YagoXiten
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Posts posted by YagoXiten
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If any ability on Valkyr needs removed, it's her four. It's one of the worst designed things in the game at the moment.
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the new blessing u suggest is useless as we can use melee weapon gain 1000+ hp pre channeled hit now
And this lets you do it from range, and doesn't require a mod slot.
You can just make Blessing and Link be exclusive. If you start Link, Blessing will turn off and the other way arownd.
I like the sugestions for the first 2 skills.
But here's somethign for
Link: Trinity links herself with 3 targets, enemy or tenno and as long as one link is active she has 75% damage reduction and full imunity to crowd control. If tenno are linked they will receive the damage reduction and control imunity. If enemies are linked they will take 100% of the damage any linked tenno takes(including trinity). Tenno will always have priority to link.
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Blessing: Trinity starts pulsing, globally, every second. Each pulse applies (base)+(multiplier x maxPower) HP shield (like Iron Skin) for 1 second. Base is affected by power streangth. Blessing replaces Link. The shield stops only damage but not crowd control.
So like this, WoL is the only one that actualy heals(preferably consuming only energy), Link offers damage reduction and CC imunity to tenno in range, Blessing offers almost full damage imunity with infinite range, but no CC imunity. More, because Blessing and Link are exclusive, Trinity would have to chose what's best for different situations.
It feels awful to have forced interaction patterns on your abilities. It really ruins flow. Furthermore, that would fail to solve many of her main problems. Trinity is highly non-interactive for both her enemies and her allies. Enemies are punished for trying to hit her, despite the AI mandating they should always do so, and players are rewarded with no need to make smart decisions. Just because you have a Trinity in your squad does not mean that you should be able to take no consideration for your survivability.
Why does everything have to revolve around damage? Why?
Wasn't Warframe supposed to be all about cunning (buffs, debuffs, stun, knock back, decoys, stealth et cetera) and mobility , and less about weapons of mass destruction?
I don't see how this revolves around damage. If you're referring to damage amplification, it's a filler ability, if you're referring to Life Steal, it's to prevent Trinity from becoming a glorified TF2 Dispenser. Because, currently, that's what she is. A masochistic Dispenser.
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blood bath seems out of place, and also isn't really cc. only singles out one target. Empathetic link seems cool, but not really useful, as she would be downed near instantly after casting where her damage soaking would immediately stop. Also the suggested 4th lacks usefulness, considering lifesteal is more of a way to recover from close encounters and can be easily placed on a melee weapon now.
Yeah coming up with a trinity rework is tough, which is why DE hasn't done it yet :P
This is but one of half a dozen reworks I've thought up for her in the time I've been playing.
The main point of the 3. is just to fill, I'll admit. It's the same stun as her current Well of Life.
I think Link would still be plenty usable. 75% damage reduction on her is immense. I was originally going to make the ability redirect a portion of damage taken, as the current Link does (though in a small point-blank AoE around her), but I'm hesitant to do that. Scaling off of damage taken can easily get pretty broken. Plus, I was worried about her ability to keep her allies alive.
This is all tentative and subject to change, of course.
The reason that I made Blessing Life Steal is because it forces Trinity and her allies to do something to gain the benefit. Currently, Trinity can hide in a closet and still carry her team through hour long survivals. If you reduced the range of the ability, she'd just end up grouping with her team every twenty seconds to re-apply it and little would change from the current iteration.
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Trinity is meant to be a Warframe with healing abilities... Where's her healing abilities?
Trinity is meant to be a support, and to keep her allies in the fight. Granting them Life Steal, restoring their Shields, and reducing the damage they take creates a very large degree of effective healing.
To be honest, this iteration is actually likely more overpowered than the current one--however--that's more of a matter of numerics than intrinsic design flaws.
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Hello, Warframe Community. Whilst I know that none of you know me, I have been playing Warframe since just after Sayrn was released.
I have about 120 hours logged into Trinity alone.Her current state is--and let's be honest here--broken as hell.
I've an idea for a rework which I have posted below. Please provide your feedback.
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1. Well of Life || 25 Energy
Drains 10/15/20/25% of Trinity's CURRENT HP to release a rejuvenating pulse, which restores 10/15/20/25% of Trinity's MAXIMUM shields and Energy to all allies within 8/12/16/20 meters.
Explanation:
Essentially, this combines her Energy Vampire and her Well of Life into a single ability, removing the redundancies with Trinity's restorative kit, and limiting her ability to trivialize Energy costs.
She still does have the ability to restore energy to her team, but it has an actual cost and must be carefully managed.
Increasing her Maximum Energy through Flow will allow her to restore more, whilst increasing Power Strength will boost the shield restore.
(It's also important to note that since the Shield restore is based upon her own Shields, the restore will have the same effect for her team, rather than providing better restoration on some targets than others.)
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2. Bloodbath || 50 Energy
Trinity levitates a target into the air, disabling them for 6/9/12/15 seconds and increasing the damage taken by the target by 20/30/40/50%.
Explanation:
With the changes to her other abilities, it was clear Trinity need a new ability to round her out. This should provide her with some much needed Crowd Control.
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3. Empathic Link || 75 Energy
For the next 4/6/8/10 seconds, Trinity gains 30/45/60/75% damage reduction, and 20/30/40/50% of all damage taken by Trinity's allies is redirected to her instead.
Explanation:
This keeps Trinity's solo-play durability in tact, but removes the offensive component of the ability. It adds additional supportive elements to her, so that she is not so selfish. This also helps counter-balance out the massive changes to Blessing.
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4. Vampiric Blessing || 100 Energy
Trinity grants 8/12/16/20% Life Steal to her allies.
Explanation:
The previous Blessing had to go for obvious reasons. Invulnerability, even for 'brief' windows of time could be game-breaking. Furthermore, the heal created redundancy with her other abilities, and the mechanics of the skill trivialized her team.
This new Trinity has the tools to help keep her allies in the fight with the Shield and Energy restore, the damage reduction, and the Life Steal, but her team is required to stay close and to take some active part in combat to take advantage of it. Trinity herself is no longer able to hide in a closet and full heal with Blessing, which means she must take risks and be actively involved in attaining her longevity.
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meh, because making corrosive with toxic and electric makes so much more sense. And viral being made with cold and toxin.
Ah yeah also magnetic being generated by what, cold and electricity? Everyone here knows of superconductors and makes the link instantly, right? Right?
Frankly, Id' really like to see the names of elements replaced with something that has some kind of sense in lore.
Say Fire with <Orokin Plasma>, Cold with <Corpus CryoTechTM>, and whatever.
As it is, it's between fantasy and silly.
btw, blast is probably the only combined element that makes any sense. Overheat very fast a very cold thing and boom it goes.
Wind is even more fantasy, please don't.
I think you're missing the point. I couldn't care less about realism. It's more about how Gas is not distinguished or unique compared to the rest.
(And actually, there's quite a few of those combinations that make some logical sense, not just Blast.)
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As everyone here knows, there are a total of 13 damage types. Three physical, four elemental, and six compound.Of those six combinations, most are clever and intuitive. However, a couple of them lack distinction, especially when compared to other damage types.To illustrate this, look closely at the definitions below.--------------------A toxin is a poisonous substance.Gas is simply a state of matter, though in this instance it is referring to a gas that is poisonous.A virus is a malicious microscopic unit that infects and hijacks cells to reproduce.A corrosive substance is one that will destory and damage other things it comes into contact with.-------------------Whilst it can be initially difficult to tell, it does seem that Viral and Corrosive are both very distinctively different than the others.But this leaves Gas and Toxin. There does not seem to be enough difference between them to warrant two damage types.I propose the following to fix this:First, replace the current blast 'Gas' with 'Blast'. Blast would now be produced with Toxin + Heat. As many chemicals are volatile and explosive, this is a logical and reasonable combination.Then change the 'Cold' + 'Heat' combination to 'Wind'. Anyone familiar with how temperature affects weather systems and wind patterns should understand why this is fitting.Status chances, enemy resistances, and some Warframe powers may require additional mild adjustment, but these changes should improve the intuitiveness of the current damage system.It would also help to improve Zeyphr, whose Tornado currently does 'Magnetic' base damage.
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For some reason my launcher file has gone missing. I think my anti-virus deleted it.
And the site's download page currently says it is not available.
Help please.
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Weapon(s) used: Scoliac, Fang, Kogake, Dual Zoren
Faction(s) fought: Grineer, Corpus, Infested, Corrupted
Mod(s) equipped/Stance used:Stances: Burning Wasp, Coiling Viper, Sinking Talon, Grim Fury, Swirling Tiger
Other Mods: Pressure Point, Spoiled Strike, Fury, Killing Blow, Reflex Coil
Thoughts & Experiences:Stances are too hard to aquire.
This game has a lot of RNG and grinding to it. It was not bad at first, however, as more content has been added it has gotten ridiculous. I paid Platinum for the majority of my stance mods because of the amount of time it was taking to farm them.
I should not be required to grind to experience my weapons as they should be in the first place. Imagine if newly created Warframes had no powers. This is effectively what this was done, and I cannot stress enough how frustrating this was.I logged in expecting new content in an overhaul I have been excited about for months only to be taunted by hours of grinding first.
The controls and keybindings need massive work.
They are awkward on both the mouse/keyboard setup and my controller.
During melee stance, I would expect left click to be melee, right click to be block, and E to be Channeling. This is not the case. Because of the current setup, it is especially difficult to transition between melee and ranged weapons, and I often find myself mashing Channeling whilst trying to attack.
On that note, Channeling in general is awkward to use for a number of reasons. Primarily, due to having to hold it down. (I would expect it it to be a toggle.) It's also difficult to tell how much it actually does. Sometimes all it seems to do is make enemies disintegrate.
The combos are difficult to initiate as intended. An on-screen prompt that displays what has already been keyed would be ideal. As would be a removal and replacement of any 'Pause' combos with 'Hold' combos.
An even better implementation would be an alternate attack key, thus changing the combos from [ A, A, Pause, A, A ] to [A, A, B, A]. In detail, this would likely require changing the controls to something like the following:
Mouse Wheel: Switches between primary, secondary, and melee weapons.
Mouse Button 1: Primary Attack (Single Shot for Ballistica)
Mouse Button 2: Zoom for ranged Weapons, Alternate Attack for Melee WeaponsMelee Attack (Default E): Alternate Fire for Ranged (Detonation of traps, Barrage of Ballistica), Channel Toggling for Melee
Melee Stance: (Default F?): Block
There are some other minor concerns I have for this system. Namely that certain stance/weapon combos seem better for certain weapons when it should primary be a matter of personal preference. For example, consider the whip stances: Coiling Viper and Burning Wasp.
Burning Wasp features long ranged, wide arcing attacks, where as Coiling Viper features a flurry of quick attacks.
Once again, which you should use should primarily be based upon personal preference. However, the way it is currently implemented, Burning Wasp is best on a weapon with low critical modifiers, low speed, and high base damage. Coiling Viper is best on a weapon with high critical modifiers, high speed, and low base damage.
Since 'Stance' mods dedicate your weapon to a certain gameplay style, it makes sense that mod layouts and weapon efficiency would match this. In other words, imagine if they increased or decreased the base stat values of your chosen weapon to reflect their intended gameplay patterns such as the following:
Burning Wasp- Wide arcing combos, -25% Base Speed, +25% base damage, -50% base critical chance, - 25% critical damage.
Coiling Viper- Powerful quick strikes with energetic flps, +25% base speed, -40% base damage, +100% base critical chance, +50% critical damage.
Again, this would affect the weapon's BASE stats, which changes how other mods like Pressure Point, Fury, Organ Shatter, and True Steel work.
With changes like this, a 'crit weapon' like the Dual Zoren would still be BEST with a critical hit build, however, it would also be a more viable alternative to use a different stance and mod loadout. To simplify: Gameplay and build dedication would be decided by Stances, not by the weapon you use them on.
Overall, I am impressed by Melee 2.0, though the controls are very lacking, and grinding for mods is the worst possible way to handle the stances. There are also currently too few combos, though I do not mind this too much. Still, it would be nice to have three to five per weapon, rather than the current two or three. Actual aerial and crouching combos would also be nice additions, as would combo moves that transition between standing / aerial and crouching / standing, etc.
There could still be a little bit more diversity in weapon builds, though I understand that to be a more drastic change that requires a large amount of time and resources.
Approximate Time Spent:
8+ hours.
Supplementary Info: Optional (Mouse/Keyboard? Controller? Coop/solo?)Mouse/Keyboard and Controller, Co-Op and Solo.
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Being able to burst and use a power multiple times, or save energy and hold it should be the operator's choice. If you want to limit that, the limitation should create gameplay not lock you out of gameplay. Nyx/Rhino for example need to kill their targets before they can cast their AoE CC again (Power In Use) creating gameplay and a new trade off to consider for +/- duration on mods.
A timer reduces gameplay and adds nothing to a game with only four skills. Their purpose is to prevent people from just using only a few buttons in more complicated games, by forcing the player to fill time while waiting for timers and create attack chains. This brings nothing to warframe.
I'm not sure on-what you're exactly commenting.
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I said CC and I said at High wave, later survival of which damage from frames is mostly useless save fore a smaller pool.
It messes with Vaubon shrinking his abilities by more than half(the CC frame)
Valkyr can be utterly ruined by this late gate as her timing is dropped risking her being being useless only focusing on a few targets or worse, being killed quickly from not being able to finish off her target to save her from the damage back lash. Her buff is now also spammy and short lived.
All of Ember's abilities, save her 1, while now more spammy are crippled from this as they grow with duration
Trinity has to spend most of her time spamming her skills more than doing much else and even screws with her 1 2 combo if there is any lag.
While it is optimal for some frame, it is not for others.
It's always going to end up optimal on every frame. The duration penalty can easily be counter-acted with Narrow Minded and Continuity, if need be there's Overextended and/or Blind Rage.
By itself--yes. It has some frames it breaks and others that don't want it.
Fleeting Expertise combined with other corrupt mods will end up breaking EVERY frame.
Vauban doesn't care that he loses power range, because casting it more and having a smaller AoE means that he can target his CC better and avoid the target cap on Bastille.
Trinity doesn't care if she loses Power Range because her Blessing hits everything regardless.
Ash doesn't care about losing Power Range because it just makes his Bladestorm end quicker and be more focused.
Volt doesn't care at all that he loses duration because Electric Shield is mostly S#&$ and Speed is laughable later for offensive purposes.
Regardless, that is not the major point of this thread. Like I mentioned previously, Warframe abilities scale in non-intuitive and silly ways.
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If it is just a 1:1 Ratio you don't gain anything and have to consistently use the ability, making moot that you lowered the cost..
Except that Warframes have more than one ability, and many of them have abilities that are STRICTLY BUFFED BY THIS.
Volt: Loses nothing on his damaging powers.
Ash: Loses nothing on any of his powers.
Nova: Loses nothing on her Anti-Matter Drop or Molecular Prime.
And it doesn't matter on for example, Volt, that you have to cast Speed more often if you can spam Overload or Shock to just clear rooms and chain stun.
EDIT:
Death is the best form of CC, and being able to clear low level rooms for no cost and to constantly chain stun or kill higher level rooms with powers like Frost's Avalanche or Mag's Crush can completely break some frames.
Vauban loses some CC potential, but can put out so many Tesla grenades with 1 that he can easily solo 20 wave Defense missions with the right loadout.
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Vauban is honestly probably one of the most overpowered frames.
Max Fleeting Expertise, then you can choose to use other mods like Narrow Minded and Overextended.
Your abilities are basically free, it doesn't matter that your Tesla does little damage when you have THIRTY of them out to instakill the first enemy to walk up to an area, multiple smaller Bastille's prevents the target cap problem, and Vortex has no cost but still does a large amount of utility.
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They should add cooldowns for some abilities, and Fleeting Expertises negative effect on power duration should make the cooldown last longer. Done, problem solved for one of the mods.
See, that's called a 'band-aid' fix. It doesn't address the actual cause of the issue--the way that Warframe abilities scale is broken--but it fixes the problem.
It's not a very good design tactic.
Doesn't Fleeting also take a crap on most, if not all CC abilities which are must haves for later survival/endless defense?
Nope. The way Fleeting Expertise scales is a 1:1 ratio.
You have to cast slightly more often but you get the same CC duration for the Energy cost, and it's pure win on any ability without a duration...Like most Warframe room-clears.
It's technically a 1: .95 or so ratio due to the half second or so spent in animation, but you can also counter act that REALLY easily by slapping on Continuity or Constitution.
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Too many frames have corrupted mods (and to some extent regular mods) that become just make them utter cheese or work in incredibly strange ways.
I mean, Narrow Minded on Trinity or Ash is pure win with pretty much no noticeable drawbacks. (Or Fleeting Expertise on EVERY Warframe--that thing is massive bullS#&$, if we're honest for a second.)
The way certain abilities benefit and others don't from certain mods completely breaks some frames. DE seems to be aware of this, because to prevent abuse certain abilities scale weirdly.
Like Vauban's Tesla and Oberon's Renewal...
.The problem is that this is really counter-intuitive, a band-aid fix to the problem, and is honestly rarely much of a detriment. It doesn't matter if Vauban's Tesla does not zap as much if I can place FOUR for the price of one.
With the way that Oberon's heal works, you're better off with a slow HoT rather than a quicker heal because either lets you heal just fine in between rooms and you end up overhealing AND wasting Energy most the time with your quick powerful heal. (Plus Fleeting Expertise lets you spam Reckoning which is a lot more efficient for regeneration and damage mitigation than Renewal.)
These kinds of things are honestly just silly.
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The only feasible change I can see Blessing undergoing range-wise is the 50 m limit for other skills. In terms of its invuln, a slight duration nerf possibly.
These changes would only make sense if her other three skills were up to par.
If her other three skills were 'up to par' at the moment, she'd be by far the most broken thing in the game. She's as she is now because all of her power is in one incredibly overpowered ability.
The problem isn't blessing is too strong its the other abilities are too weak to even bother with most of the time.
Did DE really really expect to heal someone with WoL do you tell everyone to ignore the WoL target and go hug it for 8 seconds to get a pulse that heals a pitiful amount of hp. If it wasn't for the CC people would be asking for old WoL back, except old WoL sucked too.
EV already had a major nerf. The problem was you spent energy on a target to get your energy back and a teammate kills the target. Now with power duration buffs you need to wait 4-6 seconds of it being alive glowing and stationary to hope it doesn't get killed while you have to stand near it to get your energy. I used to be a big supporter of no power duration mods on trinity for maximizing energy gain from vampire by letting it wear off faster to avoid the cap now I go full duration because vampire is worthless now. They killed some build options and made the biggest complaint about vampire worse. Their fix wasn't so good either giving the enemy 100% increased EHP while vampired just makes it so the enemy takes more ammo to kill yet still dies before the energy pulse.
I am not a fan of nerfed link. The extra targets were cool but standing in a t3 void defense and watching bunches of 2s appear for the damage is sad. Sure it offers a high damage reduction percentage but it really doesn't matter at the point where you would need it. Its either enemies are no threat or you would be shredded in a second with link up there really isn't too much middle ground and considering armor some frames can get close to the damage reduction of link passively. If trinity actualy had a decent armor stat it would be an actual tanking tool. Right now its pretty much enemy radar + a way to get more time to cast blessing its not like energy is a problem with how often blue orbs drop.
That just leaves blessing which I will admit is too strong as it is with the current skill set. The problem is trinity has all its eggs in one basket there needs to be some deep changes to trinity to make the other abilitys more viable before it is nerfed. The invulnerability is the only thing thats worth using if the other abilities were actualy worth using then they have to pick between being blessing bot or using their other abilities. Considering what stops end game runs is ammo attrition being able to use your energy offensively to get to that point quicker of defensivley to slow it down should still result in about the same number of waves in a mission. By the time invulnerability becomes over powered is about the time the enemies have enough dps to down the trinity while casting it. Most other frames do not suffer a down side from using their ultimate why should trinity? I remember when blessing had a 3 second duration at max rank it was on the list to leave at min rank but a 10 second base duration is too long they should reach a middle point to get the length of the invulnerability to a reasonable amount. The extra power duration mods is what broke it. The hard part is finding a duration where it still does something useful before you max it out and mod it and yet not too long at end game
Also nerfing blessing to damage reduction would be horrible. 75% reduction still means shields are going down in about 4 seconds. That means you have no way to recover shields or burst heal a teammate till blessing wears off due to power in use. So you give your teammate 3 more seconds in a firefight before going to cover then you have a 22 second wait to be able to do it again due to power in use message.
WoL is going to suck so long as Blessing does a heal. That's pretty much fact. Anyone low HP at the moment is not going to risk going out to shoot the target, and Blessing is a full heal regardless. It's hard to compete with that.
EV has been changed the way it was because it was trying to prevent people from maxing out Blessing duration. Unfortunately, Energy Siphon and Fleeting Expertise mods people are still doing it.
And that's all you need link for. Because Trinity is more of a mash-4-to-win frame than even Nova.
Basically, though, yeah, Trinity has too much in one spell.
I liked Trinity before the buffs to Blessing. I played her constantly. She was fun, and a bit broken, but not anywhere near as bad as she is now.
And 75% reduction is huge. I know it means at the highest level of content that you'd still go down instantly, but keep in mind /high level content is broken at the moment/. It has gotten better with damage 2.0, in some ways, but is still broken. Demanding Blessing or other abilities like Snow Globe and Molecular Prime to be blatantly overpowered so that they can enable players to do the highest level of content is just masking a problem rather than addressing it.
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YagoXiten, you have a point. Although, Trin really needs a form of invulnerability for herself at least - every warframe should be able to survive similar challenges, and without crazy AoE/CC invulnerability-stripped Trin will be even more of a weight on teams' shoulders.
Currently, she is played a lot more than before 9.8, solely for the reasons of people using her Blessing to push through the challenge. If Blessing is no longer a magical "stop-dying" button, which it shouldn't be, Trin is going to need her old link back at least.
For the record, I'm not citing my rework as the best solution for her, but it is one.
If you look at it, you'll realize she's pretty much invulnerable so long as she's working for it. CC immunity, the ability to heal and restore Energy, and damage reduction.
The only way you're going down with that is if you manage things poorly. At the same time, with the way the ranges and abilities work, you'll have to be mid to melee range to actually do that, which can open her up for a lot of risk.
That's the sort of way Trinity SHOULD be. High risk for high reward.
At the moment, it's AFK for infinite reward, and that's pretty broken.
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I didn't realize that Trinity was supposed to compete with "damage" in those regards.
You're not. And that's part of the problem. The only way to interact with enemies is to CC, damage, or hide from them. The first one is covered better by most the other Warframes or anyone with a Kestrel, see the rest of the post about the second one, and the last one is lame and amounts to having Shade and AFKing or staring at walls and boxes. I have no incentive, or ability to compete with them. So why try? Just spam 2 and 4 and you pretty much secure victory for your team without actually needing to play. It's not like you're actually required to do anything more than that, either. I can stand on the cryopod in Defense missions and do nothing but 2 and 4 without leaving my spot and still be the top contributor to the team.
There's a reason I only break out my Trinity when I need to solo something or to be god-mode for those ridiculously high level alerts. She's broken, and I get more satisfaction out of my Volt or Excalibur than I ever can out of her simply because I'm not required to do or rewarded for doing anything more than hitting Blessing and tabbing out.
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Why are you comparing a Moba with warframe? Actually I am not 100% sure why I am even going on with this at this point, in fact with all that you have said so far its actually made the cause that we both were going for look completely stupid. Why go through all the effort to break a character that isn't played all to often. I was pro change but not pro nerf which is the entirety of your changes (regardless of what you think it is a massive nerf not constructive to the character at all) but at this point this conversation turned me to prefer keeping her as she is.
To make a point about black boxes. Point was made. It does not seem to have been acknowledged. I could have used WoW, or several other video games, but I haven't been into those lately so it becomes harder to talk specific examples. I can't use any of the Warframes in this game because just about all of them are in some way broken and riddled with bad design. Volt has a couple of abilities with contradictory uses. Frost is pretty much nothing but Snow Globe. Rhino basically has Invulnerability and a stupidly powerful crowd control spell. Excalibur's Radial Blind is pretty much strictly better than Loki's Radial Disarm, and cheaper, and with no tradeoff for the strengths. Loki and Ash's invisibility abilities can be pretty much permanently maintained, allowing for practically invulnerability. Ember is just boring and basically four instances of the same spell. Nova's ultimate does way too much and Anti-Matter drop can hit broken levels of damage, Valkyr's abilities are clunky and weak and her Hysteria punishes you for investing a lot of time into picking and leveling a melee weapon, plus it's best used with War Cry--but feels lackluster if you dont' spend 175 Energy on it (and it's so-so at best even then). Vauban gets to be free win status on most missions because of Fleeting Expertise Tesla spam. Nekros has base stats worse than Excalibur's but he's all around weaker except for feeling required for farming. See where I'm going with this?
Why 'break' a character that isn't played? Because first of all, CURRENT TRINITY IS BROKEN. What this means?: You nerf her, she is S#&$. You buff her, she is hideously overpowered. She doesn't really have much of an in between. That's why I'd suggest fixing her core issues. Her last changes just kinda buffed her good points and nerfed her bad points. Blessing became quicker to cast when it was already too strong, Energy Vampire was really strong but required teamwork and is now much easier to literally remove Energy costs for her and her team, she gained crowd control. Her Link was nerfed, which makes her less inclined to use it to go toe-to-toe with her foes, instead preferring a more passive Blessing spam whilst managing Link so she doesn't go down trying to use Blessing (which is still strong enough to do this about the same as before)...
I have 150 hours on her, and the only reason I don't have more is because she's incredibly overpowered. I know it, my friends know it, and we'd rather have fun than just win the mission because I can spam Blessing.
Look, I like Trinity in theory as the battle-healer. And she can do that. But she's broken, and you can be more effective to your team standing in a corner and mashing the 4 key on your keyboard when it wears off. I often pick her on Defense missions and just tab out and browse forums whilst I count for when to cast it again, because I can't compete with a Nova or a Rhino or Volt, or even an Ash on those missions for damage, and it still helps them to faceroll the same as if I actually tried.
EDIT:
I'm also well aware of how much that nerfs her Blessing's regeneration. But she still has a Well of Life to heal, and she'd be trying to keep Blessing up constantly so that they would never lose Shields in the first place.
If an ability does 1,000,000 damage, yes, nerfing it down to 10,000 is a HUGE nerf percent wise...but that hardly makes it weak.
Oh noes, Trinity can't rubber band and save us all when we're about to fall...Perhaps she should have been preventing you from getting there in the FIRST PLACE. Which is exactly what I've allowed her to do.
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Why do I care? Cause you wanted to destroy the invincibility (the only the conceptually wrong with the character) AND the regeneration (which is perfectly fine the way it is).
Balance is that one character is on par with other characters while preferably being different. Your change makes trinities ult (100 energy cost) regen less than Shield polarize (50 energy cost) which is in no way balanced. I understand you want to make her require more effort but it really would only require the invincibility to be gone and replaced with something more interactive. While I do agree the fact that her having 2 heals isn't needed and her first is weighed out by her ult that isn't merit enough to completely obliterate her ult. There is a difference between the character requiring more skill to handle and them just being trash and your changes would make her trash.
If I had to pick between the way she is now and your changes I would prefer her as she is (and I am pro invincibility removal).
First: You do realize that there's still a 75% damage reduction buff, right? I don't think you're grasping how much effective durability that is.
Go look at DotA. Look at Storm Spirit's Vortex. It's nowhere near as good as Dark Seer's Vaccuum, or as Vengeful Spirit's Magic Missle. But it doesn't matter in the slightest because /of the character it is on/ and if he had a spell as good as them he'd be downright obscenely broken.
Abilities are not to be compared in a black box as you have just done. You also did not mention how Shields do not factor in armor, and how some damage effects like Slash and Toxin can just bypass them. Nor did you mention that Mag has only that to regenerate or support her allies. Trinity has another heal, the ability to grant her allies Energy, and to herself which can pretty much trivialize any costs she has. You can heal an ally with Well of Life, and THEN Blessing, for example, to make it a pretty much full heal. And with the damage reduction and restore, once again, your allies aren't likely to fall below half health very much ANYWAYS. Basically, Trinity now has the window to F*** up. That's hardly obliterating the ability. Trinity's ultimate NEEDS gutted, though, for the sake of balance. It's stronger than Molecular Prime at high levels. I kept Trinity's overall power level about the same, it's actually buffed her a bit if played correctly to the full extent her kit offers her.
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Like I said before having it be current health or a full heal doesn't change the fact that she is still going to have to watch the health bars. Infact I could argue that the current health makes her do it more. All your change does is reduce the effective regen of the skill by close to 75%.Trinity as a character isn't rediculous the ONLY thing that needs to be touched is the invincibility. Another sign of good design is not over nerfing/changing things and doing things little at a time to see what it does to the balance of the class/frame. Change the invincibility (which I wholeheartedly believe to be the only thing too strong about her) to something else and see what happens from there. Your changes assume that the regeneration portion of her ult is what people actually use it for which (surprise) it is not.
And the difference is that she isn't JUST watching the health bars and MUST be doing something else to maintain effectiveness. Namely using her Well of Life to keep people healthy, her Energy Vampire to keep her team's Energy up and her own ability to support in tact. This iteration does not promote passive gameplay for Trinity (herp derp watch health bars and four whenever), or for her allies (they can't just sit behind a box and get full health to go out, they have to take risks and play the game too). This promotes teamwork and actual support rather than Trinity just carrying everyone by being Trinity. Current Trinity can hide in a corner with Shade, use Energy Vampire, and then Blessing as needed. Not like she can compete in damage very well with a frame like Nova or Volt anyways.
Gutting the regeneration of an ability with too much regeneration, when she has an /another ability/ that does that? Fancy that. Removing redundancies. So she might have combos and use her full ability set.
And actually that's not a sign of good design, good design practices. Not the same thing. This is neither here nor there, though.
Back on topic, I actually was more concerned with Invulnerability. The reason the regeneration was massively gutted was, again, redundancies. She actually has a heal ability already, I don't see why she even needs the heal on her current Blessing. It would STILL be powerful if it were just the invulnerability buff. And if the regeneration isn't really what it's used for, why do you care about it getting changed? She can still keep her team healthy if she manages all her abilities, and works with her team. That's what she's supposed to do. She's still a battle-healer, too, with plenty of reason to dive into the fray and beat on things. Her theme is kept in tact, her healthy gameplay features are kept, the bad ones are removed, and she's much easier to balance numerically.
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Having the frame continue to keep an eye on when hp pools get low is the basis of the skill. There is no difference between current health/shield vs missing health/shields besides the fact that you basically take a S#&$ on the ability when you make it current. If it is current she will give litterally 0 of either shield or hp depending on if she decides to use it before the allies shields break or after. Ontop of this you are forcing the trinity to heal the ally when they get to half health which is super silly in the fact that we can't see the allies maximum health.
Overall you are decreasing the ults regen effectiveness by almost 75% (have to use it when they get to half health or shield and they won't recieve one or the other) AND removing the invincibility. Why? Because we said that the INVINCIBILITY creates poor play. What you are proposing would kill the frame and all that is wrong with it is the fact that invincibility is insidious to good gameplay.
The only thing trinity needs is a reduction or removal of the invincibility portion of her ult in exchange for something else.
An ability with a simplistic use pattern, which is always available, is pretty much going to passively happen. That isn't intelligent gameplay. That isn't skilled gameplay. That's knowing how the spell works. Watching HP bars isn't exactly exciting or all that releavnt in a fast paced shooter. And even games that promote that for healers, like WoW, they have to make decisions about WHICH heal to use.
The regeneration of the ability is ridiculously strong. And redundant with her first ability. There's no reason to distribute so much budget into this skill. And not being able to see the half HP is fixed with a simple UI update. And again, this requires Trinity to properly manage when to heal, rather than just "Oh someone is low health best 4." A live target crouched behind a box gets a bit of health back, and a damage reduction to let them pop out and hit a Well of Life, which encourages gameplay rather than having someone just save them by Trinity just being in the game.
You can still use it for the damage reduction, and it's still global, so your allies should, realistically, not be getting below half too much anyways.
It punishes you if you makes mistakes, rewards you greatly if you play properly, and prevents passive, uninteresting gameplay. All signs of good design.
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Not sure why current health needs to be a part of it. Just take the invincibility off and make it bring back up nearby downed allies and gives all allies a lesser version of rhinos iron skin. If it was current health/shields an ally would be at 25% and only be healed for 25% of their hp taking them up to 50% which means 50% is the ideal use range which doesn't make sense as an ult designed to save allies. Unless you meant missing health/shields in which case 100% of missing health/shields is still a full heal.
Because if you are not constantly using the ability to support your team (say you go down or manage your Energy poorly, or your team is managing their health poorly by facetanking Bombards), then it will not reward you. Effective clutch saves are now about proper decision making and Energy management, rather than just good timing. Trinity has the ability to always have full Energy. You need to have the frame constantly be burning that off, or else she LITERALLY has no effective costs and can just always use the ability when she needs to. If something is ALWAYS going to happen in a particular circumstance, then you might as well make it passive.
She can save up her Energy, so she can Blessing when she needs to, but if she saves up too much and is too passive, then her team's health will fall, and Blessing will not reward her.
SKILLED DECISION MAKING AND GAMEPLAY WHAT IS THIS MADNESS.
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A Trinity rework that actually balances her and makes her no longer broken, whilst still retaining her ability to go berserk and into the fray.
1:
Well of Life - Makes a target the Well of Life, stunning it. Whoever hits that target restores life. If the target dies before the duration expires, it will travel to another nearby unit for the remaining time left.
2:
Energy Vampire - Buffs Trinity, making it so that when Trinity damages a target, they are slowed and radiate a pulse that restores Energy based upon the damage dealt.
3:
Link- Trinity instantly becomes immune to crowd control effects and converts a portion of damage taken into Fire Rate and attack speed.
4:
Blessing- After a cast time, Trinity restoring 100% of her allies CURRENT health and shields, and makes them take massively reduced damage for a short time.
Why In Lotus' Name Are The Daggers So Slow?
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RIP Fang.