WernerShadow
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Posts posted by WernerShadow
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This thread got salty pretty fast...
On topic: The only ability rework Ash needs is for his Smokescreen and some new updated Bladestorm animations. Other than that he could use a passive and hes perfectly balanced
To this i can agree
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Read first 2 pages. Haha, this Spartan guy. Doesn't even know how Ash's ult works and doesn't know how enemy scaling works.
He is a noob we just ignore him true ash playrs know the power 30% of my warframe days has been spent using Ash i love him and would rage if they changed him
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Look by no means ash is a perfect frame, not at all. But he is not a team player, and thank DE for that, it would be boring. He is a solo frame, and he does that spectacularly. He is very very strong, with different builds aswell not only with 4spam build. Also you can kill everything in raids with Ash, and beyond raids, no high level enemies are worth killing.
That being said, i do not think Ash needs a rework, he only needs some adjustments
1- throw +1 shuriken for each level. (maybe even let them be increased in number with power strenght)
2-SS i like it maybe increase by 2 seconds stagger time and invisibility duration.
3- Teleport is awesome, it lets you bladestorm manually, reduce the cost to 15 and let it target more stuff, also add an aiming assistant or something to be cast more quickly.Or even go as far as increase the melee counter with each teleport for a set amount of time.
4-Bladestorm- it is a weak ultimate, but it can save your life and it kills a lot of things. I actualy like this one .... But if i had to id like it to be more like a large smoke AOE where pressing just E would teleport you to any target and play the assassination animation, while your clones also target other stuff. Also the smoke AOE could reduce enemy accuracy or some team stuff for people who like to cry. This way you get cc and more control over ash.
Here have my rework
I still like him as he is right now.
Blade storm weak? The single most powerfull ability in the game is weak? That is funny
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Exact.
Just thought of this imagin adding an excal with the radial finish augment 300% extra finisher damage you would one shot any level mob
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I'm loving ash prime , nothing wrong with him at all.
He's a great frame ... Especially running solo,
But people always complain that it's not perfect for them and that will never change ,
So great work DE !
Ash prime is worth the 90$
Could not agree more there is always people whining about a frame some people just can not be satisfied.
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I took my Ash to T4Int yesterday. Helped wreck all the way up to Wave 8 - and could have gone further if we weren't convinced that all the Prime Carrier BPs we were getting was going to continue.
Lets take this as a good example a standard defence team will be running a frost/limbo, trinity,mag and an excal or nova now just ad an ash and he deals tons of damage never even needs to leave frost or limbos dome and deals tons of damage and you dont need CC if there is no mob left to control
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The entire game pretty much revolves around killing things, with a few exceptions (Spy, Hijack, Sabotage, Deception, etc). That being said, Ash's role in a squad is to simply be an near-unkillable killing machine. He doesn't help out like Banshee or Nova by amplifying damage, or locking down groups of enemies like Nyx or Loki; but he kills enemies, and he's damn good at doing it.
What he brings to the team is nothing more than the basics of just having a teammate that most people take for granted. He kills enemies and revives allies, and you're not going to see him downed often like a Loki or Nova.
Not everybody has to bring overwhelming amounts of team buffs and debilitating CC, the basics can just be enough. Ash isn't the best room nuker, and he's definitely not the tankiest frame, nor is he the most mobile; but he's got all 3 in a single package.
There are times when I play Chroma that I wish I could just get all these enemies off my back quickly. Or when I'm playing Loki and annoyed when I get one-shot through crossfire even when stealthed. Or wishing I could get someplace faster as Banshee. About the only regret I have on Ash is staring at the screen wishing I could do something besides watch a cinematic.
I like yoy already the fact is thou 99% of every one who plays this game is nearly useless if the mobs are not CC into oblivion and that is why they dont like Ash. He does not make them look like good players they Actully have to be good
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Just remove Bladestorm and put something interesting in its place.
No no no no 1000 times no go away
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I use all of ash abilities. But I do wish his blade storm used melee mods, his teleport was free aim like dishonored, and those two abilities weren't so annoying to trigger (because of the insane precision u have to pull off in thw middle of combat)
He already use the melee counter that is by far more powerful since his ability completly ignores armor or sheilds
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Ash is great but his ultimate leaves something to be desired in the gameplay department, i.e. the lack of interaction. While it's great being an invincible teleporting nuke of a ninja, I did bring other weapons into the mission that I would like to use, but his Bladestorm is too good to not use often. His lack of CC in the rest of his abilities (Smokescreen stagger barely counts since you're performing the animation while it staggers) means that you're going to be spamming Bladestorm or Smokescreen often as well, to avoid damage. Or even Teleport-finisher; which IMO feels more like a ninja than Bladestorm, but is completely outclassed by the latter.
Other frames have nukes, but none of them really take you out of the game and turn you into a spectator like Ash does. But taking away the cinematic gets rid of one of his most signature perks (stylish assassintions), and would also remove the invulnerability perk as well, while turning him into an even more boring press 4 to insta-kill like Saryn or old Excalibur. Due to that, nothing short of a near-total rework can give Ash a new and unique playstyle while trying to preserve his theme and signature abilities.
Touching on another infamous press-4-to-win frame, Mesa's Peacemaker is absurdly strong; but at least it makes you feel like a gunslinger in a shootout,
at the cost of your teammate's fun. You're rooted in place, but you can decide when to end it. You've got an aimbot, but you're the one pulling the trigger. The fluid animations and effects only enhance the experience. Sure in the end all you're doing is standing there and pressing a button, but it has just enough player interaction that make you feel like nothing short of a badass. Ash's Bladestorm just leaves you there watching, and waiting until you regain control of your character.From a balance standpoint however, Ash is fine. He does insane damage and has very high survivability; at the cost of having virtually no CC or significant team buffs. There are other frames like Frost (being worked on), Ember (she's still meh), and Mag (maybe, she looks to be the new Excal of nerfs) that are in more need of a pass on abilities.
So while Ash doesn't need any changes right now, I'd love for DE to perhaps look at updating his abilities in the future to improve the player's experience while keeping within his theme.
I like watching him pull mobs apart with his cool looking assassination moves and there are so many frame that one would think not every frame has to get a rework its only because they primed him he now gets any actual attention here
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max blind rage hahaha intensify with rising storm gives me more than i need i can add transient fortitude if i dont plan to use smoke screen making my blade storm cost only 25 energy considering i have a primed flow on i can spam it 16 times if i wanted to but i prefere using all 4 skills during a match. With my current build ill damage a single unite hit by balde storm once for a good 34,500 damage over 6 seconds if i hit the same target 18 times he takes 621,000 in 6 seconds if i add transient fortitute in ill probably end up doing 1 mil damage so no they wont be a crowd left to worry aboutAre you actually serious? Are you planning on getting a x3 multiplier in a Void with maxed blind rage and duration mods on? You're funny.
And even then, that still won't kill an Eximus Heavy Gunner, and it will take you 30 seconds to cast, and you'll make the enemies you target invincible to your entire team, thus making your "incredible" squad DPS terrible.
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Alright...
"90+ minutes in a T4 survival. Level 160 heavy gunners have over 345,000 health. This isn't counting Eximus type heavy gunners(1 spawns with every group) which have over 600,000 health and Nullifiers. A max power bladestorm with 3x melee combo, which Nullifiers WILL interrupt your combo counters, only does roughly 50-60k including bleed damage.
Throwing out arbitrary numbers just because you think they 'feel' right isn't truth, its misleading. And you would get away with it too, since most people will never go that long. Much less with Ash; but anyone who has been that long with any frame will know what ridiculous bullet sponges everything becomes past level 90. And how it takes focus-fire headshots from 2-3 squad members to bring down one eximus at level 150+."
Don't even tell me how to play Ash if you're going to tell me to spam 4, when a SS build is significantly better.
Also, don't tell me "no one goes past 90 minutes", I used to consistently go to 3 hours before the game began to be unplayable with all the bugs on console.
Wow your math is bad if i modded him with no extra damage the base is 2000 and you will get a 700 bleed proc over 6 seconds for 7 ticks 4900 damage times that with 18 attacks 124,200 damage add the x3 melee multiplayer 372,600 makes your tiny weapon look like its not even there
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That doesn't matter. Armour barely scales, while health does. So again, it doesn't do much for how long it takes to kill. The slash procs take forever and you'll die before they do if you plan on waiting for them to die from slash damage, lol.
Why would I need armour ignore when I'm running a x4 corrosive projection, viral Dread build? So, my dread is still better, kills faster, and doesn't have a stupidly long duration to cast.
Have you ever been caught in a BladeStorm glitch in a raid? GG to you.
Long duration to cast? Must be an xbox thing those 10 fps. It casts instantly and armor does not scale? Then why do you need 4 CP auras? They dont reduce health you joke but armor
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So I'm garbage because I don't run a Bladestorm build and just spam 4 all day? Damn, dude. I beat I'm worthless to society for owning a console too. Thanks b
All frames have a single ability you over use play Excalibur and you over use Radial blind play Nova and you over use molecular prime every frame has an ability you will spam more often than not or you fail horribly and become a burden to the team
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2000 damage at base? It takes like 30 seconds to perform some times.
I can do 20k with a single dread shot.
Allow me to explain why you know nothing first Blade storm deals Finisher damage meaning it has 100% armor ignore he has 0 damage drop off unlike your dread. secondly his ability has a base of 2000 then he bleed procs them for 35% of the that for 7 ticks making for 4900 damage over 6 seconds amounting to a grand total of 6,900 of armor and shield ignoring damage and this damage is the same weather you attack a level 1 or level 100 Ash always does the same amount of damage
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Is that your mentality? "Leave him as trash, leave him as a low level frame and useless in the endgame". I have 300 in mission hours on Ash, and he's trash. His amazing Bladestorm ability is pretty terrible against level 90 enemies, and his SS only lasts 8 seconds at base. Not to mention even his Primed Version is super fragile, as he has no armour.
Ash needs a rework, if this game is going down the path of providing an end game then all frames need to be viable for it. End of discussion.
I have over 20 days of play with Ash and i can tell you if you cant 2 shot level 90 enemys with blade storn you are clueless on how to use him try this mod him for 75% efficiency get rising storm and take out your melee weapon now stack a 300 melee counter and watch as you 2 shot every level 90 mob your welcome
So in essens his abilitys are fine just trash players that cant use him
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With the recent Ash Prime Hype i now see posts to completely rework him don't even go there he works fine he is an great Assassin if you want long lasting stealth play get a loki.
Before he got primed most players did not pay him 2 cents of notice now all of a sudden he needs a rework he does not some of us have played him since the early beta and like him as he is.
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Ash Prime looks amazing, he really does. The most painful downside of how amazing he looks is that he's still just Ash. While he isn't as down as Oberon, he's ultimately quite boring as the best method to play him is to keep him in Bladestorm, watching the same animations over and over and over again.
As for in endless scaling, Bladestorm falls off rather quickly, as does Shuriken, and Teleport is just useless against a group of enemies. That leaves Smoke Bomb, a slower cast Invisibility for a stagger that can't even be used in the air. This essentially makes him a worse Loki, so if you plan to do an endlessly scaling mission, why not take Loki instead?
This is a complete rework, much like Excalibur 2.0 which led to the current state of Excalibur. The idea of this rework is to adjust his abilities to gain scaling and more practical utility, separating himself from Loki completely to stand out on his own and become more unique in order to become a welcome addition to an end game group while also giving more variety to the current playstyles.
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1: Shuriken - A single shuriken flies towards the enemy your reticule is closest to and deals slash damage as well as having a high chance to proc slash. Where the shuriken hits creates a weakpoint that doesn't do bonus damage, but instead simply ignores the enemy's armor or shields in that spot. Hold onto the cast button to lock onto multiple targets, or multiple times on one target, to launch more shuriken at a time.
Scaling off melee or secondary weapon's mods would be ideal.
Augment - Seeking Shuriken would, instead of removing only 70%, woud completely remove armor OR shield from an enemy. The duration of this would be based on the same duration as Shuriken's.
Shuriken would be affeted by Strength and Duration. Strength would increase the intial damage, as well as the amount of each tick from the slash proc, while Duration would dictate how long the weakpoint (or augment) stay active, as well as the length of the slash proc.
Reason to Update: Shuriken on their own don't get very far and have no utility alone. While the current augment already does most of what this update does, it creates a small, skill based oppurtunity to take advantage of, at least on your own.
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2: Smoke Screen - Taking a page from the new Radial Blind, Ash throws a smoke bomb straight down, be it in air or while mobile, and creates a massive cloud of smoke on the ground. Enemies targeting anything inside of the cloud lose significant amounts of accuracy, and enemies inside of the cloud itself become blinded and wander aimlessly and can possibly walk out of the cloud as well. Smoke Bomb can be cast multiple times to create more clouds, and for the sake of balance, caps off at three (and perhaps, even add a cooldown if spending all three too quickly?).
Enemies blinded in the smoke are subject to finisher attacks, perhaps Ash's special finishers with his katars to signify extra bonus damage.
Enemies are also given a red hologram/outline inside of the smoke, much like how when you see a blue hologram of your allies through walls/obstacles, making personal and team visibility a non-issue.
Augment - Smoke Shadow makes it so allies in the smoke cloud become invisible for as long as the cloud is up, stopping enemies from shooting at all.
Smoke Bomb would be affected by Duration and Range, for the time the cloud persists and how large it is.
Reason to Update: As it stands, Smoke Bomb is junk. You can't cast it while mobile, not while in the air, it's much less time while invisible compared to Loki in exchange for a temporary stagger. Making it larger and more unique, away from Invisibility, gives it more application, such as in defense or extraction. Other skill updates also promote Ash building more for duration as well, making this more synergetic with Ash's skills as opposed to how Ash is currently mininum duration.
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3: Shadowfall - Ash summons a number of holograms near enemies, each one grappling their target in a variety of ways in order to hold them in place, from pinning them to the ground to an elaborate arm lock. An enemy being held can be shot, or killed with a unique finisher per weapon type (Ash, specifically, using his katars). It cannot be recast so long as some holograms are in place, so you can't send out a hundred holograms to hold down an army. Enemies can target these holograms to try and free their allies if they have no other targets.
Heavy units in the cone will always, ALWAYS, be priority targets.
Enemies being held down cannot call for help or raise an alarm for the benefit of stealth.
Augment - They explode if you hit cast again. 100% blast proc chance, knocks everything out of the way. Also makes Shadowfall recastable on your own time. If a nullifier walks near one and dispels it, THEY STILL EXPLODE!
Shadowfall is affected by Strength, Duration, and Range. Strength dictates the number of holograms, Duration is how long the holograms exist, and Range increases the size of the cone, launching holograms out further.
Reason to Replace: Teleport isn't a good mobility skill, as you need a target. It's not good for your health if you target an enemy in a group and can't cast Smoke Bomb fast enough. It's suited to target a lone heavy unit in order to do a finisher attack on them, but all frames can already dropkick a lone enemy over in order to do a finisher attack. All Teleport has, in this sense, is the ability to catch up to teammates ahead of you. Why not have something more useful?
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4: Bladestorm - Toggle - Ash creates two high end holograms who act as wingmen, staying on his left and right, running and moving like actual units while always facing towards the closest enemy (or forward if there are no enemies). They draw enemy fire like any warframe, and block all incoming damage with Ash's unique katars, but Ash himself can still be targeted as well. Upon getting close enough to an enemy, a hologram will teleport from its position and initiate a takedown (like the current bladestorm) on whatever enemy is nearby and either return one it's finished, or jump to the next enemy nearby. Targets being attaced by clones are still damageable, and holograms will still be targeted by enemies in this state.
Holograms can and will target enemies being held by Shadowfall and use a unique finisher.
Ash will -NOT- join his holograms in their finisher attacks, giving him the ability to freely use other skills or weapons and aid his holograms in a way better than just being stuck in an animation with them.
And finally, the damage of Ash's holograms will scale off the mods of your melee weapon.
Augment - Ash gains a third hologram in Bladestorm that attempts to stay in front of Ash, in order to block any frontal damage as well as make it much harder for enemies to target Ash, as well as another unit to move into surrounding attacks for better crowd control. (If seeing around the third hologram is an issue, it can probably be transparent compared to the other two, or see through like Mirage's Hall of Mirrors.)
Bladestorm is affected by Strength and Range, for hologram damage and how close you have to be for them to initiate an attack.
Reason to Replace: Bladestorm is currently Ash's largest problem. The best way for Ash to survive being attacked by a massive group? Not Smoke Bomb, but Bladestorm. Need some crowd control? Bladestorm. Need time to recover? Bladestorm, not Smoke Bomb! Bladestorm is an instant cast, it makes Smoke Bomb pointless, and if you build for Smoke Bomb instead, it makes Shuriken and Bladestorm weak and worthless, as well as your own invisbility, because you COULD instead be playing Loki at that point. In this sense, Ash -is- Bladestorm. And you'll be watching the same animations over and over and over and over and over... Ash no longer joining his clones in the attack is definitely very, very important.
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People have always put Ash and Loki side by side for comparison, as they both have invisibility and are made to be stealthy. Loki focuses on stealth and makes little use of misdirection, his decoy. The focus of this rework is to make Ash the opposite of Loki, who instead focuses on misdirection and minors in stealth. Inspiration for this of course comes from Ash's current reliance Bladestorm, why not make it so he can do more with them?
Synergy is, of course, important too. Shuriken, in combination with Shadowfall, make for easy use of weakpoints. Get into a group of enemies while they're busy shooting at a clone and throw down a smoke bomb, and unleash a real bladestorm.
Team synergy is key as well in this. Smoke Bomb becomes its own way to defend points, making it hard for an enemy to attack it. Allies can hide in the cloud as well. Create more targets for enemies to target to keep the pressure off your allies, and take dangerous enemies out of play before they can really hurt a anyone with Shadowfall.
A personal favorite example of his powers working in tandem is with Loki's Disarm and Ash's Smoke Screen, luring enemies into the cloud with only their little sticks, a trap filled with Loki's Invisibility boosted melee damaged and Ash's continuous Bladestorm, making these two stealth frames create a formidable defense together. Then, add Banshee to the group with her Silence Augment and you've got one hell of a long lasting party exclusively stealthier frames.
Not only is each skill now more useful on its own with these changes, but in conjunction with each other, and as well as with other players, Ash becomes a silent protector through means of misdirection and assassination, making a safer combat scenario by keeping high threats out of play, and keeping your team out of sight.
I will say this only once dont you dare touch my Ash go play other frames if he bores you delet this post or change it as an augment idea but leave my ash be
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I got what i payed for and i expect better when i payed for it
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I would say more like bullet attractor and nyxs ult as bullets basicly charge it with damage
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This augment reverse the polarity of here ability and causes it to reflect bullets instead. She can now place it around friendly targets including pods and excavators or her self if no traget is selected. Any bullets shot at it is spinned around it giving the change that any enemy crossing into it may take hits from the rounds being spinned.
Size and durstion is affected by range and duration mods
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I find it sad that the no skill and noob players in this game rule the direction it goes in they never see anything past level 45 and figure a frame is OP try a level 80 mob noob and see what is Truely OP
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Balanced? Then please provide a proper argument.
From my perspective, there is nothing balanced about having someone stand on top of a cryo-pod, hold down left-click, and obliterate everything in a 50 meter radius.
Thank you aimbot is OP period how ever some noobs like OP but give the rest of us a skill based alternative
Ash 2.0
in Warframes
Posted
The only reason Ash would not get picked over excal is because most if not 99% of the players are not worth a dam of the mobs are not CC to death Ash brings high damage he is that frame that works in between the line and he has the single most powerful ability in game bar none yet most players lack any knowledge of how he works