Azamagon
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Posts posted by Azamagon
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Joining the discussion about making Loki more supportive - sure, but I'd say make it more offensive and utility-based. I just don't feel it too fitting for a mischiefer to be so defensive. I think his Switch augment is pushing that far enough.
So, some suggestions:
Passive - Keep the wallcling bonus if you wish. But I'd also give him +50% weapon damage versus enemies he attacks in their back.
Decoy - Let him recast to remove it early (on holdcast, at least). On Decoy death/removal, make it blind nearby enemies briefly, opening them up to finishers.
Damage Decoy - Make the basic decoy (ie the non-enemy targetted one) also do the status-spreading when it is hit. Also, root the enemy if using the enemy-targetted version. Lastly, if enemies melee a decoy (either version), the status-application is applied in an AoE around the decoy.
Invisibility - Is fine. Maybe let us remove it early via a holdcast?
Hushed Invisibility - Either make this an exilus-augment, or make it add something extra (and rename it), like making it also grant added weapon status chance or something while Invisibility is active.
Switch Teleport - Make it also pull in enemies around a swapped enemy or Decoy (but not allies) at the end location. Preferably in a non-ragdoll fashion. Holdcast to swap with Decoy automatically, if within range.
Radial Disarm - On top of the disarm, also make it apply a duration-based debuff on all enemies in the radius (even affecting non-disarmable enemies), which does 2 things: 1) enemies suffer X% of their damage dealt back at themselves, converted to True damage-type, and 2) make them "silenced", ie unable to cast abilities.
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If you wanna add even more offensive debuffs, like damage amplifiers and/or armor removal in his kit, sure, do that too - but I personally think it'd be a bit too much at this point, and they are slightly overused.
However, my suggestions try to keep the abilities distinct and synergetic in a "mischievous" way, mainly with the additions to the passive, Switch and Disarm:
Switch Teleport is all about positioning, so it also makes sense to have it help bundle enemies up.
Disarm is the weapon-tampering ability, so damage-reflection and ability-blocking (to force their attack) makes sense. It also makes its natural Decoy synergy even better (and further so with Damage Decoy).
The "backstab" passive also kinda ties the whole kit together - because other than crowd control for safety and shenanigans, WHY would you like to control them, or change your/their positioning? Well, this passive adds an answer to that: To potentially kill them faster (and the self-damage added to disarm directly helps with that too), which is more helpful in modern Warframe.
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Could be fixed if they simply made the regular Decoy also spread status when it is attacked (when u have the augment equipped, of course).
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On 2024-03-20 at 4:38 AM, Pakaku said:
There's one fundamental catch to blast damage... It's almost always an innate element on explosives launchers, so trying to make Blast good means making those launchers exponentially stronger, and I feel like Blast itself is held back because of that
I think we probably need to do something like change Blast into its own physical damage type that launchers get, which doesn't actually proc anything and is simply there as an AoE stand-in that contributes some amount of neutral damage. Then we could turn the actual H+C combo into something actually good without worrying about explosives launchers becoming innately overpowered, but you could still have the option to mod it back in if you wanted it.
The other thing to think about is what you give up from modding H+C: anything else that Heat or Cold mod with, namely Viral. Unless Viral stops being the meta, we need to figure out how to make H+C worth considering. If it doesn't shake up the meta hard enough, then it's not really worth the dev work
I think this is the key!
If all explosive attacks' Blast damage was instead converted into IPS (mostly Impact, I guess?), then the combined Heat+Cold element could be changed into something else entirely, something useful.
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Wholeheartedly agreed.
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18 hours ago, BalBalPrime said:
Possible solutions to this problem:
- make melee attacks performed against the victim send out a radial pulse of reflected status effects instead of affecting only the attacker. This would merge well with the tendency of disarmed enemies to converge together around the victim.
I like that, clean and simple.
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Im of the opinion that Banshee needs 4 overarcing changes:
1) QoL, such as onehanded casting etc
2) Something to help her stay alive a bit better, which doesn't rely on CC.
3) A change to her Soundquake so it fits better in her kit's otherwise rather gun-reliant kit.
4) Toning down the ridiculously excessive strength of Sonar (Sonar-stacking being the issue here).
So, here's what I'd do:
PASSIVE - Keep her silenced weapons passive, but add another thing: Enemies can't see Banshee further than X meters away (this could change depending on her actions, so crouching is a really short range, but sprinting increases her visible range). If she hurts them or they hurt her, they can see her for a handful of seconds regardless of their distance to her.
This would give her a mobility/positioning-based pseudo-invisibility, which helps her survivability in a way that works excellently with Silence's functions, and Sonic Boom's pushback.
#1 SONIC BOOM - Mostly just QoL here:
Allow her to cast it and move at the same time.
All enemy projectiles are also deflected forward by the boom, capable of hurting enemies. The deflection effect lingers in the air for 0,5 seconds after cast, which means it also has the ability to deflect hitscan shots!
Instead of knockdown, make it stun enemies for an extended duration - still while pushing them backwards. Stun would work much better with Sonar's weakspots than knockdown does.
#2 SONAR - Now functions like an aura, more similar to Silence, lasting 15/20/25/30 seconds. Recasting the ability refreshes the aura duration and changes out any current weakspot points (allowing you to "reroll" them if you get bad spots). Enemies leaving the aura keeps the weakspot for about 5 seconds.
Augment remains the same of pulsating out new weakspot areas - but they can no longer stack on the same spot, just cover more areas of the enemy bodies. Could compensate this nerf by having the augment also add some more strength to the ability.
Overall, this reduces the insane potential strength of Sonar by removing its stackability, but massively improves its QoL, no longer needing to recast it constantly when new enemies arrive. Making it an aura also improves its function as an enemy detection tool.
#3 SILENCE - Can now be recast (and holdcast for a second to remove it). Recasting also restuns enemies within its range. Opens enemies to finishers by default, for as long as they are within its radius (even after the stun animation wears out).
This removes some of its anti-synergy with modding for too much range, in regards to its CC-capabilities.
#4 SOUNDQUAKE - This gets a rather heavy rework:
Casts a singular Soundquake pulse (like with her current augment) by default. This deals some initial Blast damage, briefly slows down and lengthily debuffs all struck enemies.
This lengthier debuff causes all enemies to "echo" out X% of the damage they have taken in a small/moderate area around them, including the initial damage from Soundquake itself.
This gives it synergy in particular with Sonar, as shooting their weakspot while affected by Soundquake would give strong AoE damage on all your shots. All while still remaining a low level nuke.
I dunno what i would do with the augment though.
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Good thread, i agreed with everything here.
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Not gonna lie, when I read the foreword, I was highly sceptical if this was gonna be any good - but you did good!
Sure, it's a highly simplified version of his kit, but there is a certain beauty to its simplicity that I can't dislike :) There are a few interactions I think need changing or tweaking (more to that below), but the gist of your rework can totally work.
Sidenote: I still think his current rift-functions can be salvaged (i'll give you a link to my own rework below, i would love your feedback on it!), but regardless, on to the detailed feedback:
Rift Plane + Stasis effects: These two changes are lowkey genius, hehe. It keeps the spirit of the Rift Plane to a degree, but removes the major cheesiness of it, and encourages and allows active gameplay. I think the values are potentially fine as suggested too.
However, considering how this "new" kit (revamped Rift Surge especially) would be rather energy-hungry, i'd also keep the energy-on-Rifted-enemy-kill (but lowered to 5 energy, maybe?).
Banish - Make the healing effect and Rift planing apply to the caster too, for a duration. Also please don't remove the strength-boostability of the heal!
I also love how Helminth-friendly your rework made Banish! Sidenote: Maybe Banish could need a new name?
Rift Surge - This is no longer "perpetual" like the current version (since current Rift Surge applies RIFT SURGE on others on death, not "Radial Banish", as that requires un-Banishing them with his 1 or 4), which would be fine if it did something else too. Like, weapon-amping Rift Torrent effect, but for Limbo only. Then the augment could apply it for allies too and boost its power further. But suggested as is, is kinda pointless.
Cataclysm - This honestly seems pretty solid, I guess? Seems fine by me.
As for my own rework, here it is:
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I tried adjusting them all, thoroughly:
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1 hour ago, sunderthefirmament said:
#1 Looks great! I'd play it.
#2 Eh... I get rid of Paralysis. I have no need of finishers with (current) Valkyr, and Ripline is dear to my heart. Even with its many flaws. My favorite Helminth on her is Wrathful Advance. Some might call it overkill mobility, but the stance for her 4 is so rigid that I'm always craving more movement.
#1 Awesome! :)
#2 I can see that. Ripline for long distance traversal, Wrathful Advance for a quick little distance burst and ofc the tasty critbuff. I personally put in Wrathful over Ripline, as Paralysis is neat for emergency CC - put i can see your setup being useful in the new Whispers in the Wall tileset, actually.
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3 hours ago, Redphienix said:
Not in the position to make a longwinded response so instead I'll simply say:
I like it!
1 being a grouping tool with some temporary (due to cheap cast cost) armor strip is an interesting direction to take it, I like it a lot actually because it makes me genuinely consider using it as a passive spam ability whenever I stop swinging.
2 could potentially get away with just using normal range instead of affinity since A: It can now be recast (so not as bothersome to miss someone) and B: The adjustments to her 1 would encourage less range dumping and potentially even range building on occasion- so she's not AS stifled by a min range setup.
3 becomes something I'd consider spamming during 4 for some added AOE, sounds adequate
4 sounds a lot more aggro in a way I enjoy. I do hope they 'improve' the stance on her claws as well, but as an ability this is nice. No matter how you twist it, this is a nerf to her current "Invuln forever" setup, but, it's also more interactive as you're spending health but fighting gives it back.
I would offer 1 additional concept. Her 4 should be a toggle state REGARDLESS of claws. As she exists now she loses invuln if she pulls out a weapon- and in your build she would lose 90% DR and status immunity upon swapping. 4 should be a full on toggle that changes her melee swap to the claws and activates these hysteria passives- that way she won't get bopped by swapping at the wrong time and can focus more on the health drain/regen aspects without worry.
Neat stuff :)
Sweet, glad you like it! :)
On #2, i guess that'd be true. Im simply just of the opinion that support abilities in general need to be far easier to apply on teammates.
#4 - Ah yeah, i entirely forgot to discuss about the stance >_< Her slide attack is really strong, but the regular combos need a lot of help, especially mobility-wise (forward combos really shouldn't stop your movement, for example). As for the durability bonus, i don't think it should last a long time when swapping to guns, maybe just like a second, then it quickly diminishes its effect (and immediately pops back to full strength when you go back to the claws of course). Because if the DR lingers even with the guns in hand, i don't really see anyone really using Hysteria for its claws...
Thanks for the review :)
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4 hours ago, taiiat said:
it doesn't have to be an Augment and doesn't have to be on Paralysis, just with the way these two Abilities work as is, Paralysis is the less clunky and awkward to use one, is all.
they're both arguably in need of being replaced entirely - maybe Paralysis is okay with some Mechanics changes, since the Animation is 'fine' and such.interact midair sounds like i might end up MH Wirebugging into a Wall while i'm trying to activate something, heh. aside from that uhh, idunno if Warframes really need a Wirebug, but i don't have a strong opinion on that.
Ah ok, gotcha. So, if Ripline wete to become more fluid and reliable, i guess you'd be ok with the suggested Ripline's new grouping mechanism? It'd be extremely similar to Prolonged Paralysis after all, just centered wherever you aim it, rather than being centered on Valkyr.
As for the Parazon spiderman-wire, i just figured that'd be the most logical place for it: You press X to hack (which utilizes the Parazon), X to finisher (on Mercy, yup, Parazon, so why not X for spiderman? :) Could be aim + X in midair to make it more delibarate and thus less prone to accidental use.
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3 hours ago, Nimisha_Prime said:
Valkyr needs her fourth as is. The rest sounds good.
In what way? Her Hysteria is currently quite counter-synergetic with her kit:
* Warcry grants a hefty armorbonus for her, which is pointless in Hysteria, as you're invincible during it.
* Hysteria draining energy means that you are less inclined to use her other abilities. This is generally a potential problem for all Exalted weapons, but moreso for Valkyr, as it has an ever-increasing energy cost. With a healthdrain and her added health-as-energy passive, she is highly encouraged to use her whole kit, especially in close up and brutal melee...
* ... and with that wonky "damage storing" effect on Hysteria, she is encouraged to RUN AWAY in fights when things get tough, very counter-intuitive for a BERSERKER frame! Berserkers basically live to fight, and fight to live. With health drain and health-on-kill, that moreso would be true than now.
* Hysteric Assault further cements Ripline as the main Helminth-slot. Imo, Helminth choices should be hard to make.
* There is no incentive to use finishers, despite that being one of the main niches of non-augmented Paralysis.
* And i haven't even mentioned the stance itself! It too has big problems, mainly that her slide attacks makes everything else seem useless, compounded by the fact that her basic combos are hella clunky and have no good procs etc
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40 minutes ago, taiiat said:
i think Ripline is the weaker link than Paralysis generally tbh, and so i'd rather keep Prolonged Paralysis
mainly because the physics of how Ripline works have always been clunky and awkward anyways, Paralysis is thin on useful Mechanics but it atleast isn't askward to use
shrugor i guess that's just reason to blast both of them into bits, and only ensuring to keep the functionality Prolonged Paralysis offers somewhere in the Warframe.
Imagining using my suggested Ripline, I can see it being a pain to use for grouping, especially when compared to how Prolonged Paralysis functions.
So i guess you and @Tiltskillet are right about Prolonged Paralysis, although I'd make the augment's grouping function a baseline effect of Paralysis at least.
One old and more drastic idea is to make (the mobility part of) Ripline a thing all Warframes could use via the Parazon - say, by pressing X (or whatever your action-key may be) while midair? That way, Valkyr could have an entirely new ability to fill in her first slot.
Back to the drawing board i guess? xD
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59 minutes ago, Tiltskillet said:
Really good stuff AFAIC. Except that I hate Prolonged Paralysis losing its unique grouping utility. A little sad with Rip Line losing its yeet, but I rarely use it for that...intentionally...anyway.
Yeah, I understand losing the unique grouping effect sucks, but that is exactly why i added a grouping effect to Ripline (which would also be unique as far as i can remember, becoming the only grouper ability that is also a mobility tool at the same time).
I was actually tinkering with Ripline doing a "group yeet" thing, but I felt it was better to give it casting consistency (ie Valkyr always going where you aim Ripline).
If nothing else, holdcasting could be a group yeet? I dunno, sometimes you just have to trim stuff to make it better overall *shrugs*
At least I felt that I managed to distribute the power more evenly throughout the kit with these suggestions.
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Im just gonna go straight to the point here:
PASSIVE - Nimble Berserker:
* Her quicker recovery from high falls and knockdowns remain as they are.
* Additional passive: If out of energy, Valkyr can use health instead to cast her abilities. Ratio: 1 energy costs 2 health.
RIPLINE:
* When targetting enemies or allies, Valkyr no longer grabs them and flings them over. Instead, Valkyr travels to the enemy/ally target. This keeps the ability's mobility function the same wether you target terrain or targets, giving it a lot more consistency.
* Upon impact with terrain/ally/enemy, up to 5/6/7/8 enemies (amount unmoddable) within 8/9/10/12 meters (Range moddable) from the impact point are pulled to the impact point. All enemies (including the main one, if enemy targetted) are knocked down and suffer 5 puncture procs each.
* Its damage component remains, and it also damages all enemies pulled in.
* Ripline augment -> Rip Apart (either a new augment, or a revamp of Swing Line):
* Rip Apart: Adds +1/2/3/4 max enemy targets to Ripline, and all affected enemies have their armor and shields reduced by 50/60/70/80% (Strength moddable) for 6/7/8/10 seconds (Duration moddable).
WARCRY:
* Now recastable at any time.
* No longer slows down enemies (the slowdown was moved over to Paralysis).
* Base buff duration increased to 15/20/25/30 seconds (up from 7/10/12/15).
* Buffing radius is now within Affinity Range instead.
* Its augment (Eternal War) also causes Warcry to increase all healing recovered for Valkyr and affected allies by 15/25/35/50%.
PARALYSIS:
* Renamed Brutal Paralysis.
* No longer costs shields to cast, nor does her shields affect its damage output anymore - in fact, it now deals no damage at all.
* Energycost increased to 25 (from 5).
* Affected enemies are still stunned and opened up to finishers, but they are also debuffed for 5/6/8/10 seconds (Duration moddable). This debuff has 2 effects:
1) The enemies are slowed down by 20/30/40/50% (Strength moddable, capped at 75%).
2) When a debuffed enemy dies, it will explode into a mist of gore and guts! The explosion damage is equal to 7/8/9/10% of the target's total health+shields (Strength moddable) as impact+slash+puncture damage within 3/4/5/6 meters (Range moddable). Damage is increased by 3/4/5/6x if killed with a finisher.
* Paralysis augment -> Prolonged Paralysis is now Brutal Rage:
* Brutal Rage: Enemies affected by Brutal Paralysis suffer 5/10/15/20% of Hysteria's damage every 0,5 seconds (note: this damage frequency is affected by Hysteria's attack speed mods!). Kills with this damage counts as Finishers for effects related to Brutal Paralysis and Hysteria (if Hysteria is active).
HYSTERIA:
* Only costs energy to activate, the channeling cost now drains from HEALTH instead of energy! The health drain ramps up over time too.
* Performing finishers pauses the health drain for 3 seconds (Duration moddable) and resets the health ramp up cost!
* Hysteria grants 90% damage reduction and full immunity to status effects while active, instead of granting semi-invincibility (nor does she store any damage taken etc).
* Now has a positive 5-meter aura (now also affected by Range mods): If an enemy dies within this aura, or if killed by Valkyr via her melee attacks or abilities from any range, she restores 5% of her max health (unmoddable). Finisher kills restore 4x as much health.
* The Hysteria Claws no longer has regular lifesteal.
* The augments could arguably remain the same?
So, that was my rework suggestion for Valkyr. What do you think?
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No mention of Prowl having way too many restrictions? Primarily, Iwould love for her to be able to bulletjump etc without breaking the invisibility, even if all those mobility actions are slowed down - this is less about speed and more about the jarringly different way you are forced to play to, well, not so suddenly die.
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Not bad!
While I would personally try to salvage Switch Teleport in other ways, im in 100% agreement with adding damage reflection somewhere in his kit (Which you did with Trick Treaty - I would personally add it as an added effect to his Disarm).
I also like that you added potential for strength builds, as that would definitely allow for more build variety - and with that said, I also like your suggested passive aiding with Power Strength to not make that modding TOO difficult.
I still think Hushed Invisibility is too limited and niched though. I'd also have it provide some other bonus, like added status chance with all his weapons.
All in all though, not bad! :)
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Two major additions:
- Ranged Incarnons now all gain a little bit of Incarnon charge with bodyshots - This is both for general QoL in this often chaotic game, but also to slightly depopularize the Torid a bit. The amount gained per bodyshot is all individualized, but the fullauto hitscan weapons generally gain the least from bodyshots (like 1/6th or so of a headshot).
- Melee Incarnon "meter" no longer falls off when combo points are lost - Melee Incarnons now also have a meter which needs to be built. Building this meter is still linked to combo gain and still has the same values required - however, due to being a seperate meter, the chance to go into Incarnon mode is no longer lost if your combo points are lost. They still require a full Incarnon meter to activate though. Also, when the melee Incarnon form expires, your current combo points you might have is immediately added to the next meter (meaning things like initial combo points are still very useful for quicker Incarnon reactivation).
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On 2023-12-26 at 10:26 PM, ArbitraryWisdom said:
Pablo is just talking about making how different buffs are applied more clear.
He uses Torid as an example since one of its evolutions is +Critical chance.Basically he wants to make it more clear that stuff like Point Strike (Multiplies base critical chance) is a different layer of buff than Arcane Avenger (adds to critical chance after other buffs), or Torid's Crit buff evolution (adds to critical chance before other buffs). Currently the wording on the buffs don't indicate that they fit into different layers. Pablo isn't talking about nerfs at all.
Could be worded so simply though:
- Normal crit chance bonus - like Point Strike (multiplies base critical chance)
- Flat crit chance bonus - like Arcane Avenger (adds to critical chance after other buffs)
- Base crit chance bonus - like Torid's Crit buff evolution (adds to critical chance before other buffs).
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Aside from the weird drop rates: It needs to be direct hits with the vial itself, the AoE doesn't count.
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Reworked his passive:
He still has a very long wallclinging bonus. However, he now also gets a +50% multiplicative weapon damage bonus, either while wallclinging, and/or when attacking enemies from behind them.
Think of it as an opportunistic / backstab kind of thing.
Not only is it thematic to a deadly trickster, but it also works well with his kit:
Invisibility - Pretty obvious, being invisible makes it easier to position oneself to attack enemies in their backs, or to be safe while wallclinging.
Decoy - Drawing enemies attention towards the decoy can allow him to attack enemies from behind without himself even moving at all.
Disarm/Switch - A little less direct, but similar to Decoy these 2 abilities can also tamper with enemy positioning, which can allow for some "backstabs" too.
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Why is it so beautiful? <3
Love it! So sad and melancholic. More of that please!
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Same here. Can't log in. And just as I took a day off of work! T_T
We Need an Update to Many Passives
in Warframes
Posted
A simple one could be:
When Loki attacks enemies in their back, he deals 1,5x weapon damage! A sort of "backstab" if you will (but works with ranged weapons too), which helps him in the offensive department, while still fitting his mischievous role, and synergizes well with all his abilities (as they all allow him to reposition himself, his Decoy and/or his enemies).