[Vauban's Rework was a bit undwhelming just Like Ash's so here is my Version.]

What bobben needs is some tweaks with his 1 and 2. Especially his 2.

Tesla does almost no damage even with full STR.

Solution: IMO I think that it should be apart of his bag of balls (in his 2nd ability so he can cycle through and select it).So basically his 1st ability is horrible. It isn't useful for anything. It does basically no damage and it has no cc because they have horrible status chance. I know it isn't for doing damage. Damage isn't what I and many other players want for him. We want his Tesla grenades to have 100% status. That's literally the solution. It would be a great addition to his kit because it just gives him a bit more of cc capability.  He is a crowd control frame after all. I'd also like to see some kind of synergy between Tesla and Vortex but I havnt quite thought of an Idea. Ah let me address this. "It's a first ability it's supposed to be lack luster" "most first abilities are luck luster". Those are not an argument. No ability in the game should be unuseful or unusuable.

His 2 is, um, lackluster and mostly useful but amusing.

Bounce is useless (only useful for trolling that is)

Trip laser doesn't even work sometimes.

Concuss can be useful but... why should i use that instead of bastile or vortex?

The only good (and kinda broken) thing about is 2 is shred. A full STR bobben can reduce 100% of grineer armor. Combine that with vortex and you can oneshot everything.

Solution: So at first I was like..hey we should rework this ability! But then I was like no! I thought of this crazy cool idea where we would be able to construction new Ball tools for Vauban. DE could add different balls to the game for us to construct and they'd each do a different thing! We could replace a ball tool just like we replace emotes. It could be something amazing if DE decided to be creative.

Bastille and vortex is what most of the vaubans use. These two are fine. I answer many other players would like the Reppeling Bastille augment to be fixed (many players post about it, how sometimes it doesn't repel enemies )

 

 

[Vauban's Rework was a bit undwhelming just Like Ash's so here is my Version.]

Tesla

The Problems:

Tesla is a very underwhelming ability. Overall it seems like it does low damage of a damage type that isn't all that great against most enemies to begin with and the actual Tesla's don't fire as often as they should to really help that DPS along. What's worse, Tesla's best aspects are gated behind the augment Tesla Link, whereby the Tesla's can connect together to form an electric string/net that deal constant damage to anything moving within them. Even this, though, doesn't help this ability that's meant to deal damage to enemies.

The Solutions:

Make Tesla have a 100% status chance ( They do horrid CC)

Integrate Tesla Link into Tesla's base ability.

Make Tesla discharge at a rate of 2 schocks/second when an enemy is within the range of a Tesla orb, with a base charge count of 50 per Tesla.

Reduce the shock radius of individual Tesla to 6m. This radius is no longer affected by Power Range.

Length of Tesla connection is affected by Power Range.

Electrical connections between Tesla do 500 base electricity damage with 100% chance to stun enemies for 3 seconds.

 

Minelayer

The Problems

Minelayer is just not useful. I have tried to find good uses for it, but for the life of me I couldn't find a consistently good use besides Trip Mine (because stunning enemies is universally good).

Bounce Mines aren't useful in the slightest; they're just annoying. They bounce enemies into the air where you can't shoot them, they barely stun the enemies they do bounce, they only bounce one enemy at a time and they have a @(*()$ recharge time before they can bounce again. The Magnetic Proc is the only redeeming quality of these things but the nature of Magnetic Proc's is only useful against one faction of enemies in the game. . . Bounce could be removed entirely and nobody would miss it, I don't think (sadists might disagree).

Trip Mines are a good ability. That's pretty much all I have to say about them. They're not great, but they're not meh either. I stated above that the fact that stunning enemies is universally good, which by extension makes this ability just good. I've basically moved their functionality to Tesla like they should have been from the beginning, though.

Shred Mines are also alright. I like the fact that they shred some armor if the enemy survives the initial explosion, but the fact that they're just an explosive seems pretty dull to me. It alone wouldn't even be worthy of being a Warframe's first ability, IMO, which is why it makes sense that it's been paired with what are essentially 3 other "mini" abilities.

Concuss is basically a less useful version of Shred. Enough said.

Minelayer as a whole, though, is needlessly clunky for what are some very non-essential abilities. Ivara's Quiver suffers practically the same problem since Minelayer was clearly made with that in mind, but at least Ivara has some exceptionally good arrows like Sleep or Invis. Vauban's mines just don't match up.

Overall I think the ability needs to be scrapped and replaced.

The Solution

Vauban's Minelayer is scrapped and replaced altogether.

Bastille now fills Vauban's 2nd ability slot. No changes are made to Bastille.

 

Bastille

Literally just move this to his second ability slot. This is honestly a great ability that maybe needs a bit of leeway with the relation to Power Strength and the maximum enemies affected, but 12 enemies at base is alright considering you'll be killing those enemies while they're trapped as well as the augment.

 

Vortex

Move this into the third ability slot. Vortex has never really felt to me like a true ultimate ability as it functions practically as a better version of Bastille with a significantly smaller range. Maybe increase the Magnetic proc rate a bit, or make it guaranteed, though. Really, what would be the harm?

 

Bastion

This is a new ultimate ability I recommend for Vauban by replacing Minelayer. Originally it was going to just be a deployable that introduced some buff to your teammates within range, but I wanted to take it further than that.

Ability is called "Bastion."

Vauban throws out a deployable box that morphs into a small tower. This tower begins emitting energy once deployed. The tower has a base health of 5,000 (or whatever Chroma's Effigy is). Tower health scales with Strength and Duration.

The tower emits an aura in a radius that gives Warframes in the radius various buffs: 25% damage reduction, 70% increased shield regeneration that overflows into overshields at a rate of 10%, 35% damage increase from all sources (rifles, melee, abilities, etc). Damage reduction and increase are affected by Power Strength while shield regen and overflow are not.

Aura radius is affected by Power Range.

Enemies within the aura will prioritize attacking the Bastion tower over other objectives or Warframes.

[Eclipse vs. Vex Armor: Strange Damage Multipliers]

Just now, motorfirebox said:

You're fighting the Eidolon at night, you sure you're getting Mirage's damage bonus?

He only talked about Chroma one shotting the Teralyst. He wasn't talking about fighting the Teralyst with Mirage as well. He's just saying that it feels like Mirage's damage buff is lack luster compared to chroma.

[Eclipse vs. Vex Armor: Strange Damage Multipliers]

Yeah I agree.

It feels like Mirage is indeed weaker..

 

[No seriously. This is a must for Mirage.]

7 minutes ago, (PS4)XxDarkyanxX said:

And said buff is crazy good.
Only having one buff when you enter a mission isn't the end of the world if the buff gives you 4x the damage or 95% damage reduction.
The only thing that would need a fix is the source of the buff.
"Light and Darkness?" It's too inconsistent UNLESS it's on the Day/Night cycle of certain maps.

Do agree that you don't fix power issues by forcing mods into your arsenal.

They do charge very fast, but they also require forced modding into a straight direction, self-damaging weapon with little damage and more than often he's just plain boring to play.
He really needs a change of direction from the Vex Armor god-role that he has.
__________________________________
Mesa actually has plenty of flaws by herself,
First power is good, but the cast time is an hassle to deal with against an army of enemy so people don't use it.

The damage increase on her 2nd is generally around 50-60% which is awfully weak as compared to the 400-600% Mirage or Chroma.
The CC is... inconsistent? it's limited to "pulses" on a countdown, which means it doesn't serve too nicely as CC unless you shove max range in it which affects all your other powers in a negative way.

the damage reduction on her 3rd only works on projectile, which leaves you awfully weak ( with 60-90 armor I forgot which it is ) against Status effect/melee or anything that isn't a bullet.

Her fourth is good, but what exalted weapon isn't?
Also leaves you immobile, spinning around whilst holding the trigger and boring.
Takes mods from your secondary weapon, which kinda reduces what weapon/mods you can equip if you want to perform overly well.
___________________________________
Octavia does overshadow a lot of people though, but she's rarely used, or at least rarely seen from my experience because the method of activation is unreliable and terrible.

Okay but if the player doesn't get the buff he/she wants they have to right to complain or atleast want to control it. It doesn't matter if it was a 8000% damage buff or a 175% dmg reduction. It's frustrating and I don't know why you're baffled. If we want a certain buff we should either be able to control the light for a brief period of time, supply the buff ourself or DE needs to go to each individual map and fix some of the lighting inconsistencies for Mirage. Either one is fine.

[No seriously. This is a must for Mirage.]

33 minutes ago, TKDancer said:

chroma's buff charges extremely fast(specially scorn since shields are so fragile) and he can have both high damage and high armor at the same time after being show for a couple of seconds, so he wouldnt be overshadowed by a mirage with some control over eclipse

 

by that logic mesa and octavia overshadow all other frames in 99/100 of occasions

 

and making the solution creating a source of light/shadow while better than it currently is would feel... weird, mirage's theme is illusions and athletics, so having to hang in 1 spot for a specific buff would be weird

Creating a source of light/shadow would be fine because she has a little bit of a light theme to her as well

[No seriously. This is a must for Mirage.]

5 minutes ago, -Temp0- said:

Still useless.

That's not mirage's problem even IF you will completely ignore the fact Chroma is 10 times tankier and his damage multiplier is greater than Mirage's and that he's doing both things at once when Mirage can only do one at the time.

I agree. I feel like DE would be quicker to nerf chroma and other frames then give us these changes so that we don't have anyone to compare too :/

[No seriously. This is a must for Mirage.]

5 minutes ago, MuscleBeach said:

If you look at the second paragraph of this suggestion I made:

It looks like you made a good case. I would say Nerf the damage side of Eclipse a little (from 200% damage to maybe 190%? It should still be higher than Chroma since you have to turn on the buff with a second skill) and also implement the ambient light effect (Which makes it weaker than Chroma so it's only situationally better). Keep in mind, my suggested changes don't allow for 100% up time since the better of the two efficiency mods reduces duration by 60% and only 30% probably won't be enough. 

^

[No seriously. This is a must for Mirage.]

8 minutes ago, djternan said:

I would suggest that Mirage keeps whatever buff she gets when she casts the ability for the duration of ability.  She should also have some indicator of what the light level is.  This way you know what buff you will get and can keep whichever you want without having to stand in place but you still have to find/create a location to get the buff you want.

 

I like the idea of Prism creating a light source to be able to get the light buff.  Maybe Sleight of Hand could get something that creates "shadows" to get the dark buff?

Yes that's what I'm leaning towards. That way you can do work to get the type of buff you want.

[Mirage Quality of Light Changes (Video)]

We need to keep these threads going man. I wish I could bump yours up next to mine. I will for sure link your thread in my post.

[No seriously. This is a must for Mirage.]

10 minutes ago, MuscleBeach said:

What do you guys think about her always being in Darkness mode and while you channel your 4 or when the 2 pops, you're in light mode for its duration? This way you are in control and use her 2 and 4 more often. Maybe add a few seconds after 4 pops for light mode to linger. Or it fades away over a few seconds. 

You can even keep the ambient light as an effect, though I don't personally think it's necessary. When you're not standing in the proper lighting, buffs only work at 90% effectiveness instead of their normal 100%. This way the spirit of the frame is still there but you also have control of your lighting, at the cost of spending energy on abilities you normally wouldn't take the time to cast in most situations. 

Dude this is a golden idea. I'd prefer this over Eclipse being entirely light dependent. I and many other players would like to have more control with Eclipse. I hope DE or Reb ends up reading your idea.

[No seriously. This is a must for Mirage.]

23 minutes ago, deliciousdoobmaster69 said:

Also nbd, but I'm kinda butt hurt that the community is just now starting to take issue with this subject. I've been yelling about this terrible Mirage travesty since November. We would've had a lot more luck with getting these changes when they were actually messing around with her. Now we'll pretty much have to wait a year or more with DE's track record of warframe fixes. 

I've been noticed..so have other people. It's just that people shoot down other people and then say "someone else needs changes more then those frame does!!". Either that or the thread just falls off.

[No seriously. This is a must for Mirage.]

1 minute ago, deliciousdoobmaster69 said:

I agree with TKDancer, we talked a lot about this on my post I linked above. I thought at first a augment would be nice, but really what we need is just a straight up change. Compared to a lot of frames Mirage doesn't need to lose a mod slot to be on equal ground with her peers, she should just be on the same level as herself.

Well the only chance we might have of getting the changes are getting augments because DE is lazy a times :/

[No seriously. This is a must for Mirage.]

5 hours ago, deliciousdoobmaster69 said:

I've had a post up since before her Sleight of hand change talking about how garbage the lighting for her in the Plains of Eidolon. It's pretty difficult to be certain in all the other levels a lot of people will say. I don't seem to have to much of a problem with regular levels, but I understand the frustration. I was hoping they would see my post and tie a lighting affect into her Sleight of Hand changes, but I had no luck. Mirage is an amazing frame, but forcing her to depend on a crappy mechanics is just sad. 

My post got a decent amount of attention so I thought maybe when Mirage Prime dropped they would do something to her, but no. They pretty much dropped her Prime and didn't give her any love. It's funny how the past two Primes can get complete overhauls, but what does Mirage get? An animation change and a worthless aggro gem that doesn't even get affected by the mods she has. Well maybe range, but definitely not duration.

It seems like DE dropped Mirage Prime for the holidays not because they thought it would get better sales than Zephyr, but because she had a more complete kit so less work for the holidays IMO. Zephyr needed work and they were busy enough as is so they slapped a new skin on Mirage on said Happy Holidays, while totally disregarding the fact that Mirage is worthless on the Plains.  

Yeah it really disappoints me :(

[No seriously. This is a must for Mirage.]

7 hours ago, SPARTAN-187.Thanatos said:

I've wondered about Mirage ever since PoE released, and I wonder if some synergies could be possible to consider?

• So Mirage is explained as being a sly conjurer, master of illusion, what if casting Hall of Mirrors could be acting to also refract light from Mirage, giving here a cloak of darkness?
  • So not only do the doppelgangers draw attention, they could also work to have Eclipse begin in the shadows, so to speak, with enemies shooting at them instead of Mirage.
    • The Rakta Dark Dagger has a similar effect, so I've had this idea on the back of my mind for some time.
  • This way when Hall of Mirrors and Eclipse are both active, the default state for Eclipse as being very difficult to track from a distance granting the damage resistance buff.
• Next, then ambient light sources, Sleight of Hand's Jewel and Prism can function as sources of light that Mirage can use / generate on command.
  • As the default state is having a shroud, she can then choose when to ramp up damage when necessary in casting other abilities, as there are already different sorts of interplay in here abilities.
  • This also grants her a stronger degree of control out in the Plains to use the damage reduction out there and choose when to light it up to rain hell on the enemy, and could help with how she casts Prism in the first place (I mean the animation length and movement halting).

So could something like this be plausible to consider?

That's actually a very interesting idea.. :o

[No seriously. This is a must for Mirage.]

41 minutes ago, TheGrimCorsair said:

Would make a good augment for Prism.

Yeah would be nice.

[No seriously. This is a must for Mirage.]

2 hours ago, Calumniis said:

so the choice of either getting 400% - 600% dmg or 95% reduction for pressing one button is not op. Aha.

you know why that would be op? because it goes into the same niche as Chroma. As much as i love him, the buff is too high (not to mention of Chroma's other problems and that Chroma has gotten literally just one tiny job with that after times of everyone not giving a damn about him)  and now you want to give that same stuff to a frame that is (and would be even more) objectively better than him, hm?

What OP suggests is simply broken and hurts the already fragile balance of the game. This reminds me of the dude who thinks that Rhino needs to get the same slf dmg buff Chroma can get "just because chroma has it xdddd".

a frame that has insane damage AND insane dmg reduction AND crowd control? no thanks. Chroma has at least some downsides although they dont make up for the dmg buff admittedly. but he is on the rework list anyways so that will likely change.

I can see where you're coming from but there is a first for everything. It seriously isnt that OP. You're acting like there isn't a frame who can't buff herself, cc, kill,turn invisible, and supply herself with infinite energy regency (Octavia). All I'm asking for us to be able to create a light source that would give us the buff we want for a short time. Let's say 15-18 seconds. DE could make it to where we only have 1 or two a mission so we would be forced to use it wisely. I'd even be fine with a cool down rate on that part of the ability. Just be a bit more open minded please.

[No seriously. This is a must for Mirage.]

Thank you all for your either positive and or /sneak diss ish feed back. I hope to keep this thread going.

[No seriously. This is a must for Mirage.]

4 minutes ago, TKDancer said:

we have frames that can have ridiculous dmg output while keeping their damage resistance/CC

 

chroma, mesa, equinox, gara

 

making mirage a more dependable frame by giving us more control instead of the wonky light-dependant feature is just a must, because as i said, its wonky

 

u can keep the shadow buff despite being in light and vice-versa, there are maps where the is simply no light/shadow

 

we need control over eclipse in some way

Exactly!^  Other frames can do what they describe. Thank you for joining this discussion.

[No seriously. This is a must for Mirage.]

9 minutes ago, Arkandae said:

FTFY

It's faster to kill everyone than cast the prism.

I'm not sure about what OP means when he says "needs to be able to cycle through her light and dark phases".
There were suggestions like using her 2 as a source of light/darkness, then you have to stay near the gem to get the right buff. There are other issues with eclipse, like for example having a 95% damage reduction buff while being under a bright light. 

To be fair, even if it would help, I dont often need one buff or the other even in sorties so it would feel like a QoL fix, I can live without it. I don't think it would be OP though.

 

"Buffing" yourself with hikou/glaive/whatever (taking one of your weapon slot) because you don't often have the full damage buff when ennemies shoot at you. And Chroma is bugged af, 192000 damage on the eidolon with opticor, ~7500 without buff, how is that a 500% damage multiplier ? If they fix him one day, eidolon group will be more diverse (rhino, octavia, mirage,...).

Mirage is bugged too, but in the wrong way : 

 

 

 

No thank you a lot for letting me know!! I went about this all wrong. I shouldn't have said that you would be able to get the buffs with a click of a button. A light source is a really great idea!!

[No seriously. This is a must for Mirage.]

1 minute ago, Soldier1312 said:

Instead of cycling I lately thought about little bit of synergy between her abilities. I thought about her 4th ability being considered as a source of light that could change Eclipse's mode to +dmg one, but I have no sensible idea how one could use +dmg reduction mode in light.

That would be super sick!

[No seriously. This is a must for Mirage.]

Just now, Ragingwasabi said:

i dont see how its op if she can only cycle through them tbh. she not using them both at a time. situational stuff kinda suck especially when its hard to tell what defines as light or dark in warframe.

Thank you.

[No seriously. This is a must for Mirage.]

8 minutes ago, GinKenshin said:

that's not flexibility, that's being OP. chroma has his problems as well 

prob with chroma is that he lacks CC and deals dmg to a single/handful of targets, mirage can do that, CC clear larger mobs 


just because other frame are broken doesn't mean it should be that way. mirage is perfectly balanced, you're just salty here


again, tell me, and don't compare this to another outdated frame....what's her downsides with that change? 

How am I salty? Why are the people on here so quick to just call each other names and shoot each other down? It's like what the hell? One drawback would be uhhh I dunno. I guess it is balanced but players want what they want. It isn't like I've been the only one suggesting the change. I just want to make her a bit better because sometimes people just want to switch it up.

[No seriously. This is a must for Mirage.]

Just now, Cris0407 said:

No...

Deal with it :->

You see you add nothing to the topic. Why not? What is your argument?

[No seriously. This is a must for Mirage.]

2 minutes ago, GinKenshin said:

so you want a frame that can CC like crazy, either via blinding or using CC/AoE weapons to clear entire rooms to be able to choose whether it can deal more dmg or take less dmg 


so.....what will stop mirage from being unbalanced and OP if your idea does go through? what? low survivability stats? dmg reduction, remember? hard to get? it's a free frame from an easy quest, plus you can buy and farm the prime still

tell me a downside to mirage if your idea goes through. because now, her only balancing downside is that you cannot choose between these buffs 

Dude but Chroma can fricken get huge amounts of damage buffs as well as soak up damage and hit harder. What are his downsides? Come on man we need a bit more flexibility.