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Posts posted by (XBOX)Regxxh

  1. 1 minute ago, Sazero said:

    Another day, another balance thread.
    To make a repeating story short: It's not gonna happen, there is too much work involved.
    And Warframe isn't a MOBA, so balance isn't required to begin with.

    The fact that people are constantly asking for balance is proof that balance is needed, because when a large amount of players are complaining, a large amount of players aren't having fun with the game.

    • Like 2
  2. 1 hour ago, Reitrix said:

    the actual effects for Oberon himself, including but not limited the immunity to knockdowns etc, aren't even suggested to be part of the effect. 


    17 minutes ago, (PSN)robotwars7 said:

    Oberon also gives Armor if renewal is active whilst on the Ground, as well as status immunity to anyone on it.

    To be fair these effects are mentioned in the Tips section, which is more than what some abilities get, but it's still insane that the defensive side of Hallowed Ground isn't part of the ability description.

    • Like 1
  3. 18 minutes ago, Reitrix said:

    More to the point, We shouldn't require 3rd party sites to learn basic information about game systems. One particular gripe i have is that Ability descriptions in game don't even tell you half of what they actually do sometimes. 
    Oberon is a prime example. Hallowed Ground simply states "Deals radiation damage to enemies standing in it" but the actual effects for Oberon himself, including but not limited the immunity to knockdowns etc, aren't even suggested to be part of the effect. 

    DE really needs to turn the Codex into a Wiki. Not just for Frames but for everything. Many things in the game have hidden mechanics and are only given a superficial explanation. 

    ^This 100%. People completely write off abilities because they don't know how they work, and they go through the entire game thinking a decent ability is worthless. Many people don't know about all of the hidden effects Silence has, or that Prism has an incredibly powerful damage scaling mechanic, or that Eclipse's damage reduction just doesn't reduce toxin damage, because these things are not written in game (although the Eclipse thing seems like a bug). Obviously it'd be hard to include everything a player needs to know, but these are important mechanics that make or break abilities, and they're not mentioned anywhere in the game.

  4. There will always be an incentive to acquire the normal variant of a frame because Helminth exists. Prime Warframes draw in a lot of money through Prime Access, and a ton of hype as fans see their favorite frame get a beautiful golden variant with upgraded stats. To not prime specific Warframes for the sole reason that they are the only reason to play certain content (which in some cases they aren't) is not only irrational from a sales perspective, but also incredibly disappointing to people that enjoy those Warframes.

    • Like 4
  5. 8 minutes ago, (PSN)nerex33 said:

    I told you, if you don't like him, don't use him. Stop nitpicking any little detail possible, like all of the 'that's only one mission type' or any of your other little pseudo-arguments. Like I stated, it was just a few things off the top of my head. If you won't use a frame because they are useless in a certain type of situation or mission

    I ask you when you use these 2 abilities regularly. Your answer was either stuff that was pointless to do, or stuff that only pertained to a single mission type. I would say that proves that those abilities are useless. You can then make the conclusion that I think Loki is useless. You'd be wrong, but you can make that conclusion. I think most people can agree that if 2/5 of the abilities (passive included) are useless, the frame is not in a good state design-wise. For Loki, those 2 abilities are enough to make him powerful, but the other 60% of his kit is generally useless.

    I also don't know why you assume I don't play Loki. He's my 3rd most used frame as an MR30 player with every frame unlocked. I can acknowledge that his kit is mostly trash without neglecting him.

    • Like 2
  6. 38 minutes ago, Divided010 said:

    This is pretty easy to show to be false...the baseline crit mod for shotguns is 90% so the mod is over 100% stronger at 200% and that means with both mods on a shotgun you only have 290% crit chance which is not as huge of a difference.  Rifles would get 350% with both mods a crit chance which is 60% higher than shot guns.

    Do you mean to tell me that 290% and 350% are not higher than 200%? Read what you're quoting again.

    39 minutes ago, Divided010 said:

    And regardless getting up to these levels of crit chance is doable with a riven. So the only thing that making the corrupted crit mods exclusive with the baseline is removes the non riven ability to get to those levels of crit chance on primary weapons.

    Rivens that landed a good roll, and are specifically for weapons with very high dispositions. What you're asking for is what Rivens accomplish with very good rng on underused weapons, but for every single weapon without any rng. Do you see why that might be hard to consider?

    • Like 3
  7. 23 minutes ago, (PSN)nerex33 said:

    put it in a location enemies can't really get to to guarantee you don't go down

    • If placed in a position where enemies cannot reach:
      • Within a few seconds Infested enemies will swap their aggro to another target.
      • Grineer and Corpus enemies will keep trying to aim at the Decoy until it disappears even if they cannot see or hit it, making it extremely effective if placed in good cover against enemy fire.

    This applies to all melee units, including disarmed ranged units. The Grineer and Corpus part is only applying to ranged units.

    23 minutes ago, (PSN)nerex33 said:

    Great when used in spy missions to swap with behind laser barriers or distract vault guards to another side of the vault since it doesn't seem to set off alarms for some reason.

    Not only is this for a single mission type, but it's also completely pointless to do, since you are Loki, who is invisible, and thus doesn't care about enemies detecting him.

    23 minutes ago, (PSN)nerex33 said:

    Place it out when reviving someone to keep AoE attacks far from yourself while reviving. 

    Or you use Operator Void Mode to be invincible while reviving. Players don't go down in the content before finishing the War Within, so there's no excuse not to.

    23 minutes ago, (PSN)nerex33 said:

    As for Switch Teleport, again, in spy vaults or as a quick way to return to a location

    Again, limited to one mission type. Using it for mobility outside of that is pointless when compared to just bullet jumping over there.

    23 minutes ago, (PSN)nerex33 said:

    make allies invincible for a while, swap places with a downed ally

    Making allies invincible isn't effective for the same reason that giving allies DR doesn't matter: Your allies build themselves to stay alive without your help, so the actual benefits of you making an ally invincible are meager. As for swapping places with a downed ally, you accomplish nothing, since you could just walk over there, pop into operator form, void mode, than revive, all in one motion.

    23 minutes ago, (PSN)nerex33 said:

    remove an enemy from an area, stun them allowing you time to do whatever you want to them

    Clunky single target crowd control that is outclassed by just killing the thing. Excellent.


    23 minutes ago, (PSN)nerex33 said:

    drastically speed up PoE bounties with that dumb drone and just teleport it across the plains

    In that single stage of that one mission type, you can shave off a minute from something that takes 3 minutes or less. Fantastic.

    But hey, if you don't trust me, here are some Loki players responding to my questions about Loki...


  8. 2 minutes ago, Divided010 said:

    Then why did they buff the corrupt crit mods at all? If they didn't think the stats on the guns were a issue? Also the corrupted crit mods have more crit on them than the baseline mods so crit chances are absolutely not staying the same anyway.

    The mods were useless, so they buffed them. The potential critical stats are only being pushed a little, as opposed to them being pushed a lot by allowing those 2 large increases to stack.


    8 minutes ago, Divided010 said:

    Also double stacking the crit mods is not nessacirly even the best way to build for a gun right? Especially with those new mods that you now have to slot it. Any build with both the baseline and the corrupted crit mod on it would be giving up two whole mod slots just for crit chance, which is a lot of mod slots for ONLY just crit chance increasing. So it is not like it is 100% guaranteed going to be the best way to build every single gun out there.

    It would actually be powerful on a lot of weapons with a spare mod slot and decent fire rate. I'd probably stack in on a majority of my rifles.

  9. 1 hour ago, (PSN)nerex33 said:

    If you only use two of his abilities, you aren't doing it right.

    Would you like to explain how you use Decoy and Switch Teleport regularly?

  10. 1 hour ago, Divided010 said:

    Why do they need to stay in the same area as they have been if DE is trying to buff primary weapons to the height of the red crit god status of melee?

    For melee builds...achieving red crits is comparatively simple and is part of the reason why they are so powerful in the first place. So it would seem that allowing primary weapons to reach new crit heights/approach or reach melee levels of crit would do a lot to bridge that gap.

    DE doesn't think the stats of guns is an issue, which is why they went with adding mods and arcanes that add scaling buffs to guns, rather than improving the stats. Part of the reason it seems weird is that DE vastly overestimates how difficult it is to keep the maximum bonuses of a weapon's scaling factor, so you see the new weapon stacking buffs having a built in Naramon feature, along with being extremely powerful, so you view that as being comparable to the immediate bonuses gun modding has been limited to for a long time. DE thinks having to build up mod stacks is an actual trade off, and so thinks that less power for immediate maximum bonuses is a decision the player will actually make, which they won't unless the power is insane in the case of heavy attack builds. 

    So to actually answer your question, the potential modding stats need to stay in the same range because those stats are immediately applied, as opposed to the build up of Galvanized mods and melee combo, both of which should be stronger with the drawback of requiring buildup and maintenance. The issue is that melee combo wasn't balanced properly, and it's so easy to maintain that we compare the immediate stat builds to the fully built up melee combo builds.

  11. On 2021-07-20 at 4:47 AM, bad4youLT said:

    I thought game is officially beaten once you reach mr30 which at that point you get prompt congratulating you fallowed by automatic uninstall of the game .

    This is the case, but you forgot to mention the automatic permaban as well. Everyone at Legendary Rank 1 is a cheater.

  12. 2 minutes ago, 0_The_F00l said:

    ALL gear 😈 

    And that's the point I am making ,

    the power across the board would be lower for players. Level 50 could potentially be a challenge and steel path would be near impossible without a combination of a well built squad.

    I can't think of many people that would be in favor of this, since it reduces the power fantasy below a reasonable level, while also making the game way harder for people that play solo, and makes the gap between gear even wider, as a lot of gear will go from "viable but not the best" to "not viable at all". It's fine if games require teams to take on the hard content, but those games are not Warframe, and I'd say that people that want team-balanced difficulty to be regular should play Destiny 2.

    Now I'd be fine if there was team-balanced difficulty in certain content, such as raids, but relying on a well built squad for all gameplay that's actually challenging would make the game feel a lot more restrictive, as we'd be pushed towards building Holy Trinity setups, where if you don't play the right frame, you don't get a team, meaning you don't get to play.

  13. 7 minutes ago, 0_The_F00l said:

    I personally feel they should have this rule set for all their mods. Only one mod per attribute enhancement permitted and buff some of the corrupted mods to actually be better than their regular variants just like they did here. 

    Would really shuffle the loadouts.

    For Warframes too or just weapons? I don't think either would be a good idea, as the potential modding stats are taken into account when designing a weapon/frame's base stats. The reason for these 2 mods having exclusivity is to keep the potential critical stats in around the same area that they've been. If we wanted to apply that to every other mod, our potential modding stats would be way lower, and they'd have to go back through every weapon and frame they designed around these potential modding stats to bring them back up to the power we have now.

  14. 4 hours ago, SneakyErvin said:

    This thread is about "Battlefield" scale matches. Your player hosted "dedicated" servers wont handle that. There is a reason clans in BF and other similar games rent their servers, and why others play on official servers.

    There is a massive difference between 8, 16, 32 and 64 players and what is needed from a server. There is also a massive difference between having a small community where a select few player handled servers may suffice and having a popular wide spread, multi-region PvP mode. Do you hostly think PvPers would be attracted to a hit-and-miss server setup where in one game you play on a great server and the next on one that barely gets by? No, people would move on and abandon it yet again, just like how people avoid certain servers in Battlefield because they arent stable. Here in WF that would be widespread, since there would be no actual baseline standard when it is player hosted.

    This thread isn't about Battlefield scale matches, that was just something I agreed would be cool, but highly unrealistic. The OP is talking more about something similar to an arcade shooter like CoD with 8-12 players. Sorry that I didn't explicitly say that in the main thread.

    • Like 1
  15. 1 hour ago, Paranoicon said:

    Second caveat, though, is that I don't necessarily know if it should be a Conclave game mode, or a separate game entirely. The reason for this is as simple as the way Warframe is advertised. A Co-Op loot-based space shooter with Advanced Mobility.
    It's not a game that anyone would expect to have a mode that is close to being the direct opposite of what's advertised.
    And while I think that simple fact is likely to make a moderately decent PvP mode seem solid in comparison, I can't deny the possibility that the expectation of "A Co-Op etc..." could end up harming this new PvP mode. If it's handled with the appropriate level of care, which shouldn't be that much, in all fairness, it probably won't prove an issue. However, what with DE's very publicly known management issues, and the fact they're likely working full gear on The New War, appropriate handling is a bit more unlikely than it should be.
    If it's handled as a separate project from Warframe, that simply utilizes the Warframe IP, as well as some assets and code, then that could allow a (hopefully better managed) department within DE to focus exclusively on this game, as well as tailor content for it, rather than being another thing nailed to Warframe's... ahem rear.

    Yea this paragraph brings up a great point. A Corpus vs. Grineer mode would be the opposite of what Warframe is advertised as, and while it might be fun to play, probably would have trouble fitting in. I think overall making another game would be the best outcome, as it would fix this issue while also letting DE expand a lot more on this idea.

    I'd probably want something similar to what Ubisoft did with Rainbow Six Siege's Operation Outbreak: Introduce a smaller version of the idea in the main game (in this case a permanent Conclave mode), throw a little event around it to get players trying it, and develop the full game passively over a long period of time while working on the main game's regular content. Granted the final product should not be the same quality as what Ubisoft produced, but their failings seem like more of a developer fault than a fault with their strategy. Hopefully DE can do something like this over the next few years, assuming they continue to grow as a studio.

    The rest of the post, which I didn't quote in whole due to its size, is entirely stuff I agree with. Well said, and thanks for the write up.

    • Like 2
  16. 35 minutes ago, ----Legacy---- said:

    Yeah, let's totally omit that the "wonderful warframe community" does its best to send away any new player who shows any legitimate interest in conclave, just like they start raging directly to the devs any time conclave is mentioned in the patch notes. This community is overal mature enough to never do such things.

    I can admit I'm very guilty of this, and I'm not even a hardcore PvE only type of player. Any time a new player in our alliance asks about Conclave, I'll tell them it's not worth their time. I do still think Conclave is generally not worth someone's time, but it definitely doesn't help Conclave's popularity when I or anyone else do that.

    • Like 1
  17. 2 hours ago, TomCruisesSon said:

    Underlined section is the point I am trying to make, there is nothing here that would make people go. "Oh wow, that mode looks great! I want to do that!" Its just gutted Conclave gameplay with different models. (if we are using the gameplay we saw from the demo as the pace you want for this game mode.) And at that point, what useful data is their for Conclave to use if the core mechanics work differently?

    It would draw in new players by being a very available option. No need to buy anything, no grind beforehand, and no gear difference between old and new players (besides possible cosmetics). If I'm a player who finds enjoyment in PvP (someone who wouldn't play Warframe in the first place), and I hear a F2P game has a pretty decent PvP game mode (more that can be said about Conclave) that takes no investment from me beyond completing a tutorial, I'd be willing to try it out. Maybe in playing this game mode I find the core mechanics of Warframe interesting (the ones we keep in this mode), and I decide to play the actual game. Even if I don't wanna play actual Warframe, I'm still playing the game regularly if I enjoy it enough, and If DE decides to add cosmetic plat purchases, I might even put money in.

    As for it being gutted Conclave, I'd argue that less is more in that case, as the features we're removing from Conclave made the gameplay worse and less fair. If this mode gets good reception, that doesn't reflect on Conclave specifically, but it's an indication that PvP content would be something worth pursuing further, which would incentivize reworking Conclave by way of it already being in the game.

    2 hours ago, TomCruisesSon said:

    So what makes this mode any different from Conclave or Lunaro? They both started (as far as I know) as essential clean PvP slates for DE to work with and it didn't pan out. What makes this new suggested mode any different?

    They were clean PvP slates, but DE didn't address the core issue of Warframes not being compatible with PvP gameplay, so these modes were doomed to fail as long as DE tried to fit a square peg in a round hole. They can tweak abilities and weapons to try and make them acceptable in PvP, but it'll never be a clean translation. This mode keeps the gunplay and abilities of Warframe, with both being specifically designed for this PvP mode. There's no attempt to translate PvE gameplay to PvP, because the PvP gameplay is being built from a basic framework that has none of the existing obstacles that Warframes have as PvE characters.

    2 hours ago, TomCruisesSon said:

    If you are going to use existing weapons for this mode, which do they use? The Conclave version or the Main Game version? Do they build the characters around the existing guns stats or do they need to make new stats for weapons so they work properly with the existing health, armor, and shields systems used in the demo?

    Again, if the weapons aren't expansive and just the ones we've used before but slightly tuned for this version of PvP, the maps are from an already existing system, and no modding, what will draw people in?? It sounds like it will be using existing assets we've already seen but with slowed down gameplay. I don't know how that can draw people in.

    The stats shown in the demo would be slightly altered, and the weapon stats would be designed around that. This does mean more work as stats are being remade, but the amount of weapons in the actual mode would be miniscule (6-8 weapons, 3-4 for each side, more can be added later) compared to base Warframe and Conclave, which really simplifies balance.

    I think it's important to mention that the New War demo is not exactly what we'd see in this sort of gameplay: We'd get more abilities, better movement (but not Warframe movement), and some general improvements to make it feel better than it probably will in the New War. These would be small changes, not redoing what they've made for the New War.

    And I'll reiterate why this draws people in: New players have a very available PvP option that's decently made, and existing PvE players have an option for repetitive content if they're open to it. 

    While it doesn't draw in the exclusively PvE crowd, the framework is already there, so this isn't as much of a developer time sink to create it as the large PvE content we get seasonally in place of fixing old systems.

  18. 4 minutes ago, TomCruisesSon said:

    If the main point of making this mode is to make it easier on the devs, that already feels like a step in the wrong direction on why someone would want to play said mode.

    Well no, the point isn't making it easier on the devs. The point is expansion of an existing system to create content that brings in new players, creates repetitive and enjoyable content for existing players, while also serving as an opportunity to collect data to inform the decision to fix a poorly designed game mode.

    7 minutes ago, TomCruisesSon said:

    I'm sorry but it is not, PvP is not a selling point anymore, DE personally knows this. The Amazing Eternals, Conclave, Lunaro, these are big, blatant red flags that PvP alone does not make people want to actively play something anymore.

    I can't speak about The Amazing Eternals, but I can say Conclave and Lunaro aren't well designed, which is obviously going to make it hard for people to want to engage with these modes.

    8 minutes ago, TomCruisesSon said:

    If they make this from the ground up, and anytime we have put in this game has zero effect on the mode. That means DE has a lot of work ahead of them to draw people in. They would have to make ANOTHER separate set of weapons, characters, maps, and possible mods that work completely different from its own PvP and PvE systems. I don't know if they would find that worth it.

    As discussed earlier, they don't need make this from the ground up. The systems and assets already exist in game. They can reuse models from Grineer and Corpus soldiers, the weapons don't need to be expansive, only enough for variety, while also being already existent in game (my examples in the OP were all existing weapons), the maps can be combinations of existing tiles or Conclave maps we already have. Modding probably wouldn't exist in this game mode, as it contributes to a feeling of unfairness. The work is there, but it's not nearly as much as building an entire game from the ground up.

    • Like 1
  19. 15 minutes ago, FrostDragoon said:

    2. PvP players saw this as a potential solution to many of the complaints against Conclave specifically, but drastically overestimate and overstate the community's general interest in PvP in the first place.

    3. Threads like this emerge because the PvP players (perhaps unwittingly) conflate the interest in the former to interest in the latter, or wish to use it as a way to hijack that interest to promote PvP. They refuse to admit that the real reason they get so much pushback isn't because of the core concept itself, but because PvP has no real place or purpose in this game. DE has shown through both Conclave and Lunaro that they fundamentally don't understand what makes PvP appealing in the first place and that they are unable to deliver on the kind of experience players would expect. Some players just don't like PvP at all (in any game, not just Warframe), so the combination of them and those who see these failures as detrimental due to the opportunity cost don't want to see those mistakes repeated again.

    I'm not a PvP player though. I indulge in a little PvP through other games, but generally I enjoy single player rpgs and mmos. I've played Warframe for a long time, and I've only done a small amount of Conclave games, so I wouldn't consider myself a master of Conclave at all. I made this thread because I saw the gameplay of the New War, and thought the best way to expand upon it would be through PvP, which would also bring something casual to do for the casual playerbase, and would also serve as a test of player interest in PvP, which would provide incentive to fix the most neglected content in the game: Conclave.

  20. 27 minutes ago, TomCruisesSon said:

    "Hey, I know you like Warframe, but what about a PVP mode where you are slower, have less maneuverability, and have a limited arsenal?"

    So the main point of a PvP mode like this would be that it's easier to polish than Conclave is. If we made a PvP mode that incorporated the gameplay of Warframe, we'd have Conclave, and we see that Conclave isn't popular. This mode doesn't have the elements of Conclave that make the gameplay feel frustrating, so it can be used to see if PvP is a good alternative, and if it is, maybe Conclave could be seen as something worth redesigning. 

    As for the hook, I think PvP is itself a good hook, as it's engaging content that varies from game to game. Having something that you can quickly hop into when you're bored is great, and where Conclave could be that, its design gives an advantage to players that have already engaged with the PvE content, which makes it less fair for the people who aren't on that level yet.

    Now, DE could lock PvE cosmetics behind PvP to create a small incentive, like they have with Conclave, but I don't think anyone would actually be in favor of that besides the same kind of snobby PvP elitists that got Universal Medallions changed to not work in Conclave.

    • Like 1
  21. 1 minute ago, _Achillean_ said:

    Ok i see your point and i agree with them maybe i wanted to make him too cool and too powerful but i still hope and believe that even they don't take my ideas, they might have better idea for his rework. And i will be waiting patiently until it gets release. 

    Unfortunately, it doesn't seem like DE has any reworks planned, based on the comments of DE Pablo. It also seems like they ditched their idea of making single adjustments to frames that need it on a consistent basis, something they wanted to start doing after HoD launched. Chroma is definitely among the frames that need a revisit the most, as his current gameplay is limited to refreshing 2 timers that give him better stats.

  22. 2 minutes ago, XzWasPzX said:

    Idea is not going anywhere, we ve just seen the "battle" in action, different huds, etc, but the adventure itself its gonna take a time until it comes, personally im expecting them to release the adventure around Christmas, the topic will be over the table again when that happens. So there s plenty of time even to listen to DE, and discuss a proposal. 

    There's not really a difference between posting it now and posting it then. The actual design points in the OP are not going to be taken into consideration, but the thread exists mainly to gauge player feedback on a further exploration of Warframe PvP, which is something we should know sooner rather than later.

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