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Everything posted by master_of_destiny

  1. Fair and unfair. Let's review with some actual facts. The Exploiter Orb had about 3 phases while in the cave. That is wall perch to initial cooling duct destruction, cold slams and spawns until two subsequent ducts are destroyed, and a final situation where the orb would climb up top and drop enemies until enough damage was accumulated. The "Exploit" that you are referring to is using a Nova to prime the orb, and slow it down. If you the simultaneously destroyed the last two cooling ducts at once you'd skip the fial phase of the fight inside. It was, at most, skipping a situation where enemies dropped onto your head. Nothing great... The "fix" was to artificially limit the number of vents that could be destroyed in any one phase. This was not an exploit, you still blew up all of the cooling vents. It was simply skipping another over long animation that you'd have to wait for, in order to continue the fight. The fact that DE did this was not to stop "cheating." It was because they thought that doing this was not what they intended...because they want us locked into another 30-60 seconds of useless animation twice....because that's their vision. If it isn't clear, I hated this change. It was taking a player found way of speeding up a boss fight, and claiming it was dishonest. It's then linked to a boss that requires you grind for thermia, grind out the boss fight, and then hope for a rare ephemera drop. Because fashion frame is endgame...but getting there at most two minutes sooner is cheating.
  2. Let's talk about this....because while I can see your frustration I don't agree with it entirely. Arbitrations start at a high level (60-80). They scale off of the current enemy level system. The mission changes once per hour, it's nutty random, and if you die your team needs to carry burdens until you can be resurrected. In a full team of four you'll be required to have a 2-2-1 burden load, as a minimum burden to each individual players. Said burdens steal health and energy....but once used you can get all of this back. The reward drops are whatever that mission would be...so often are 99.9% random garbage resources and 0.1% vitus essence. The only catch is that arbitrations also have a per segment reward, so you've proportionately also got the chance o earn thousands upon thousands of endo...assuming that's your thing. Now, Steel Path is standard levels+100. It doubles resource drop chance, and mod drop chance. This part is laughable (200% of 1 in 10,000 drops is still 1 in 5,000), but the less laughable part is the +250% health, shields, and armor. This means that the Steel Path is not a "player choice" game mode. It's a game mode where you largely have to be kitted for the current meta. Your special rewards are either 3 steel essence per a 5 mission daily selection, or two essence dropped on the death if a acolyte. Acolytes have the tendency to spawn wherever they feel like, whenever they feel like. Is a spy mission it's about once every 5 minutes...so 24 essence per hour is the best possible drop rate. Other rewards are a literal joke, because they default to regular star chart pools. That is to say a level 30-40 mission rewards better than a 120 mission in Steel Path. On a positive note you can die to your heart's content, as long as you either get a standard resurrection or use one of your 4-6 resurrections. Now....why is the Arbitrations better then? Consistency and cost of rewards. Let me elaborate from where I stand. If I want to earn an umbral forma blue print I need to get 150 steel essence between each offering. That's 150/3 or 50 missions that I have to run. Theoretically I could improve this with acolyte spawn drops....but a 2 minute capture mission won't even have the chance to spawn an acolyte. This means that just to get the unique stuff from Steel Path I need to grind the snot out of it...and forego any of the other weekly rewards. I will also, after the update, have to grind steel essence to buy arcance unlockers. If they are surprisingly cheap, and aren't another thing that requires a forma and 24 hours of construction, they might only be an annoyance. What do I mean by cheap? Well, 2 steel essence. How do I come to this number? Oh boy. Let's assume that you only use about 10 primary and secondary weapons. That's basically a joke...but we'll assume. 10 weapons+ 10 catalysts+ 10 exilus adapters+ 10 arcane unlockers+ about 6 forma per weapon (60 total) means that every single items you want to test for viability at high levels is a huge cost. Why eve care about this? Well, DE continues to bag on about player choice. They have rivens "to make everything viable at higher levels," and I note that phrase because while DE hadn't actually done this it is still their stated goal. Right now people go into the simulacrum, do a youtube video, and determine if a thing is valuable or is a mastery rank fodder weapon. If you're about to dramatically increase that investment, I don't see why anyone would ever engage with any new content unless it's disproportionately strong...and DE's modus operandi is to release a thing underpowered and buff later. For those with a pair of brain cells, that would mean virtually everything comes out dead on arrival. By the time a riven buff happens, a minimum of 90 days later, nobody cares. Hmmm....this is almost like DE forgot about how their content stream works... You know, the release poor and release middling content, both ideas existing because they fear power creep more than anything else. So, why then am I actually happy about arbitrations bearing the mods? Well, the investment. I am clearly not happy with the rewards rate...but at the same time arbitrations do give you either endo or pull from a unique rewards pool. If absolutely none of the drops from the game mode interests you, then you can get Rolling Guard, Power Donation, and Grendel locators from the store. If I don't feel like the Steel Path grind I lose out on...umbral forma. Of course, that seems to be a once every 10 weeks thing...and with only 3 umbral mods the thigs have little absolute need to exist (with current sentient content). Heck, we aren't cheated on the cost of arcane unlocks then Steel Path will remain the least value highest bar grind in the game...because why the heck not? Put into one paragraph, because people seem to be incapable of reason; Arbitrations may penalize death harder, but they are also demonstrably less of a mess when it comes to unfun tanky enemies. I see why you'd think otherwise...but the facts don't bare out the emotional logic. The death burdens are less of an annoyance than a level 120 enemy who claims difficulty only in the length of their health bar is infinitely less fun is a fast paced looter shooter, especially one with the tagline "ninjas play free." This isn't a Gears of War style game, where hiding behind cover is expected.
  3. Short answer, no. Longer answer....highly RNG dependent. You've got, at most 5 drones spawning. The amount of drops remains a constant...but that only means the chances of you getting a drop increase over time....because they're 1-0.97n where n is the number of killed drones. The catch is, I think, you mean that there's a variable in the equation such that the 97% chance of not dropping decreases. In which case, you're out of luck. You could literally be grinding this game mode for months or years without relief. Would you care for a personal experience to give you a frame of reference? Mine is depressing. I haven't maxed out any of the arcanes. The closest I am is 18, and the farthest is 10. That's out of 21, of course. Despite this I've bought everything from the vendor. I have 578 vitus essence kicking around. Believe me when I say this, Arbitrations suck. You can literally go 40 minutes in a survival and get only endo. You can wait days before you get anything resembling a reward that entices you. You can even wind up with multiple ephemera without ever seeing a mod. It's another RNG trap, where if you play long enough you're assured a cheap death by level disparity...or an invisible toxic cloud...or a bombard rocket...or a nullifier. I can say I'm not happy, but the real buggering is Steel Path. They are locked to a spawn about every five minutes, but only regular star chart rewards. Nothing quite like a level 120 mission that gives out Meso relics... But DE isn't going to fix Steel Path. That's too hard. They'll slap on a layer of grind to what we already have for some minor buffs, nerf what works, and presumably tell us this is all part of the vision.
  4. Let me follow the through line to this game, over several years. I'm doing this, so that we can understand exactly why the community would be angry, and why those who suggest "it's endgame" are totally missing the point. DE released a bunch of content. It was gated by MR to some extent....but generally just pumped out. This meant that people with a low MR and high MR often had access to the same weapons...and given the absolutely insane structure of them once you got the Tigris Prime you had very little reason to grind for anything else. Remember, this was back when pizzas didn't exist, eHP scaling was insane, and people had to play as a team because enemies could curb stomp you. Now, things changed. DE stated their goal was to support player choice. Fantastic, but how? Well, that'd be rivens. The stated goal was that weaker weapons would be buffed up, so you could take even the "bad" weapons to high level content without a problem. Onward to a new future....until you realize that the same haphazard balance came to rivens. That is to say, the rivens sometimes buffed weapons to the moon and other times they made a weapon meh. There was very little balance. Introduce the operator. Introduce the rather substantive buffs associated. Introduce arcanes. All of these items offer creeping increases to power. None of them are game breaking....barring something like invisibility+melee. That said, the "endgame" endurance run was now possible with cheese strategies and instant kill weapons (covert lethality). DE recognizes that the melee system is broken. Introduce melee 3.0. This removes some of the greatest cheese, but basically buffs everything to usable levels. Note, this was the goal of rivens...which have now become arbitrage based on a desired outcome of usage rather than an outcome of equal viability. Well, melee is uniformly awesome. There are even some edge cases that can break animations...you know, when the game itself isn't breaking them. Yeah, 8 years in and it's still a buggy mess. Now we have a proposed future. It seems to be built upon ultra fast killing to maintain buffs...of course this means that any high damage but low fire rate guns are sat out in the cold. It also seems like there's only a focus on the horde shooting...because apparently that's the only way that this game "should" be played. Does anybody at DE really check the statements that they make, and measure against the past. Rivens didn't balance things. Arcanes required an insane buffing to make them not "abused when double stacked." Now we've got power creep mods with much higher costs, another grind to unlock things, and all of this in service to grinding out bullet sponge enemies for that slight bit of power...to make the grind for those items easier. Seriously, WTF? This isn't about endgame. Endgame most definitely isn't about player choice. All of this is predicated upon DE playing their own game...and it seems like they "balance" based only on final state. Yeah, goody. Another 30-40 hour grind so that I can "feel good" after a miserable trip there. Why even try at this point? Now, I do reserve the right to change opinions. That said, both sides of the debate here are insane. This is not for veterans. It is not to give us a reasonable balance. It is to generate another RNG grind...and it's really depressing that the logic seems to be to give the barest minimum buff that would be tolerable. It's not power creep if it's barely noticeable, right? Oh... By the way, it's also not worth arguing about if we claim it's only for the steel path knowing full well that this "optional" game mode will soon hide content behind it in excess of being the only source for umbral forma. Yeah...an optional challenge mode my aching back side. That's my anger. Something promised as fun will now be a grind...because this game needs more of that.
  5. So...this all hinges on actual costing. I'm not sure why people aren't taking that into account first...because even DE have finally tacitly admitted to this. Let's spend just a second, and figure this out. In an arbitration you've got 1 vitus essence awarded per cycle, a potential to drop from the drones, and one reward that is a pack of three vitus essence. This practically has meant that I can get anywhere from 13 to 50 vitus essence when playing a 40 minute survival (50 requiring a booster)...so let's cut the math to about 30 vitus essence as a high estimation of the earnings per 40 minutes. This of course runs us at about 45 essence per hour, though your mileage may vary substantially run to run. That means when DE places something into the store at 50 essence they're imposing a grind that is greater than an hour in arbitrations. It also means if we're getting it as part of the random drops...oh boy, that'd suck. Nothing quite like 40 minutes where your rewards are a mod, 6 sculptures, a endo pack, and 3 essence. Now imagine trying to get 21 arcanes....oh boy. Specifically, I can imagine this because I've maxed out every single other arcane in the game, except for those five. 11 Pistoleers, 18 Bodyguard, and the three remainders between those two. Literal years of casual arbitrations, and I cannot get 21 of those arcanes. Now, let's look at Steel Essence. That's rewarded as 3 per mission, for a finite mission quantity. It's dropped in increments of 2 by a spawn that seems to be at best every five minutes. That means you can theoretically get 16 Steel Essence in 40 minutes, or 24 per hour. This means that asking for the same time investment would have the cost in steel essence being exceptionally low...as in about half the cost of vitus essence. Now....what exactly do we have as a setup? Well, no numbers. The acolytes will "spawn more frequently" than before...so what? 4:30 instead of 5:00 is more frequently, but it's immaterial if you're searching for 50 Steel Essence. I'd challenge that what DE has presented is about 25% of a plan. There's no mod cost. There's no new spawn rate. There's no cost for these arcanes, or the unlocker to get arcanes applied. There's no data on how many arcanes we'll need (to be maxed out). There's no data on whether these arcanes matter. Most unfortunately, these mods all seem to be high cost...so how exactly are we to use other high cost mods with them? A crit and heavy calibur build already requires a polarity to each mod slot, without any extra capacity for a pexilus slot. You now want to add on a slightly better version of the mods...with a significantly higher cost? Well, goodbye edge case builds using high cost mods already. I'm not happy with the changes and the setup here. It's not about feeling cheated, but DE slapping together 5-6 changed systems without any regard for how things work together. The switch to arbitrations is...fine. It indicates though that DE isn't working with a vision. They're slapping crap together at the last minute, so that we can have something to work with. It's shaping up to be another Railjack level of failure, only this time it's monkeying with core systems. Fine, whatever. Maybe this will be the update that finally makes me regret playing this game. If it isn't, then it'll probably wind up being another 40-60 hour time sink just to get to where we were before. Hey....anybody remember those exilus slot adapters...a rare reward...for only requiem mission...that could only equip mods that were meant to be QoL? Wow...it's a repeat. Everybody is losing their crap, instead of just rolling their eyes. Why?
  6. Might I offer one better? Let's actually do some insane math here. The helminth xp is influenced by the number of subsumes, the number of items fed to it, and the number of powers assigned. Theoretically, the only time you'd "lose" any xp is if you removed or over wrote the abilities assigned to a frame. As such, it's trivial to look at the list of frames, and assume as a minimum the amount of materials required to get that subsumed quantity. That is to say, we can sum everything up. In practice: xpwarframe = nwarframe*1600 Maximum is 1600*46 = 73600 xpresources = csubsume*6.66 This is to say something like Shuriken costs 50% Calx, 77% Pheremones, and 80% Bile for 207% materials, or about 1379 xp. Assuming about 200 resources per subsume (because the math sucks and I cannot be bothered), 200*46*6.66 = 61272 This would mean that the absolute smallest amount of xp earned by someone would be 134872....and we know that's a vast undervaluation give that you'd also have resources in the bank, and you cannot even level up fully without applying at least a few infusions...because DE designed their subsume limits as such. It's also a fast estimate, so actual resource counts would give us likely more as a minimum valuation. Now...the level 10 rank for helminth requires 73125 accumulated xp. The scheme for ranking up is rankn=rankn-1+1125 for ranks greater than 1, with rank one costing 2250. that is to say, our rank costs would be as follows going forward: Rank Rank Cost Cumulative Cost 1 2250 2250 2 3375 5625 3 4500 10125 4 5625 15750 5 6750 22500 6 7875 30375 7 9000 39375 8 10125 49500 9 11250 60750 10 12375 73125 11 13500 86625 12 14625 101250 13 15750 117000 14 16875 133875 15 18000 151875 Hmmm.....it almost looks like, assuming the most basic of minimum costing calculations, DE can reasonably assume that players with all the subsumes will have rank 14 earned...and anyone with two brain cells to rub together will then reasonably assume that rank 15 is pretty much assured given that 200 resources per subsume IS A LOW ESTIMATE. Oh, and they designed the system at low levels to force you to apply abilities so you have at least rank 15 earned. Now, why am I not stressing over any of this? I don't care. The Helminth is now basically a way to take frames that need a rework, and alleviate that burden from DE. Anything amazing eats a hard nerf, anything good eats a minor nerf, and those trying to sell this to us otherwise are demonstrating "insane 1 million plus damage" on edge cases that rarely seem to be realized in gameplay...especially when most random groups consist of people running around with either nuke abilities or Ignis Wraiths. This is a system that should matter. Those that want rank 15 will rapidly earn it by sinking resources, so there's very little reason to stress. People claiming otherwise seem to believe that it's unfair. I'm sitting atop a completed Helminth, and can tell you I see nothing insane here. Especially not compared to the 46 days it takes to subsume all the powers to even be able to start this discussion. Remember 151875-73125 = 78750. 78750-1600 = 77150. 77150-(6.66*200) = 75818. To get to max rank you'll need to subsume Yaereli, and get 75818 more points. Each assigned ability is about 800 points (the values do vary wildly). They use 200 resources. That's about 2132 points per ability assigned, or 35.56 ability assignments. That is of course about 3 days of work....assuming you optimize resource assignments and point earnings... You're telling me that people are absolutely going nuts over something that DE could easily give players 4 levels on, and if not they might be forced to wait about 4 days for...in a system THAT REQUIRED 46 DAYS TO GET ACCESS TO FULLY. A system hidden behind a MR cap, 46 builds requiring 84 hours each, and extra frame slots just to have a frame to sacrifice for. Does anybody really think that this is a problem after factoring in everything else? I can't say I do....but maybe that's because I'm prioritizing the announced dramatic grind increase that forces more steel path engagement, more acolyte engagement, and all so that we can get the gun equivalent of a slightly worse arcane version of the mods that drop like candy from Deimos. Oh, but the Galvanized mods will exist....so we can get new versions of mods that will rapidly be useless at high levels because the equivalent of the BFG (the Opticor) cannot even keep up reasonably on the Steel Path, specifically when the requirement to engage these arcanes is on kill...so a 3 second charge on a bonus means if it takes 2 shots to kill I'm at 6 seconds assuming no reloads...and that's how much of the duration of the buff? Ohh. Let's lose our minds over the inability to get access to a limited use version of primed animal instinct instead. As a note, because the game is built on RNG the rare crates have a limited spawn location set. Said spawn location is fixed per tile. As such, after you've seen enough of this game, locating rare stuff is trivial. Fly past a tile with the minimap up, and look for something in an uncommon spawn area, boom. Stuff found. You're giving up a power for an indicator....so you don't have to pay attention, but are willing to spend the slot and energy. This is silly from where I sit...but whatever.
  7. Funny. It's almost like when I asked nicely for a citation the response was a flood of people screaming at the top of their lungs that I was wrong....because. My hostility is borne from a frustration that people cannot read. If the commentary was "please explain how our currently subsumed warframes will be accounted for in the new level calculation." I'd gladly have said nothing, and eagerly awaited an answer. Instead you have an entire army of people whining that it's the end of the world that they might be slightly inconvenienced...in multiple threads. If DE looks at us collectively and sees that people lose their s*** over literally nothing then there's no reason to pay attention to the forums. If their moderation is rightly off for the weekend, and they slapped this into our laps at the end of Friday, then Monday and Tuesday will simply be DE trying to make sense of the threads. This was meant as a simple question, and the response was a tidal welling of butt hurt. You suggesting that it damages my credibility after a half dozen people screaming at me that I just don't understand...without any reason, is pretty much demonstrating that you're not aware of the start of this. That said, you're more than willing to pile on. Why exactly does your opinion matter if you cannot even be bothered to understand? -Edit- Do let me be clear, because apparently people now require that more than anything else. I agree that DE was ambiguous in their definitions. I would conjecture that is because they don't even have this crap nailed down on their side...because they always seem to release quarter baked. That said, maybe the play here is to calm down, and ask for citation or clarification. Maybe instead of starting off by screaming that the world is going to end you should calm down...because DE does this crap every time. You hopefully get it, but I won't assume. DE cites a terrible change. The community gets absolutely up in arms. They walk back the most heinous crap, and only that. What we are left with is still bad....but they "listened to feedback" so we cannot be too angry....right? I mean, it only took like 7 years for something like 24 hour construction timers to be 23 hours. And 3 nav beacons for Mesa to only require one. And the Ghoul Saw is coming out "soon," right? I won't even suggest the universal vacuum debate....too late. Ahh.....never mind. Let's just watch as this things burns to the ground, so the polite amongst us can remain polite. How very...prudent to maintain that stoicism in the face unbridled rage. -Edit end-
  8. Hold your breath. Please. Do so until you turn blue. Once you lose consciousness take about 8 hours and come back. I, for the record, am asking you to take a nap. It improves cognitive functions. THE QUOTE ON THE FRONT PAGE IS: Every week, your Helminth will have an Affinity toward 3 Random Warframes. You can interact with Helminth with these Warframes to gain select Weekly Buffs (one Offensive and one Utility/Defense)! For example: This is represented in my math by O-S-D (offense, support, defense). IT IS STATED IN THE FIRST POST. I thus did not believe you'd follow through with the insanity of assuming otherwise....but here we stand. GO TO SLEEP. YOU NEED REST, OR YOU NEED A CLEARER HEAD. _________________________ The matrix of 3 lines, consisting of 27 options, is the potential PERMUTATIONS of a fixed 3 buff type with 3 buff options. See above. If you did not have 3 fixed buff types the opportunities shift. You would be looking at COMBINATIONS of warframes, and 3*3*3*3 different options for the buffs. That's each of the 3 frames having 3 options with 3 different levels for 3 buffs. Note that this is not what was explained in the FIRST POST, and thus is not how things were calculated. For the record, that only has (46+45+44)*3*3*3*3 = 135*81 = 10935 different arrangements. _______________________ Matrix math. Sweet jebus I have to explain this. You have what I already showed with the B-E-G matrix. Now, create a matrix of those matrixes, where the 1-1-1 is changed based upon the 27 potential iterations of the buff levels. That's basically taking a matrix of 3 dimensions (3 frame choices), and iterating it within a matrix of 3 dimensions (3 potential buff levels). This is why the number gets dizzyingly high....and why your squishy brain has a problem processing it. For the record, my squishy brain did to, hence the wobbling back and forth on that extra 3 multiplier. -Edit- I'm going to assume you don't get this....because based upon the other bits you don't understand the underlying structure. Copy that B-E-G matrix. Paste it. Now, you have a second matrix where each trio of option is 1-1-2 instead of 1-1-1. Note that this means you're going to have 27 B-E-G matrices....or (3*2*1)*3*3*3. Holy crap....the numbers align. Now, why not do this? I have respect for my time, and assumed that you can do rote copy paste operations. Based upon the response, and your O1-O2-O3 comment this may be a dramatic over assumption of you ability. That said, I cannot be bothered to teach you something so insanely basic. Before you start claiming other people don't get a thing, maybe you should make sure you do. Please. -Edit end- _______________ How do I know there will be multiple levels of buffs for each type? Well, I f***ing read. THE FIRST BLOODY POST. ".... These will be drawn randomly per player. Tenno can check their Helminth during the Weekly reset to see what Invigorations are available for the week. Once you infuse the Invigoration, it lasts the week before the power of the Helminth wears off. To give players some control over what will be very powerful buffs, the Helminth takes note of your interactions - for every 10 Invigorations you do, you’ll be able to Select what Warframe receives the next buff! ..... Are Invigoration options only chosen based on Warframes you own? No, much like Arbitration Warframe Buffs, the Invigorations options are pulled from the entire roster. ..." Pay attention to the underlined, italicized, bolded section above. The selection of the frames is going to be done by DE every week, and the buff will be randomized per player. This means that there is a static buff selection (O-S-D), there is a dynamic warframe selection (permutation), and there are multiple levels of buffs which will be unique. _______________________________ I'm done now. You can have the last words, but I'd recommend using them carefully. To this point you failed to read the first post. You failed to articulate the differences ad assumptions which would allow for a combination rather than permutation mathematical model. You failed to demonstrate why my models fail...despite claiming that they are inaccurate, while not presenting a single one of your own. Hell, at this point I really don't even understand why you want to fight. I don't really believe that you have a point here anymore, but you're welcome to try and articulate it. Again, read please. It'd look pretty silly if someone else could refute your points by simply copying and pasting the very first post...
  9. Let's define words....because apparently you want them to mean something else. Let's also use the DE quote....because heaven forbid people take them at their word. For a refresher, the quote: Does your Helminth Rank automatically increase when the new 5 Ranks are added? - No. The new Invigorations will give XP/Affinity toward Helminth in addition to normal feeding and Subsume/Infusion actions! There won’t be any automatic rankups based on the current vs new Level Cap. Are Invigoration options only chosen based on Warframes you own? No, much like Arbitration Warframe Buffs, the Invigorations options are pulled from the entire roster. Now....THE DEFINITION OF WORDS: Does your Helminth Rank automatically increase when the new 5 Ranks are added? Take note here, "automatically." - No. The new Invigorations will give XP/Affinity toward Helminth in addition to normal feeding and Subsume/Infusion actions! There won’t be any automatic rankups based on the current vs new Level Cap. Sweet jebus, a clear answer. They do not say that your accumulated XP will not be recalculated on day one to determine your new level. They ask if on day one because you were 10/10 you'll automatically upgrade to 15/15. This is not rocket science, it's the definition of words. They explain how you accumulate xp....and say it'll be used to level you up. WHY ARE MECHS A GOOD EXAMPLE? No free levels were offered. On day one the xp earned by killing was pulled, and the new level was calculated. Oh my god....DE didn't explicitly state that they'd be using the previously earned xp on mechs....why didn't everyone freak the f*** out then? Oh yeah....reading. DE stated that mechs would rebalance to the earned xp they had....just like they're stating with the helminth. For those curious, 29.5 was that update. But, we're (you guys, not me) assuming that you are at level 10...and there will be no recalculation. This means anyone who has already plowed all the frames into the helminth cannot have all of that affinity added....so the only way to get the helminth to 15 will either be to wait it out....or simply use the helminth. So...the person penalized is the edge case where you have plowed 100% of the resources in...but no longer use the helminth itself. Your complaint is this edge case will be cheated out of access to high level helminth abilities...which they would only want to apply if they used the helminth. Is someone there drinking drain cleaner? As someone who is done with the thing, and doesn't use it, I find no reason to care. You have to instead find someone butt hurt, that endured the 40+ days to subsume all frames, who wants access to all powers, but is also unwilling to use and experiment with them. All of which is predicated on DE not recalculating your level upon launch based on xp earned at the helminth... Can we see the tsunami in a bottle here? The mountain made from a mole hill? Perhaps not. Perhaps you need to fight this one out. Power to ya. At this point my response is that you've managed to make a hell of a situation out of the word automatic... I believe the only word that, at this point, might compare, would be "malignant."
  10. OK....time to stop. Terminology folks. Let's pay attention for just a moment, then understand whether a freak out should happen. An automatic level-up would be that I earned maximum rank, so when new ranks are available I get them regardless of anything else. If we use the Necramech, it'd be an "I'm level 30 today so when the update hits I'll automatically be level 40, right?" THIS IS WHAT DE IS SAYING WILL NOT HAPPEN. So what are they saying will happen? Well, you'll rank up based upon earned affinity. Affinity can be earned by subsuming, applying abilities, or feeding. This is literally repeating how the system currently works. So, what has DE stated? Well....nothing explicitly. You don't just get 5 free ranks. IF THEY REPEAT WHAT THEY DID WITH NECRAMECHS, YOUR ACCUMULATED XP WILL THEN BE USED TO RANK YOU UP. I ASKED FOR CITATION THAT THIS WAS GOING TO BE DISREGARDED....WHICH HAS NOT BEEN PROVIDED. WHEN MECHS GOT EXTRA LEVELS THEIR ACCUMULATED XP WAS USED TO CALCULATE THEIR NEW LEVEL. Please note the bold sections. DE said you will rank up only from accumulated XP. The XP is received from what you do....which is a no-duh. They have not stated that you will not gain levels upon implementation due to accumulated XP, only that there is no automatic free 5 level gain. Please, read. It's not a subtle sentence, and the freak out here is coming from literally nothing. Pay attention to the word "automatic," and note the lack of "earned."
  11. Except that's wrong. Necrammechs. Does anybody read? Level capped at 30. Affinity is loosely tracked by the amount of kills and such. When it became another "add forma, get 2 more levels to grind" DE promised the same. It wasn't that you'd suddenly be bumped from 30 to 40. It's like nobody has any memory here. Next we're going to forget that there was a time when guns were better than melee. Yeah....before those scaling mods. Which instead of addressing DE is nerfing, and adding an unlockable arcane slot for a semi-scaling mod on guns. You'll now have to buy a blue print (or get a drop), get the resources, build, apply a catalyst, level and burn through forma, earn, build, and install a pexilus mod, with the final trio of steps now being earn, build, and install an arcane slot. But no, let's argue that despite DE not saying that affinity earned is in limbo, and despite the EXACT SAME SITUATION happening with Necramechs, this is where we should collectively lose our minds.
  12. You guys reading things, or assuming? I ask because if you read the terminology is that there will be non automatic rank-up based upon new versus old level caps. What it doesn't explicitly state is that it will remain at exactly what it currently is. Note, based upon affinity earned in the system. Again, Necramechs. They did not suddenly get to level 40 if you barely got them to 30 once, it levelled up based upon eared affinity. The exact language contained in this response.
  13. So.....citation? If we are to look at similar previous experiences, this was not the case. As a example, the Necramechs. I had 5 forma into Voidrig when DE dropped the update. I kept my forma, and added a subsequent 8 levels. That is to say the system tracked my accumulated affinity and awarded it to me upon the first login. There's little reason to assume DE will not do the same, given the already large list of stuff they are "giving" to us based upon all the changes.
  14. Amazing....you can cite why I said something as a fact, then question it. Let me highlight why I said it was so.....because you apparently can't even keep an idea together for an explanation....let alone support your initial statement with simple examples. I assume that there are 3 buffs in each type. I stated it was an assumption. You have to accept this, or deny it based on nothing. Oh boy, DE releasing quarter baked info is special. I'm going to assume you have the capability to agree with the premise of an assumption, though do say so if you aren't. DE also cited an example where 3 buffs were listed....without indicating if they were linked. Yeah. This is a fundamental assumption...because if you don't make it then there's no math to do. So yeah, assume 3 potential actual buff values, unlinked to one another, meaning each potential selection has 3 outcomes. Now....the point where you seem to swallow the insanity pill. DE states there are three buff types. YOU LINKED TO THEIR POST. They state that each of these types will be covered. I then assume that there are 3 types of buffs. Now the Idiot Argument. I refer to it as such because you already made it....but refuse it. Why permutations over combinations. Let's use B-E-G again, with a Harrow in the mix added because you seem to not understand the difference because 3*2*1= 3+2+1 (because this is the edge case where they are equal). Let's then explain the potential outcomes. Remember that DE has fixed the appearance of 3 types of buffs. For an example, let's fix the arbitrary assignment of these buffs at a value of 1. Our outcomes are: BO1-ED1-GS1; BO1-GD1-ES1; BO1-HD1-GS1; BO1-GD1-HS1; BO1-HD1-ES1; BO1-ED1-HS1; EO1-BD1-GS1; EO1-GD1-BS1; EO1-HD1-GS1; EO1-GD1-HS1; EO1-HD1-BS1; EO1-BD1-HS1; GO1-ED1-BS1; GO1-BD1-ES1; GO1-HD1-BS1; GO1-BD1-HS1; GO1-HD1-ES1; GO1-ED1-HS1; HO1-ED1-GS1; HO1-GD1-ES1; HO1-BD1-GS1; HO1-GD1-BS1; HO1-BD1-ES1; HO1-ED1-BS1 Do you see yet? Let me explain one more time. The are the potential outcomes assuming that you have a fixed bonus type and bonus value. In practice pwarframe choice*1*1. Note that I've highlighted all of the B-E-G permutations. Note also that line to line you substitute only one frame for another. That is to say, line 2 switches Ember and Baruuk. Line three is line one, with Grendel and Baruuk switched. Line four is Harrow and Baruuk switched. Note also I added a fourth frame, but instead of increasing by 4 ((4+3+2+1)-(3+2+1)) we've actually added 18 (4*3*2*1-3*2*1 = 24-6 = 18) potential setups. LET'S EXPLAIN PERMUTATIONS VERSUS COMBINATIONS THEN. Do you get it? I'm really asking at this point, because if we need to go further there are going to have to be pictures. I'd also like to retract my earlier removal of a *3 factor in the mix. It is actually *3*3*3. There are 3 values, with 3 level, that are independent. Imagining this on a cube, our outcomes are in fact 1-1-1; 1-2-1; 1-1-2; 1-2-2; 1-2-3; 1-3-2; 1-3-3; 1-3-1; 1-1-3; 2-1-1; 2-2-1; 2-1-2; 2-2-2; 2-2-3; 2-3-2; 2-3-3; 2-3-1; 2-1-3; 1-1-1; 1-2-1; 1-1-2; 1-2-2; 1-2-3; 1-3-2; 1-3-3; 3-3-1; 3-1-3; This is also a question of permutations....because 3-1-3 and 3-3-1 will not be the same in practice. That's kind of how the whole fixed 3 types things works. So, we're back to me being right on step one. About 2 millions combinations. This assumes that you have 3 buff types (as DE stated). It assumes 3 buff levels for each type, because there is no information that contradicts and they're inept in providing enough data. It assumes 46 warframes, because that is what we have now. It doesn't assume a new frame will be added in...because unsurprisingly that is going to skew the combinations even higher. Of course, you keep beating that ignorant drum. I'm interested to see how far it gets you. I'm also interested if you play the lottery. Remember, the chances there are kind of fun. With a pool of 70 numbers, your chances to pick each do not depend on order. Your chance of choosing the 5 is thus (5/70)*(4/69)*(3/68)*(2/67)*(1/66) = 5!/(70*69*68*67*66). That of course is a combination select, whereas if the order mattered like it will here, your chance would be 1/(70*69*68*67*66). DID YOU CATCH THAT? WHEN ORDER MATTERS, LIKE WITH A SELECTION OF BUFFS WHICH EACH HAVE TO EXIST, YOU USE A PERMUTATION CALCULATION???? Why, it's almost like I set about stating all of these assumptions when we started. Why would I have done that? Snark over. I'm done. You either get it, or need to go back to 6th grade. I'm not sure which....and common core sucks lemons, so maybe it'd be a higher level at this point.
  15. You didn't pay attention to the later logic, nor the comment about what we currently have. It's amazing that you have the assumptions, but refuse to agree with them before inserting your own and claiming inaccuracy. Though I do appreciate the attempt to keep me honest, it's a pretty scummy implementation. What you should have caught is an extra 3 used in the calculations....but as you didn't I'll explain why it's only 819720 combinations (because I will admit error there). Note that if you only got each combination once, 819720 weeks (assuming a 52 week year) is more than 15763 years. I want permutations because the order matters. I have 3 frames, each has one of a pool of buffs. The buffs are further subdivided into what they offer. As an example, let's discuss potential values....because DE didn't yet provide them. Type - Offense, Defense, Support Value (Offense) - 200% power strength, 200% primary weapon damage, 300% secondary damage. Excal, Baruuk, and Gredel and frames. This is one combination as expressed but one permutation when the other data is added in. This order is 1:(46*45*44), and could be expressed in permutations as E-B-G, E-G-B, B-E-G, B-G-E, E-B-G, and E-G-B. If I just wanted any three frames that's a combination, but if their selected order influences which buffs are available I need the 6 permutations expressed. If not I could express the frames as a combination, but would need to express the buffs as a permutation given their random assignment. Buff Type is Offense, Defense, and Support. To simplify the math here I fix these. Bonus is 1, 2, and 3 because we don't have real values....because this info is at best quarter baked. The permutation are thus very much dependent upon order. This is not simply combinations. I'd like to elaborate, but that's 3 potential buff categories, 3 potential actual buffs, and the 6 ways that I could order this finite list of frames. Yes, (3*2*1)*3*3 = 54 combinations. If we have 4 frames the list isn't now (4+3+2)*3*3=81, it's (4*3*2)*3*3=216. This is the break of combination and permutation math. Now....I'd love to be snarky. I'd love to point out that this is why we have 336 potential combinations in the Kuva Lich system, instead of 6. I'd like to do this, but I'm going to refrain from doing so, but only to make this into one last explanation for those who are asking what the heck combination and permutations differ on. Excal (Offense - 1), Baruuk (Defense -3), and Grendel (Support - 2) is different than; Excal (Offense - 1), Baruuk (Defense -3), and Grendel (Support - 3) is different than; Excal (Offense - 1), Grendel (Defense -3), and Baruuk (Support -2) is different than; Excal (Offense - 1), Baruuk (Defense -2), and Grendel (Support - 3). Note that the buff type location is fixed...because DE has explained one of each type of buff exists. This is obvious, right? Good. Same combination of frames, but differing their position matters, and differing their buff value also matters. That means that the permutation, which is order based, is required. We account for the bonus types as being fixed at 3, because each is chosen once and independently. Likewise we account for the bonus value once, and why it is only given as 3. This is my error point. I was thinking without verifying, and added in the 3 frame categories (regular, prime, umbra). Now, please either explain your work, or apologize for the high and mighty attitude. You failed to detect an error, cited a correction which took all of 10 seconds to demonstrate was incorrect, and tried to high road me. Fantastic. It's almost like I'm taking this personally because instead of demonstrating the logic you called it out and expected nobody to check. It's almost like I'm repeating what you did...only I have checks and found an actual error...because math.
  16. So....You've added a ton of potential screen clutter because everything is going to be on a timer. That's a bold...and infuriating choice. I think that the decision to nerf things numerically is pretty backwards. Instead of addressing things reasonably you've decided to let the edge cases control the primary cases. That's really disappointing on the melee side. Maybe instead of a single "but it breaks our animations" statement you could put in the effort to fix more. A rolling berserk speed bonus still requires upkeep...but instead of that you decided to just do the minimum numerical decrease and have activation only on kills. Great...this means if we have things going, and lose it, the sponge enemies will simply prevent us from being able to get it back. Most frustratingly, steel path. It was supposed to be a challenge mode. Now it's required for umbral forma. It's required for stance forma. It's required for access to mods. It's definitely not going to get reward upgrades....so that level 105 mission will still reward at best a lith relic. That isn't a problem though. That's just the opportunity to get bad rewards, but slightly higher standing. Ohhh....and now the acolytes can spawn even more often. That'd be great, if they didn't kill the pacing of every mission and force you to fight another bullet sponge....but this time with infinite energy and apparently more armor than most enemy space ships.
  17. So...the abilities range from good to uninteresting. That's...well, it could be worse. Now the invigorations thing is really backwards. Let's do the math here, so that you can understand my hesitation. 3 different buff types, 46 frames, 32 primes (31 realistically), 1 umbra frame, and weekly refresh. Let' assume that the different buff types only have 3 permutations each....which means that on any given week, assuming that prime and non-prime frames get the buff, you have 3*3*3 or 27 potential buff combinations. You then have 46*45*44 frame choices, or 91080 different frame groups. Remember that this is dependent upon the buffs...so today you've got 2459160 potential frame-buff possible combinations. Oh joy. So...how many of those permutations matter? I'm asking because giving something like a Trinity a huge offensive buff is pointless. You know what, let's not even go there. Now, it's time for the "balance" mechanic. Assuming that you have paid to have every single frame, every 11th infusion can be controlled. To what extent? Do I have three weeks of nothing, and on the fourth week I can choose to assign the defensive ability to Gara? Do I have 9, and get a list of my next 3, then after infusing one I can choose a frame for either of the remaining two buffs? Heck, that's only round one. We'll eventually have 8 infusions in the tank, and a week where I can get the 11th...if I can infuse the two I don't want it's not really even a choice about the one remaining type of buff. All of this is...made even more infuriating because these bonuses are meant not even as the "carrot" that the degraded MR 30 buffs offer. They're actually the stick of forcing people to either use what they choose not to use, or otherwise force players to conform to what DE wants, because such a buff makes it silly to use other things. So....how has that arbitration bonus you offer, that does exactly the same, been going? Based on this it must have been effective, but I can tell you that I've never been able to care. Going into a survival arbitration armed with the Scourge and a Harrow because of a minor buff is idiotic, because Nekros exists. Oh, but now the bonus is maybe a bit bigger and it's an entire week without mission restriction. I don't think you guys have planned this out. This blatantly seems like an engagement time driver, by introducing the ability to do missions less effectively. That is to say you want us to use frames with this buff, because for virtually every mission that isn't high level a doubling of any stat will allow you to brute force it. Joy, the false choice of feeling power versus demonstrating power by efficient completion of objectives. You do think low of your players...or you don't have a goal here. Which is it?
  18. So, point of explanation about the Canadian thing, beyond the standard "not all" disclaimer. Most of the people I've met from Canada believe that discourse is almost without direct criticism of an opposing opinion. That is to say that two people lay out their beliefs, and this is the end of the discussion. If you are to directly cite issues with a person's opinion you are attacking them...which in the US is basically considered standard discourse. It's not everyone, but I used the commentary because DE as a company seems to be very much a product of their surroundings. Whether this is perception or reality is...up for vigorous debate. Regarding the lack of promises...squad link. Orb Mothers. Pickup by railjack on the surface of open worlds. All of these things were not discussed, but demonstrated. Now...the game implementation for all of them has been shaky...and whether they exist or not, some have only seen one attempt. Bless you Scarlet Spear. I don't ever believe what DE promises anymore. I fully believe that the Sisters will somehow accidentally include a male model on some of the RNG bits....because that just seems appropriate. Regarding the lack of delivery... There's a wiki page for promises not delivered. Still waiting on the saw, but I'd really like the even older promise of dual wield nikanas to get a date. Regarding the responses on stream. I believe my favorite was the absolute misery it seemed to be when they announced that the Liches would no longer insta-kill you for failing a potential 1 in 8*7*6 or 1:336 guess at arranging 3 mods in an appropriate order. Because everybody told them that the idiotic RNG was miserable of day one, but it was more than a month before they "graced" us by decreasing that potential to, at best, a 1:6 chance of guessing the proper order assuming we are willing to grind for hours to simply learn which three mods are required...without any indication of order. I believe that this was not the hill to die on, and I'm already lining up to watch the supposed railjack integration of Liches with railjack....only about two years late. Finally, let's discuss responses. Steve never admits a bad decision, because to some extent he's the auteur leading the project with a vision. If he admitted error it'd no longer be his vision...so I guess that things are as they are. Scott is always joked about as the one delivering nerfs. This is a tactic to address outrage before it can happen by making it a joke. Etcetera. What you usually get is Rebecca and the community management team cleaning things up...and boy do I think they earn their paycheck. Rebecca is regularly open about community perceived failures...and even seems to be a member of the internal group addressing things like the melee nerf and gun buff proactively. Instead of commenting on the leak, they announce a delayed developer workshop...going over it and helminth system changes. While a part of me seriously is asking WTF, the other part of me is willing to listen. Maybe it'll be good. Maybe. That'd tacitly not be admitting to what the community has already deemed a failure of a response, but realistically packaging it with something else to deny it the ability to fester. Say what you will, but Rebecca and team really do earn their keep given all the crap that seems to constantly be drawing almost universal community ire. This is all in service to a simple point. Indies with no money need to listen. Indies with money sell out (anything Zenimax), or become auteurs (Phil Fish). DE definitely pretends to be an auteur....but instead of listening they pay people in PR to fix their insanity as needed. In this way the parties responsible are never held to account. They never have to say sorry, because they have paid people to do that. They, to an extent, have sold out. You can't reasonably say otherwise given the pricing scheme on some of those skins. If you get to play both sides of the argument, get the benefits of whatever you claim this week, and never truly have to truly reconcile this insanity, then why should you? If I were in this position I'd make someone else have to take responsibility for my errors. Oh...I'm that someone professionally. I made myself sad.
  19. Point one, much obliged. As you've already stated, the history was not for you...but I could not assume a basic understanding given that I have no idea who exactly you are. I've found many failures in assuming that others are aware of things...and that is a frustration which I can alleviate. Point two, I don't believe that communication with DE is truly a two way street. I believe that it has never been. That said....passion rarely means results. I caution this because your story sounds so familiar. Not to be blunt, but let me suggest mine for parallels. Game is new...and good. Very rough, but free to play. Friends download, you play until you've got a few MR...then the grind sets in. The bugs never seem to get fixed, or new bugs become prevalent. You scream into the void...until the last fiber in you snaps and you leave the game. You come back a couple of years later, and have low expectations. All of that content is good...until you burn through the 90% that is filler and discover the 10% miserable grind. You find yourself trying to communicate with DE again...and discover fawning praise is all they respond to. Instead of burning out you try to change things again by offering the same feedback consistently. You discover that it doesn't matter, because the immediate fixes patch loot caves...while broken features are "someday" fixes. You then satisfy yourself by trying to fight the entropy, hoping that the next fix will be the one to acknowledge the issues. Yes, that's a Quantum Leap joke. SyFi used to be SciFi and play Battlestar/Quantum Leap/80's cheese. I'm old. Point three...detachment. Professional detachment. I work in quality. The joke is that the two people you wish are sick on any given day are in HR and Quality. Quality is supposed to have pride in their work, and their product. They also have to be able to call a turd a turd, and refuse to allow a polished turd out the door. When people at DE say their Quality Control and Assurance is fine, they either don't know what those words mean, or don't have the ability to improve because they can't objectively see their own work. Either of these things is a sin...but the real issue is that somebody at DE needs to LEAD. Leaders need to set goals, make deliverables, and keep people accountable. I like the dev stream enthusiasm, but DE's releases share the same inability to release a good product. That's....depressing. It will also lead to their death, as a lack of vision beyond "rule of cool" is what killed Law Breakers and countless other games. You want another Cliffy B moment? I don't. Please be warry about asking for anything. When people asked for "any kind of evergreen content" we got Echoes of Umbra. When we asked for any sort of controls on the riven market we got a nerf from low earth orbit to virtually everything. When we asked for universal vacuum...oh boy. Borrowing a movie line, sometimes dead is better. If the leaked "fixes" for guns are accurate, then maybe useless is better. Likewise, the reasonable plea for not nuking melee from orbit is likely to be....interpreted interestingly. Side note, good chat. Thank you for a conversation that feels...meaningful. It's been some time.
  20. While I appreciate your sentiment, let's take a walk down memory lane to understand the people you are talking about. I will cite only one instance, because it encapsulates everything. Check youtube for a creator by the name of Rahetalius. Instead of levelling criticism and citing opinion, he made an extensive video and cited issues that were objectively supported factually. Literally no attacks. Names were cited, but only as who had what official capacity or who committed what act. It was more investigative journalism than you can find in most newspapers. The response to said video was apocalyptic. DE responded as though this was a personal attacks...and it took an effort by the majority of the community to get DE to stop. It took more effort to get them to listen. It...well frankly given the creator purge there never seems to have been forgiveness or learning. I reinforce the later point (not listening and learning) because instead of admitting wrongdoing there was suddenly "long standing plans" to go from a community forum policed by agents DE appointed from the community, to an outside moderation group policing based upon the rules laid out in the TOS. They even, in that response, cited that it was "not because of any recent events." A statement that was apparently...difficult to reconcile with reality. In short, DE doesn't know how to take criticism and never has. Whether this is a function of being Canadian, or they themselves not having the ability to dissociate from the product, it doesn't matter. They only learn by faltering player count. Now...let me be blunt about your feedback. The creators are not right 90% of the time. Let me explain this with a hot take from Brozime. "How do we make guns relevant? Dramatically increase their damage and dramatically reduce their ammo pool." This was a sentiment that he shared...and I literally see nobody else sharing it. Likewise, watch any two of his yearly ratings videos back to back....and note that they aren't the same. This is a function of being driven by the feels rather than logic, and is not a criticism. It is a criticism of non-factual feedback. I say this because your latter point matters more. When you have many people with the same feedback, all looking at your presented facts from different angles, there is much cause for concern. To that end, let's look at the inputs to evaluate. Movement 1.0 to 2.0 was generally a good thing...but DE really messed up with some frames who had a movement ability. Zephyr literally sat for years forgotten. Pets 1.9x, or whatever you want to call the current iteration, is still a mess. Stone stupid AI, poor scaling, and an inability to care about most of them given the 3-5 stand outs (your numbers may vary) means that most of the time they're either buff generators or doing a task. Case in point Oxylus....or the fishing/plant scanning meh sentinel. Melee is on 3.0. It was initially almost useless in the ancient days. It was then a last resort. When 3.0 came around it brought the combo counter into use, had scaling damage, and didn't favor either status or critical. Both, or even hybrid, builds were fantastic. It was great...until you then look at the rest of the systems and realize that they had no such scaling system and thus literally cannot compete. Finally, but by no means the only thing, we got the Paracesis. A single novelty sentient slayer blade, with the unique mechanic of requiring 5 forma to fully unlock and adding that capacity to the weapon mod capacity. Of course, with five forma there was literally no build that you couldn't place on the thing already. That was something unique....until it wasn't. It migrated to the Kuva weapons...so a grind, on top of a grind, on top of a grind, on top of a grind, could have a grind for 5 forma and the subsequent 180 levels to max out added. That DE promised would be a unique grind for them...until the necramechs came out...but only after people did the 20 seconds of math to figure out that the 12 mod slots were a poisoned apple....because even if all the slots were polarized you couldn't equip a mod in each given their costs. The response was not to rebalance, or even to offer an Aura like mod, but to slap on a 180 level grind, another 5 forma, and call it a day. Hmmm.... It looks like my extended point is that DE cannot be held to promises. It looks like they often deliver the things they said they would not do. It also seems like instead of understanding and fixing things they slap a bandage on it, and will get around to fixing it "soon." Note the genesis of the meme there...as well as some bitterness about DE being inept with communication and transparency. Let's also review the communication from DE. We're going to rework the damage from guns, so that they're viable to use. We're looking at some minor nerfs to melee, but largely improving the performance of guns to match. -DE releases the impact procs create slash procs instead mod...which given the stupidly favored damage of slash procs functionally screams "We don't know how to balance this against slash, but know we can't nerf slash. Just make this mod an Impact only Hunter's Munitions, and call it a day." bandage fixing.- Leaked developer build information implies that the newest attempt might see a 200-300% gun damage increase....if no melee is equipped. Oh joy. A static buff which doesn't scale....so functionally it is capped and potentially won't scale like the faction buff mods. The latest commentary from the developer is not even trying to soften the melee nerf. They're telegraphing this as the slow boiled frog....because if they were honest two months ago there would have been outrage. Today though, there's nothing. The people that are angry are those that saw this with DE for the last five years, and not the newer players whose attention spans have been exceeded. With DE you have to go on a stream, and type "When Ghoul Saw DE" to get a response from a promise that was made when the first ghouls were announced. Wrapping all of this up, as a veteran of the game if they're afraid DE is going to screw this up. I'll put my money on yes. Before you do though, let's define a veteran. Play at least once a week, for no less than two hours. Play for at least two years...though three would be preferred. Play during at least one update launch...before the inevitable three plus hot fixes required to return stability. I don't have a high bar for being a veteran...because all of the people I used to play with started to meet that bar...and promptly quit. Their commentary was that this was a farming simulator, built on bad RNG, and a buggy nightmare. They also commented that DE didn't fix, they added more. They changed, but never planned for change. These things sound prophetic? Now regarding the commentary about being too fast, and the few edge cases....I don't think that DE is capable of a fair argument here. Allow me to explain, with their own handiwork. Does anyone remember in melee 2.0 why the Atterax was such a beast? Yeah, it had crit, but it could nuke whole rooms through walls. It had a substantial length as a whip, and the range mods were all percentage based. That 1 meter range sword could be 2.2 meters (as an example), but the 3 meter Atterax was suddenly 6.6 meters. Holy crap, no wonder the polearms and whips were so heavily favored. How did DE eventually fix things? Well, they changed the mod to be a set additional range. That's skipping out on some steps though. First they made the whip not go through any solids....meaning that you couldn't nuke enemies through walls. Good, right? Well, no. Between all of the random geometry in levels, and enemies themselves being solid, you now couldn't use long range weapons. Fine, after more complaints they allowed semi-solids and enemies not to prevent hit detection. OK....not terrible. Remember though, this is still with a % increase range. Combine this with assured criticals (maiming strike), and melee still far outstripped guns....and this has been in-game for literally years. Look back, and you can see people recommending Adaro runs for focus farming years ago. So....did DE even fix this with melee 3.0, despite the changes? My point here is not to criticize you, but to ask whether DE even understands their own issue. I would hazard to say that someone has shown them some pretty nutty edge cases...and instead of putting them into perspective they've decided to salt the earth like they usually do. Case in point, the sentiment for the Zephyr Prime setup was a solid meh for Zephyr, some edge love for the Tiberon, and some ok appreciation for the Kronen. The melee update dropped and tonfas now had a substantive range, excellent speed, and decent damage. The Kronen Prime then shot up the riven scale....and ate a bunch of disposition changes. Today the Kronen Prime is by far the best of the Zephyr pack....and it's because you get fast attacks in a wide area. This is prime, excusing the pun, opportunity to review only that weapon group, and maybe scale the damage to the speed better. The problem is not that attacks are too fast, but that the Kronen Prime utterly breaks the power curve. So....maybe instead of an edge case they can show on stream, DE should use some of that data and crunch out the outlying weapons. Maybe then, the problem will be clearer. Of course that's not what is being communicated to us. We just have vague, and increasingly threatening, promises that the one great system will eat nerfs. As a final compendium, let me offer just a few ways that I've heard to address the melee scaling issue. These are not complete or balanced, but could be combined to not nerf melee, increase player power, and feel like DE actually gives a crap. Shields popped by guns function off of a damage threshold. If exceeded the target will be stun locked for a short duration. This allows enemies to have shield gating, but not penalize players for taking high damage low fire rate weapons. Right now using something like the Opticor is penalized by shielded enemies, because 200k damage means nothing if you always need at least two shots to kill a level 5 mook. Guns get their own combo counter style damage increaser. Think like melee, or like sniper rifles. Guns level up like warframes. Instead of just mod capacity they increase to full damage (at 400% of current value). All base damage increase mods are removed from the game. This effectively increases their power, but also removes a required mod slot. This opens a slot for something else...like how right now melee doesn't require point strike if you build to take advantage of the combo multiplier. Impact, Slash, and Puncture are reworked. Slash maintains damage, but said damage has a longer duration with lower value ticks. Same loss, but much slower. Impact stuns a target rigid, instead of ragdolling them. On top of this it opens the enemy to finishers. Puncture procs create Banshee like weak points on the target. If one of these weak points is hit it does some multiplier of the base damage, ignoring all armor and causing the target to flee in terror. Slash is less weighted, because the game prefers dead over bleeding. Impact is more weighted for weapons that kill from afar or at point blank...because the headshot bonuses are pretty sweet, unless you can get a finisher. Puncture is a fantastic crowd control, for high volume of fire weapons. All of these benefit guns because right now the only play is hunter's munitions for bleed or status spreaders. The former is simply outclassed as levels rise and the later is a means to maximize melee. With these altered procs at least distance combat can be useful for something. etc.... (everyone who plays has an opinion, but permutations of the above seem most common) Instead, what we're likely to see is bandage mods. We'll have one or two that are genuinely interesting, a couple with niche cases, and the remainder that most players cannot see a usage for in regular play...but somebody will find a single niche usage for to create a million damage....and will then promptly be forgotten about because setting up things in the simulacrum are entirely different from running them in-game. The people cited have all seen this dozens of times before, and DE has never fundamentally understood their failures enough to change, so as the saying goes 'Those who do not understand history are doomed to repeat it." The only question is how long we'll stick around for the ride. I can't say I'm seeing a reason to care if they continue this crap. To be clear, the crap I refer to (in this instance) is raids. More years gone than present. Always "a possibility." Always hinted at. You then look at the buggy state of the game, and read that DE found it too exhausting to maintain them. Then you remember that a prime access can break basic mechanics....and I just hope that they stop baiting people to believe that they'll be back...or if they ever come back, they will have the dedicated community they once had. Those people who led the raid school bus aren't here anymore. Why in hades would they be? The raids thing is a diversion, but it hints at an underlying truth. I could have cited dozens of issues....but chose a whole new can of worms. How many worm cans have to exist, before there's no hope of things not being implement-fight-change slightly-outdate the outrage-bleed players-draw new ones-blame veterans for being too salty-promise the people that remain the moon-repeat?
  21. Hey DE, let's talk for a minute. In the last 24 months you've done a lot to remove some of the old grind from the system. It's been insanely inconsistent, entirely out of left field, and functionally it's gotten to the point of being silly for those of us who spent literal years dealing with some of it...so that newer players don't have to. That said, it's understandable if your veteran players are bleeding off and you want new players. The lower that barrier to entry is the better....and it'll be three years of daily logins until people start earning 4 weapon slots for logins. That said, let's talk about an insanely uneven game mode that needs a work-over. Namely, the infested salvage. It's a mess right now...but you can fix it with little more than a few item changes, some costing changes, and better rewards. Let's talk this through, but I'll bullet point the fixes in order. 1) Remove the common and uncommon mods from the C rotation rewards. 2) Replace the mods with Scintillant. 3) Remove the mod rewards for the other rounds. 4) Replace the mods with rare Deimos minerals (minerals only, forcing refinement). 5) Remove the Tellurium cost from creating the antiserum injectors. 6) Change the complete fieldrons to just the fieldron samples equivalent. Let's explain these changes by category. 1 and 3 are removing garbage rewards, that upon earning them make me want to just log out. I'm sure that's a universal truth, because by the time you've unlocked all the way to Eris having a maxed stretch mod is pretty much the punchline to a bad joke. 2 and 4 are linking Deimos and Eris as places that the infested can be found. The point here is to give us some way to earn this stuff that isn't the vaults (you did remove these rewards from their pool), or RNG mining. 5 and 6 are making investment into this game mode worth it. What do I mean here? Well, 2 Tellurium and 2 Fieldrons. A rare drop from a single tileset, and an item which either requires further clan research and build time or running inconsistent invasion mission. This is all on top of the build costs....so let's actually do the math here, assuming that you have the research done and all of the resources. Purchase (15,000 credits) blue print. Assemble resources (10 samples, 1 control module, 500 salvage, 250 plastids, 15000 credits). Wait 12 hours. Purchase (15,000 credits) blue print. Assemble resources (10 samples, 1 control module, 500 salvage, 250 plastids, 15000 credits). Wait 12 hours. Purchase (15,000 credits) blue print. Assemble resources (2 Fieldron, 6000 salvage, 500 antiserum injectors, 2 Tellurium, 30000 credits). Wait 24 hours. Oh goody. I have an item that costs 105000 credits, will take a minimum of 48 hours to build, and the benefit is that I can reset my armor on the mission, That is of course, assuming I've already pulled 500 antiserum injectors...an amount that I could earn after running about 8 waves (I got 600-800 in eight waves....but RNG and all). Combine this with the Tellurium and research costs....and I have literally no reason to come back to the current mission after I've managed to grind out a pair of Nidus blue print sets (1 for play, 1 for the helminth). Now, why focus on this? Ironically, if you removed the garbage mods this would be an excellent and rewarding mission. The Neo and Axi relic quantity is high, barring idiocy like endo, the rewards are genuinely good, and the decay of armor actually makes the infested something to be mildly concerned with. This would also give us a niche case to use the infested impedance aura....because there's no real reason anywhere else in the game. Seriously, this would be a great opportunity to fix some broken stuff from the past, and bridge it into some of the newer content, without any effort. I know that this will be disregarded, but had to suggest it. At this point you walked back the nav coordinates that one day one made getting mesa a pain. You walked back the insano price of railjack which was the connective tissue of the game...but only for veterans...but not. You've walked back the Animo beacons. You entirely eliminated the beacons required for Vay Hek. At this point the only two things I can think of that remain are the rathuum points for facing Kela, and the cost of vitus essence to get access to Grendel. That, and the bizarro frustration that is getting the final bit of Harrow from defections.
  22. You managed to make me question my response....until the second sentence. Stop. Think. Understand. Synthesize. The post being quoted says that things suck. The response back falls into one of two categories, and then one of several branches. Lets assume for a moment that you actually read my response and the original...and we come to you being too dense to understand the line of reasoning and logic following through. So....I guess I have my answer. Now, about those other lines of reasoning. Let me fill you in. I disagree (the event rewards can be changed to make it good, I enjoy the gameplay, I enjoy the rewards). I agree (here's how to fix it, I empathize, DE sucks, whatever else DE deems trolly and from entitled players). My response is from the later camp, option one. If you don't engage, DE doesn't get new play time. If they don't, they either have to admit that the game mode is a bust or justify its failures. For this particular game mode round 1 was an utter s*** show of grinding. Round 2 acknowledged that prices were too high. Round 3 has more AI patches to try and prevent people from waiting out a five minute timer...but that's about it. Oh.....never mind. They added a rifle skin....that only applies to projectile shooting rifles. Yeah....that's like getting a shotgun skin that only applies to beam based weapons (and all....0....current Phage players rejoice). I'm happy that you like the game mode. Good for you, play to your heart's content. The discussion was that the economy sucks. I. DO. NOT. CARE. ABOUT. ANYTHING. ELSE. Trying to drag this into a discussion about a game mode is pretty much not understanding a conversation, inserting yourself in, then being angry when people refuse to bend the knee to your diversion. I'd call it bad form, but at this point I just can't be bothered. Sometimes the easiest thing to do with a brick wall is to not try and force it to understand, but simply ignore it. As an aside, let me address an asinine point made by idiots. Let me follow the logic through. You are not forced to breathe. You are not forced to eat. Stop doing both. The repercussion is death. The universe will happily continue chugging along without you. I choose to play a game. I choose to do the dog days event because it includes items that influence other game modes. Nihilism sucks, but every time you suggest an idiotic argument like "nobody is holding a gun to your head" I have to question how little you value yourself. Please stop making this argument. Every single time the level of cringe I react with seems to get worse....because it's a ten year old's argument. It's asking "why" ten times. It shows no desire to truly understand, and only values the nihilism of nothingness. I'd argue further on the topic, but I've already given it too much credence. Here are some other things I don't have to do: Go to work - I have no money Pay taxes - I get acquainted with a jail cell Resurface for a breathe after being submerged - I believe the term asphyxiation is the best use here Bathe - Oh boy....the joke here is I become a convention goer, but the realistic one is to deny any normal human interaction Take vaccinations to diseases - If you look up measles, mumps, rubella, and a variety of horrible things you can see some disturbing crap that was "normal" in the past....yeesh... Nihilism makes you suck. It forces regularly happy people around you to not be. It also leads nowhere, because the central conceit is that nothing matters. Most of us move away from it when we become adults, and it's just "those mopey teens" that are what they are. If you value yourself so little, then maybe seek out some professional help. I don't know who you are, but when nothing matters it's generally a sign that you need some help...and there's no shame in asking for it. -This is not an ad hominem attack. If you genuinely see no value in your time, doing things to make you happy, please seek help. If taking that happiness away is not a problem, then you have one. I've known a few friends who could have used that advice.- Last bit, a fight is not a bad thing. It's two people disagreeing, trying to reconcile that disagreement. Worst case scenario, both parties understand more about the opposite perspective. The absolute worst is that one side adds nothing new to the table, and drags the discussion away from the point. Best case scenario, both parties find either common ground or new reinforcement for their perspective. So we are clear...this is if you have an argument. "My opinion is" is not an argument. It is an inability to articulate an argument. I like Dog Days because it's a unique....ish...game mode and a limited event is an argument. If the economy sucks, don't engage with it so DE is forced to evaluate player participation is an argument. "Some people like it" is not an argument. It's the opposite of some people hate it....which is true about virtually everything.
  23. So...I cannot speak for DE. At the same time, I can speak to what they've said and done. Disruptions are a game mode where you can theoretically stall out the game, and prevent the natural level progression. That is to say, if you simply do not activate the final tower you can have an infinite amount of enemies spawning at a set level range forever. This doesn't seem like a great situation...until you understand that you can farm like mad. Yeah...as long as the enemies you want are spawning, you can kill them at your leisure. This means that you have no difficulty in farming things with fractional percentage drop rates, because you can force spawn rates higher. DE originally found this "bug" and addressed it by installing a time-out on endless missions which could be forced to hang. Of course, they didn't ever plan on sufficiently testing this out....because the problem was solved. Now, introduce the corpus ship tileset's insano RNG structure. That is to say rarely the map can be insanely huge, and the branching paths are so long that without simply rushing there's no way to get the medallions. Thing is...this is a 1 in dozens problem. The perception is that people cheesing the RNG system to get rewards is much more of an issue....and thus we have our current situation. In a sentence; stopping farming cheese means more than truly fixing the systems. For the record I agree with your frustration. That said, I don't see this as ever getting a proper fix, until some other system breaks.
  24. I can't tell if you're trolling, dense, or just want to pick a fight. No matter the solution, you've managed to miss out on the point. The quoted post says that the trade economy sucks and that just getting the alerts done is basically all that is tolerable. My response back is that if the trade rates suck and the game mode is bad don't engage. In the case of the former, we already know that DE can give us a decrease in the cost of things...because they did during round two. The player feedback was that the costs were too high, so they provided a decrease. In the case of the later, a lack of participation has shaped many things for this game. Case in point, when was the last time that our nightwave had any "clear a kuva lich node" dailies? When was the last time that we were required to use navigation beacons that prosecutors dropped to combine them into a locator, so that we could fight Vay Hek on Earth? Yes, that was a thing. When, and I'll stop beating this dead horse after this example, was the cost of mutalist alad V navigation coordinates decreased by 67% (rounded) because new players were having trouble getting enough of them to grind out a bunch of mesa parts? Yes, 3 beacons to 1 is a 66.67% decrease....so for the same six beacons you'd need before (a 33% drop rate with 6 runs means about 91% of people get the drop) you'd only need 6 nav coordinates rather than 18. If it's not apparent, I've also stated my situation as a basis. I hate this game mode....because forcing us to play a game mode for five minute blocks with a reward rate that effectively encourages kill stealing, isn't really a game mode that makes me want to come back. By not spending a single pearl on things that aren't tied to other game modes, I'm stating that this game mode is only viable in so far as it can positively influence other modes. This stands in stark contract to something like Plague Star where I happily continued to grind to earn rewards. It stands in contrast to Scarlet Spear, where I did enough grinding to get the rewards so that I didn't have to go back and grind the Eidolons. This is a game mode where I 100% control what rewards I get, and despite this I don't engage. This is the only way to communicate back to DE....because if we just put up a post it doesn't matter. It hasn't mattered for a long time, and the sooner we can understand that, the sooner we can start doing the right thing to get things fixed.
  25. So don't buy it. I'm not saying this in an elitist manner. I'm saying this as a practical player. This is the second return, or third time, this event went off. The first time was bad. People discovered that performance wasn't rewarded, so they found camping spots to wait out the timers (where the AI broke down). They found the prices utterly nuts. All of this was then in service to a game mode with absolutely no content worth grinding for....because floofs. Round 2 introduced "price reductions" no longer highlighted in round 3. It otherwise was a repeat of the slightly better ending version of round 1. So....just frustrating. Round 3 is charging 300+ pearls for a floof. It's charging 700 pearls for the captura scene. It's got all of the rathuum mod rewards....which most people had given the need to grind Sedna. The only new thing is an ephemera....that's a stripped down version of the tool toy everyone wears for the game mode. The high cost "new" thing is a weapon skin...that literally has been asked for since the beginning. It's 490 pearls....or way to much to bother with for a novelty skin that in-game will be another bizarro meme before too long. I say all of this to highlight my perspective here. I have the content, none of the floofs, and about 200 pearls. I need another 300 to get the rifle skin, then I'm done. I have none of the floofs, and playing this game mode doesn't make me desire them. Do the same. If we don't participate in large numbers DE has to either acknowledge it next year, or actively deny reality. Either way, it'll highlight what DE will put out in the future.
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