it passively.  The damage is somewhat laughable, but you're not using it for that.

 

Link *****

Perhaps this is unintentional, but so far, as long as I've had Link up, I've not taken any damage.  From what I can tell, it's now dealing that damage to every enemy around me with no cap.  That seems...  Well..  Horrendously overpowered.  I'm guessing this is a bug, but, even so, I'm still going to report it as my experience has been.

 

Blessing *****

While it doesn't particularly matter about the heal (which is nice, but effectively unnecessary), the fact that this ability now gives instant invincibility is what makes it truly powerful.  Provided you watch the health of your allies, you can easily make clutch saves now.

 

Kit ****

A massive swing in performance, Trinity can now save allies, provide energy more easily, and generally be a very potent support.

 

Vauban [18]

Tesla ****

While it doesn't do a lot of damage, the absurd duration is fantastic for defense.

 

Bounce **

A single target stun is what this basically is.  True, it has mobility potential, but it's either limited or dwarfed by wallrunning.

 

Bastille ****

Snow Globe is to Grineer/Corpus Defense as Bastille is to Infested Defense.  It's no longer invincible, but still very powerful.

 

Vortex ****

While not overly powerful, it does act as good crowd control and opens the door for Ogris bombardment.

 

Kit ****

Overall, a very solid frame and one of the best.  The obvious choice for Infested Defense, or put another way, he is the king of Xini.

 

Volt [11]

Shock **

While the damage may be bad, against low-level Corpus, it is incredibly potent.  Now that chaining is (mostly) fixed, the ability isn't complete junk.

 

Speed ****

A great team-wide steroid.  Unfortunately, it does basically nothing for Volt as it is now worse for him than it was before and encourages gameplay that runs counter to what is enabled by his stats.

 

Electric Shield ****

A very powerful ability.  The ability to negate all enemy damage while amplifying your own is great.  Particularly potent with things like the Dera or Supra.  Only real problem is that is static and its small width makes its use even in Endless Defense limited.

 

Overload **

What was once the most powerful ability the game has ever known (far more powerful than M-Prime currently is in terms of end-result) got nerfed hard.  Several attempts have been made since then to rebuff it here and there, but the fact that it has reduced power when used from the same location makes it near-useless for Defense.  Also, electrical modifiers make Volt unwanted on Infested levels.  Last, the duration is quite long and leaves Volt vulnerable for a while after dealing sub-par damage.

 

Kit *

Volt tries to be a steroid machine (Speed), a static gunslinger (Electric Shield), and a caster (Shock and Overload) without actually being good at any of those roles because he doesn't have sufficient support in any of them.  His kit tries to do too many things and thus fails at all of them.

 

 

 

Part 2 - Evaluation and Comparison

 

In accordance with the above, from most -> least points, this is the ranking.

 

1.   Nova

2.   Rhino

3.   Trinity

4.   Nyx

5.   Banshee, Excalibur, Vauban, Mag

6.   Nekros

7.   Frost, Loki, Saryn

8    Ash, Ember

9.   Volt

 

Also, the following which have received extreme values and thus are the most likely to need the attention of developers.  I personally do not believe all here do, but I shall keep my views on which out of this post as much as possible.

 

One Star

-Teleport

-Silence

-Super Jump

-Volt's Kit

 

Five Stars

-Sonar

-Slash Dash

-Snow Globe

-Pull

-Antimatter Drop

-Molecular Prime

-Chaos

-Roar

-Rhino Stomp

-Link

-Blessing

-Miasma

 

I'm sure there will be countless controversies with what has been posted, but I hope that the systematic evaluation of abilities has indicated where developers should be focused when it comes to balance.  There are some frames such as Frost that are being propped up by one or two good abilities when the rest of the kit is lacking while others just need attention.  They may have improved in the past pass, but they are far from on-par with other frames.

 

Some frames need love, others need nerfs.  I was hoping however that this approach would better direct attention to the components that need it more than others and help to show exactly what needs changes.

Edited October 11, 2013 by Volt_Cruelerz

[mhyr1104]

Nyx Absorb should go down a bit more, there was a bug where the Absorb's damage absorb wouldn't work, I somehow got flamed to death by Grineer Scorch as soon as I used it since their fires bypassed shields upon activation (is it fixed now?)

[Lady_Khaos]

Couldn't have said any of it better myself. These are all very accurate summaries, and should be a good guide to the devs as to what they need to work on. Consider sending this to Scott.

Edited August 23, 2013 by Khaos_Zand3r

[kamimegurine]

Ohh well this is just so wrong dude... SS and inv is only for stealth runs ??? kidding me ???? i really like to watch u in the mid of 15 lv 270+ enemies with any frame that don't have invisibility, Trinity energy vamp not good enough ??? even if u press 4 u wont kill a lv 270+ mob u really do wanna have that energy vamp when every mob in the map is stronger than a boss and blessing last so long that you have your team8 asses covered... Banshe having 19 ??? really... have u realize that stomp is a way better than quake??? and about the 5-15 dmg that will inflict to heavy armor lv 120+ enemies???  yeah sonar is cool but do u really will have the time to stand in front of any enemy lv 90+??  Nova... she is not that OP... once again have u ever go further than wave 5??? cast Molecular prime u wont have that massive dmg, it will act more as a dmg amp, Antimatter drop orb moves to slow and if u wanna have nice dmg u have to shot it... she doesn't last enough in front of enemy sight to do this... she is not a tank, wormhole really 75 energy for this ??? and u just said that teleport is useless...  Excalibur... try slash dash vs infested enemies when u get stopped by a toxic come back, radial blind dont last that long... radial jav is not that great... yes exca is a good one but not enough for that rating... you are telling me that you will be going with exca before almost every frame... oh god this is so wrong

[Jugganatha]

I like how, for the most part, you avoided defense missions as a metric for how these frames perform.

 

"Here's what they're supposed to do, and here's how well they do it" is how this whole post reads to me, and I have to say I appreciate it. Loki and Ash are not defense frames and should not be measured as such.

 

You also make good points for the buffing of Frost and Volt. A lot of people are divided on where to go with those two, but at least someone can state why they are not "fine as they are" (which is quickly becoming one of my most hated phrases).

 

+1

[andboomgoestheydynamite]

I basically agree with all your ideas except a couple. To name one I would think rhino stomp gets 5 starts not 4.(And plus one to the guy above me who also agrees frost and volt need a buff)

Edited August 23, 2013 by andboomgoestheydynamite

[MageMeat]

I am kind of confused why people make lists like this.

It neither proves anything nor encourages changes in the long run.

[Lady_Khaos]

I am kind of confused why people make lists like this.

It neither proves anything nor encourages changes in the long run.

 

It does when your name is Volt_Cruelerz and you are commonly known among the devs.

[Cyrosage]

I know what you're going for but the delivery was off.  You tested each frame and each ability, great.  You provided your opinion, great.  You asserted (twice) that this will show where the developers should be focusing, not so great.

Your guidance for the developers is based solely on your opinion.  There are some facts and hard numbers involved, but you don't take into account play styles, types of levels (raid vs defense vs escort), and use end-game high level content to belittle whichever skills you chose.

Overall, I side with some of the things you said, but implying opinion equals fact is where many posts in this forum end up as flames and end up less productive.

This strikes me as doing a benchmark for many air-cooled CPU heatsinks in an 80 degree (F) room.

 

Edit: Followup to the post before mine.. Posting a lot doesn't mean you're right.

Edited August 23, 2013 by Cyrosage

[KONAir]

"Overall, a decent frame to have beside you.  Nothing special, but he does have tools which change the battlefield."

 

Hear, hear Ruse Master has no battlefield changing abilities. Decoy is doesn't stop enemy from attacking Tenno, Invisibility itself does not offer nigh infinite tactical options, Switch Tele does not offer mobility that instantly messes up the battlelines and Radial Disarm doesn't change the nature of battle itself at al

Edited August 23, 2013 by KONAir

[RoboDoge]

This seems like it was scaled on enemies below level 50.

 

Seems little shallow to me, we all have our opinions but this is like new player scaling.

Edited August 23, 2013 by RoboDog

[saltshaker42]

Yea, I agree with RoboDog, and I disagree with this.

 

Not that I'm gonna say anything about it... Just... I don't agree. That's pretty much it.

 

*edit*

 

I will say something.

 

I don't agree with Volt's stars. Speed, and electric shield are terrible skills. Other than this I can't find anything wrong with your rating system, its just that, that's enough to make me disagree.

 

Sorry.

Edited August 24, 2013 by saltshaker42

[WarOverlord]

Really, the best rating would probably be a good solid 20.

I mean, look at Rhino and Vauban.

Much higher than that and it starts to become unbalanced.

Much lower and it is complete $#!+.

[Volt_Cruelerz]

This seems like it was scaled on enemies below level 50.

 

Seems little shallow to me, we all have our opinions but this is like new player scaling.

I tried to be more comprehensive than just endless defense.  Give me an example of what you mean.

Edited August 23, 2013 by Volt_Cruelerz

[RoboDoge]

I tried to be more comprehensive than just endless defense.  Give me an example of what you mean.

Play more with warframes, they are not what they seems.

 

Use everyone for 2 weeks without switching, you will find some abilities awesome. Try using frames with enemies around level 150 and you will see how to cope. You dont even need 2 weeks with frame, just do few runs with enemies around level 150 to see their true nature.

[notlamprey]

Time well spent by the OP.

 

Whether or not people agree with him, this is feedback that DE can use. I mean really use.

 

It isn't often that someone makes an organized, rational post about their considered opinion on so many things.

 

Having played all these frames by now - with the exception of Loki and Excalibro - I would say that I generally agree with everything V_C posted.

[WarOverlord]

Time well spent by the OP.

 

Whether or not people agree with him, this is feedback that DE can use. I mean really use.

 

It isn't often that someone makes an organized, rational post about their considered opinion on so many things.

 

Having played all these frames by now - with the exception of Loki and Excalibro - I would say that I generally agree with everything V_C posted.

I agree as well.

It is very well organized and comprehensive.

[rksk16it]

I tried to be more comprehensive than just endless defense.  Give me an example of what you mean.

 

IMHO there is no such thing as "comprehensive" when you are comparing warframes. You gotta pick one target/purpose and then give rating to each warframe. Otherwise its meaningless.

 

There are players who play mainly defense, and that too very high level. Your ratings are incorrect for them.

 

There are new players who play on lower level planets. For them, in terms of damage, Nova's MPrime should deserve no less than 50 stars.

[HellEnforcer]

 I agree with some of your points, and I disagree with others. Seems you did not really spend much time using all the WarFrames. (More accurately, playing them in every possible style)

 

 Just to mention one of them. Mag's Pull can be used by her. If you have a melee weapon, you can swing a couple of charged attacks and they willl be probably dead before they get up.

 

 I like the fact that you at least tried to use all of them and that you tried to put some thought on each of them. But you are leaving aside that some of them seem to be specialized for certain things and playstyles and not just to go and decimate all on their path (which seems to be the guideline you used here).

 

 Also, the score seems a bit off sometimes. Like on Ash Bladestorm. You say it great but with just some delay, yet it has just 3 stars.

[Volt_Cruelerz]

 I agree with some of your points, and I disagree with others. Seems you did not really spend much time using all the WarFrames. (More accurately, playing them in every possible style)

 

 Just to mention one of them. Mag's Pull can be used by her. If you have a melee weapon, you can swing a couple of charged attacks and they willl be probably dead before they get up.

 

 I like the fact that you at least tried to use all of them and that you tried to put some thought on each of them. But you are leaving aside that some of them seem to be specialized for certain things and playstyles and not just to go and decimate all on their path (which seems to be the guideline you used here).

 

 Also, the score seems a bit off sometimes. Like on Ash Bladestorm. You say it great but with just some delay, yet it has just 3 stars.

Bladestorm takes quite a long time to cast during which enemies are not CC'd at all.  That's why.

 

Play more with warframes, they are not what they seems.

 

Use everyone for 2 weeks without switching, you will find some abilities awesome. Try using frames with enemies around level 150 and you will see how to cope. You dont even need 2 weeks with frame, just do few runs with enemies around level 150 to see their true nature.

I will admit I haven't used all of them extensively.  That said, there is still more to the game than level 150 enemies.  Are there any in particular it'd behoove me to go back and play more?

Edited August 23, 2013 by Volt_Cruelerz

[WarOverlord]

If I guess correctly, this is designed around level 60 enemies right?

That would make it very accurate, as I doubt DE would scale it up to void defense wave 30.

That would end up with something ridiculously overpowered, like Nova.

Really, Rhino is the most balanced frame of all, hence his popularity.

Also, Rhino is the only warframe with a mastery restriction, leading me to believe that DE knows he is complete and needs no real further changes.

Edited August 23, 2013 by WarOverlord

[Volt_Cruelerz]

If I guess correctly, this is designed around level 60 enemies right?

That would make it very accurate, as I doubt DE would scale it up to void defense wave 30.

That would end up with something ridiculously overpowered, like Nova.

Really, Rhino is the most balanced frame of all, hence his popularity.

Also, Rhino is the only warframe with a mastery restriction, leading me to believe that DE knows he is complete and needs no real further changes.

This is an attempt to be overall with consideration for both how well they fulfill their intended role and how generally usable they are.  I could easily have limited it to be "performance in ED," but there are frames that aren't designed for that.  They just simply aren't.

[TemetNosce]

I feel like you deserve something of a pat on the back for actually going through and doing the skills like this, as it doubtless took a great deal of work, although I'm somewhat skeptical of the entire kit rating. On the other hand, I'm not sure if your ratings take into account interaction with other skills or if that's relegated to kit, or for that matter whether kit includes the default stats.

 

Regardless, you asked someone earlier which frames you need to play more, and personally the area I find I disagree with you most is Nova. I don't know how much time investment you have in her, but unless I misunderstand your rating system Wormhole is not a 4 point skill, nor is Null Star. I'm going to lay out some of my disagreements here, with a brief explanation for why. That said, I would definitely appreciate a sort of overview of your rating system and what precisely kit is meant to include.

 

Wormhole : What else is rated 4? Iron Skin, Sound Quake, Mind Control... These are smooth, effective skills with extremely wide use. Wormhole as an ability while better than many movement skills, is nonetheless mildly awkward, works best with large areas, and even there is more of a way of skipping work than making runs drastically faster. Wormhole is a good skill, however it's one with limited benefits, comparing a run with it to one without it won't result in much difference.

 

Null Star : It's a solid 1 ability, but the damage isn't good enough to justify the rating, rollers can still hit you before it goes off, and if you're in genuine melee danger it's not enough to stop it. It's a "nice to have", that as mentioned you ought to run because hell, it's a benefit. It's not however nearly so useful as other skills you give this rating.

 

Speed : I agree that Volt has numerous issues right now, Speed however is still the only ability in the game whose use will drastically increase how quickly your team completes a mission on more than half the game modes. On a practical scale, Speed may be more useful than Bastille, since high level infected ED provides little actual benefit.

 

Shield Polarize : This is more another note about kit than anything else I suppose. I can see this two ways. Either this rating is accurate, as it only considers the skill in a vacuum, or it should be a one because even Crush's minimal CC does a better job of what it's for than it does.

 

Tesla : Once again, simply not worth the rating compared to other skills. The DPS is poor early on, but the per hit is enough to make it useful, later however it might as well not exist. It's a fun skill, and one that has a huge amount of damage per cast, but ultimately in a situation where it actually mattered you'd be better off using the energy elsewhere.

 

Sonic Boom : You consider this better than Pull, or for that matter Sound Quake? Limited area, terrible damage, minimal strategic utility. I'm not saying it's bad, as it's a nice tactical ability, but at the same time it's certainly not something I find myself in a large number of situations where it's the best option. I just can't possibly see how this merits a perfect rating. I'd honestly disagree with it at a four, but at a five I have to admit I'm wondering if this was a typo.

 

There are some others I'm somewhat skeptical about, but on the other hand in those cases I feel like I'm simply weighting things differently than you do (for example, I'd rate Miasma higher than Slash Dash, but I figure you're trying to factor in the difference between skill slots). Anyways, thanks for the great topic.

[-Kittens-]

-1 for resorting to tiers

 

+1 for presenting opinions with actual incidental support.

[Volt_Cruelerz]

-snip-

Nova is actually one of my favorite frames and I've played a good deal on her.  Depending on which mods are added in the future, I was considering going back to forma her.  

 

Kit: kit was for lack of a better term, an "other" category.  For instance, Volt's Speed and Shield are both very powerful abilities (even if Shield is Situational), but they flat-out contradict each other.  There's no reason to have both those abilities on the same frame.  They support different playstyles entirely.  I did weigh stats in on the kit value, but skill synergy within a frame and between allies was more important with synergy within the frame, how well it "meshed" together into one cohesive and productive skill set.

 

Wormhole: This was another that had different values on paper and with the description.  On paper, this was 5 and in the original unpublished version of the OP, it was a 4.  I ended up deciding on a 5 because it is the best at what it does and there's not really a conceivable way to make it better without fundamentally changing it from a movement ability to something else.

 

Null Star: I can see where you're coming from on Null Star.  I was bouncing back and fourth between 4 and 5.  In fact, I actually wrote out this system twice, once on paper (just numbers) and then of course in the OP.  In one case, I rated it as a 4 on paper but as I was writing the description of it, I found that it really seemed competitive enough to be a 5, albeit a lower one.  Now, it's no Slash Dash, but I felt it deserved better than a 4.  

 

Speed: I'm not sure where we disagree on this unless you want it to be a five.  I tried to keep suggestions on how to bump things up out of the OP (lol you have no idea how many times I backspaced things to cut those suggestions out).  The OP was about addressing the state of things and why they are that way so that solutions may be formulated.  I knew the OP would be very controversial since I am by no means an expert on every frame, I elected to keep those out as it would simply drive away constructive discussion on determining what belongs where.  I guess I neglected to state it in the OP, but I am open to suggestions on moving things.  Anyways, for Speed, I just can't see it as being a five simply because half its effect is lost on its caster because of what happens if Volt enters melee range.

 

Shield Restore: It can damage enemy shields and restore your own by a raw percentage.  That's not much, but I felt it was more than a 1.

 

Tesla: On paper this was 3.  In the original OP, it was 4.  I ended up settling on 5 simply because of its absurdly long duration.

 

Sonic Boom: when Mag uses Pull, she can't really do a whole lot to the three or four enemies (usually) that are at her feet.  Sure, she can ground-pound them for a couple seconds, but why didn't she just shoot them from range?  SB is one of my favorite abilities in the entire game and is my favorite 1, so perhaps that skewed things, but even so, I felt justified in doing so because it immediately gives you breathing room from an unlimited amount of targets.  The damage is laughable except against low level enemies.  The utility of being able to stun all enemies in front of you instantly for 25 energy?  That seems pretty fantastic to me.  Pull brings enemies towards a frame that has gains no advantage by doing so other than stunning them.  You do lose the benefit however of range.  That said, that stun is still very very valuable which is why I put it at 4 and SB at 5.  Both stun but one gives you breathing room and the other takes it away.

 

I was attempting to weigh things in accordance with their skill slot, yes.