Viridias
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Posts posted by Viridias
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Lets try to explain this so you can understand
You are king of a country
Neighbor country starts flexing against your country, they appear to be able to take you over completely, assimilating you into them or just outright annihilating you
You throw them a big bag of metal or give them a discount at your country mart stores
Neighbor is friendly (for now) till they want more
Former potential trouble enemy is now a slave to your metal mine like the rest of your neighbors
Our sworn enemies don't take us seriously because they know the vast majority of Tenno are swayed by a big bag of metal. They CONTROL you now, instead of you controlling them.
Why are the strong playing the game of the weak? Just crush them, we rule the entire system, don't have any neighbors to worry about or have to offer discounts to
But by all means, continue being the so called "threat" when in fact you are just another controllable entity by those weaker than you
Okay so I gotta ask - what IS it with you and this bizarre vaguely Fascist rhetoric anyway? (Not even gonna touch your absurd reading of the lore...)
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What's not to understand? You guys insist on degrading the Tenno culture so that you can make money off of sworn enemies instead of outright beating them and removing them from the system
Sounds legit
Tenno Judas as far as the eye can see
Take your soapbox BS elsewhere, we're not buying.
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When you take over the entire system... why do you need to trade with anyone?
You own it all
Und hier wi haben ein Exhibit Ei ov Not Knowing How S#&$ Works. Or even understanding the discussion.
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Funny - the last I checked even the most ideologically committed regimes and movements always ultimately found it necessary to do their accounting and pay their soldiers in, surprise surprise, cash.
Or in kind if things were too primitive for such sophistry, but the fundamentally economic nature of the transactions has ever been an universal constant.
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I know that there are countermeasures, but it can be overcome.
Not by woolly handwaves and one reactor failing they don't. A space warship's power grid must pretty much by definition be rather well hardened against power surges and other unpleasantness, and backup generators and reserve batteries are very much a given.
Outside what the reactor failure may do to the device's immediate physical surroundings the main plausible result is power loss; total in the unlikely case there's just one powerplant, partial otherwise.
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Runaways and overheating can overcome the checks to ensure that it would not destroy the ship.
Chernobyl had the similar checks (granted, it was not done as well), but the criticality accident still overcame it and caused the power spike to make Reactor #4 explode. So there is that possibility.
They were actually deliberately bypassing many of the safeties for the somewhat ill-advised tests. And that reactor type has some rather dubious design quirks to begin with. Anyways, the rest of the plant was cheerfully kept in operation into the Nineties - the last reactor wasn't shut down before the year 2000.
Compartementalisation.
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I'm saying SW is full of $&*&*#(%& bullS#&$ and should never be even attempted to be used as any kind of argument. The scene you described was merely one of only too many pointlessly and criminally idiotic details.
Also are you seriously trying to argue people who designed huge-&#! spaceships, nevermind for battle, didn't build in quite enough redundancy, circuit breakers, compartementalisation and other damage control measures to keep that kind of chain-reaction crap from happening? Get out of here.
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>Star Wars
>nope.jpg
And these aren't wet-navy ships that can sink (the wrecks of those can be rather physically intact, anyway). You literally have to physically take them apart to actually destroy them, and their sheer size already is going to make that a LOT of work. All the inevitable compartementalisation and then armour and structural reinforcement in ones actually designed for combat is going to make that a tall order.
Kinda dubious of messing with one reactor core being capable of actually destrying ships that large, or being able to power them in the first place. Multiple redundancies are likely in place, but having one of the powerplants do the ultra-tech equivalent of Chernobyl #4 and likely doing Bad Things to immediately surrounding partitions is unlikely to much help everyday operations.
Might well require the ship being withdrawn to the equivalent of dry-dock for God knows how long for powerplant refit even if no spectacular fireworks result; that'd be a cheap way to temporarily knock a big ship off the rolls and tie up dock capacity in the process, which would seem to go well with the "sabotage and confuse" strategy the Lotus seems to be pursuing.
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then what happens if someone crushed your dreams or caused your plan to fail
I have no hopes or dreams, but I'll tell you once that happens.
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All true and soundly stated ... however, so is this: "We pledge to each other our lives, our fortunes, and our scared honor."
I believe that there is room for a wide range of motivations for the Tenno ... after all, they too were reluctant warriors who became revolutionaries
Hey, I was mainly giving a counterpoint to that joker's over-simplistic nonsense.
And Theban Sacred Band ftw as far as pledges unto death go. :P
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You do realise that we can just destroy the control bridge of the ship itself to destroy the ship, for one (or at least disable the ship)? Or start a small chain reaction with destroying one of the power cores on the ship, messing up at least a part of the ship?
And where did I say anything about self-destruct mechanisms on a ship? Who would do that?
Disabling vessels and destroying vessels are two completely different things. Especially in the case of armoured battleships deliberately designed to be hard to kill. To give a wet-navy analog, the Bismarck was rendered all but unmaneuverable by a single torpedo that damaged its rudder and propulsion but actually sinking the big bastard took sustained pounding by multiple heavy surface units and ultimately the crew setting off scuttling charges.
Ofc, spacecraft can't even be sunk so the equivalent of scuttling charges would presumably just wreck vital systems so as to leave the hulk unfit for recovery by the enemy.
Self-destruct systems are inherently topical because some form has been par for the course for military vessels since forever and more to the point those would be the only way to even theoretically destroy the locale while the Tenno are actually still around.
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No one should take any Tenno seriously at this point. Instead of reclaiming the right to rule we seem to be more occupied with squabbling over loose change.
Very few Tenno grasp the notion that sometimes... it ain't about the money
It is you!!
Sers, give it a freaking rest. If the Tenno as a group had any interest in "the right to rule" to begin with they kinda wouldn't have collectively gone into cryostasis sleep without setting wake-up timers after wiping out their erstwhile masters, duh.
And it is ALWAYS about the money. The matter has been pithilily summarised by people ranging from Classical authors ("the sinews of war - unlimited money") to Medieval condottieri (Charles VIII: "what would you consider the most important to wage war?" Italian commander, unhesitantly: "money, more money, always money."), and well enough borne out in practical experience.
It's The Economy, Stupid as the saying goes.
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Has no bearing on the possibility of scuttling a ship that size nor relevance in if doing so is worth it to destroy one cell of Tenno.
That would be up to the Grineer in question or the lore.
Please srtop failing your economics forever and more importantly basing your arguments on such. Spacecraft that large are going to take a lot of time and resources to build, you don't start blowing them up just because you MIGHT get lucky and nail 1-4 SPESS NINJEEHS in the process.
There are quite a few explosive barrels and exposed cores on the Grineer ship.
Destroying it may not be a problem. Getting the debris not to land on any planet might pose a slight challenge.
I think you people are MAJORLY underestimating the kind of effort required to demolish a frikken warship that large if you don't have a decent-sized battlefleet in position. And considering the kinds of time-windows Tenno strikes tend to take and their apparent habit of interfering with the target vessel's communications (to wit, the ambient radio chatter with the "...XYZ, Tenno signals converging on your position... XYZ, do you copy...?" lines) just getting the necessary amount of firepower organised in time seems quite unlikely.
Much of the time the target vessel or base itself seems at best poorly aware of the intrusion, EW at work again presumably, so even if they actually had the means to self-destruct the place it's unlikely they'd manage to before the Tenno were back on their Lisets.
And consider: if such self-destruct systems were a common feature, what exactly would keep those selfsame Tenno strike teams from seeking out the controls for them and merrily wrecking those huge and doubtless appallingly expensive ships and bases for remarkably little effort...?
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Or she coulda been an Orokin dissident who became disillusioned with the system and conspired with the Tenno to put paid to it. Or, over the course of her apparent association with them over the war, came to identify more with the supersoldiers than her more-or-less peers and thus went along with their rebellion plan. Or God knows how many other possible and at least as convoluted scenarios, it's not like we knew diddly squat about the motivations of the revolt or even where the idea originated. Could even been the result of some kind of "memetic warfare" effort by the Sentients as a final eff-you to the Orokin for all we know.
Hell, the jury's still out on whether the Lotus is a specific individual or a position.
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I stem my evidence from the fact that nowhere in any suit have seams. Lol.
And I'm sure we've all seen the warframe's backs enough to see there are no damn zippers!
No seams? You must be looking at different 'Frames than I am, 'cause I can see plenty of those in most...
And given that we're talking about the products of NANOMACHINES, SON and similar ultra-tech material engineering there seems to be no reason to assume any openings for the ingress and egress of the wearer wouldn't close seamlessly, anyway. These rather obviously aren't the damn jeans you're wearing.
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Jiggle physics? Applied to Saryn pls? O_O
Dream on, she's the exact only female Frame to have proverbial Breast Plates courtesy of whatever that rigid-looking bone-like stuff all over her is. Oughta make her the dead last lady those'd apply to, besides "literal birdchest" Zephyr.
Why yes, crushing peoples' dreams indeed gives me both pleasure and strenght; why do you ask?
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If anything I'd probably guess hydraulic limbs and traditional motors, looking at the legs of a MOA.
*shrug* Could also be myomer pseudo-muscles, F***ING MAGNETS in some form or something even more gratuitously high-tech, or why not some combination. Not really important for the main point anyway.
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Always wondered about that
Whether it is simple DEV game programmer zeal or they spurt red motor oil or maybe some of the robotic components are organic
A riddle, wrapped in a mystery, inside an enigma ...
Eh, Patton tanks (M60s? can't be arsed to go all WoT nerd ATM and check) were notorious for the red "cherry juice" used in their turret hydraulics. Mainly because apparently the stuff was highly flammable and the pipes fragile enough to get torn alarmingly readily by hits on the vehicle...
I gather the Israelis were quite unhappy to learn this the hard way under fire and insisted on making a bunch of modifications on the cans after the war.
Anyways, we have no idea what kind of tech it is that actually moves the Corpus battlewalkers; to speak nothing of possible coolant fluids, high-tech gunk in powerpacks and probably any number of other things that might require liquids sloshing around in them for perfectly legitimate engineering reasons.
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Well from the excal codex it sounds like they had all but lost when they created the warframes. Still, at their level of technology rebuilding would be easy, and if they expanded into the sentient system they'd have even more resources to take advantage of.
Sounded like even with their newfangled Space Ninja Wizards they still suffered casualties a-plenty though. Expansion to newly vacated premises only comes up on the agenda if your economy and demographics actually allow for it, and the former in particular was almost certainly a tottering wreck - remember, the Orokin state had nobody to get assistance from; all the burden had to be shouldered domestically to the bitter end. Know much about what things were like in Germany towards the end of both World Wars...?
More to the point, that the Tenno could be recalled for pageantry and victory parade stuff basically means the Sentients and their ill-defined ability to "turn" technology were no longer relevant, likely meaning dead and routed past any likely reinitiation of contacts. Hard to see what the war-weary Tenno vets would have against the state claiming the worlds so viciously fought over as their rightful spoils, and it's not like there's been the slightest hint anywhere that there were competing claims from any party.
Whatever it was that motivated the Tenno revolt in the aftermath of the war was nigh certainly related to domestic matters; further than that moves to the field of idle speculation given the desperate shortage of information we have of the workings of the Orokin-era state and society and just where the Tenno fit in the picture.
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The void seems to be sort of a "sub-plane" of existence, rather than a series of pocket dimensions. It also seems to behave differently than reality, because travel through it is seemingly instantaneous. If you listen to the radio transmissions, one of the grineer rail operators basically says that ships going from rail to rail are shot through the void. This makes me think it's like the warp from 40k, a separate plane of existence that allows FTL travel.
Eh, pay closer attention please. The "pocket dimensions" there are the artifacts of the Orokin derelicts and towers and whatever else they might have left there by intent or accident; artificial "bubbles of reality" by some technological means separated from the surrounding alien universe.
But yeah, seems to be involved in the setting's space-travel shenanigans in some fashion. And weird superpowers. An obvious difference from the Warp of WHverse would be the acute shortage of very strange but only too sentient native energy life prone to taking active and highly unpleasant attention of the material world and its inhabitants...
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Anyways, as for the question of what changed, the Orokin were probably emboldened by their survival. They now had a whole new system to expand their influence in to, and presumably new peoples to conquer.
Eh, sounded to me like the elusive Sentients were the exact only recognisably intelligent alien species the Orokin discovered - hence the name - and the experience likely wasn't encouraging. Plus the snippets of lore we have of the war itself hint at it having been terribly costly and grueling; while there's no hint of how the conflict was finally won the manner was apparently decisive enough that the surviving Tenno could be called home for some kind of grand victory ceremony (as related by the Stalker), ie. they weren't needed to snuff out remaining pockets of resistance or serve as rapid-response reserve for some kind of occupation force.
The war likely stretched the Orokin state very thin indeed; I reckon they were going to need at least one generation's worth of rebuilding and general breath-catching before they could so much as seriously start planning for any real follow-up moves.
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Utterly different, sure
But we are talking about science fiction, not applied theoretical ecology ... so I don't agree with you that the question is pointless
It is, however, quite academic. Purely theoretical. We don't really know what humans actually *do* with the Void, but exposing people to it in some fashion appears to have been a key step in creating the super-powered Tenno and the Orokin apparently liked to use it for installations hidden in obviously very long-lived "pocket realities" of sort. Spaceships can apparently also get stuck there somehow so it may have something to do with the space-travel technology of the setting, and Infested critters apparently like to use such derelicts as their "home bases" - which in turn suggests even they can somehow move between such "islands of reality" there.
The Tenno seem to be able to reach specific sites there without trouble in nothing more than their Lisets so long as they actually know where to go looking, and the Grins and Corps seem to have much the same capability despite being presumably less familiar with the principles of the place than the ancient super-commandos.
This crap has been going on since God knows when, at the very least the Orokin era; quite a while in any case. There's no indication that any entities that might exist there have paid any heed to such extended human trespassing of their plane of existence, or if they have they clearly quite lack the ability to do anything concrete about it. Nor is there even the slightest hint in the lore that during all their interaction with the place the humans had observed anything even remotely recognisable as some kind of native lifeform.
As such the whole topic is basically arguing about angels on the head of a pin. Might be a good way to pass the time and even good mental exercise (though I have deep-seated doubts about Internets forum debates), but bearing no relevance to anything.
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Well, a lens has to be JUST RIGHT to be able to focus something the way you need it to be focused - could be that the Warframes HAVE to come in those gender-looks because of the same "just right" principle (would also explain why male-female variants aren't something on DE's 'to-do-right-now' list, even though it would make them a NICE bit of money off of people).
Implying that this hypothetical energy-Tenno, whatever it was before attaining its current state, must inhabit a physical form of specific female shape to utilise its powers to manipulate heat and a specific male shape to manipulate water.
This obviously raises a whole slew of related questions, cursory examination of which suggest they just lead into a morass of handwave ad-hoc excuses and an awful mess.
I repeat, "makes no sense whatsoever". I'd rather just apply Occam's Razor here and go with the obvious enough explanation of Gameplay And Story Segregation necessary mainly due to the "character independent" way progress in the game is traced. We're already accepting the essential immortality of the named boss characters as "one of those MMO things", not seeing why tortuously convoluted theorycrafting is required with this one.
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Maybe "us" means everyone else ever.
Or maybe he likes pretending to be royalty. Man's gotta develop a few hobbies to pass the time.
The Grineer And Corpus Don't View Tenno As A Threat
in General Discussion
Posted
So care to quote the exact part of the backstory where they became such? Because the last I checked the Infested were everyone's natural enemy by default and the Grineer only had some kind of rather one-sided ideological thing going.
I don't quite see the problem here, though I was also under the impression players tended to prefer being paid in kind (ie. in rare resources and such) instead.
Not particularly seeing the issue in helping the two major power blocks screw each other over and taking their money for it to boot to be used for our own purposes. Seems like first-rate "divide and conquer" policy to me.
The fundamental problem here rather appears to be you copping some kind of bizarre and terribly impractical puritan attitude and shouting loudly at anyone who doesn't agree with your nonsense.