SneakyErvin

People have already proven it is good and working. Sure it needs a few tweaks since there seems to be odd cases of bugs tied to it on certain DX settings and FoVs. For me it works without any kinks, for others there are minor issues. If they iron those out it can be beneficial to the whole game, since they could potentially apply it to more skills, both old that have LoS currently and other skills that could use it for balance. It could also open up for AoE weapons getting LoS tied to them to make them feel and play more realistic while also adding balance to the game. More or less if they manage to fix all kinks with Dante LoS it opens up for similar AoE to get the same treatment on other frame, if they then fix Whipclaw with this new LoS system it opens up for AoE weapons to have LoS added, since they'd check their LoS from the same point as Whipclaw, with improvements from the Dante system. So all in all, a win-win for the game as a whole.

Not only do they look unfitting to the setting, they look horrible overall. Must have been one terribly sick bunny they got hold of and skinned, cos those are some ragged ass ears. Ontop of that the clipping... Not sure which of the 3 parts is worse out of the whole mess.

Yeah, have used them all in SP. And I'm not thinking of the DPS, I'm thinking of the whole kit on each frame. Hence why I say they have more than CC and doesnt rely on it to get things done. And Khora is a damage frame, which is why all skills in her kit are designed to push her dps even higher by syncing. The worst Khora is a Khora built for CC, since all she does is slow missions to a crawl as enemies are dragged and dangling in some forgotten corner of a map. As to the other frames, it is really a "you" problem if you snow in one a specific part of a kit that is ment to work as a whole. Eximus arent that common. There is an effective cap of 4 in SP for a solo player in endless (death squads and mission variables not included), and in non-endless they are sporadically spread throughout the map. So if you know you have a hard time with eximus, dont blitz mindlessly and dont play in a manner that gets you surrounded in endless. Plus if you wanna make enemies immune to abilities in general because they are immune to CC abilities then you should be consistant and ask for them to be immune to ranged weapons aswell since some ranged weapons CC and had that interaction fixed aswell versus Eximus units. Though it is absurd to ask for them to be immune to abilities, since that pulls all damage down into the same pit even though the majority of frames do not have mindless AoE as damage skills. And it also penalizes the frame that is already worst off out of all when it comes to Eximus, since suddenly Lamebo cant even pick up thermal sunder (or other damaging abilities) to help him stay safe inside his rift while killing eximus units outside. Of course, but that is also content ment to be "hard". Things like SP Duviri Experience bonus portals would be a totally pointless addition if Eximus units were not CC immune, since that "difficulty" would suddenly not be there, because everything would sit in a glowy net, have hentai funtime or a BDSM lesson etc. You can just see how breach surge and stomp trivialized it. It is only in missions with special modifiers that you see several overguard units at once and they have those modifiers simply so people cannot lock everything down with the press of a button. I know people love to bring up Mesa and Saryn, but when you bring those to something like bonus portals they arent exactly shining because their skills wont instantly wipe that horde of eximus, while CC would if there was no immunity, which effectively would be the same as a 1HK since the threat is removed. One of the most broken things in those places was Rhino with breach surge, because you'd just surge+stomp and everything would either be blind, floating or radiated as you took your merry time picking them of with whatever weapons you had. Completely removing everything that the mission setup was designed for. And if you didnt have access to Rhino, then any frame with helminthed breach surge worked well aswell. If you had S#&$ty pulls you could always just breach surge+operator+pew pew pew to spread sparks and radiation all over. There will only be up to 4 regularly, so they are rather rare in higher content like SP where you have the screen filled with mobs. And in other missions they tend to come one by one as you move on throughout the mission. I also dont see how they matter to some frames. An eximus is really nothing more than several mobs jammed into one due to their EHP. Their damage is the same as any other mob of their type, the lethal aspect of them is tied to their abilities, which arent exactly hard to avoid. So if the Eximus is a threat, then everything else is a threat too, so any time you manage to miss CCing a single mob you face the same threat as the eximus really. But I'm fairly sure you arent running around and constantly CCing things in content you play. If you are in 100-400 content, you will very likely also carry things that will end them instantly. You can make practically any frame tanky enough these days to survive well into level 200+ content without relying on rolling guard. It's mostly that people refuse to, since they are under the assumption that they need more strength instead or something, when their damage is likely already high enough to overkill for hundreds of levels. They just stack that damage even though they will likely never play content where they need it and it wont kill things faster in the content they do frequently. Uhm... nope they arent really. Some of them are, like Khora, but she is also a frame that is easily tanky enough to survive without it in versus an eximus. Zephyr, Xaku, Nyx, Banshee, Ash and Garuda no. All of them have their survival rooted in other things aswell or practically have no actual CC at all. Nyx for instance can MC any regular mob she wants near an Eximus in order to keep it distracted while using chaos on everything else, since aggro in WF targets the closest enemy, in addition to that she can tank whatever she wants with her 4. Yareli is a 90% DR tank, so has no need for her CC aside from being a damage buffer or grouping tool for her, she likely loses more health if she decides to stop and focus on CC due to the travel time of her water balloons. And Nova doesnt positively have any CC, since most people will either run neutral or +speed even in SP+ content simply for the damage buff or to speed missions up. So shes far from being more vulnerable due to OG CC immunity because she is mostly already suicidal or indifferent to the thought. Ash has no survival tied to his teleport/finisher. Garuda isnt required to jump an eximus just because an eximus is around, she can pick any other mob in order to activate her mirror right in that moment and she is still just as invulnerable when casting abilities versus eximus shots and incoming abilities like shockwave/heatwave etc. Vauban however, yes, he certainly is less survivable. That however doesnt mean he must rely on his CC or that it is any crisis when he cant CC something. He is also likely out of sight anyways since you probably want things to not have something to shoot at, so they can get clear of obstacles in order to get vortexed properly into your flechette orbs. But hey, maybe you run into alot of eximus spawning right ontop of you? I know I dont.

Wrecking things like a madman. No issues noticed whatsoever. He's also still just as immortal as before due to the constant reg still being there. I dont worry about using his 2 or 224 combo outside of rebuffing every 90-ish seconds since it doesnt matter if it hits zero because it will be back before the OG immunity runs out due to constant killing. Might consider casting the 224 combo more in groups since you dont know how the kill speed is for others, so they might need more than the reg. I really dont see why people even complain about the OG nerf. It was sensible, since it brings it more inline with other OG since they dont have reg and they require you to hit targets to maintain it. With Dante it is fire and forget for a minute or more. Also works on ability immune bosses since it has no hit requirement, so that is a massive bonus aswell, as opposed to Kullervo that only self hurts if he tries to use it on an immune enemy. Only current annoying bug (that is on the radar) is that melee (with or without pack leader) eats the OG on your pet and either replaces it with the 2200 from primed pack leader or leaving it empty if you dont have that mod equipped. Not sure if it is possible to remove pack leader from all configs to make it work, but I'm too #*!%ing lazy to bother. I'll just cut down a few enemies from time to time instead to gets some OG filling clouds going from Dual Ichor.

Yep. AoE recieved the same mentality of "zomg worfless!" after the nerfs. With claims they were completely unusable unless they had high ammo capacity, yet many of us sat there and went "huh?" and used the low ammo weapons the same as before the nerf with no ammo issues. The same with the initial Bramma nerf even though it stayed as the top AoE and then tied with Kzarr when that was released. Did a few more runs today, same deal, no issues whatsoever. Able to maintain a constant 90-100% life support while sitting at slightly above 2 kills per second without breaking a sweat. And OG keeps him safe for close to 90 seconds in my build since they'll never catch me without killing if OG for some reason happens to hit 0. Saw some posts around that highlighted that if there is a potential LoS issue it is tied to DX version used along with FoV. So to be transparent I run DX11 with a FoV of 78 and zero issues.

Niche? It's perfect in any melee build, especially with fast weapons that hit multiple times per combo interaction. It's one of the fastest skills to cast so very easy to spread your melee 20m+ around you at all times. I dont think people realize just how much 20m actually covers. For instance, standing in the middle of Hydron means you have roughly 25m to the room furthest from the spawn, that is roughly where you run out of infinity range. 5 meters less than that is still a large area. You can also see just by how far incluence itself practically turns you into Sauron swathing elves and men with his mace.

It is more likely due to tech improvements if you experienced it early on. And it is quite clear according to old patch notes that the highest spawn density came to a pass in 2015 with changes tied to survival that altered spawn behavior etc. Since then nothing has changed in that regard except in SP specifically. Exterminate for instance still fluctuates massively in kill requirement, so there is no strict connection to power. Not to mention the idea of "powercreep" tied to density is uhm very unlikely, since just because power is added it doesnt change that players at the low end will also make use of that same content (like exterminate or survival or anything else). So upping it overtime "cos" isnt probable. And if you look at the latest addition i.e Lab Disruption, the density is rather low compared to star chart disruptions.

No, the spawn rates havent increased. The spawn increases are purely level based, with starter planets having low kill requirements as opposed to the later ones. Regular progression all in all. You can see that with SP where Earth is still a low spawn planet for exterminate compared to Sedna, Eris or Pluto. Where have you imagined spawn rates increasing? And if so, when did that become a thing, in relation to what power addition? Did Sedna suddenly pop from 90 kills needed to 120 or something?

That is/was just a tech limitation issue. The way it has been intended has been seen and experienced for PC players since 2015. We shouldnt have our power and fun altered due to the pleb state of old consoles. If so I rather turn off crossplay to keep it as is for PC.

It is still insane together with Influence, since every target recieves a hit for each target hit by influence. So 20 enemies in spears results in each target taking 20 hits from a single influence instance. The augment used to be able to spread the initial hits 50m+ aswell, atleast those didnt count as influence hits to chain them back. That is without accounting for the guaranteed slash procs. It also gave some weapons absurd AoE that even puts curse to shame. Grimoire killing everything speared within 50m with alt fire for instance, Phantasma suddenly having a 50m AoE beam etc. While ignoring LoS. Now they are limited to 20-25 meters, which is still insane for weapons, which really means the weapons are covering a total area of 40-50 meters and earlier over 100m in total.

It feels as if none of the players that yell about Dante and/or scream "reeeefunds!" have played him. I played him when I got him pre-nerf. Enjoyed him, had fun, saw massive killing and immortality. I dropped him, played Kullervo again and tested some Nezha (also a justified nerf) and was happy with that. So yeah reee reee and wha wha starts over the nerfs and LoS. Sure, it sucks with a broken LoS, who doesnt think that right? But hey, they fixed it a day later, cool, so then why all the crying and screaming? Which made me decide to jump in and try Dante again. And damn am I shocked about the nerfs and LoS, like really, totally mindboggling and breathtaking... that people complain and cry over it and threaten with refunds. Like, could someone hand me a microscope or something so I can actually spot the difference? The actual main thing that made it feel different was the fix to his 3, which was not working like it should on release and ignored LoS. The LoS added to his 4 is unnoticable, since it would practically work the exact same anyways due to the fixes on his 3. Unless for some reason you loved to run around and bleed things all over and then detonate for some reason. He is still 100% immortal aslong as you kill, I mean it is practically impossible to die. They could in reality reduce his OG cap to 1k, 5, 10k or whatever and he'd still be just as immortal thanks to killing 24/7 and having constant OG reg. Another thing that is quite obvious. The complainers are very self centered, or atleast many of them. They claim to consider others and say "remove OG think of da Chroma children! but dont you damn dare to touch mah bleedz and persnol ovragerd!". Which really just reads to me as people oblivious to the fact of OG issues overall and just want to give something they personally dont find important to keep something else. Massive newsflash! Dante is a massive support frame, which was his intent, he also brings some serious damage to the table. Right now the people saying he is suddenly useless have likely not played him, because he is at Kullervo levels of map wiping atm while also bringing immortality to the group. Not to mention the insane usefulness of a floating Noctua granting you additional elemental statuses or insane angry birds going ka-ka and ripping faces and appying debuffs. Dante with Nourish instead of his Noctua is bonkers on so many levels. He is up there on Kullervo levels for me when it comes to completely fun and ridiculous damage and survival. The pen is indeed mightier than the sword, hence why I use dual bone axes on both Dante and Kullervo, cos I aint falling for that trick... edit: When I think of it. The people screaming likely only sat in very low content and probably didnt give a crap about if they hit with his 3 or not, since they simply relied on the regular damage from final verse that is dealt as baseline within range (LoS now aswell). It was afterall 10000 damage with a +100% strength build, so a real lowbie champion skill in such content.

Yes it has. Unless you claim all of a sudden patch notes lie. Since the last changes to survival mob spawns occured in 2015. The only change after that was to fix consistancy between early and late star chart.

Nope not really true. I'll line them each up. Banshee: Only has her short stun stopped by eximus. Still removes their abilities/auras. She is also not a CC frame, she is a debuffer. Her CC lasts a whole whooping second and is a secondary effect to what the skill actually does. And I sure as hell hope you dont talk about her quake here, since who the #*!% stops to quake in order to CC? Like say DE suddenly allows for eximus CC through OG, on what planet in what universe or reality would you go "zomg I can finaly quake it!!!!!"? None hopefully since all you'd do is bounce it around while dealing abyssmal damage and locking yourself out of all actions. Nyx: Still adds confusion as she CCs everything around the OG target. Also has a strip and massive tanking potential. Does not rely on CC. Zephyr: Not restricted a bit, since you know... you can actually target the eximus and trag everything to it instead of dragging it to others. Tornadoes still wreck eximus that walk near them since they still deal damage. Yareli: Doesnt rely on CC and everything around the eximus is still CCed. So you simply laugh at the feeble damage you tank through Merulia as you waste the eximus. Can also pull of a Zephyr. Nova: She counter CCs, simple as that. Built for slow? Everything else comes slower as the eximus is singled out. Built for speed? Everything comes faster as the eximus is singled out and left behind? Still takes massive damage from allies detonating next to it. Xaku: You dont have to try and CC the eximus when you have 20 other targets around aswell. Vauban: No the eximus will still walk your way and get shredded by flechettes. Can also handle it like Zephyr and pull everything ontop of the eximus to nuke it all. Khora: No just no. She annihilates things with the whip alone. And if you have say 24 enemies where 4 are eximus a dome will still grab 20. You can then whip the eximus which also splashes to the dangling ones in the dome, spreading it to all 20 plus whatever amount of eximus you hit directly. Ash and Garuda: They arent CC frames to begin with. You also have more targets on a map than OG targets. You have extremely few OG targets in reality. Which is really the whole problem with the reasoning regarding OG and CC, since it is only a fraction of the enemies you face that have OG, everything else can be CCed to handle the eximus if needed. That is the whole point, so not everything could be CCed and killed. So you had to put focus on something that was a slight threat. And nuker frames dont have a higher advantage, they still need to focus the eximus while not having an option to handle the trash, or they clear the trash and then focus on the eximus. Most AoE on frames is really too weak to passively and effectively handle the eximus and the strong damage is often much more focused, like a gun or melee. So it really just comes down to which way a frame removes the adds from the picture as they kill the eximus. CC frames CC the adds, damage frames kill the adds and dent the OG and then focus on the eximus. People need to stop with the disengeneous reasoning where they make it seem like everything gets CC immune the moment a single eximus shows up. Again, it is just the eximus that is immune out of all the mobs around it.

What you decide to show is also still part of the game, in low level missions when we are new. So again, you are against natural progress, since your "powercreep" starts the moment we grab a few mods and non-MK1 starter weapons. High density gameplay in the shape we have now in endless has been around since around 2015. Meaning it has been the norm for the majority of the current lifespan of the game. High density gameplay was added prior to that though, already in 2013, but tweaked to feel smoother and better up to and through parts of 2015.

Well since they did manage to make LoS work now and plan on using that system on other LoS frames I dont see a problem with them adding it to all other AoE. It only took them a few days to implement this and make it work. The most important thing is that they should likely consider it on a skill to skill basis, since adding LoS to some AoE skills make no actual sense. Quake, Sonar, Molecular Prime for instance or even Miasma could be questionable. Piercing Roar aswell due it it more or less being a massive shockwave which in reality isnt just bound to stopping at a wall if there is an accessway for it to spread. Quake, Sonar and MP are quite self explainatory, and Miasma is an airborne virus that can likely find its way through nooks and crannies. However, I wouldnt be opposed to Miasma having it's damage removed, since the main use it in order to spread viral status and the debuff so spores can spread. Spores can have LoS based on the viewpoint of the enemy they infect, but 360 degrees around it since it isnt the enemy spreading the spores, it's the spores spreading themselves. It would block them from passing through walls though. Then for thermal sunder it really depends on if the idea behind it is that it superheats or supercools the air, in which case a wall wouldnt really matter. But it seems more like something that originates from Gauss so could be stopped by a wall.

A nice W for a frame that really didnt need more winning aswell, namely Kullervo. Because he has no shields under his OG, meaning the changes for OG next week will allow him to gain insane amounts of energy through Rage or Adrenaline since damage to OG isnt mitigated by anything. The new augment for Vex armor is insane as a heal when you play solo. It's practically always up and constantly healing you.

I just find it so fun that people are upset over OG cucking CC. Can you guys atleast stop acting as if we actually have a vast part of the roster that rely on CCs and struggle due to OG? Honestly, I can name 1 single frame that actually suffers from it, 1 out of 56(?). And that is poor Mr. Limbo, not even in his fancy top hat do they give a S#&$ about him (maybe they once were grouped with a Limbo). Every other frame either comes with damage or things tied to their CCs that make it work versus OG aswell. If you honestly think there are more frames than Lamebo that are so SoL versus OG please give a few examples.

Amar? Shoot him with bow when able to, hide behind rock to avoid damage. Kill mirror images when they pop, if you hit the real Amar they'll all disappear. Not sure if the real one is indicated by a red arrow in The New War. Heal as needed. Cant recall if I swapped to pistol to pop mirror images or kept using the bow. If you have the two other Archons left I'd suggest picking Boreal as the next since it is a rather simple fight where you can hide behind trees and roots. And the mechanics are easy. When it starts pushing you away with a an expanding dome, just roll into it and shoot the bastard, that way it returns to fighting again. All in all the fights are about avoiding damage from the archons and figuring out their mechanics as you make use of the environment to stay safe. Amar = rocks are your friends. Boreal = Make sure to be a happy tree friend.

No since WF doesnt introduce new power nor content on a regular basis that effectively renders old items/content obsolete. Powercreep is about a constant introductions of more powerful items and content. It doesnt apply when you get replacements and slightly more power sporadically, sometimes with years passing in between. It is just natural progression. I mean, someone can claim that things like Bramma and Kzarr was powercreep, but in reality it wasnt, since what they did AoE already did earlier, to a point where DE nerfed it long long long ago. So what DE really did with the introduction of Bramma and Kzarr (and early AoE changes) was revert the gameplay to an earlier state, since potentially it fit better in the game at that point. But lol... that has always been a thing. All that has really changed is that we are allowed to build so we can also farm effeciently in high content (and access high content without hours of work) that rewards slightly more in return for slightly higher threat. And that we can do it solo. Which would have also been possible all the same before in low content with the old and weak skills if DE just allowed us to have the same density solo as in groups. The kill rate has always been the same, it just happened to rely on groups earlier since DE were stingy about giving us 4-player density while solo for some reason. It's been like that since I started playing 7 years ago and it had been like that long before I joined aswell. Density has always been a standard.

5k would be about 10 times (or more) too much considering how much plunder, rubble and defy and scarab armor grants, which is nowhere in those regions. I'd say something like +250 armor that scales with strength, meaning 500 at +100% strength and 750 at +200% strength if he really wants to build for it.

It's a 65 degree cone while Dagath is just a wide straight line. It isnt really an issue to spread doom either, since tapping scythe is something you do on the go and and it has insane range while also piercing enemies to hit several per cast, where each one hit spread doom further. My point was really just that both have the same playstyle "role" as pure damage dealers. With the benefit of Dagath also providing debuffs for the group. Then you arent building or playing her properly at all since she can go full caster with no trouble throughout a 2h SP fissure survival. Constant gating aswell as tons of ehp potential with the right build(s) while 1HKing practically everything, including things like nullifiers and eximus. Plus most things are moving at a crawl thanks to scythes.

Same area in practicality unless you wanna rely on his 4 for AoE. I rather use roar, wrathful and a influence melee at that point, since all of that allows me to stay mobile. The trade off is that Kullervo's cone results in instant killing, Dagath aswell since her Doom keeps spreading, so no need for constant prepping, so can just horse around mostly.

Sampotes with Melee Influence is so much fun, especially on Kullervo with uhm 700% crit and some purple tau shards. Even the normal slam wipes rooms.

She's like most damage frames, not much to offer a group but very able to handle her own. Kullervo is the same, he even offers less to a group because he doesnt provide viral nor an easily managable slow even. Both are strong as Hel none the less. I prefer to replace Dagath's 3 with Fractured Blast, works well with the range investments and strength, gives her other options to survive and gives something to the group if you are in one. And on Kullervo I replace Ukko with augmented Roar, which gives a nice buff to the group and knocks enemies down and makes them easier to crit and hitting others for less.

The Dante farm has been the best. Did two SP disruption runs where I stayed for around 1h and 20min in each, after that I had everything I needed in order to buy the few things I was missing. Being able to go ham on C rotation over and over and over is amazing.