NuclearCoffeePot
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Posts posted by NuclearCoffeePot
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2 hours ago, DarthIronclad said:
For his passive,i will prob give him an adaptive damage effect with 75% status chance
The adaptive damage will be similar to the adaptive damage from his 4 currently,but with a fixed status chace at 75%
Corrosive for Armor,Magnetic for shields,gas for infested health and viral for non infested health.
His passive affects all of his abilities that deal damage
Slapping the adaptive damage on his passive would be nice, very effective overall
2 hours ago, DarthIronclad said:For his 1,his thralls are not permanent until 'dead',when they are killed,they will turn into a spectral form similar to vomolysts for a set duration,with a bonus damage multiplier.
Also thralls in normal and spectral form as affected by his passive.
Sounds good
2 hours ago, DarthIronclad said:His 2 will be reworked to a duration based adaptation like effect,but granting 100% resistance to up to 4 damage type,resisted damage will be amplified and reflected back at the enemy.
If you are going to remove damage immunity and switch it out for reduction you should consider keeping the health/shield drain a part of the kit, you'll still wind up taking damage and if you run into a nully it will come in handy, give it to thralls, damaging unturned thralls instantly deals max health damage to restore health and shields- excess becomes overshields- on spectral forms the restoration is doubled
2 hours ago, DarthIronclad said:His 3 can be completely replaced...with an ability similar to the Conculyst's cyclone ability,generates a powerful cyclone charged with sentient energy around the frame,greatly increasing his movement speed and granting full damage immunity,enemies that are unfortunate to be in range of this ability will take heavy damage. The duration of the ability will be short,but it can be powerful is used right
A nice touch- For the synergy just discussed let it pull spectral form thralls to your location- if you don't want to put it on that we can just have it so casting 1 with no target will summon the nearest few thralls and that can be cast inside dm and 3
2 hours ago, DarthIronclad said:For his 4,i will add a small AOE effect to his beams on impact,similar to how the prism lasers from the Battalyst work.
I'd be fine with just a vertical hitbox but that seems possible, your rework has mainly touched on sentient ideas while keeping thrall the same so balancing it out with some eidolon would be nice, have laser's leave energy pillars when it touches terrain- This is something the gauntalyst does already
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8 hours ago, kwlingo said:
Lots of these frame are useless when you have frames that take their strongest asset away like CC or killing one enemy at a time compared to a Nuke frame. Frost, Nyx, Titania and many others are not needed if you want to kill off an entire room. The only time these abilities are needed when the enemy level starts getting into the level 120+ when nukers take longer to scale their ability. This is when those frames can start to have a few shinning moments. But then at this level even Frost bubble will be needed to spam also. lol At least confusion with Nyx still works. On star chart levels room clears will always trump the rest of the frames unless you just want to run a support like Trinity to know you will at least be engaged in replenishing energy and health.
I did see a youtube video on the new End Game Titania because of all the damage reduction in air mods now can get up to 90% + add adaptation will make her super tankie.
What you are saying is true, however- Take Titania, yes, with the right build her dex pixia can annihalate single targets and she can both live long and prosper, but what of the rest of her kit, weak and wonky cc and some weak buffs aside from thorns and mabye dust- she has no real options aside from a Razorwing build, and it's not fun being stuck in one role like that- Yes they can do it and they can be better options then other frame's because nuke damage fall off in most cases, but they get shoehorned into using the same few abilities while the rest of their kit falls away- with other frame's i don;t need to use other abilities but I CAN and it's fine, with frames like Rev, Nyx, Titania you have to build one path, you could build for duration with Rev but what will that do, you lose your damage and tankiness and you don't get much in exchange save 7 enemies who walk around doing no damage and only serving as a distraction for enemies and a reave that lasts longer- They aren't uselss, as long as you build them in one way, don't and you suffer
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On 2019-12-30 at 9:52 PM, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said:
No, Revenant needs a full rework.
-That's what this whole page is for, please leave your own idea's for a rework rather then restating your opinion as though it is fact- It doesn't matter if other people think something different, the page is for discussion and sharing ideas, at least Red Dough Boy gave an idea in a polite and concise manner
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8 hours ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said:
Literally every frame that’s not Nyx is better than Revenant. He is the literal bottom of the barrel. That’s full justification for a rework.
Thematically yes but when you lok at what he has he is certainly not, free damage immunity, health and shield vampirism, and a damage source that adapts to the enemies weakness, he isn't the best but he's certainly not bottom of the barrel- Besides, I'm not saying he doesn't need one, just that he wouldnt get one for being bad, unless they nerf him again, he would get a rework for his thematic problems. Not that hard to understand the point I'm making.
-Again I must reiterate, if you are leaving comments, make them constructive, share your ideas please-
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14 hours ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said:
Half the frames in the game do whatever Revenant does better. And even still frames that don’t do what he does so well that what they do makes them infinitely better than Revenant.
Being worse then some frames is not justification, his poor theme following is but the fact that he may be less effective then other frames, every frame has someone better then them at something, that doesn't mean every frame needs a rework. And as far as I know there aren't any other frames who can adapt their damage to enemy weakness on the fly. Chroma and chromatic blade exist but they are both only base elemental type, and are decided BEFORE a mission-
14 hours ago, nslay said:A while back, a poster remarked about how Revenant wasn't originally a sentient/Eidolon frame until becoming trapped with the Eidolon. What are your thoughts about the very original form of Revenant? Does being trapped with Eidolon necessarily mean all of his skills are replaced?
I really do wonder what DE will do with Revenant Prime... Technically Revenant Prime should be the Warframe prior to it being trapped with the Eidolon! This could very well turn out to be an unconventional Primed Warframe with some different abilities if DE follows the lore (which they probably won't).
They won't give him a prime thats different, they might rework him before that happens or if they actually wanted to do something creative give people the option to remove the eidolon's effect, mabye splitting him into 2 frames, a pure eidolon, and his original form-
As for his original form, A vampire isn't far fetched, if we are talking about who can keep an eidolon trapped for thousands of years someone capable of leaching away health constantly would certainly be the top choice- plus there are vampire kavats on the plains- if we consider his job as a vampiric warden he might have used his own abilities to keep the eidolon there while his minions the cats roam the plains, keeping people away and feeding, probably returning what they feed to revenant to keep him strong
14 hours ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said:It doesn’t make any sense. What was the point of DE introducing the idea of a frame that is corrupted by Eidolons energy if they had literally zero intention of having it’s abilities reflect that and instead making a frame that has vampire powers without absolutely no justification for those powers when the lore doesn’t make sense. If DE wanted to make a vampire theme Warframe then they shouldn’t have both his lore and appearance reference Eidolons. Why do I keep having to explain this. It’s not f***ing rocket science. The lore doesn’t connect to the characters powers. IT’S NOT THAT DIFFICULT TO UNDERSTAND!
Must I really reiterate this AGAIN- the point of this thread isn't to debate about what went wrong in his development or talk about how dumb DE was, fact is they did screw up his theme. This is a post where we discuss Ideas for how he could be changed, please contribute some ideas instead of just arguing with other posters in a "I'm right your not and your opinions don't matter" fight.
17 hours ago, (XB1)Knight Raime said:Personally I've always wanted the explosion of the pillars to trigger a wave of healing for him and his allies. Whether the explosion removes the pillars or not I'm unsure. It's been awhile since I made suggestions to improve the kit.
I really do wish he had a way to make a group of thralls at once.
The synergy would be off, it's great on paper but since most of the time you won't take any damage at all it is only helpful for allies- As for making a group at once, Enthrall spreads to enemies fast especially if you pick the right enemy, napalms and bombards for aoe, hyeka and drak masters cause you also take control of their companions- rather then make a group at once being able to collect them together at will would be nice, currently they wander around and attack things until there aren't any enemies, mabye if reave could tp thralls near you during the cast delay, that way you can group them all with you-
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2 hours ago, (XB1)Red Dough Boy said:
Rather than a full rework I'd like an augment or just pure change for the thralls to die once the power ends, giving you overshields and health, or energy. Even if it's a lower cap you get a small force of the enemies own troops to kill for you, then they die at the end of the time. Or if thralls that die under the effect become Vomvalysts that continue to fight for you, and can't be killed by allies because that's obnoxious and ruins Enthrall. The problem with it now is that you get about 8 or so thralls and if you don't kill them before the time is up they go right back to fighting you. I think his powers are okay for the most part, but Enthrall could use a change.
To that REd I recomend you to the link available in the post, it takes you to an alternate thread with a smaller scale rework mainly focusing on qol and enthrall changes
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38 minutes ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said:
No, Revenant needs a full rework.
You don't need to just tell them no, as I stated in last post, Constructive criticism is welcome, give an example of why you believe he is wrong at least or learn to let stuff go
28 minutes ago, CopperBezel said:Well, there's the other thread still. Apparently it was impossible to discuss both things in the same thread. I don't know whether this thread needs to exist, but rather than encouraging it further when you don't need it yourself, it'd be best to go post in the other.
I explain my reasoning. 1- not to clutter up the main post 2- to prevent the small rework vs large rework crowds for Rev fighting in chat, by splitting it, it is easier for me to manage-
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This page is dedicated to concepts for a large scale Revenant rework to make him more thematically appropriate-
I will provide a link to the page dedicated to a smaller scale rework below
Revenant as is does not deliver on his theme as an Eidolon frame, due mainly to an unclear development cycle where the theme was muddled up with vampires- The ideas I will now propose are intented to be more thematically appropriate, interesting, and fun- They are not finalized, leave your feedback and ideas in the comments and I will do my utmost best to read them, understand them, and edit my own ideas accordingly to help create a better image of what the community wants. With that said here are my ideas.
QuotePassive-His current can go out the window- New passive- Regenerating Scream-
QuoteWhen his shields are depleted Revenant releases a scream that stuns nearby enemies and links him to his Eidolon Minions(will discuss) He will then drain health and shields from them to restore his shields, excess healing will become Energy-
1st Power-Blood Summon-Based after the hydrolist's ability- On activation Blood Summon marks the targeted enemy, reducing their hp/shields/ and movement speed by a percentage- Killing the target will create a Bloom- a brief portal that summons the Eidolon Primalyst- a unique eidolon minion for Revenant to utilize in combat-
Primalyst Mock-up info and stats
QuoteThe Primalyst is a sentient beast, appearing as a hollow wolf shaped creature made up of eidolon bone plate's, the interior is vacant and contains only energy and the face is similar to that of a vomvalyst though more animalistic, with a lower jaw being formed from eidolon energies-
The Primalyst itself, fitting for both a destructive Eidolon and the original use of Revenant which was as a warden, is capable of rushing, immobilizing, and subsequently damaging it's targets- as such I have modeled the Primalyst's stats after those of the Sunika Kubrow as it was bred as a combat variant of Kubrow- Of course since you can have several Primalyst's active the stats will be reduced accordingly(do keep in mind these are only a temp example and have not been fully balanced statwise- the example's I give for it's numbers are only mock-up's)
Attack types- The primalyst has two attacks
First type- The Primalyst slashes at an enemy with it's front claws, dealing 50 slash damage per strike
Second Type-Primalyst tackles it's opponent at high speed, knocking them to the ground and pinning them down, It then breaths eidolon energy across it's target from it's mouth- This attack deals 50 corrosive and 50 magnetic damage per second for x seconds(the duration of the pin and attack is increased with duration mods)
Health-90 base-270 at ability max rank
Shields-70 base-210 at ability max rank
Armor-50
Crit chance-low- 5%
Crit damage-2.5x
Status chance-10%- based on power strength
Primalyst's gather near Revenant when first summoned2nd ability-
QuoteMesmer skin isn't really a good name for this ability, I'm open for suggestions: On cast revenant create's a health buffer for himself- for x seconds after the initial cast(based on duration) revenant taunts enemies nearby into attacking him and absorbs their damage, absorbed damage adds increasing amounts of over-shields to the buffer, in addition, for every damage type he is struck by his buffer gains stacking damage reduction to those types(this reduction applies to both over-shields and health and lasts for x seconds after his buffer is destroyed)-
Active Primalyst's will also recieve overshields and 50% of the damage reduction
3-Dance Macabre-
QuoteDance Macabre now has 2 functions-
On tap cast- Revenant sweeps one hand in an arc, firing lasers that sweep across a 180 degree angle-
On hold cast- Revenant transitions into a rotation mode, his body remains still but he raises his hand over his head, creating a prism of light that fires lasers omnidirectionally- With each full rotation the lasers damage grows and the damage of the lasers adapts to it's enemies with repeated hits- In this form Revenant may only rotate up to 4 time's at base-cap's at 8 rotations
-Damage growth based on power strength
-Range of lasers based on range
-Duration effects how many time's revenant rotate's
All lasers now have a vertical Hitbox, damaging enemies both above and below the actual laser visual effect
When lasers strike Primalyst's they will sacrifice 25% of their maximum hp to create a pillar of eidolon flames that damages enemies who enter-Pillar is wider then current pillars- this may only occur once twice per cast of Dance Macabre
4-Summoning Scream-
QuoteAs the "anchor" for the eidolon to pull itself into the material world this ability seems only fitting-
-On cast Revenant summons 4 Eidolon Pieces within his affinity range, the pieces appear as large Sentient bone's and Eidolon body parts, all wreathed in eidolon tendrils- These Pieces begin to corrupt the surrounding environment, applying a DOT effect to enemies who pass within range
-Ability is a channeled effect with a low drain per second
- -Eidolon Pieces have their own Health and shields, and mirror some of Revenants abilities to an extent
- Casting Blood Summon will create a Primalyst from each Eidolon piece
- Casting will cause the Pieces to mirror the taunt and use absorbed damage to heal themselves and generate overshields
- When Dance Macabre hit's Pieces they create an explosion at the cost of 25% of their max hp- can happen twice per cast of Dance Macabre
- When Pieces are outside of Revenants affinity range they despawn after x seconds and respawn near Revenant
I believe an interesting way to please the whole crowd would be to introduce a quest of sorts when you have the Revenant frame, It allows you to, at the end, either keep revenant the same or split him into two different frames, the Eidolon form, and the Original form- THis will allow ppl who like current Rev to have that with the necessary updates, ppl who want a full eidolon frame will get that + we can play as what Revenant was originally, I have actually generated a concept for that, lemme know what you think
Thematically-A mystic of sorts, with a focus on mesmerising foes and the vampiric aspect originally intended for Rev, I intend to keep some of Reb's concepts with changes of course-
To fit his theme I chose a name honoring of a famous mystic, and one actually rumored at the time of his existence to be a vampire for his ability to bewitch and the famous time when he was assasinated but even after being shot and poisoned the cause of death was drowning because they threw him into the river after all that- this may ring some bells for people- I am of course talking about Rasputin, Russian priest and Mystic- for the name I will use his first- Grigori- which can be altered in dialect to fit warframe quite well I think-
"This is Grigori, the mystic, the heretic, seducing an army of thralls, he toys with his enemies until the time come's to feast"
I have done my best to give him 3 different options for how to build him for different playstyles- I will discuss this later
Abilities:
Passive-The old Idea of gaining Lifesteal based on your energy pool works rather well- I propose that he gains lifesteal for every % of missing energy, thus letting him sustain himself even when he cannot rely on abilities
1-Enthrall-Grigori extends a hand towards his chosen foe, bewitching them with his power, the Enemy becomes a thrall, they attack their former allies- The thralls are coated in a "Mesmer Skin" the first 1/2/2/3 enemies to attack them also become enthralled- Thralls also gain a % damage bonus for every active thrall(scaling with strength)- they are duration based- WHile not immune to damage when a thrall is slain by another ally there is a % chance(also based on power strength) for the slain thrall to create a seeking projectile that targets an enemy and enthralls them-
2-Hypnotic Mirror-Grigori channels his powers to create a hypnotic mirror around his body-the coverage is angle based similar to Baruuk's Elude- Enemies are taunted into attacking the mirror, after which they become entranced by it, becoming pacified as long as the mirror is active and for a duration after that- while in this form Grigori can cast other abilities however, he may enthrall pacified enemies with a reduced cast time and energy cost- casting 4 does not interrupt the mirror- 3 interaction will be explained next
3-Reave- Reave causes Grigori to dissolve into a free floating mist form, he links to enemies around him and drains a % of their maximum health and shields- increased against enemies afflicred by his other three abilities(does stack if they have been effected by several(ex: pacified-then enthralled=2 stacks+4 effect=3 stacks)- the drain(based on strength) occurs over the duration of the ability and the range of the link is based on range, thralls effected by the link will follow in range- When cast in his 2 form the channel will be disabled and resume on touchdown- casting 4 in this form will cause you to exit- can recast to exit early- cannot cast enthrall inside this form
4-Basically the old Rev 4 before dm was introduced- Grigori forces enemies in range into a deep slumber, they do not awaken on damage-duration of the sleep based on duration- range based on range
The gist: The gist of this concept is that there are 3 possible build paths
Power/Duration- This build elevates enthrall by increasing damage and how long they last while also allowing you to remain in reave for a long period and avoid damage - this does not buff reave as much as you would think as the tether range is reduced and the health drain takes place over the duration of the ability-this does however, due to the tether causing thralls to follow, let you move around with thralls all around you, enabling you to effectively conduct your troops
Power/Range- Focuses on Reave's damage potential by increasing both the range of the tether and the drain- because the drain takes course over the duration of the ability the reduced duration from this build will enable you to leach quickly and effectively but you will not have as powerful of cc or a long damage immunity period
Range/Duration-Focus on Hypnotic Mirror and 4- Since taunt+pacification on 2 is based on range and the duration after exiting the mirror is based on duration plus the obvious 4 scaling and the ability to stay inside your reave for prolonged periods will enable you to move quickly and cc large areas while remaining mostly unharmed
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Alrighty peeps, IM very thankful for your feedback and I'll post a dedicated thread specifically for a complete rework of Revenants kit within the next 24 hours- Ill leave a link in the opening post when it's up- thanks for your feedbcak- Ill make this thread for non-drastic changes that way we can keep it from getting to cluttered or a Drastic vs non-drastic changes argument thread- See yall soon
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On 2019-12-28 at 8:02 PM, Madway7 said:
My idea for a new passive (in a rework that would keep him mostly the same) would be to give him an amount of strength based on his shield capacity. Say, 20% for reg shield, 50 when at maxed overshields.
That would certainly help make his dm thrall synergy be actually useful-
On 2019-12-28 at 8:02 PM, Madway7 said:So how would I change it (if I could)? I would make it a Mirage ball that always follows him. (thats the basics of it although I'm still working out balance issues which would come from being able to shoot weapons and move around freely)
This sounds like a badass augment, he doesn't have one currently- Might use this in an updated post 🙂 thx
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7 hours ago, CopperBezel said:
Healing Return is weird as hell. You have to inflict a status proc with the weapon it's installed on, then hit that same enemy without killing them, to activate the healing. Since the return is per status type per hit, a weapon that can throw out a lot of quick strikes without initially dealing a lot of damage is best. It's unfortunately a very poor substitute for what Life Strike used to do.
What I don't know without trying is how if at all it would interact with EB's blade beams. It wouldn't surprise me if they're actually weirdly circumventing it the way they do the combo counter. = /
I checked while testing lifestrike andhealing return for OP- wave's work with healing return
7 hours ago, CopperBezel said:The energy waves do have a separate status proc (at that 100% chance when built well) and all that punchthrough, which can mean waves of stacking corrosive procs before your sword actually connects with a particular enemy. So I kinda think it's more a calculus of whether the wall of armor strip you're putting out is enough to justify the nerf bat it requires you to use to land the killing blows. With very high-level armored enemies, it seems to start to make up for itself, but I don't think it's going to outperform the really top-tier melee weapons even then.
Without building for lifestrike you can deal a lot of damage, I don't find myself falling off much in damage at higher levels, only in survivability, which could be circumvented by changing radial javelin to be more useful- if we really wanted to make lifestrike work well for him then just have slash dash count as a heavy attack and scale off eb mods, this won't be glamorous and it will need a range boost, but it could work well enough- If we really want to talk about exalted weapons that need buffs, let's look at wukong and valc not excal- his damage is fine, his survivability could increase by changing his third ability since it has no place- they are in far more trouble
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42 minutes ago, Ryden said:
Sighh.. not much choice currently
Unfortunantly but in high levels there are always other options for frame's, if you really want to use excal we just have to wait and make suggestions till something is changed- mabye we can change 3 for something defensive based- draining hp from enemies struck or other things
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14 minutes ago, Yun_Woo-Seok said:
Even being affected by mods, enemy scaling will have this damage fall off pretty quickly. Only instance of reflected dmg I've seen work is Octavia, which is fine imo since that's the only way she can kill via abilities.
Excal already has his 4 for dmg, he just needs better defense to take his 4 into high level content. We know his 3 summons skanas to attack, so summoning them to protect him instead sounds like a plausible change while still keeping their aesthetic value.
The point in my mind isn't to deal damage, it;s as a way to avoid damage to increase survivability, the reason i include damage scaling with melee is because without it ppl would probbaly complain it deals no damage- YOu can tweak it however you want but having a way to avoid damage is really great and thematically the ability fits for a swordsman
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Ok- Played around a bit with life strike compared to healing return- Lifestreak heal is definetly greater and with a 720 hp exalted umbra even without killing blow I could heal from 200 to max against a group of 8 lvl 100 heavy gunners in one hit- my advise for you since you don't want to get fked in close range by having to heavy attack is to use heavy ground slam- at least in the simulacrum you still recieve the heals but it has a much faster cast and will apply lifted to all the enemies for you- if you still don't like that use a status application weapon like cyanex ahead of time before striking with eb for healing- it still won't heal as much though- If you are really worried about getting screwed using heavy attacks perform a slide attack first with eb to blind enemies before you start the charge- ultimately I would just channel ground slam though- it can travel a distance, cc's enemies on landing, and heals you a bunch
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13 hours ago, Ryden said:
And is it just me, or does Healing Return just not work at all? Or at least only when it wants to? With 100% status chance, should I not be seeing health returned on literally every swipe? Even if this were to be the case, it's still not enough when you're surrounded.
A lot of mods don't work the same with projections like ex waves and serene storm- it might be that it only works when you hit them with the blade itself- or that you are only applying a few status effects since it is 11 per hit per status effect applied- but it doesn't stack with repeated instances of the same damage type like multiple slash procs-
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Just now, Graive said:
I like the idea, but feel just increasing the general blast radius would have the same effect, especially if the number of barrages is increased. If your suggestion is adding more that I'm just not seeing please let me know so I can consider and try incorporating it.
I have a post about hydroid, I changed a lot from the original concept thanks to community feedback and helped kapn create his concept- heres the link
My orignial Idea was this however-
Passive-Tide meter- Through generating "Tide" Hydroids abilities would gain increased range on cast- Tide can be gained from undertow and killing enemies effected by abilities
1-Cast as you would currently- on initial cast the first wave of missiles divide themselves amoungst enemies in range- Corrosive projection would be made innate with it starting at a low armor reduction- ramping up for repeated hits
Augment- On cast Hydroid would create a zone around himself that dropped it;s own missiles
2-Riptide-Begin a drain that consumes available tide meter in place of energy when possible- Transform into a watery state- Gain movement and attack speed-Attacks pass through you- generate tide meter on enemy kills- whirlpool beneath feet drags enemies closer
3-Undertow- Big change- Undertow uses a mechanic similar to how railjack creates the illusion that all the tile's are in one place- in reality if you didn't know all the ship interiors have their own skybox while the windows act as a portal you can see through and launcher tp's you etc
-Undertow acts like a portal into an underwater zone- Enemies who fall in are suspended in the water and take consistent dps- 1 projectiles can fall in- Hydroid can enter or exit the zone by pressing shift while walking over undertow(it is no longer channel and while you are placed in automatically you can leave and the puddle will remain- Starts as a base cost- While inside the puddle hydroid begins a drain effect that leeches energy for every enemy inside- drain is capped after 5 enemies- For every enemy in undertow Hydroid also passively generates more tide in his meter
4-Kraken-TEntacles are changed- they now grab an enemy and hold them in place, crushing them slowly dealing impact and viral dps- tentacles also are summoned in the underwater zone(nicknamed The Deep)- and excecute enemies inside when their health drops below 15%
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12 minutes ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said:
Thralls are not Vombulysts.
Correct-my point still stands- They aren't but they act like- Im pushing that they be replaced anyway- look at the main post, it has been edited
12 minutes ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said:No other frame has literally zero reason for existing. They all atleast have one use (except Nyx).
My problem with this statement is that you have already said he can survive longer then tanks- that is a reason for existing, if we are talking lorewise all frames have a purpose, killing sentients, if we are talking mechanically that is what we are trying to fix here
14 minutes ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said:Mesmer Skin has literally nothing to do with Eidolons. In the devstream it was described as a representation of how Vampires mesmerize/hypnotize their victims.
I will cede to you that it has little to no thematic connection- I refer to it;s purpose not it's function in my quote- and yes- that is also why I change it in my second Idea concept in the main post- look at it
15 minutes ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said:I’m going to clarify this as best as I can. What was the point of DE creating Revenants backstory about him being corrupted by Eidolons energy if they had zero intention of having his powers represent that and instead make a vampire frame. Despite the fact that Eidolons have absolutely nothing to do with vampires.
There is none-I won't argue that there was- It was poor decision making on part of the DEV's
16 minutes ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said:The reason why Revenant is a vampire is because they let Rebecca lead his development. So despite the fact that Revenants original concept art being literally labeled as “Eidolon frame” she wanted a vampire and completely disregarded Revenants lore and appearance just so she could have a vampire frame. The reason why he has 1 singular Eidolon related ability with Danse Macabre is because after his reveal Steve said that the frame that looks like an Eidolon needs to actually have Eidolon powers.
Correct
16 minutes ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said:And if you don’t want this to devolve into an arguement then stop trying to debate my points with faulty logic.
I have agreed with most of your points and provided reasoning, the point of this entire thread as with all of my threads is to post my own ideas, gather feedback, edit them, repeat until I create an Idea that most people like-You may conclude it is faulty logic- okay- the reason I argue is because I can accept criticism in posts, and that is why I edit the main posts(Please look at it)- however I can not accept criticism in my threads that are not constructive, it is a common theme in your posts to call someone wrong but give little to no insightful examples of how you would make it, rendering your criticism ignorable at best as it provides nothing to the argument save a negative voice, and intolerable at worst as you seem needlessly condescending and rude to other people in the forums- If you call my logic faulty, fine, but I'm here to listen to your ideas, not you repeatedly saying the words wrong and faulty, please provide a constructive response as to what you want from revenant beyond thematic changes, give examples as others have- and as I said before, please refer back to the opening post- I have edited it with the old idea summarized and tucked in a quote, and the new ideas in their own box, they are more thematically aligned, and I would hope that as my most active poster you would have something to say about it
-Seeya Soon, NCP- 🙂
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Here is an idea for a radial javelin change, If we want him to keep a swordsman theme while giving survivability then here
New 3-Parry- Enter a counter state, reflecting attacks coming from an angle in front of you while slightly reducing movement speed- 100% chance to parry melee attacks, perform finisher against enemies who do this- acts as a toggle, can be used with exalted blade active-with exalted blade, parrying attacks releases an aoe ring all around you, knocking back enemies and restoring a small amount of energy for each enemy hit- Return damage can scale with your equipped melee, if none or if using 4 scales with exalted blade stats- can use other abilities which will stop the drain for the casting animation and switch back- IN counter state you cannot attack with ranged weapons
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14 minutes ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said:
The Eidolons did not mind control Revenant. He got to comfortable being around them and forgot about how dangerous they were and they took advantage of it and dragged him down into the sentient dimension.
Vombulysts are not Thralls. They don’t need to be mind controlled by the Teralyst to work with it. They just work with it because they’re already on the same side.
Blood is part of gore. Half her deal is slash procs and slash shreds enemies to ribbons.
Wrong. Reave does not restore Mesmer stacks. Reaving Thralls does. There’s a difference. Also, yes Revenant can technically survive longer than other tank frames, but he’s practically useless in content that’s not excessively long endurance runs because those frames severely outpace and outperform him. And the fact that he’s only useful when you get to enemy levels that are up in the thousands is even more against Revenants favor because DE doesn’t want to support that kind of play. It’s the whole reason they dropped Void Towers in favor of relics. Revenant is literally in a game that wants nothing to do with him.
Nyx is just as bad as Revenant. Titanias at least has a practical use of being able to kill Eidolons with her 4 and Hydroid has a place in farming squads with his augment. Revenant has literally no practical use.
Mesmer skin is nothing like Synovias. If it was actually representative of them then he’d only have 4-6 charges and a lot of health in between those charges. Not 15 that get torn through like wet tissue. As stated before Thralls are nothing like Vombulysts. Throwing a symbol on their head that looks like one doesn’t immediately make them like vombulysts. DE covered up the wall of mist that Reave was with the Vombulysts dash. They didn’t change the mechanics or anything. Revenants 1-3 are literally just vampire powers that they painted over with Eidolon design.
And there’s the old arguement “Maybe he was a vampire before he was captured by the Eidolons”. If he WAS a vampire and DE had literally zero intention of putting any kind of Eidolons abilities on him. Then what was the point of giving him a backstory where he is literally corrupted by Eidolons energy for thousands of years? If they wanted to make a vampire themed frame that’s fine, but they can’t make a frame who’s lore is tied to Eidolons and appearance is reminiscent of Eidolons and be like “That’s a vampire”.
Also did you notice what I said at the beginning, just wanted to clarify I don't really want to argue cause I don;t want to have this post stopped as has happened in the past because of SOME people who refuse to listen to other players and give constructive criticism rather then just flat refusal- I'd rather hear what you have to say about the main post that I updated rather then a post I made replying to everyone's comments and saying try not to argue 🙂
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1 minute ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said:
The Eidolons did not mind control Revenant. He got to comfortable being around them and forgot about how dangerous they were and they took advantage of it and dragged him down into the sentient dimension.
I was not refering to him being dragged down, at the end of the Mask of the Revenant quest we see that the Eidolon is controling Revenant into attacking you, a fellow tenno, Nakak specifically says, "It's become a mask for, some kind of eidolon"-
2 minutes ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said:Vombulysts are not Thralls. They don’t need to be mind controlled by the Teralyst to work with it. They just work with it because they’re already on the same side.
When saying thralls are to rev as vomvulysts are to eidolon I was obviously not saying it in a literal sense, Eidolons use Thralls as distractions and to heal themselves when they are weakened, Revenant uses them for aggro and to heal himself when he is weakened
4 minutes ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said:rong. Reave does not restore Mesmer stacks. Reaving Thralls does. There’s a difference.
Correct- I did not include this but my point still stands, Reave can restore mesmer stacks, if it dashes through thralls
4 minutes ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said:Blood is part of gore. Half her deal is slash procs and slash shreds enemies to ribbons.
Also correct, IDK why we are arguing about this in a rev post tho- IM just not bringing it up again 🙂
5 minutes ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said:Also, yes Revenant can technically survive longer than other tank frames, but he’s practically useless in content that’s not excessively long endurance runs because those frames severely outpace and outperform him
Which can be said for other frames- And the fact that he can proves he is not inherently bad as you say, he can outperform tanks in both endurance and damage
6 minutes ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said:Nyx is just as bad as Revenant. Titanias at least has a practical use of being able to kill Eidolons with her 4 and Hydroid has a place in farming squads with his augment. Revenant has literally no practical use.
Yes, and thats my point-I love titania but her only good ability is 4- spellbind is wonky, tribute is weak, lantern is innefective at best
and hydroid, while he surves a purpose when he is using an augment is boring to play efficiently, puddle play and occasional casts of 4 are not interactive gameplay
7 minutes ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said:Mesmer skin is nothing like Synovias. If it was actually representative of them then he’d only have 4-6 charges and a lot of health in between those charges. Not 15 that get torn through like wet tissue. As stated before Thralls are nothing like Vombulysts. Throwing a symbol on their head that looks like one doesn’t immediately make them like vombulysts. DE covered up the wall of mist that Reave was with the Vombulysts dash. They didn’t change the mechanics or anything. Revenants 1-3 are literally just vampire powers that they painted over with Eidolon design.
They are not synovia, but there intent as an eidolon power is there. A power to make his actual health untargetable, thats synovia outer covering, but they can't make it immune to all damage save Tau like normal synovia cause normal enemies don't deal that, and if it was duration it would just be another Iron skin
9 minutes ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said:And there’s the old arguement “Maybe he was a vampire before he was captured by the Eidolons”. If he WAS a vampire and DE had literally zero intention of putting any kind of Eidolons abilities on him. Then what was the point of giving him a backstory where he is literally corrupted by Eidolons energy for thousands of years? If they wanted to make a vampire themed frame that’s fine, but they can’t make a frame who’s lore is tied to Eidolons and appearance is reminiscent of Eidolons and be like “That’s a vampire”.
-I did not state he was a vampire because of eidolons, i stated he was a vampire before the eidolon took over since that was the best frame for the job, he wouldnt need to be replaced ever and was least likely to die- For the second bit- your totally right- the reason they had was that, "Hey, plains of Eidolon are dropping and it wouldn't make much sense to release a vampire frame at the same time, lets make him eidolon, and then they rushed to change him and thats why his Eidolon link is just poorly masked Vampire abilities- Also people had been calling for a sentient frame for quite a bit- It wasn't a logical decision, it was a rushed one- thats why
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19 minutes ago, (PS4)Iron4EverRooster said:
Another interesting ability could be; Loki's decoy turns into a specter. Therefore, when casting, the option could be to cast a decoy or a specter. In addition, the decoy or specter could be set to stay or follow
This is an interesting idea- it could work on hold cast or be an augment- therefore keeping the invuln phase and at the end gaining a damage and health boost based on how much it took
19 minutes ago, (PS4)Iron4EverRooster said:4. Shape-shifting
Could be that rather then invincibility when leaving invis he camouflages himself as the primary enemy faction nearby for 10 seconds or until invis recast
19 minutes ago, (PS4)Iron4EverRooster said:5.Instead of speed reduction, health, shield, or armor could be reduced, but only for a new ability.
Disarm currently to me feels like a- im coming out of invis- lets disarm enemies so they are easy to dispatch- with a freely cancellable invis that is less necessary since you shouldnt come out when in large groups- instead for 4 we can have, say, Tricksters Spirit-Loki causes several enemies in range to be coated in a tenno hologram, causing their allies to fire on them, this effect lasts for a duration-enemy fire towards these targets can have a damage multiplier or else the damage can ramp up the longer the duration
-Loki doesn't need to many changes but making the trickster frame with more tricks up his sleeve is certainly fun- I would recomment a look at ash as well, the true ninja of our space ninja game could use a little love
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20 hours ago, Graive said:
I'm not crazy about tagging enemies since Ash's tagging mechanic feels so clunky already, but I understand your goal was to reduce the rng nature of the ability here. I've got no good suggestions 😕
Heres an idea I poested for his 1- On initial cast The first wave homes in on enemies within the radius and they gradually spread their fire over the duration- this means it will initially be focused where all the enemies are but spread out over time so as not to let enemies walk through unscathed
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Alright Peeps, don't argue to much, we are presenting ideas not competing over who's is best, who is wrong, who is right, in the end this is all conceptual, nobody is wrong, nobody is right-
Here are some things I have to say before I update the main Post
15 hours ago, CopperBezel said:Enthrall is just ... both thematically and in gameplay terms, I don't know why it's there. Mind control is an Orokin thing, not a Sentient thing.
Yes...and no- We have actually seen eidolons take control of someone, wanna guess who, rev, litereally in his quest is quoted as being a mask for the eidolon- he used himself to hold back the Eidolon but in the end was puppeteer-ed into exiting and letting it pull itself out.- Second- The reason it is there is yes, his orignial vampire theme, but consider that thralls are to Revenant what vomvy's are to eidolons, the problem is that they aren't vomvalst's so it makes no sense-
4 hours ago, CopperBezel said:Check the name of her alt helmet and consider that it's not gore she draws on, it's blood....
4 hours ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said:It’s pretty easy to surmount from other frames and the names DE picks for stuff that simply going off the name of a cosmetic to argue a frames theme is pretty flimsy.
None of Garuda's abilities actually use gore, she drains blood, heals from blood, make's blood mirrors, blood and knife projectiles, procs bleed effects- she doesn't string out organs across the battlefield she stabs people and uses the drained blood for her abilities- 1- stab an enemy, turn their BLOOD into a shield and projectile 2-BLOOD altar- stab an enemy, drain blood for healing 3-BLOOD letting- stab yourself, damage returns energy 4- Creates knives that seek enemies and stab them, proccing BLEED effects
5 hours ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said:His 4 actually makes the most sense. Eidolons fire lasers. Danse Macabre is Revenant firing out a bunch of lasers, it also has an offensive version of the sentient damage adaptation.
Also, outside of Danse Macabre the rest of Revenants abilities are garbage, so he’s pretty much the worst frame gameplay wise.
1st part-agree
second part- Revenant can still be used in higher level content because he gets free damage immunity, his 3 restores mesmer stacks btw- and his 4 damage adapts to enemy weakness- in terms of the worst frame for gameplay that can easily go to other frames like Hydroid for being boring, Titania for being mostly useless, and Nyx for old/stale and underwhelming mechanics- Yes his mechanics are sloppy, but his gameplay is not the worst
5 hours ago, (PS4)thegarada said:I have to agree with GearsMatrix, the design of rev is completely off. Skill 1-3 has nothing to do with being a reverent or eidolon. Skill 4, ballerina dance has nothing to do with anything. The design of this skill feels almost like a prank by DE. In terms of game play he is not bad, but aesthetically he is a disaster.
Aesthetically yes he is a disaster- Lasers are something sentients use all the time, there are 2 eidolon attacks that use them(not counting ropalysts)- and batalysts also fire lasers
1-3 abilities- more so- Mesmer skin is sort of ment to be Rev;s synovia type ability but it is mechanically compeletely off- Thralls are ment to be what vomvalysts are to eidolons but they fail miserably Reave is kinda like a vomvy dash but that's the end of it- it was always tied to the vampire theme since a classic vampire ability was to shapeshift into mist and other things
You all have made fair points and I am grateful for your feedback- my next post will update the original source with 2 ideas- one that changes not much and another that totally revamps him for the eidolon theme
Sidenote- He wasn't always an eidolon infused frame, perhaps orignially they decided he was best for keeping eidolons at bay because he was a vampire and he could continue fighting as long as he needed because he could leach health from the eidolon, and use mind control to weaken the eidolons mind
-Try and keep the infighting to a minimum- I do not want these threads to be taken down because of it, I've seen it happen before, I dont want it happening again, I won't name names but I know some here were involved in prior argument related takedowns- Just try not to argue
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2 minutes ago, --NovaPrime-- said:
having given this more thought, a way to make dodge chance to.. for lack of a better phrase "feel better to play with" if the passive became i mechanic to catch every dodged bullet and we revolved a kit arnound that, a channled ability to incress your dodge chance, another as a form to battle-field control like the "lure" ability i mentioned in previous posts and another ability to send the bullets back scaling with your power stength, maybe getting a excals 4 style augment to chosse the damage type with colours. Rounded out nicley with some more direct durability so you dont get 1 banged by a level 60 corpus crewman on an unlucky dice roll. perhaps extra sheild, with another augment to activate automaticly when your shields are broken but you cant cast it on allies?
So- as an off the top idea- like this
Passive- Event Horizon- Projectiles that come close to you have a % chance to be absorbed by your frame, synergizes with other abilities- the more projectiles you absorb the heavier you get, reducing your sprint speed from 100% down to 75%(base speed is high) but making you more resistant to knockdown and cc
1-Return- Create a shotgun blast of projectiles dealing base damage per pelletx power strength +damage from absorbed attacks divided amoungst pellets- utilizes 25% of stored damage on cast
2-Gravi-Flux- Create a zone at the target location that taunts enemies into attacking it and absorbs their damage, shared with your own counter- hitting it with a 1 will cause it to detonate for 50% of it's absorbed damage x power strength
3-Activate a channel that significantly increases the effectiveness of your passive absorption chance, while a gravi-flux is active this will also taunt enemies
4-Encompass-Massively increase the radius of your Event horizon and shield allies within your affinity range with their own, while in this form a projectile forms every x seconds, damage is base+recently collected damagexpower strength- the projectile then seeks out the nearest enemy and strike them
Radial Javelin Rework
in Warframes
Posted
MK- Here is an idea quick, on cast Excal performs a similar cast animation and create's projectiles that seek out enemies in range of the ability, for every enemy struck he gains lifesteal, with every enemy struck that he kills he increases the lifesteal from that stack and refreshes the durtion