[Magic tricks are never what they seem.]

18 minutes ago, trst said:

Except the only time they ever nerfed something to that extent it was with melee spin builds. All the other nerfs that players like to claim to have "ruined" something were never so impactful. That is unless said players were the type that can only put in the absolute minimum amount of effort and not a touch more.

Memeing strike was only one small part of a huge melee change in update 26. That one mod was necessary collateral damage to better melee as a whole. 

 

[spintowin2.0]

19 hours ago, xXDragonGodXx said:

I know xD but thanks for telling me xD

I didn't have a lot of time to go into all the melee I liked and why earlier. 

Alright, so my long time favorites are nami skyla prime and kronen prime. Sovereign outcast and swirling tiger stances are just too much fun to use especially with their multi hit combos. Both of those weapons are basically identical with fast base attack speed, high slash weight, high status chance and decent crits. Pretty much anything that has slash weight ~70% and 20% crit and status falls into this endlessly scaling slash monster category that includes stuff like reaper prime, venka prime, nikana prime, dakra prime, broken war, gunsen, prisma dual cleavers and one of my favorite sleeper weapons dual ether with a 1.45 dispo. This was my goto category of melee weapons for the longest time. There was not much reason to change.

I like niche stuff like armor strip gas or gas/electric daggers with argonak as well. So I used rakta dark dagger, karyst prime, balla for quite a while, the recently added incarnon ceramic dagger and innodem also got added to the mix. Infested weapons like caustacyst and keratinos are cool too because they have base corrosive and viral on them which can make for some fun builds. Keratinos is the predecessor to incarnons imo with it's ~3m range for 3 minutes on 12x heavy attack that is unique to the weapon with 6 hits that all force proc slash. What really got me about these two weapons was they had high status and could be build for both corrosive and viral, self priming melee weapons that had to be built totally different that slash based ones. It was a fun puzzle to figure out and test multiple rivens. Zaws are also a fun rabbit hole to explore, I was into exodia hunt heavy blade dokrahm for a bit before helminth because I could group enemies with ground slams of heavy blade stances and I could build for speed unlike most other heavy blades. Exodia contagion builds are always fun too. One of the most useful ways I've found to use a contagion zaw is on Mag since I can throw the zaw through her bubble and pick off eximus units that I can't cc. My kronsh machete zaw with a cd/dmg/- riven on is is Mag's whacking stick. Jat Kusar used to be a beast with old gas when it was tox damage. I loved that thing. Dark split sword has always been one of my favorites, I wish that the heavy blade and dual sword crit and status stats were switched and you could swap vbetween both forms in mission though. Tenet Livia stance sucks but it's combo pausing gimmick is damn useful for heavy attacks in disruption. I rolled several rivens hundreds of times looking for heavy attack efficiency and other useful stats to tap demos. 

I could keep going, there are a lot of melee weapons I like and many of them get put on the back burner because there are so many good options. I get hooked on finding what I consider to be as close to perfect a riven for specific melee weapons,  running them for awhile and moving on to the next thing...until I fall back on my handful of favorites.

Having a bunch of utility primers with rivens rolled for ms/sc/fr/element/sd etc is also part of the fun of maining melee. I get locked into my primers though, I like having a baseline of knowing how my primer preforms so I can get semi consistent results when testing melee weapons. Once i do that I figure out how certain primers paired with different types of melee weapons preform as a good baseline to testing frames. Like I can test any new frame or helminth idea I have on an existing frame with epitaph and nami skyla and quickly get a sense of how that frames build preforms and adjust accordingly 

[spintowin2.0]

9 minutes ago, xXDragonGodXx said:

Don't know what you mean by RDD? But with a 9k+ KPH as you word it, you would be looking at 150 KPM which is good. I haven't done any Speedva Melee builds yet, as I find her somewhat squishy solo SP.

This is what I'm also thinking that he is doing, but I don't really agree with melee as an AOE, but that's just playstyle. As my playstyle is more aggressive than anyone I have ever actually played with or seen, in the sense that I will actively look for groups of enemies, instead of killing whatever comes to me or whatever shows up in a given area. I do wonder what melee weapons you are "maining" or using actively tho. :)

RDD=Rakta Dark Dagger. It's good for gas electric builds with amalgam argonak mod for aoe armor strip. What's also cool is lingering gas clouds regen shields so you don't need to fully regen shields in a single cast to efficiently reset shield gate. Kind of like a passive shield regen that's spread by influence but it also strips armor. I use this on solo speedva a lot. 

I build melee fast with a lot of range. When your melee weapons hits multiple times a second and has 7.5-9+ range I consider it aoe damage. It really comes down to playstyle though, if you actively move around with slide attacks and specific melee combos you can cover a lot of ground quickly and take out huge packs. Using grouping abilities or nautilus cordon really helps with melee kps averages as well.

I use too many melee to list but you can check anyone's profile in game by typing /profile username and sort by used and check kill count/used and compare that to their playtime to get a good idea of what they use and how much they've used it. 

[Might as well rename Bile to Ambergris with how precious it is.]

24 minutes ago, Drachnyn said:

 It's not worth it to do 3% feeding.

Sometimes it is

[spintowin2.0]

14 hours ago, (XBOX)Player244024418 said:

Want to make melee better? Fix the speed. Im running along then I swing my melee and suddenly I'm slo motion. It's ridiculous. This is my main gripe. The moment you swing it's like you enter a slow portal, only you. 

Faster weapons don't damage enough. Heavier weapons need quickening and berserker unless you have a unique frame like kullervo or sacrifice an arcane spot for melee speed which is conditional. The fact that melee needs two mod slots, an arcane, a possible volt spectre and an incarnon mode to be tolerable is ridiculous. 

Additionally losing everything to a nullifier if you don't one-hit-kill it is annoying.

i like melee but the speedometer fetch is offset too far on the slow side. A slight move to the fast will do wonders.

If your melee feels slow I'm curious how you build a melee weapon because my experience with melee is the polar opposite. I don't main any frame but I do main melee and I've learned a thing or two about a thing or two.

I think you are trying to build for OHKO instead of death by a thousand cuts. I look at most melee as aoe damage not single target burst dps. I prioritize speed and range to maximize my ability to apply status effects to as many targets as quick as possible. 

There are definitely some outlier melee weapons/classes with extremely slow base attack speed and/or slow stance options like heavy blades and hammers. I'll build stuff like Gram Prime, Tenet Livia and Karyst Prime with 2 sources of attack speed because I feel they are unusable without it. However, there are enough weapons classes like dual swords, tonfas, nikanas, claws, daggers and swords that have multiple viable options in each class with decent base attack speed and good quick stances that only a single source of attack speed is required. 

The recent addition of tennokai, melee arcanes and incarnons have significantly increased viable options for melee weapons. Before it was pretty much hybrid crit/status builds on slash weighted weapons but now pure status builds with influence and little to no slash at all can out kps old builds. Like I have a RDD riven with -100%+ CC and I routinely hit 9k+ kph solo with it and have topped 13k kph on speedva. High speed, range and status weapons are really good right now.

Anyways, link me some builds, bet I could help.

[If you were able to rework a Tileset, what would it be and how?]

Honestly, none. All of the new tile sets look absolutely fantastic but they suck to play on. They are either to large, too cluttered or some combination of both and it makes enemy pathing terrible. 

[Why does my orbiter have a blue glow now]

nothing looks right anymore.

I didn't really play today, just kind of tweaked settings trying to get it to look close to what it was before. 

[Summonable Weapon changing?]

I've always wanted an arsenal drop landing craft. I tinker with builds too often and always forget to change them back and I end up aborting within a minute because I know i have the wrong build on either frame, weapons or both. 

My 2.8k quit missions stat would be significantly lower if I had arsenal drop landing craft. 

[Worst Riven Mods]

5 hours ago, Cram_Duahcim said:

All of em: Worst decision was introducing them in the first place.

If it were up to me I'd remove em outright.

Good thing it's not up to you. Rivens aren't going anywhere. 

[Inaros is the True Vampire Warframe (Vasca Warframe when?)]

Don't bring up vampire frames, you'll summon that one guy. 

[incarnons and headshot charging]

7 minutes ago, Aldain said:

I more mean that melee feels like it only realistically has one really worthwhile type of build most of the time and that build is "Combo or GTFO".

Preferences notwithstanding it just feels empty to me, very "Number go up, damage go up", there's no real execution to it imo even with Tennokai as a part of the equation.

It just feels less involved to me than with guns which have to both aim and depending on the weapon focus on headshots, but also has other builds like Internal Bleeding and more variety in behaviors between different firearms. Attack speed (and a handful of weapons like the Syam from Duviri or with natural passives) notwithstanding every weapon just feels like every other weapon in the same class with few if any reasons to not take the best statline possible and call it a day.

Probably doesn't help that a lot of stances are...awkward especially in their forward moving combo, I mean Decisive Judgment for example has this dead stop to your momentum every second swing that they've never fixed since Melee 2.0 dropped iirc.

I personally just don't feel like melee is that engaging and lacks a depth outside of a very shallow combo meter that is comically overcentralizing and actively punishes using anything other than melee weapons due to the falloff timer, which yes, is circumventable, but with how easy it is to circumvent kind of renders it a "Why is it here in the first place" question to me.

Again, all just my personal feelings/hot take, if you like Melee as it is more power to you, I just...kind of don't.

I get what you're saying, I feel kind of the same way about guns. It seems basic point, click shoot, fulfill conditional requirements to activate buffs and don't let them fall off. A lot of guns feel samey to me, like I could get a similar experience from any number of shooters. Meanwhile, I find that there are more than a few stances that I really enjoy and I can easily combine specific parts of combos with slide attacks and parkour maneuvers to traverse the battlefield seamlessly. I've never really found another game that comes close to what we have in WF. 

Just to stay on topic I'm not a huge fan of headshot mechanics because I'm using a controller and my aim is atrocious. There is also the fact that deadhead arcane requires kills from shots but dot kills don't count and incarnon doesn't count kills from headshots, just seems off to me. Not sure how arcane pistoleer/victory behave, I don't think I've ever used them.

I'd rather just spray and pray or spam aoe to proc status effects to buff melee. 

[incarnons and headshot charging]

1 hour ago, Aldain said:

Hot Incarnon take from me since this thread seems like a good place for it:

Melee Incarnons are boring as hell strictly due to to the fact that they're uniformly tied to the combo system, while I'm giving hot takes out I'd also like to say Melee in general has gotten increasingly more boring and one dimensional due to the ever increasing overreliance on the combo system as well imo.

Melee is in a pretty good state now imo. It's not hard to maintain combo, slap 1 dex arcane on your utility primer and you're good. With enough attack speed/range and SP enemy density it's easy to quickly build combo. If you're not in SP combo doesn't matter because everything is paper. With the addition of tennokai mods Discipline's Merit you have heavy attacks on command while keeping your combo. It's way better that the endless combo, channeling and timed attacks that led to the spin2win memeing strike meta that was around when I started. 

Auto melee could get removed or better yet have a way to toggle it off but besides that I really like where melee is right now. 

It all comes down to personal preference I guess. I was never really into shooter games but melee was a staple in arpgs I came from so it comes naturally to me and feels better than most other games I've played. 

[Hi, havent played since 2019, looking for meta builds.]

 

22 minutes ago, ForsakenCrusader said:

Do u know a meta build for ember and saryn?

In the 3 hours since you've posted this thread you could have watched a dozen build videos on youtube for whatever frames you wanted. There are people out there with the information you're looking for and they share it freely. You just have to click on the video and watch it.

[Name for Grimoire - one slow, another one fast]

I like naming my weapons after dragon keys. I think it's funny when people remind me that I still have keys equipped .

[What icarnons does the community want?]

Keratinos is kind of the first melee incarnon with +range on 12x heavy attack but it would be cool if it got the full incarnon treatment. 

Other melee I'd want would be dark split sword, dark dagger and boltace. 

Kohm incarnon could be a lot of fun too. 

Incarnon adapters for kitguns/zaws would also be a game changer. 

[Stop the Inaros rework]

I'll post this every opportunity i get

 

[QoL suggestion: auto-switch bane mod or maybe deprecate it with an umbra mod.]

I find it funny that the people that don't actually use faction mods are the ones wanting them removed from the game. 

I don't use hp/armor mods on my frames since shield gating is a thing so all health armor mods, arcanes etc. should be removed. I can survive w/o those things so no one should have them. 

[Xaku is fun but thraxx centurions's don't care about their evasion]

1 minute ago, Xzorn said:

 

I'm not really talking about a skill thing here. When I said crutch I was talking about a mechanical crutch.

It's no different than it was before. My endurance Banshee used QT and that's it. Same with Saryn. Ember, Volt and Limbo used nothing at all.
They relied on perfect use of their kits while moving with those skills properly in order to not get hit because one hit would kill them.

That's what I meant by Brawlers / eHP frames were easy but had limits. You could face tank until you couldn't. Some of the frames I mentioned had no limits. Long as you didn't screw up, you didn't die. That was the trade off for glass cannon aka caster types and I always found it to be fair. With the addition of Shield Gating and Overguard enemies which ignore your abilities those frames are forced into "Playing Shield Gate". I find it a worse experience than what we had before Shield Gating.

I would much prefer being able to fully rely on my abilities and die in one hit.

OK, I think i just misinterpreted what you were saying by how it was phrased. 

Since shield gating was released before overguard I was already built up to shield gate. Overguard is hot garbage because imo it pigeon holes players into op overkill dps, regular enemies no longer matter because you have to be able to brute force your way through overgaurd. Negating essential parts of certain frames kits is also bs imo. Like I loved playing Banshee and they way I played her she relayed on that brief stagger from silence, but eximus enemies don't get staggered. Even if they can't cast abilities they still have weapons.

What really got me about overguard was it was released along side Gyre. I was actually hyped for that frame, classic elemental caster with passive cc from aoe electric procs!! yes please. That frame perfectly suits my playstyle but the enemies that I most want to cc are totally immune until they no longer pose a threat. Overguard goes down and they instantly melt because I'm "forced" to build for them specifically. 

[Xaku is fun but thraxx centurions's don't care about their evasion]

5 hours ago, Xzorn said:

 

Well, except Overguard kinda ruined that.

Brawler / eHP frames were easier but had a general limitation without help while casters like Limbo, Mag, old Vauban, old Nyx, Banshee and similar could accomplish far more but one mistake and you died. IMO this was always a fair trade between the two archetypes. Now most have to crutch Shield Gating instead of just playing well.

Have you actually tried shield gating builds? Like really tried to run longer endless mission surviving only on shield gating. You have to play well and your reaction time has to be on point. I find it a far more engaging playstyle than building to tank.

It also opens up a lot more build potential when you aren't wasting mod slots, arcanes and shard space trying to make squishy frames into tanks. It's like you can build frames towards their strengths instead of building them to compensate for their deficiencies. Shield gating blew the whole game wide open for me.

I've always preferred dps glass cannon playstyle in other games and shield gating allows that in WF. I'm not going to tell people that prefer tanks to git gud, it's just a different playstyle that is totally valid and requires a different skill set.

[QoL suggestion: auto-switch bane mod or maybe deprecate it with an umbra mod.]

6 hours ago, quxier said:

Every mission? ahhaha. I just press Esc > Navigation > ...

I don't change/check gear to the point I can go to Netracells (which require some good enough gear) with just random gear. I was like, hmm... that slow, that's weak, that's slow, frame does something so let's do this. Plus I'm vazarin so let's heal stuffs. Hahaha.

In general I have at least 1 decent weapon like Kuva Nukor. It's far from the best but at least it does something.

 

I change gear when I want different style, mission is harder (e.g. Netracell or Riven challenge). I prefer not to change gear every time I play another mission. That's why most of my gear is self contained. My frames usually have p.flow and Energize, Rush, maybe efficiency. My Carrier p. that I don't change has looter, vacuum and ammo conversion. So on and so forth. I change single gear (e.g. frame or weapon) not whole lodout.

I cycle through about half a dozen frames a day, each of them have 6 configs with different builds and their own loadout. idk what build I was using last so i always check before I go into a mission. I generally play solo and run longer missions so spending a minute to pick the wf build I want and weapon builds that compliment the type of mission I'm running makes sense to me. Spending a minute in the arsenal is nothing compared to the hours I'll spend in the mission I'm about to play.  

Like I could take Wisp into any mission with any of my builds on her and whatever weapons i happen to have equipped and complete a mission but I'd rather not slog through a disruption or netracell missions with a loadout built for endless survival. 

[QoL suggestion: auto-switch bane mod or maybe deprecate it with an umbra mod.]

Does nobody check their loadout before they enter a mission?

I leave myself a note to make sure I have the builds I want. 

6 minutes ago, CosoMalvadoNG said:

i dont use those mods and i dont have any problem.

Faction mods are a final damage multiplier like roar. They are pretty good

 

[Don't take my time or love for this game for granted]

10 minutes ago, (PSN)Foxville1971 said:

If it's a case where it becomes easier to buy everything I therefore don't see the point of the game.

It's not like you buy everything. There are enough things to do in game that you should be able to find something that you enjoy playing that is also a decent passive farm for sellable items. Play what you enjoy while making some plat on the side to buy whatever you don't like farming. 

[Xaku is fun but thraxx centurions's don't care about their evasion]

27 minutes ago, Kaiga said:

 i find myself having to use rolling guard/operator cheese as a regular part of the kit after a certain point, which isn't a great sign.

This can be said for almost any frame though. Especially the ones with low ehp like xaku.

IMO Xaku is a classic glass cannon. Huge dps/kps potential but they can't take a hit. It's a cookie cutter architype that has been around forever. 

[Baruuk The Last Whoop bender (Air burst)]

I was into making themed builds for awhile but I also tried to make them abominations by removing what I thought was the frames signature ability. 

I watched some kung fu western movie and it made me think about the phrase "never take a knife to a gunfight" and the perfect response would be something like "I wasn't planning on taking a knife, I'm taking my swords". I knew I had to make a melee Mesa cowgirl thing. I figured that ensnare was as close to a lasso as I could get to keep with the cowgirl theme so I infused that over peacemakers. It was a pretty fun build actually, only downside was having to double tap her 1 to shieldgate reliably.

[what is hate and what is acceptable]

Region chat has entered the forums