HardcoreSalmon

I don't have a problem with grind and I understand it's necessary. My problem is when getting a frame/weapon is absolutely ridiculous, like Caliban for example. There have been many times when the grind was way too annoying and then DE later reduces it a lot. For example: Hydroid - required a Frequency Triangulator to fight Vay Hek which dropped from Prosecutors. You needed 2, 4, 8 and 12 of different kinds. You farmed these prosecutors for hours to build one key for a chance to get a hydroid part. Then they removed this entirely and made the boss fight available all the time. Zephyr - required 600 oxium which dropped on a specific corpus defence. Oxium ospreys dropped significantly less oxium and couldn't be desecrated. Then they increased the oxium dropped per osprey and made desecrate work on them. If ridiculous grind is the point of this game then why would DE make these changes? I don't have a problem with grind, I have a problem with ridiculous grinds that are way overtuned. Take the Shedu for example. This is completely ridiculous and should be reduced and it was even worse at the start because the anomolies weren't always available.

I've added a list of warframes sorted by release date in the main post.

I think usually the worst grinds are the ones where you wouldn't play the mission anyway. Missions people play normally: Void Fissures, Kuva Siphons, Sortie, Eidolon Hunts, Disruption etc. When you have a mission that the only reason to play it is for one or two frames or weapons you have a problem. Especially if there are no extra rewards. Best examples are: Arum Spinosa - Arcana bounties that no one would play otherwise and tedious as hell Korrudo - Whose idea was it to put this on Tusk Thumpers? Ambassador - Rotation c of a Railjack survival. The only real reason to play this survival and stay long otherwise is for necramech affinity. Nidus - I don't think anyone plays infested salvage unless they want Nidus. Dagath - An exterminate where you can't even use matchmaking that has nothing but a resource.

352 is simply the amount minutes it takes if you never get a drop and buy it. 5 minutes per wave as an average. 22 crystal fragments per wave on steel path. 1550 fragments required to buy everything. (1550 / 22) * 5 = 352 To take the potential drops into account: 22 fragments per wave and 1550 required to buy. 1550 / 22 = 70.45 waves required Rotation c takes 4 waves, so: 70.45 / 4 = 17.61 rotation Cs Citrine expected rotation c rewards: BP - 10, parts - 16 So you are expected to get one drop when you have enough to buy every part. For Citrine I think, unless you're really lucky, you will have enough to buy it before you get a drop. For Voruna things are more complicated because Lua Thrax Plasm are affected by resource boosters and they drop from enemies as well as at the end of rotations. I think it was 5 per rotation and 1 drop per enemy. 350 required Lua Thrax Plasm, 6 per rotation on the tier 2 survival. 350 / 6 = 58.3 rotations required, so: 58.3 * 5 = 291.6 minutes. With a resource booster it goes down to 50 rotations. The Voruna expected drop chances: BP - 8 rotation Cs, parts - 12 rotation Cs 58.3 / 4 =14. 14 rotation C rewards for the whole time it takes to farm the thrax plasm. So you will probably get one drop in the time it takes to farm all the resources required. This wouldn't save you time if you get a drop, just gives you more resources to buy a weapon part instead. I think when I got Voruna and Citrine I didn't get a single part drop and had to buy it all with the resources, so I think it doesn't really affect it.

I sometimes find getting regular frames extremely frustrating and thought I would make a list and total the estimated time to get each warframe. The information was taken from the wiki and I used the expected amount of runs to get each part. Calculation example: Chassis takes an expected 8 runs, the mission takes 10 minutes: 8 * 10 = 80 minutes. These numbers are based on averages and sometimes an estimation for the mission times. Real time could be better or worse. The numbers represent minutes of farming time: Ash BP: 0, Neu: 70, Cha: 70, Sys: 70, Total: 210 Atlas BP: 0, Neu: 20, Cha: 20, Sys: 40, Total: 80 Banshee Clan Research Baruuk Requires Vox Solaris standing and rank Caliban BP: 0, Neu: 105, Cha: 105, Sys: 105, Total: 315 - requires farming narmer bounties, narmer isoplasts and Anomolies in railjack Chroma Junction rewards Citrine BP: 200, Neu: 320, Cha: 320, Sys: 320, Total: 1160* - if you buy it with fragments: 516 regular, 352 minutes on steel path. Dagath BP: 0, Neu: 30, Cha: 30, Sys: 30, Total: 90 - Requires clan research Ember BP: 0, Neu: 6, Cha: 6, Sys: 12, Total: 24 Equinox BP: 80, Neu: 70, Cha: 70, Sys: 70, Total: 290 - each part is two parts Excalibur BP: 0, Neu: 6, Cha: 6, Sys: 12, Total: 24 Frost BP: 0, Neu: 6, Cha: 6, Sys: 12, Total: 24 Gara BP: 0, Neu: 55, Cha: 35, Sys: 70, Total: 160 - requires mining resources as well Garuda BP: 0, Neu: 80, Cha: 65, Sys: 65, Total: 210 - requires toroids Gauss BP: 0, Neu: 180, Cha: 180, Sys: 180, Total: 540 Grendel BP: 0, Neu: 80, Cha: 75, Sys: 80, Total: 235 - the missions suck, requires 25 vitus essence from arbitrations for each part Gyre BP: 70, Neu: 100, Cha: 190, Sys: 110, Total: 470 - requires Thrax Plasm Harrow BP: 0, Neu: 50, Cha: 30, Sys: 120, Total: 200 - 120 minutes in Defection missions feels like about 3 times as long Hildryn BP: 0, Neu: 40, Cha: 40, Sys: 80, Total: 160 - requires rank 5 in Vox Solaris rank Hydroid BP: 0, Neu: 10, Cha: 10, Sys: 20, Total: 40 - used to be 10 times worse because you needed beacons to fight the boss Inaros Quest Ivara BP: 40, Neu: 40, Cha: 40, Sys: 40, Total: 160 Khora BP: 120, Neu: 110, Cha: 60, Sys: 120, Total: 410* - As you farm these parts together in the same mission the total time is probably about half of this, required kavat genetic codes Kullervo BP: 105, Neu: 90, Cha: 90, Sys: 90, Total: 285 - requires a lot of Duviri resources Lavos Requires Entrati standing and rank - requires 550 hexanon Limbo Quest Loki BP: 0, Neu: 6, Cha: 6, Sys: 12, Total: 24 Mag BP: 0, Neu: 6, Cha: 6, Sys: 12, Total: 24 Mesa BP: 0, Neu: 38, Cha: 38, Sys: 76, Total: 152 - Requires nav coordinates from invasions Mirage Quest Nekros BP: 0, Neu: 15, Cha: 15, Sys: 15, Total: 45 Nezha Clan Tech Nidus BP: 0, Neu: 90, Cha: 90, Sys: 90, Total: 270 Nova BP: 0, Neu: 6, Cha: 6, Sys: 12, Total: 24 Nyx BP: 0, Neu: 6, Cha: 6, Sys: 12, Total: 24 - Not always available Oberon BP: 0, Neu: 100, Cha: 100, Sys: 100, Total: 300 Octavia BP: 0, Neu: 80, Cha: 10, Sys: 40, Total: 130 Protea BP: 0, Neu: 90, Cha: 90, Sys: 90, Total: 270 Qorvex BP: 0, Neu: 60, Cha: 60, Sys: 60, Total: 180 Revenant BP: 0, Neu: 60, Cha: 60, Sys: 60, Total: 180 Rhino BP: 0, Neu: 12, Cha: 12, Sys: 24, Total: 48 Saryn BP: 0, Neu: 40, Cha: 40, Sys: 80, Total: 160 - Requires judgement points to access the mission Sevagoth BP: 0, Neu: 100, Cha: 100, Sys: 100, Total: 300 Styanax Kahl missions Titania BP: 0, Neu: 30, Cha: 30, Sys: 30, Total: 90 - Requires flower resources Trinity BP: 0, Neu: 60, Cha: 60, Sys: 60, Total: 240 - Requires animo nav beacons Valkyr BP: 0, Neu: 6, Cha: 6, Sys: 12, Total: 24 Vauban Nightwave Volt Clan Tech Voruna BP: 160, Neu: 240, Cha: 240, Sys: 240, Total: 880* - 291 if bought with Lua Thrax Plasm. Wisp BP: 40, Neu: 30, Cha: 30, Sys: 30, Total: 130 Wukong Clan Tech Xaku BP: 0, Neu: 80, Cha: 110, Sys: 80, Total: 270 Yarelli Clan Tech, quest Zephyr Clan Tech Warframes in order of release with total times: Here are the warframes and their farm time in order of release: What do you think is the worst frame to farm? In my experience the worst was Caliban. Having to do the narmer bounties, on top of getting 9 anomoly shards. Also the only frame I ever bought was Harrow because you couldn't pay me to do a defection mission.