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Everything posted by DConagher

  1. pictured, Diagoras Atlas Dax (380 wins, 20 losses, 362 by K.O.), "Landslide of Rhodes". 5-Time Orokin Heavyweight Boxing Champion of the Cosmos, Hero of the Telamon Crisis, posing at the remnants of the Saturn-6th "Apollo Arena"- where he won his 221st and "favorite" bout by a signature Landslide Upper just 2 minutes into the 1st Round, against "Baruuk" Yang Tzun. (Semi-related bit below is themed/based on "Back (to Rise!)", TJ Combo's song from Killer Instinct S2: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HpIPAApE8CQ Put 'em up, show me what you got I want to see how you rock, if you're great or not Wanna take my spot, better train to box. I'll leave your name on rocks in a place forgot Ready to Rumble in the jungle on these weak lions I'm a legend- yea, the One "Greek Giant" Think you can last 3 rounds against me, fool keep trying! (I'm back!) When I breakthrough, I shake fools with great moves And train to stay loose, my power stays brute Hit me if you want, my chin is like Granite Keep throwing your best out, but I'm still left standing Rock steady, heart's heavy with the fire Call me the trailblazer- I'm taking this game higher Jab, Hook, Uppercut- Feel my blow when it impacts up your gut- You wanna try to beat the Champ, you ain't tough enough- I stick and move through your best with a counter punch- Man I feint with precision, aim hitting for your brain- Cause I trained with the wisdom, gained vision through the pain! (I'm back!) Real Grit, I can power through you with no risk Leaving your soul twisted up in my closed fist Take notice, I stand as the "Bouldest" Baddest, erratic fighter you could face on a foes list The knockout king to all my opponents- I'm taking every moment to win, baby I own it Yeah, I start to zone in with flurries and combinations And end you with haymakers, my skills are way greater! I will beat through the system, stay vicious in the ring- I'm back forever, you can't Rock my reign!
  2. Prices are part of the main reason everyone I've met has disliked the riven market as a whole. As for the "disposition" tweaks and prices not necessarily being related, or demand not changing......Let me phrase it this way: You buy X thing for a sum of Gold. The devs then make X thing better/worse. Is it still worth the same sum of Gold? Because it is different, are more/less people going to want it? is it now the best in slot? These are the questions that must be asked by a meta every time a patch-notes arrive. Dispo tweaks and the markets feedback to them are inherently related, and changes to a game, in the opinion of this tenno, should not be made without due consideration to the fallout, market or gameplay wise. its also the reason in multiple of my posts on this thread, I make note of the idea DE should nerf the WEAPON not the riven. This will detract the inherent involvement of price to a degree, as the focus is on the balance of the weapon, and the Riven is simply along for the ride (See, my little bullet list on how I've seen rivens valued). Prices are an important part of this discussion because a grind-y "MMO" styled game without a market is not healthy. Hindering or injuring your own market to acquire balance may not be the best decision, or conversely it may be too little. A good example of this is the avoidance of nerfing the Kohms disposition, back in the first round of disposition tweaks. However, it is now we see some of the negatives of this decision, with systems like the one brought up in this post from DEConnor; the Devs are to the point of breaking up the disposition of the family of weapons to try and "balance" certain rivens more effectively. My retort to this, and "feedback for de how to solve?!" as you put it, is that, *again*, instead of messing with the rivens, NERF. THE. WEAPONS. If you so desperately want the game balanced, and we simply MUST have less effective guns, then just get it over with already. Nerfing the rivens will do so little by comparison to actually balancing the weapons, but gets much much less disapproval because rivens are a system not fully understood and utilized by many people (Hence, my listing of how rivens work, and sites to gain education from in regards sans topic). In short, give more education to the player-base how rivens work, and make the balance changes in places where it will actually matter.
  3. My argument against this is that as you stated, Kavats and kubrows are already "reasonably powerful", while sentinel weapons even with rivens, are "less so". Regardless, a Kavat/Kubrow/Moa will last longer in higher leveled content than a Sentinel due to the [Link] mods and the ability to be revived, while a sentinel might have more "utility" on the surface, and requires far less tending to. Moas are in my opinion the best companion currently, due to no needed credit maintenance or affection, as well as the ability to use both pet and sentinel mods on them. However, they lack the damage output of a Kubrow/Kavat, the "hands-free" aspect of the sentinel, and the utility offered by both the specific breeds/models of Pets/sentinels. Additionally, sentinel weapons share mods with your primary/secondary weapons, so you can't run the same barrel diffusion on your deth machine rifle and your Opticor, as an example.
  4. I'd agree with you in that its unlikely platinum sales will drop, probably because most of the time people aren't buying plat solely to acquire rivens with. However, I would disagree with you in that people are being salty with these changes purely on the economic basis alone, or perceived threats to profit gained. While I will admit I disdain these new changes for what it's done for the market, I've not been someone trying to cash in on the next weapon to be primed. My lot in game has been mainly oriented around acquiring people rivens they seek, and selling/trading rivens for people who don't like/don't understand the riven market as it is, and gaining profit for my time or effective sales. Labeling the market a bunch of greedy neckbeards isn't *really* fair. I'll agree the market isn't the friendliest, but it certainly isn't the worst I've been a part in. I made a post not far back from where this reply will end up on the thread, that might help explain why something is the way it is, if the market seems too complicated and crazy at first glance! There is a lot more to it than the "evil seller being greedy by asking a fortune for his/her riven"- is it fair for a buyer to always want to pay as low as they can, but not for a seller to always ask as much as they can? Its two sides of the same coin. My dilemma with these changes is not so much in the sake of it'll make selling rivens even more difficult, its that now I see very little reason to acquire, level, and use a variant of a weapon I enjoy, if my riven is only going to be worse by doing so. Even if they hold true to the statement made by Connor, in that they don't "intend" to make the variant worse and/or pointless with these changes; unless the variant gives me exactly what I want in the weapon to the degree I'm ok with the riven and by extension the weapon possibly being worse, the only "reason" to progress is mastery, and mastery is kinda pointless right now, especially beyond 16.
  5. I've been wondering what DE's true intentions were with some of these disposition changes, as honestly the market has been the only thing that has been getting the "nerf" in these tweaks. What's crazy to you is Tuesday to me, and if you take the time to learn about how Rivens actually work, study what it is you're looking for (Off sites like Semlar.com , for example), and actually bother to observe what people are selling *and why* they're asking what they're asking, it might seem less crazy to you. (This is directed at anyone confused by the riven market, not just you MaSiu!) Example: You pull a rubico riven out of a sortie reward. You know what kinda stats are good on the rubico, and surprise, it happens to have CC/CD/MS/-zoom (Crit chance, Crit Damage, Multishot, with a negative to zoom if you don't commonly speak the shorthand of stats!). You are not physically capable of getting a much better riven than that for the Rubico, performance wise. Maybe you roll rivens, so you have some idea whats good/not good on various weapons. Not only that, you might even have a rather high grading (That is to say, if the riven could roll between 40-100 and you roll a 90, that would be a rather *high grade* riven- Higher area of the variable %- again, mainly something that comes up in selling rivens.) Now, factoring in the matter you have a VERY good riven with an above average grading for a very powerful weapon, first decide if you're going to sell it, and then what it might be worth. Other people are probably still selling ***bad*** rubico rivens (Terrible stat rolls, rolled a bunch of times to no avail, and maybe not even maxed) for in the 750 range. Your riven is a LOT better than those rivens. A "decent" one, maybe a CC/Dmg/neg riven with low grading or a rather annoying neg, might even see 1k-2k in terms of price-point. Your riven is still better than that. It would not be wrong to call your riven in this scenario a *god roll* because it has basically ideal stats with good grading. Because of those factors, *and the weapons popularity and role as an Eidolon Hunter's weapon of choice, it wouldn't be *cheap* by any stretch. If you list it for what you'd consider fair, even with all those boons, at lets say 4,000 plat (and most people still say that's too much, at multiple hundreds of dollars worth of purchased plat), you'd probably have buyer after buyer wanting your riven. Some people would be able to offer you more, maybe even up to 5k or 6k, because they WANT your riven. Whatever you sell your riven for, Timmy down the street should expect at least/around that much if he pulls a MS/CC/CD/-zoom rubico riven, because for most intensive purposes, they're very similar rivens. Lets flip the script a bit- You have a rather powerful riven for a lesser used weapon, sans whatever you want, but I'll say the Grinlok. Now, the Prisma Grinlok is not a *weak* weapon, but its not popular or effective on Eidolons. So a "god-roll" riven with ideal stats and good grading is still going to be more "reasonable" in terms of price point, because of its lack of popularity. A weapons stupidly high cost for rivens boils down to the factors of the following: Hype (of the weapon) Power (of the weapon) Usage (popularity) (of the weapon) Stat Alignment (of the riven, to the weapon) Grading Value (of the riven) Impact of the Negative (of the riven, to the weapon) Sought after Requirements EG, Status Kohm (Of the riven, to the weapon) MOST of the Riven value and use links directly back to the weapon. If the weapon isn't great, even a God-Roll riven for it will probably still be rather cheap, compared to even a bad riven for a weapon with more potential. I don't know if that helps, but for the most part, the Riven Market of trade chat isn't so much crazy! Mainly, it boils down to sellers are often overestimating the value of what they have because buyers always seek to pay the lowest they can (3rd rule of Acquisition if you're a Treckie; Never pay more for an Acquisition than you have to). A seller should realistically expect to make as much as they can off a sale, but this is seen as greedy, while a buyer seeking to pay as low as they can is seen as "savvy". Its the reason I personally love to haggle! Tl;DR: do a bit of research into what makes rivens tick- Maybe you roll them for personal use, but it'd make a lot more sense to you (and some of the others in this thread i'd imagine) why people ask what they do price wise based on the factors above. Sellers are motivated to sell high by the same reason you or other people might be motivated to buy low. Hope that clears things up! Final little note, again not directly related to MaSiuChu: You can get to hundreds of dollars worth of currency flipping prime parts if you have to- Entirely in-game, with not a penance spent on prime access or anything else. Its for that reason I don't consider people asking thousands of plat to be insane, depending on what they're selling. Its not hundreds of dollars of your money, its currency you've ground and earned- It should matter little more to you than buying things off an in-game auction board with farmed gold or silver.
  6. Concerning your 1-2-3 points: Locking rivens has some interesting points with it- I do like the idea of locking rivens for personal use, preventing their sale and locking in their stats. However, the conflicting negative idea is kinda pointless, especially if the intention is to be able to "lock in" a crit roll and then reroll the neg off it and use it for personal use. I get the idea behind it, but the extra roll is unnecessary. In addition, though DE would never add it, I would like the stats to remain permanent if locked- Even through Dispo changes. Bumping the stats of lesser used weapons I'd disagree with, simply because for the most part, a good enough damage riven can make these weapons that lack status and crit at least usable. Tossing a 1.0-1.1 dispo on all rivens is a terrible idea. You stated yourself that there are weapons that simply outperform other weapons, and that your Tigris prime will do you well. Comparing and equalizing a Tigris Prime to a Strun or Kohm doesn't make sense. I would also like to add that just because you disdain the swamp-pit that is trade chat doesn't mean there aren't those of us that actually enjoy trying to trade and sell wares, even if we do have to deal with some toxic people to do so. My suggestion, as a "dirty black market riven dealer" of sorts, is that if you want balance and meta shifts, change the weapon. Look at the catchmoon. Dispo nerf after dispo nerf, people kept using it. It wasn't until this recent fall off nerf, which while HARSH, was somewhat needed, that the kitgun lost its place in so many peoples main slot of the arsenal. +, these changes don't account for people who use weapons without rivens, and still get more than powerful performance in some instances, the Tigris being a *prime* example. A weapon riven price, in my opinion boils down to the factors of the following: Hype (of the weapon) Power (of the weapon) Usage (popularity) (of the weapon) Stat Alignment (of the riven, to the weapon) Grading Value (of the riven) Impact of the Negative (of the riven, to the weapon) Sought after Requirements EG, Status Kohm (Of the riven, to the weapon) Maybe its just me, but I see a lot of things relating more to the weapon itself than the riven. *Maybe, just maybe*, rivens aren't the real problem here.
  7. And people who unveil for selling, in your system, would suffer.
  8. Words can not express how dissatisfied this update makes me from a market standpoint. Perhaps I'm over-reacting here, but I'm doing a DEEEEP concern. 2 points about this before we get into the nittygritty: Firstly, as a player who buys, sells, and uses rivens on a multiple times in a day basis, I can tell you this does not have exciting implications for the future changes to riven dispo, to me as a player. It is incredibly depressing to me that at least you @[DE]Connor, thought I'd gather the team you speak for, sees nerfing the power of variant weapons as exciting and forward looking. Oh, a cool new prime of one of my favorite weapons! Can't wait to go make good use of it! "Yeah, but its dispo is S#&$ compared to your current weapon" ....You're telling me as a player I now need to farm up a new variant of one of my old weapons (So rarely any actual functionality increases bar things like the pryana- stronger stats is the main improvement here), invest all the forma, time, effort, and potato into it, and after all of that, its now going to be arguably worse than the base *BECAUSE* its a prime/variant? *BECAUSE* its new and shiny, its a downgrade to my riven? Even if it isn't worse, or to phrase it correctly, even if the stat boosts carry the day (and its not a .4 dispo hit for being a "different type" of the same weapon), the kick-ass riven you have for it is going to be worse? Why?! How does this fix any of the balance issues within the game?! Secondly, how is this going to affect Primes? Vandals? Wraiths? Syndicate weapons? Weapons with Syndicate mods down the line? How will this affect people who play "exalted" frames like Gara, Khora, or Atlas, who rely on the riven of the weapon to augment the power of their 1st abilities? Are we now as players encouraged to ignore even the most shiny orokin improvements of our weapons because of the frame we play? When these frames aren't even close to the biggest offenders of "balance"? Is the eventual plan to make these abilities exalted? And if so, how are you going to compensate us for the multiple hundreds of % boon rivens give us when/if that change rolls around? My 2 immediate concerns aside, lets talk about this from a multiple player standpoint. Timmy, Johnny, and Spike, to pull a magic terminology. Timmy, the low MR player who just plays the game for fun and because he can do cool ninja parkour tricks Johnny, the intermediate player, who has some of the capabilities of endgame, but isn't so completed that he's mastered it all. He plays the game for some of the synergy of improving his weapons and frames, and because the playstyle of the game, even if a "grind" is fun. Spike, the master/serious player, who has leveled most everything there is to level, and optimized many of his builds to the tenth or farther percentile. He plays the game for success- making platinum, carrying his clan to glory, and you might even see him in Lunaro, though lets not get too crazy or off base here. As a player, I'm probably more of a Johnny, although then it comes to Atlas in particular, I'm definitely a Spike, but lets look at it as though these are just completely random people. Timmy starts up warframe and sees these changes. Most of the new kuva stuff or rivens probably don't really matter to him, and he probably moves on his way. For the most part, Timmy doesn't really care about stats or anything, he's just playing the game to have fun. While I'm sure we can all relate to playing a game for the fun of it, MOST of the 27 million losers that I've met are playing the game for more than just that "basic" enjoyment. However, Timmy might notice that his shiny new red gun gets a little less benefit from his purple mod than his not so shiny grey gun, and if he even cares, maybe that will cause him to flip some mods around. Johnny players are going to look at this update and see some of their precious synergy being tampered with. Johnny just got a cool new kuva weapon, and it just so happened to be an improved variant of one of his favorite weapons! Its got some decent crit now, along with some other boons, and even an innate element effect! There are so many things he can do with these new stats now, but there's one catch: his riven that he's had for a while doesn't really "work" on this new weapon. Maybe its a basic shotgun riven with like, 120% status chance, so he doesn't have to run 2 dualstats- On this new, shiny, interesting weapon, it might only give say, 80 or 100%. He still needs to run a dualstat on top of that to hit is status goals now, because this new weapon "would be too powerful otherwise", sans nerf. Most of the players I've met are at this tier: they play the game for the fun of playing it, but also for doing the cool things within- taking a weapon many people consider bad, and making it function better, or finding improvements to make the weapons/frames they use more fun. It's kinda hard to want to try and find some cool new uses for some of these kuva weapons when one of the main tools of making weapons more powerful, Rivens, are directly/indirectly being hampered by it being a "variant" weapon. Spike players, the few that I've met that still hang around and play actively, I would imagine this update really won't matter to them either, but not for a good reason. This update won't really matter to a "master level" player, because they probably weren't going to use many of these new weapons consistently to begin with. They'll still grab it for the mastery, blast through the new content, and instead of really....caring, most of them will just discount the new variants as Mr fodder or trash weapons, unless they prove themselves in some way to these players. If they do, the players will probably do a lot of science with it- come up with a cool new build, or make the thing remove 150+ content in a click or two. Now, these new weapons must not only contend with whatever well oiled machine the Spike was using previously, they have to do that with a significant lesser boon from rivens. Riven changes aren't going to severely impact balance. It won't stop people from using a "problematic weapon" (See, the catchmoon), and it doesn't really *matter* in the scheme of things. If you want to balance the game, actually balance it then. Change the weapons stats rather than #*!%ing with the riven, and you'll see a much more dramatic response in terms of balance. As it stands, all I've seen or received from the Disposition changes has been nerf after nerf, and to be honest I don't really care. Couple of my favorite weapons lost some dispo, but it doesn't mean they were made *bad*. Catchmoon got dispo nerfed into the dirt, and then kicked while it was down by the falloff nerf, but its still fun to use. Just because a mod does a few less % doesn't mean its a reason to quit playing the game, and the game is still fun regardless. This however, is not merely a disposition nerf. Now, whenever a new weapon comes out, one of the guns I'm waiting for gets primed/variant-ed, or whenever I'm thinking of messing with a prime/variant weapon, I'll have to account for the fact, as a player who plays the game for more than surface level enjoyment, that my riven in particular won't do what it says on the tin. While not to over-exaggerate it, it almost feels like I'm being told to choose between riven and variant. As someone who actually enjoys rivens for the certain fact that rivens have such variety to them, this update hurts my ability to enjoy the game more than it does balance any of the broken things I can do as a player. I asked it before when the first bit of "Disposition changes" rolled around, and I'll ask it again now since I still haven't gotten a straight answer: "Why is changing the rivens the path DE is choosing to go down? How is that healthy to the game? How does it accomplish anything other than screwing with the market?" Again, from a balance standpoint, these riven changes do nothing much, so clearly I have so little to be salty about, right? It's not the balance these riven changes hurt so badly, its the market. Before these changes, I could hop on and sell rivens til my trades ran dry, and it was honestly enjoyable. Now, people rarely if ever want to buy anything, because it *might* get nerfed, weapon or riven both. The exceptions are cheap trash rolls for less than the cost of a prime set, or actual perfect rivens people just can't hope to roll, so they shell out for. If I can attest to nothing else, it is that these riven disposition changes have royally screwed up the riven market for me as a player and riven trader, between off-sites like Riven.market and even just trade-chat itself. As a last, VERY salty aside, I've half a mind to draw attention to this paragraph. Prior to the "Riven Dispo updates" that now come every prime cycle, this was not a concern. A weapon being primed was cause for celebration! Your favorite gun is gonna have some cool new stuff! Post that update, Dread. Your favorite gun will likely get dispo nerfed due to popularity. Now, after this update, We're being sold this "We can leave your current riven build unaffected" pitch as though it will be better than the days before these pointless disposition changes. "In the Past" is not some bygone era of warframe, where the Devs walked among the star-chart dealing nerfs to weapons as primes hit. This is not a gift or a cause for celebration, it is little more than a (Rather poorly done,might I add) band-aid to a pointless fix that was done in the all too recent past- Balance the WEAPON if there are issues with the game, but for the love of the Void, leave the riven alone!
  9. Not seeing anything related to Atlas/Khora/Gara, which is just a mild bit concerning. Buffs seem interesting to melee, and the new combo system might make stuff more interesting. Not having the exilus for melee makes sense, but Im looking forward to when it drops.
  10. I have 3 *major* concerns about this update: 1: What kind of a damage increase are ALL the weapons getting if we lack melee combo? Is it going to be about 3x-4x to compensate? Will this include Exalted Blade/Monkey stick AND ""exalted"" weapons, like Atlas punch or Ash Bladestorm? Will this be like the other weapon overhauls, and thereby cause any change to weapons base CC/CD/SC/Speed/Range/Etc? 2: Any plans to change how rivens will be working for melee, other than the current bits of Dispo #*!%itry? Do I need to be worried about the fact my current statstick gives me like 600% total damage, and that might get yoinked? 3: If you aren't planning to give the abilities a damage increase, AND you #*!% with the riven's dispo/ statstick built weapons on top of that, how are you going to compensate frames like my Atlas (Who just got f*king primed don't do him dirty like this) who lose an INANE amount of damage? Just from having a Jaw Sword I'm getting ~600%, and without the common 3x-4x combo mult I'm getting, that's going to be an average loss of close to 2000% damage. I could understand this if EVERY weapon could do what a crit/Gas redeemer with CO can do, but this seems like a massive nerf, most especially so to melee frames, and then most painful of which to the "not" exalted frames, like Ash and Atlas/Gara/Khora. I can already seriously outpace my statstick built punch with a proper Prisma Grinlok for killing armored content, let alone a dedicated stripping weapon. If this update nerfs warframe abilities when they're already not the biggest offenders, while also ignoring the "problematic" ones like Saryn, we have a serious problem.
  11. Coming back here to say that a part of this bit of feedback were slightly pre-mature, and rather than edit my previous post I'd rather own up to it; His IN-GAME prime stats are actually far better than any preview let on. Atlas prime has a gained most note-ably, 75 base health, among other boons. (Atlas Prime on the left vs his non-prime Counterpart) These are actually far better stats than I was expecting him to receive- 175 base HP is more than even Nidus, so in current-day Atlas Prime has the most base HP of any frame in the game bar Inaros at this point, and the extra shields and energy are nice to have as well. I still don't personally feel like this Prime Access was to the same tier as some of the other more recent ones with the actual exclusives it offered, and while he does still have the problems many people have identified (some love to his kit and augments would still be appreciated later down the line), the fact of his prime having stats worth caring about and the syndana being touched up (Along with his rumblers retaining prime details, thanks for that!) make Atlas Prime atleast a little more interesting.
  12. Coming here to say 2 things: A: All-Might Prime is HERE! Delayed by Wukong, and put by the wayside by most of the community, but the mountain has come to us, *AtlasT*. I am very excited....or, I would be. I can't not be, though, right? Frame I put thousands of hours of fun and work into, is both primed, looks cool, and might actually get some playtime from the community! B: Except....I have to say that if this was ANY other warframe- if this wasn't the same Atlas I've put thousands of hours into, I don't think I'd bother farming him, let alone buying the PA. Let alone just how much I've run Atlas (to the point I haven't even bothered leveling MOST things), the stats on their own would detract me from caring. .1 sprint speed, and ***25*** armor? When he has a passive 450 (Couldn't have even been enough to be the 2nd highest in the game, behind Valk prime?) AND an additional sustainable ~1200-1300 effectively at BASE (and I think we can all agree you don't play Atlas if you want to go fast)- what actual benefit is there to these stats? More health, More Energy, MAYBE a DECENT amount of armor on a Bruiser frame, or perhaps going the nidus route and gaining some passive Ability % increases, but these stats are a SERIOUS letdown. My only hope is that nudged in there somewhere is a rework, and/or a buff to Atlas's abilities (Like the almost pointless 5% Crit and Status chance he has, in this stage of Warframe, or perhaps something actually seriously useful for a 2?) (I've made a few threads for community feedback, and some really great ideas have sprouted there, would love for you to take a look if you can spare the time of day) The prime access itself is coming with a Sentinel I've never cared to test with (so, a personal problem on that front), a cavalcade of accessories for that sentinel (that, imo, don't even look nice), 1 warframe cosmetic being an alright syndana, and then Atlas and his Tekko- Do I as a player really want to pay 140$ USD for a decent bit of plat, farm-able gear, an "alright" syndana? Not even a cool set of like, part-rock armor for thematic sake- nothing for your operator, an alt helm, an ephemera? Anything? I don't care about or need the boosters- MR 17 with millions of credits, I can do just about everything in this game, BAR trade 20+ times a day or summon level 150 enemies in a testing realm. The moddrop chance booster has been roasted enough, and all its going to mean for me is a slight bit more endo. The plat is basically whatever, I make mine off the market. I'm sitting on 140$ in steam waiting for this PA to arrive, and I almost feel like, the more I think about it, the more it feels like a waste. On the side note of being let down, more and more as I've advanced into warframe's "End-game", I've found that while I can play the game and have fun with Atlas (he is definitely both an under-appreciated and under-used frame- You can't play thousands of hours with a character and say "he's bad to play" or demand a buff), it honestly feels like his kit just doesn't ....Flow. At all. I'd hazard a guess that's why he's under-used. Wisp has been the first frame to actually seriously impact my Atlas use, partially due to how much synergy she has. Looking at the frame himself: Atlas has the major redeeming feat of: Being immortal while punching, having 350 base all impact damage on his 1, and having landslides 0-2-4. His updated petrify is a good Crowd control ability, and a setup of decent passives. That....that's about it. His wall is basically pointless (I think of the hundreds of thousands of abilities I've used, Wall wouldn't even makeup 400-500), and his Rumblers are, for lack of a better word, a box of rocks. Rubble is a decent system, but its blocky and clunky. He doesn't have a standout pool of health, or energy, or shields, or anything other than 3rd highest base AC. While he has that 450 armor at base, does that really compare to the other "tank" frames and what they can survive through? Is 25 armor REALLY going to make a difference here? Lets compare him to Khora and Gara, rather than drawing lines to Rhino or Inaros or Niderp. Start with Khora. Her "exalted" does 300 points Ips, but has 25% CC and 20% SC to Atlas's ....5% and...5%. She has multiple CC options, from her ability to chain down 1 target to her hole Christmas tree of pain, and then she has Venari- arguably the best summon-able ally in the game (Glaring at wukong right now....) Not only that, but Khora has much more ability synergy to work with- where I get rubble from killing petrified people, and a measly bit more from Landslide as Atlas, she can use her Dome to bounce damage around, use Venari to support people other than herself, and has the "passive" effect of *2* companions. Not only that, she has actually decent Augments. Accumulating Whipclaw and her loot mod for her Christmas dome come to mind. Tell me, what of Atlas's 4 augments are worth using? We've got: Discount 3 but its unreliable and single target Pointless bulwarks, the Trilogy The single *worst* loot augment in the game (to the point people forget it even exists) and the only real decent one IMO, after it's recent buff 1 BIG rockboi. Gara is something entirely different! She has 800 (of her choice, Puncture or slash) damage on her "Exalted" (If you're keeping track, well over double atlas and Khora, albeit without Atlas's 0-2-4, but it is Slash and puncture- so no 25% penalty to Flesh), amazing Crowd control, amazing team support in the form of 90% damage resistance boons, and all the synergy in the world. She has an augment for energy generation, and her Vitrify is incredibly similar to Petrify in its workings and bonus damage given- Meanwhile, her's is a 360* circle, mine is....what, a 60-90* cone? Her passive is a bit weird, but all in all, stats wise, it *might* be a fair assumption Gara is just better mathematically. The short summary of it is, no matter how much I adore the rocky lad, I can't help but feel....saddened by his less than stellar arrival. His prime stats are a joke, his PA is honestly just not worth it- the "exclusives" boil down to a weird looking sentinel set and an OK syndana. It's like you were told a party was being thrown, and then when you get there, there's 1 person with a party horn and a 2 week old cake from the local mart. Its still your birthday, its still a great day, but a lot of the luster and light is MIA. I can accept the fact maybe he just didn't see enough love, what with how busy you all must be with Empyrean and New War, Rail Jack and everything else with the game. I'm no game dev, but as a business man I can sort of understand not allocating a ton of work to a frame that makes up such a small % of your use-age stats. Not to mention, Vauban and Ember could really use some touch-ups. I get it. Its a big part of why I love this game, I really do. The team behind this game is awesome.... The gameplay, balancing, and to an extent, the grind, even- as well as this community. Even when I'm not in a mission, I can get so much form just chatting with people about builds, or making deals in trade-chat- being helpful in region or recruit has been a great way for me to pass the time. As someone who loves to trade, I can usually earn all the platinum I need off deals with other players, though I do occasionally make use of the discounts you offer through the login system. I can't think of anything I seriously *detest* about the game, and its definitely one of the best I've ever had the privilege to play. For those reasons, and despite my internal clock saying I shouldn't, you'll still be getting 140$ USD from Floridaman later today, this time. I can only hope that somewhere down the line, or maybe if we're lucky enough, rolled out with some community feedback in the coming months, come a few nice touch-ups, maybe a set of useful augments, or perhaps a kit rework to some of his less stellar abilities. He doesn't need much- I can't argue against what I've been able to pull off with this lad of Rock and Stone, but a little love for him would be adored. At the very least, from this Tenno.
  13. Awesome! Was about to post something about the bug here, glad to know fix is on it's way. On a "semi"-related note, Will say that I am *EXCITED* for Punch-lad Prime. I'm hoping that, rather than an overhaul or kit rework, he gets some work done for his other Augments and a look at buffing landslides terrible Crit chance (or a decent up to its crit damage to compensate- Like the Nukor or Kubrows in general). Atlas as he is, he's a powerful warframe, and to be perfectly honest he probably doesn't NEED a rework. Just the ability to earn him without farming an Archwing assassinate is going to do wonders for his popularity. Some simple fixes would (in my opinion) be all he really needs. True, I've brought up rework ideas for a while on various forum posts, but to be honest I can't spend hundreds of hours on a frame and then say he NEEDS a total overhaul. Simply uncapping rubble (Or a higher limit- maybe some kind of small scaling damage based on the rubble you have?), maybe a new second ability on the extreme end, and some touch ups to his augments- I think he'd see a massive usage increase. He's already a lot better than when I first picked him up, after the changes he got to his 3, and with the introduction of rubble, so all I am is excited! Another option if Atlas was to be buffed is looking directly at Landslide. Landslide having a 5%CC, comparing it to i.e Khoras Whipclaw (and the augments for our comparable 1st "exalted" abilities) feels a bit bad, currently- maybe add a boon there? Even if I can hit incredibly hard, and am Invulnerable during cast, landslide also doesn't have a good status chance- Whipclaw has both high crit and status chance, by comparison, along with an IPS spread. The Tekko Prime are gonna be awesome, though, and maybe using the Tekko Prime could give Landslide a crit buff similar to how Atlas gives the weapon a base status chance increase? Would help compensate for the lower disposition the Tekko offers compared to the current statsticks (i.e Amphis,Jaw Sword, Kogake Prime), and would open up a lot more build paths for him! It wouldn't even need to be too crazy of a crit buff, as Landslide already does have the insane damage and makes you invulnerable on use- It has its advantages, but I would just like for crit to be not so much of a wasted stat when you're building for your punch, personally!
  14. Little bump to bring up A: HIS PRIME IS NO LONGER DELAYED :D! and B: Here's a thought- What if DE combined his 2 into his 4, call it Terraform, and basically make them one ability? Could function like wisps buffs or khora cat, tap cast to make a wall, hold cast to make a golem, with a summon limit of like, 4, and then give him a new second ability? New 4 could also be an interesting use to spend your rubble. He's a *Brawler* frame, not just a boxer... maybe a new kick attack for his 2? Almost seems like it could be fused with landslide, but the idea of them being separate has some cool aspects to it. The boot could function similar to landslide, and in the process open up a neat way to add some more animations/options- effectively creating his own MMA type stance: Have it be a 3-5 hit combo (kinda like landslide does now with its 0-2-4, probably stick with about the same numbers here), made up of either his 1 or his new 2.The cool part is that these various attacks could do different effects on the last hit based on the build-up. Landslide as of right now is a 1.R. straight, then 1.L.hook, then 1.R. uppercut loop. What if he, as an example, did a 1.R. Straight, followed by a 2. left kick, and led that maybe into a 2.right roundhouse, as a basic 1-2-2 combo? Or maybe he leads with a more or less 2."Falcon" kick, followed by a quick short 1.uppercut and then a 1.left straight, as a 2-1-1? Most of the animations could probably be pulled from the Sparring and Fist weapon stances fairly easily, and the last hit effects could be something as simple as reduced damage with more range, increased rubble gen from kills, maybe one that costs rubble to hit harder. It'd be cool to see your Rumblers mimic you as well. Get a decent group of golems together and you'd be a squad of monks practicing martial arts as you combo your way through the vessels. I'd LOVE to see one big boot that launches people into orbit, like the old Sonicor, or Boros giving Saitama the free ride to the moon. It would be a lot of data and combinations, but aside from the complexity of hitting 1 then 2 then 2 again, instead of 1.1.1 (and,you'd still have the 1.1.1 combo!), it shouldn't be too drastic a change. And that also could let his 1 and new 2 have different interactions with his new 4th, allowing you to landslide into the wall to roll it like a boulder (Like we can now, no loss of function if you like playing Rolling Stones), or landslide into a golem to do aoe damage and disperse it for rubble. I'd love to be able kick into the golem to wear it (GIVE US THE CONCLAVE MOD FOR PVE, PLEASE!!!!!) and maybe kicking into the wall bounces you in the direct the walls facing? (I don't know about this one, I'd love some feedback/ideas) Honestly, some of this is my own wants of just more animations to do, as I've probably used landslide alone atleast a few hundred thousand times by now, what with my average abilities used even per short mission being commonly over 1k. I think this string of sense could have some merit though, and him being able to sort of "Build" his own combo attacks off his various kicks and punches could be really neat, + this idea doesn't drastically change his character or playstyle- just expands on it a bit. Thoughts? 😄
  15. Titanic Rumbler - Rumblers Augment - Atlas Increase to damage and speed Re-triggering the power will activate the taunt, as well as cause a knockdown effect Neat! Not sure I'd use it personally if it still makes only 1 rumbler, due to the loss of 1 rumbler equating to 25 less rubble generated off spamming 4, but more consistency may make it useful! Anything coming for his other 3 augments, though? Ore gaze being literally the worst loot augment, and it being effectively replaced, and automated, even being worse than what replaces it, due to things you can't scan with it, by a helios; Maybe make the augment halve its energy cost but now has the ability cost some rubble? Even fits the name! Tectonic Fracture is honestly ok as a concept, but the ability its for is just too lackluster. It would be cool to see the functionality at base- 1 wall doesn't do enough with Atlas's kit or in general, and devoting a slot to making the ability worth anything feelsbadman. Imagine having to devote a slot on frost to be able to stack his bubbles. So, maybe keep with the name, and the augment lets you punch your walls, shattering them in a cone of rubble for I/P/S damage? Petrified walls could then deal more damage when fired! Path of Statues isn't too bad either, now that it correctly scales off duration; but when you compare it to other augments for abilities of a similar vein (Khora compared to atlas, both have a melee damage scaling powerful first ability, but where Atlas has more base damage, Khora has actual status and crit chance, and a MUCH better first augment, along with more over-all synergy), it comes up short. Having your rubble increase the landslide damage could be an option here! These ability augment ideas wouldn't be MANDATORY, but would provide him with some niche fixes to common complaints with his kit
  16. Its ok, do it with the staticor anyway. Its brighter, makes more effects, and can actually crash games if you hit people with low enough specs. Kill the fun, but leave the actual eye cancer. /s
  17. Atlas gets small rework to fix a S#&$ty 3rd ability, couple nice tweaks. Thats the end of it. Wukong gets a full kit rebuild, THEN gets primed (arguably before he should, by release dates), and now a deluxe skin. Meanwhile, Atlas still has to be at the very least one of the least played frames in the game due to how annoying he is to get among other reasons. Any news, ANYTHING about him at all? Update: Was not expecting the surprise atlas skin, but I gotta say; Loving my new Earth Elemental Skin for the Earth Frame! The energy flowing through it really makes him look like a cool elemental. Gotta say though. The helmet looks more like Wukong than Atlas. And him having a tail now. Really weird. Eh. Can live with it. At least its an "Earth" themed skin for an "earth" themed frame and not some actually rock looking, well done inlaid energy skin for a frame that has NOTHING to do with earth. Oh. Ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhh.
  18. ^ Basically this. Part of the original concerns brought up with the rubble changes was that Atlas has it a bit difficult according to some to generate his rubble, so I neglected to include that in the 2nd proposed list. As for it taking a %, that might make it annoying to farm up a reasonable amount when every ping takes off a chunk of your stock.
  19. What you mention about the armor is part of reason I wanted it un-capped instead of just "flat number". Its not going to change much "damage resistance wise" having 3,000 rubble instead of 1,500, as you've said. You would still have retarded survival, so totally "Uncapping" it *could* have that issue. My main worry is based off current day. Even with the decay rate changed, Its not "easy" to maintain at exactly 1500 rubble. Increasing the amount Atlas can "hold" would let him have more freedom of use with his new rubble focused abilities, especially since I accidentally made his 2 and 4 costs a bit too low in my proposed options in the second changelist. The goal was for his 4 to cost about 500, and for all of his 2 creations together to cost anywhere from 250-500. Spending 2/3rds of your available rubble, easy to generate or not, in exchange for some very impactful abilities, is still reasonably expensive. Setting his cap to that 3,000 mark you mentioned puts it to 1/3rd your cap. I'd rather not just reduce the cost of his 2 and 4 to be 1/3rd of your 1,500 cap, because I want it to actually be you spending rubble to accomplish things. I want rubble to have some truly felt force in what he does, rather than just being another Nidus.
  20. You're right @CommanderC2121, his weird stats are there, and giving him some crit love would be neat; Before any of that though, Augments! I brought it up a bit earlier, and you're right, his augments are kinda garbo for this state of the game. And, with these possible ability reworks, his augments would need some new love. Path of Statues used to be go-to back in the day (Old *channeled* petrify era), because you didn't have other cc options. Now that his kit has other CC, how about Path of Statues increases your next punches damage for every petrified enemy you've killed? Maybe the *augment* lets him gain some base damage for landslide, based on his rubble? His new 2 could still work off Tectonic Fracture, just that now it'd have to be more than "get a size-able increase in your evocation limit" from the augment- His base would be 5, but we probably don't want 15 or 20 rumblers running around, fun though it might be. Maybe something to the vein of the Monlith totem armor buff affecting your Rumblers and walls, and applying more armor based on *your* rubble, along with your rumblers now taunting enemies? His 3rd augment needs to be more than just loot generation. The adds scans to codex is nice, but it needs something else, or at least ACTUAL loot gen. What would you all recommend for it? His 4th augment of course would need to be removed and re-printed, since rumblers would be part of his 2- His Vesuvius augment could be that it scales off of, and enemies hit by it add to, your melee combo, making it sort of a Combo-builder/Breaker, and letting it do some more *respectable* damage.
  21. Ah, I see. My question is then, why exactly? The rubble giving tonnes of armor, its never *easily* going to get to the simply obscene amounts needed for more than the 90-95% resistance threshold. and all of that work still isn't netting you too much extra mitigation. Pick one. The ability can't work off shattering impact, Healing return, and condition overload and remain as it. Either you have separately modifiable *weapon* like Excal's blade, and make it a full on channeled exalted with stance combos. OR You have something like Garuda's Talons, where its a modified melee weapon to give you stats (by the sounds of it, still letting you have a normal melee weapon in addition), which would have to have a pointless stance mod or cost you capacity. Both options in this scenario cost you rivens, if they become separately moddable. That on its own is a pretty major damage hit. If you use a statstick, again, you still lose the augment melee mods adding 100% damage, for things like the Dual Cleavers, Jaw Sword, Skana. As it is, the reason shattering impact and condition overload with landslide isn't exactly perfectly clear, and having shattering impact on landslide would be cool, but a better point is that Atlas's landslide has piss poor status and crit chance (5% each) while comparable skills like Khoras whipclaw have SUBSTANTIALLY more than that- Whipclaw has a 2x crit multiplier as does Landslide, but while landslide has 5% crit and status chance, Whipeclaw has 20% crit and 25% status chance, base. Also, whipclaw benefits from both Range scaling aspects; target distance and explosion AoE, and has a FAAAAAAAAAAAAR better augment in the form of Accumulating Whipclaw. However, where it "falters" is that its damage is spread IPS wise, and it doesn't make you invulnerable on cast. This makes Atlas's 350 base damage seem much higher than her base 300 because of the ability to mod it especially for 1 type. Impact becomes as good as pure damage to Atlas, but conversely, she could feasibly clear content better with her whip due to elemental scaling. Something to definitely consider would be buffing Atlas's Crit/Status chance. That would be something kinda neat that could come with his prime, actually, but I'd think it would be very unlikely they'd do such a thing. As for this, I could see your argument with proc prevention, if there weren't ways to strip most of their armor with a click or 2, across multiple weapons. Strun Wraith, Drakgoon, or just about any pellet count shotty will do- The riven is Multi/Punchthrough/-Infested and, Path of statues does give rubble currently....that's why I suggested it if you don't like his 3. Its a usable alternative.
  22. The rubble being uncapped but with an armor point? How do you mean exactly? Something like the melee combo where it ramps up? I don't quite follow you. As for the soft cap, being able to scale the actual rubble itself, with no other complex mechanics, will still net you rather scary armor potential. With the Umbral Fiber 1 rank off max, with all 3 mods, it gets Atlas to 1,237 armor on my build currently. +1,500 from Rubble, if it can be maintained, and Arcane Guardian, you're going to be at that 10% damage taken threshold relatively easily.The purpose for uncapping it and changing it is so that if you stop maintaining, you can coast in that 1,500 range without needing to constantly kill things. My usual number I try to maintain, current game, is 1,200-1,300 Landslide having an exalted weapon is something I've been wondering about for a while, and something I've brought up on other threads before. The responses I've received have been less supportive of that, and I've grown to echo that position- Making it a dedicated "exalted ability" would be a mistake. If his 1 becomes a channeled Exalted ability, even if its more similar to Hildryn, at minimum it will lose the benefit of melee rivens. Gara, Khora, and Atlas are alone in that they benefited from Rivens, and I believe that is part of the reason they didn't receive the exalted treatment. Also, how will invulnerability work with it, if its a dedicated ability. Invuln until you turn off the weapon or run out of energy? The best route I've seen brought up towards that end is Garuda and her Talons. Atlas could make use of something of that nature, but if any changes occur there he is almost certainly losing out on rivens, let alone any augment mods for stat-sticks like the Jaw Sword. Rubble can come from the landslide augment as well, if you don't like his 3 even post rework. As for the immunity for procs, due to the damage calculations that petrify allows for, and the fact it doesn't remove procs or prevent their damage if they already exist, I've never seen any issue with it prevent status effects for its duration. As for your tectonics idea, part of that is something that has been floating around for a while- Let landslide detonate the wall! Making it all puncture though....why exactly? If anything, why not have it split between the 3 IPS? For Rumblers, the Ai isn't so much the biggest issue. They can bumble about and be as smart as the rocks that make them up all they want to. They just need to make some form of impact for it. As they are, they are reasonably tanky. Having them deal some form of damage and run around and soak, maybe taunting at base even, would give them a lot more "OOMPH" so to speak. Drakewurrum earlier in this thread brought up the idea of Landslide letting your rumblers also landslide. If their landslide is to deal any real damage it will need mods, so having it cast only every 3rd punch or so, as well as just one of their random attacks,would balance them out quite nicely. As for them blocking bullets, that could be "useful" but then you'd have the issue of them getting in the way.
  23. This has turned into a very interesting thread, and given me a lot to think about pertaining to Atlas's 2. There has been a lot of talk and some interesting concepts thrown around here. Being honest, you can't play a frame for hundreds of hours and love it, and ALSO want the frame changed to be a different frame entirely. If Atlas is fated to stick with his Tectonics and his Rumblers remain sub-par as minions (by comparison to things like Wukong's Specter), that isn't going to be the end of Atlas. Whether he gets buffed or not, or reworked or not, hes still going to be an awesome frame. I hope him being primed will make more people try him, now that hes not locked behind Archwing/plat gates. Hes in a much better place than when Brozime had a few ideas for a rework way back in 2017. His Tectonics however, as an ability; is it not at least *kind of* lack-luster? Even with the augment, the 3 "fences" we throw up around an objective could never honestly compete with something like Snowglobe, or the Rift putting it in a separate dimension, or even to an extent, barricading it off with a wall of Glass, and without the augment, its only really great for 1 door or hallway. Rolling it as a boulder is never going to deal a significant damage output currently- certainly no where close to what we can do with *just *Landslide. It can be fun, and it has its limited uses, but does it have purpose and value enough to be there? His Rumblers are ok, to be fair. They do their job of showing up, yeeting rocks at people, taking fire, and generating rubble. If they get left alone, cool. Yet again, however; they can be at least slightly expensive if you don't rock the efficiency for them, and Range/Duration being negatived for any reason does hurt the ability to a fair extent. And, yet again, the augment for them is simply not worth it. To an arguable degree, even Path of Statues isn't really worth the mod-slot either. If naught else were to happen to the frame, most of his augments could use some touching up. But, in terms of non-augment changes and reworks, there have been a couple great ideas that have shown up here in this thread: - Having your Rumblers landslide with you would be awesome! - Having all your abilities scale off Rubble would tie the mechanic together nicely, and this is not the first time someone has brought up the idea to shotgun the walls (see Broz's vid)- That would give them an amazing purpose, as well as give him some more plausible AoE. I'd absolutely love to see this! - Originally, I would have wanted Tectonics gone in trade for something more utilitarian and/or damage focused; After having played (and enjoyed) Wisp as well as leveled Khora however, its become apparent Tectonics would not *need* to be removed so much as put together with some other aspects of his kit (I wasn't fully aware abilities could be combined onto 1 key). It seems this would be far more acceptable of an option, as he doesn't "lose" anything. - It has also been brought up Atlas is more of a "brawler". While I can agree he is a brawler, he is more than just that. The mines may not tie into that theme very well though, and partially that was just as a 3rd option to have to aid his defensive prowess. Is there another simple "earth-bending" like concept that could be tossed in with his Wall and Rubblers? These suggestions from you all sound awesome, and would fit in keeping Atlas as an Gaian Brawler, a [Ground][Fighting] type if you will. When combined with some of the original points I wanted to bring up, a new Tl;DR list of possible changes could be: - Uncapping Atlas's Rubble - Changing the rates he gains, and the ways he loses, rubble - Changing how his abilities work with his Rubble - Combine his 2nd ability, Tectonics, and his current 4th, Rumblers, and toss in an armor-buffing Monolith into a new second ability; Evoke - Give him a new 4th ability, one that could spend rubble and covers something he's missing; Vesuvius - Change Landslide to gain lunge distance based on Range (?) (This one would be more debatable, especially if Vesuvius isn't just a 4-to-nuke button- we don't want to remove something others enjoy about the frame, as I have clearly been shown in this thread XD) To go down the list into detail, uncapping the Rubble will in general just be a useful fix. If you can generate more, it will reward you for it. Changing the rates he gains and ways he loses Rubble will fix one issue other players seem to have; being unable to maintain reasonable rubble. To begin with, as Scruffle brought up, you could now only have rubble decay upon taking Health damage or standing in a nully bubble, and gaining rubble or a small amount of time would stop this The rate we gain Rubble at can honestly be left alone, especially if the abilities themselves will innately work off the rubble and no scaling damage needs to be calculated. His abilities could now interact with Rubble in a more cohesive way, similar in a vein to what CommanderC2121 mentioned: -His new second ability "Evoke" would consume 50 rubble (no energy) to create a Tectonic Wall, Rumbler, or Stone Monolith. The Rumblers would function as they do now, with the added caveats that, as Drakewurrum thought up, the Rumblers would also Landslide to enemies on occasion or whenever you use Landslide's *3rd* hit, and no longer have a duration. The Walls could be punched into, causing them to fire in a directional-shotgun-cone of rock and flint (To compensate for the inability to roll them). More-over, the walls would scale in size based on Ability Strength. The Monolith would give an armor buff to frames that enter it (Scaled off strength), and would function much like Wisps 1- the Monolith would have no duration (However, it would have health), and the buff given would only decay outside of its AoE. At base, you can make a total of 5 evoked creations at any given time. ^Nullfiers would interact with this ability much as they do with our current Rumblers- They would rapidly sap the HP of the Evoked creations, rather than instantly disable them. -His Petrify could cost 50 energy now, instead of its previous 75. --Petrifying the Wall would increase the damage dealt when it is punched as well as repair it. --Petrifying the Rumblers would slow them but increase their damage, as well as repair them. --Petrifying the Monolith would repair it, as well as increase the amount of armor given by the buff. His new fourth ability "Vesuvius" would consume *500* rubble (no energy) to cast, with a 3 second cast time. Atlas calls the rubble into his fist, and slams it into the floor, detonating any Evoked creations within the 13/18/25m AoE (scaled off Range). This ability would knock down any enemies susceptible, as well as reduce their base armor by 25 (Scaling with power strength) as it pulses out, before fissuring the ground and dealing 400/600/800 damage (scaled with ability Strength). The long and short of these new ideas, in conjunction with whats been recommended in this thread and others, is a bit more comprehensive change list to Atlas would make him into more of an *Earth* , and emphasis on the earth, brawler, and give him more to do without being too busy in the long run. Vesuvius being able to strip armor would give him a lot of potential in higher end content, doing both a lot of damage and having reasonably useful CC, while also helping him against heavily armored later-game content, and follows the theme of Shattering Impact in removing a fair amount of the base armor, even before power strength. Considering these revisions and accounting for your contributions to the concept, how would you feel about these changes? - Uncapping Atlas's Rubble - Changing the rates he gains, and the ways he loses, rubble - Changing how his abilities work with his Rubble - Combine his 2nd ability, Tectonics, and his current 4th, Rumblers, and toss in an armor-buffing Monolith into a new second ability; Evoke - Give him a new 4th ability, one that could spend rubble and covers something he's missing; Vesuvius - Change Landslide to gain lunge distance based on Range (?)
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