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SortaRandom

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  1. This looks hella dope. Hot dang. The mobility from the Hold combo looks MUCH better than I was anticipating (i.e. much better than what Iron Staff has right now), and that base range looks satisfying to use! BUT: A couple of quick comments on certain topics: ALIGNING MELEE ATTACKS TO CAMERA DIRECTION: This wasn't mentioned at all in this thread. I play with this option disabled (as is standard in any "monster-hunting" type of game, e.g. Dark Souls / Monster Hunter / Dauntless / Vindictus), and it works fine since most weapons/stances don't have directional combos... but the current Iron Staff preview unfortunately doesn't support this style at all (i.e. all "forward" combos only activate when holding W, but not A,S,D). Are there plans to give the "align melee attacks to camera" option a quick review, so that it's properly compatible with Melee 3.0 (i.e. could y'all let A,S,D activate the "forward" combos in addition to W)? Or are players like myself kinda just SOL? BLOOD RUSH AND MAIMING STRIKE: I'm glad that the spin2win meta is being toned down, but I haven't seen any mention of the current multiplicative scaling between these two mods. Maiming Strike's +90% CC bonus is currently multiplied by Blood Rush, and that's why the MS+BR combo is so overpowered in the first place. If I'm interpreting this correctly and Maiming Strike is now multiplicative rather than additive (a la True Steel), then it sounds like Maiming Strike itself is being gutted, even though it's the MS+BR interaction that's the problem. Example: A fake melee weapon with 0% crit chance will currently have >535% crit chance at 3.0x combo if MS+BR are equipped. My solution: Let MS apply after BR, not before. This way, the same weapon will have a flat 90% crit chance, regardless of combo. Current plan: MS is multiplicative, so the same weapon has 0% crit chance, and MS is unusable on weapons with low base crit chance. <-- Not good. (I've been saying this repeatedly in numerous feedback threads for literally years, and I know I'm not the only one. Not seeing any mention of this here is a little bit disheartening, to say the least.)
  2. Excalibur, but with a long-reaching melee weapon and negative STR. Use Slash Dash to get around, use Blind for stealth bonus damage from melee weapons (especially polearms/whips/gunblades/glaives, so you don't get sucked into Finisher attacks on every enemy), and never ever press 3 or 4. You'll also have fantastic CC, which works wonders on large maps. Also, Wukong.
  3. Me anticipating literally any Melee 3.0 information after more than a month of no devstreams:
  4. Side note, it also works with Exalted Blade regardless of what melee you have equipped.
  5. I'm VERY happy with the rotations being changed across game modes, but this particular mod... ... THIS PARTICULAR MOD... ... doesn't really inspire confidence for, well, Melee 3.0 in its entirety. In the game's current state, some of the WORST parts of the melee 2.0/2.9999999 system include the combo counter's insta-depletion (mandatory mod slot on nearly all weapons if you're not using Naramon) and charge attacks as a whole (hilariously slow and useless on anything besides glaives/gunblades/Zenistar). Adding mods centered around these mechanics, after all this time and all this feedback, feels like yall are just telling us that Melee 3.0 won't address the inherent problems of either mechanic. (I have similar feelings regarding blocking/damagereflection and Amalgam Javlok Magazine Warp, which was added in the jupiter remaster. The mechanic is hot garbage at base for all weapons, and adding a bandaid mod does nothing to address that.) Not to be a negative nancy in this thread full of amazing changes for Arbitrations, but... if mods like this are being added into the game this late into Melee 3.0's development, one can't help but be pessimistic about it IMO.
  6. Do you happen to have a Vigilante mod equipped on your warframe?
  7. Rhino was going to be my go-to response. Stomp doesn't have quite the same duration as Divine Spears, but it reaches noticeably further and is very consistent in what it affects (i.e. literally anything and everything, including bosses with the caveat that it doesn't last as long against bosses). Definitely one of the most potent CC abilities in the game, and IMO the most reliable... provided that you don't build him exclusively as a tank or something (as 99% of rhino players apparently do). If you've got enough range+efficiency for his 1 to be worth using, Rhino can also be pretty darn fast compared to most other frames. For a less tanky option, I'm a big fan of Excalibur, with his incredible mobility (Slash Dash), invulnerability frames (Slash Dash), CC (Blind), and melee damage (Blind-- especially if using a long-ranged melee weapon that can attack without triggering Finishers). I personally just slap on Overextended and never touch his 3 or 4; you'll have enough mobility and CC to breeze through nearly every open-world mission. He tends to be a bit squishy against higher-leveled enemies, though, so you'll want to get used to moving around a lot and always have a reliable source of healing handy (e.g. Magus Elevate, Life Strike, etc). EDIT: If you happen to use a melee weapon as your main source of damage: you should consider using a Phantasma or some other gun that can rapidly spread Radiation procs on groups of enemies. It'll work great for Condition Overload, and the reliable radiation procs mean that you've got a good CC option with you at all times. If you don't mind sacrificing a gun slot, the CC really opens up the variety of frames that you can use as all-rounders, allowing you to take selfish frames (Ash, Wukong, Chroma, etc) into defense-oriented missions without a hitch!
  8. Off the top of my head, Arcane Avenger and Kavats (especially Adarza) are your best bet. Kavat buffs are a bit sporadic and unreliable, and Arcane Avenger works best on tanky frames that can eat up a lot of small hits. Stacking the two together should push you into orange-crit territory, but I feel like you're going to need a Harrow if you want red crits on your nukor. EDIT: Come to think of it, do multiple Arcane Avengers stack on top of each other? You'd think this would be easy to google, but all of the results I've been getting are either conflicting or horribly outdated. If someone could confirm whether or not this is the case, that'd be great!
  9. This might come as a bit of a shock to you, but there's no way to accurately measure range if the hitboxes are so wonky that measurements become inconsistent. That's literally the reason I brought up hitboxes in the first place, my dude. You know so much about polearms that you incorrectly "corrected" me in saying that zaw polearms have OrthosP-like range? Which, if I may add, started bringing the conversation to where it is right now? Common knowledge indeed. But yeah, regarding your point about me laser-focusing on polearms when you didn't request that information-- I'm realizing now that I misread your OP. I had somehow misinterpreted it as you requesting exact range information for the different Zaw categories, as opposed to strictly non-Polearm zaw categories. That's my bad. Honestly, though, I feel like I still would've posted all that polearm stuff even if I had read your OP correctly. Maybe I'm being a bit presumptuous, but in a thread requesting details about zaw ranges, I think it's good to bring up relevant information that people reading this thread might not have already known. Primed Reach is used because the uncertainty of measurement (i.e. ~0.1m if you're using a sniper scope) is constant regardless of how long the weapon is. You want the uncertainty to be small compared to the measurement itself. If you've got a weapon that reaches 100.0m, then a simulacrum test will tell you that it's "100.0m, give or take ~0.1m" (i.e. hella accurate); whereas if you've got a weapon that reaches 0.01m, then a simulacrum test will tell you that it's "0.01m, give or take ~0.1m" (i.e. hella inaccurate). Extreme example, but you get the idea. If it's base range you want, then divide by 2.65. (And yes, I have tested this out on a variety of non-Zaw weapon types-- the base ranges for the non-Zaw weapons have been incredibly consistent with the "PR range ÷ 2.65" prediction.) Yes, mom.
  10. Fair. My point is that this seems to happen quite a bit more often for zaw polearms, though, since their hitboxes have been particularly janky since release.
  11. You'd think so, right? But nope, the "blind spot" on the hitbox is only for a narrow range of angles, facing the roller almost dead on. That is: the swing is an arc from your FoV's upper left to lower right, which means that you'd expect a huge "gap" on the lower left, no? As in, if you aim too far to the right, you'd eventually expect the polearm to just whoosh over the roller without ever coming into contact. That's not what's happening, though-- aiming more to the right of this "blind spot" that I'm describing (which, again, appears when facing the roller almost dead on) causes the zaw to start hitting again, which indicates that it's not as clear-cut an issue as "zaws have shorter vertical reach" or something. If it was, then I likely wouldn't have made that "wonky zaw hitboxes" thread back in November 2017, and I definitely wouldn't have reproduced its findings today. Not to mention that this isn't nearly the only blind spot; they seem to come and go depending on minute changes in distance. Similar issues will occasionally happen during regular gameplay, where a zaw swing completely "misses" a target within range despite having a clear line of sight. Wee bit frustrating.
  12. So I just tested out the Zaw Polearm hitboxes, using a Cyath+Seekalla zaw. The Zaw polearm hitboxes are still HELLA wonky. It still behaves almost exactly as I described in the thread I linked in my first post (literally November 2017), with the zaw hitting with okayish consistency at around 7.9m, but sometimes completely missing its target depending on where you're aiming. I'm literally in the Simulacrum now, swinging my zaw (Primed Reach, no riven) at a Roller Eximus (nice spherical hitbox) using the first hit of Shimmering Blight, and consistently missing at 7.0m from the target if I aim slightly to the right of dead-center. OrthosP still hits consistently at 8.1m, and (while this isn't measured nearly as accurately) its slide attacks still feel like they reach further than the Zaw's. Ooh, instead of relying on the waypoint marker, you should try using a sniper rifle scope as a measuring tape! It measures distance to the first decimal place, and you can more easily "target" parts of the enemy that are closest to you. Gives more accurate and more-consistent results that way. Also, yeah, I faintly recall that "consistency update" as well. I feel like polearms with Primed Reach have become "narrower" since that update (in the sense that slide attacks, for example, don't have nearly the same "vertical reach" that they did before), but I haven't really noticed any substantial difference in horizontal reach...
  13. Oooh, interesting! The last time I tested this was a few months back, around the time that one of the devs (Sheldon, I think?) was answering a bunch of players' questions on stream about various game mechanics. I'll test this ingame in a bit, though-- if the Zaw hitboxes are indeed OrthosP-tier now, then that's a nice overall buff from what it was before! Oh, I know, I was just kinda vomiting all of my knowledge about hitboxes at once. Again, I'm not sure about this either since I've never bothered testing it out. Hm... maybe the hammers and heavy blades ending up longer might actually be due to the Strikes being considered in the hitbox. The Rabvee and Dokrahm strikes look significantly longer than the strikes that give polearms/staves, so that would make sense. (Needs testing, though.) Also, this might be a bit of a no-brainer, but when testing polearms, have you tried crouching while attacking? The reason I chose the first swings of Shimmering Blight and Clashing Forest for my tests is partly that they give nice, clean swing arcs, and partly that they have "full freedom of leg movement" (WASD/sprint/crouch/etc), meaning that you can prevent the step from happening by simply crouching during the swing.
  14. Some polearms (OrthosPrime, Guandao, and Cassowar) actually reach significantly further at base! Whips as well, although their hitboxes tend to be buggy and unreliable without Primed Reach equipped. Regarding the base ranges of weapon categories-- the long story short is that Zaws seem to have incredibly wonky hitboxes that make an actual "base range" difficult to pin down, even with Primed Reach equipped. Non-zaw weapons will behave more consistently. Let's look at polearms and staves, for example-- When looking at a basic attack with seemingly-unmodified hitbox length (e.g. the first hit of Shimmering Blight for polearms, or the first hit of Clashing Forest for staves), the weapons seem to be split into four distinct categories. These are the ranges measured with a maxed Primed Reach, give or take ~0.1m: 8.1m - Orthos Prime, Guandao, Cassowar ???m - Zaw Polearms (they be buggy af, and haven't been fixed since literally 2017) ???m - Zaw Staff (I've never tested, but I assume that they're similarly buggy) 5.5m - Orthos, Kesheg, Tonbo, Sydon, and presumably all other Polearms aside from Lesion 4.2m - Lesion, Amphis, Mk1-Bo, Bo Prime, Tipedo, and I assume all other Staves (Fun fact: I also tested out a few longswords/dualswords a while back, and interestingly, they also tended to be split into similar "length categories". Some swords like Dex Dakra and Twin Krokhur had Staff-like (4.2m) range, while other swords like Dual Ichor were shorter to the point that accurate measurements felt impossible. The long ones got hit with a stealth nerf since then, so as of the last time I tested them out, they're all the same (shorter) length now. Needs confirmation, though, it's been a while.) But yeah, with the Polearm and Staff and (outdated) Longsword/Dualsword range tests, it seems that the "base lengths" of weapons across categories might be more similar than we thought. Maybe to the point that certain weapons within the same "range category" (e.g. Lesion & staves & pre-nerf-DexDakra, assuming the consistent 4.2m isn't just a coincidence) might have straight-up identical hitboxes at base. I'm not sure about heavy blades, though. Haven't tested the ranges for those at all, Zaw or otherwise. Regarding whether Zaws have any "variance" within the same category based on grip... I've got no clue, but I'm curious about this as well. It seems that it'd be a bit difficult to calculate due to the inherent wonkiness of zaw hitboxes (for polearms, at least), but if anyone with a wide variety of Polearm grips or something could test it out, that'd be great! Come to think of it, I'm also kind of curious as to whether Strikes contribute to the hitbox as well... EDIT: Just to clarify, I've only really tested the ranges for the weapons that I listed above. As for lengths from heavy blades / longswords / daggers / etc (Zaw or otherwise), hopefully someone with more experience could enlighten us!
  15. I'm running into this issue as well! Cloudwalker seems to be retaining your momentum upon cast, with up/down momentum being retained throughout the ability, and horizontal momentum being reapplied at the end of it. It's really weird. Quoting myself from the main bug report thread: Also, Void Dashing seems to retain the operator's momentum as well, as per https://forums.warframe.com/topic/1124013-momentum-carried-over-in-void-dash-electricity-graphics-bug/. Horizontal momentum, at least-- it's hard to tell if vertical is retained since Void mode "dampens" vertical movement in a similar way to aimgliding. Maybe this is related?
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