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[DE]Rebecca

Daily Tribute Dev Workshop!

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Personally I think the whole idea of the login rewards is kinda lame. No offense but you're locking content behind people logging in for like 3 seconds daily even when they can just as easily log off right after. That's not an "active player".

 

Personally I think coming up with new events or even rehashing old ones and putting these mods and weapons and stuff behind token or score based performance would be soooooo much better than just logins... at least the people who get them would have to be somewhat active.

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Just now, -InV-igo95862 said:

Since you changed the Weapons/Armour to 100, 300, 500... does that mean I won't get the new armor at 1000 days log in if the system comes out before that. I am around 950 days at the moment.

Learn to read. Timing for each category isn't changing.

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1 minute ago, ThingInABox said:

First, It's a login system, not gameplay. You type your account details and click. if had actual do something game-wise to get you have a point. The login reward is a thank you from the devs.

Second, all things in life is about time investment. You right now are investing your time to write forum posts to hopefully gain power to influence the game development the way you want.

If time investment was the only consideration I wouldn't have a problem with it. The issue is that I would need a time machine to go back and start playing the game earlier. If you said, I put 1000 hours in and you should put in the same, I'm on board. But even if I spent all-day, every-day playing Warframe it doesn't count towards log-ins.

The argument against a more progressive system isn't about time investment. For a lot of people, it's about maintaining status.

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My only concern is will there be enough unique milestone rewards after 1000 to not have to pick duplicates or "evergreen" packs of easy to get things all the time?

 

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7 minutes ago, kaotis said:

And as guessed 0 appreciation to the players that spent all the time to get there and just a change to cater to the new players...Instead of making a catch up mechanic like every survival that you reached 60 min you get 1 day or something like that.... nooooo let's just nerf the system coz it requieres 2 much loyalty and apparently it's 2 fcking hard to log in the game. This video summarizes in part my opinion over the mater and how DE basically gets on their knees and kiss the feet of the new players more than the mesiahs

 

During the previous Prime Vault in the winter, DE announced plans to introduce a Prime Accessories Pack in some form. The immediate backlash was that the players that had already bought into the Prime Access to get those accessories - when they didn't necessarily need any of the prime frames or weapons that came with them - were being punished for supporting the developers.

DE responded by saying that the Prime Accessory Packs wouldn't be available for that Prime Vault rotation, and that the players that bought those packs - either the original prime access or the Prime Vault packs that were frames, weapons, and accessories all bundled together - had access to those items considerably before anyone that would be getting those cosmetics from future Vault Accessory Packs.

The accessory pack was a feature that had been requested every time the prime vault made an appearance, and when DE listened and announced they were intending to introduce them with the new Prime Vault this summer, there was an immediate backlash from players that thought that others were getting an "easier route" to the content they paid for.

The earlier access to the weapons and prime mods in the current system is a reward for veterans that have been playing this game since the Daily Tribute system was introduced. I am one of those players; I am approaching 950 daily logins. I got to experience the Zenith and the Zenistar on launch before some content creators had time to create videos for them. All of the other systems in Warframe - syndicates, resources, clan research, event weapons, endgame content - are iterative, and tend in the direction of favoring agency on the part of the player and gratifying rewards for participating in the content that DE provides. Why, then, would we expect the Daily Tribute system - which is itself a second iteration upon the daily login rewards - to remain in stasis when the improvements suggested in this workshop improve player agency and a sense of gratification?

In addition, if logging in everyday isn't hard - and I would argue that is the case - then why should we expect *reverence* from DE and the community for doing so? We are not "messiahs" because we have been playing the game longer than other players. We are veterans. We had access to all of the content in the game before these players did, and we have had the privilege - and the detriment - of experiencing these systems as they iterate. That's what we signed up for.

In this workshop, they have delineated a system where we would be getting rewards that were multiple times better than new players for the non-milestone rewards. DE clearly has laid forth a framework where players that have been around a while experience residuals for logging in everyday and supporting Warframe and its community. Don't you think it's more productive to ask for those numbers to be tweaked in our favor than it is to belittle DE for daring to iterate to make the new player experience better?

We don't deserve to be placed on pedestals for being around longer than other players, and it is absurd to me to suggest just because my experience to get access to some content was hard that someone else should have to struggle just as much. Imagine if DE adopted that mindset with the Plains of Eidolon! Everyone that grinded through bounties as they were released would be entitled to ensure that bounties never improved because "they had to grind it the hard way, so everyone else should too". As someone that has done many bounties - from launch until today - I'm glad they're in the state they are now instead of where they were last October.

Your position is antagonistic not only to new players but to the community as a whole because you seem to care more about your status as a player above others than whether or not Warframe's systems improve over time. I invite you to reconsider.

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3 minutes ago, Lakais said:

That part about the repeats is true, as far as I know. But in the dev workshop thread, Reb cleared up that basically none of the reward items will be tradeable. I sort of get why they chose this, more incentive to log on I guess. But yeah, I based what i said off of what was said in the devstream, I hadn't checked the Dev Workshop. 

Aw, well my butt-hurt-ery continues and now I must turn up the salt. The rest of the message goes out to the general public.

You got a test in class two weeks from now.

You study your pa-tooty off.

Two weeks have passed and you're now about to take the test.

As the teacher is passing out the test in class, enters Student X.

Student X argues "There was too much material to cover and I wanted to hang out with my homies, please just give me an A"

The teacher gives Student X an A on the test even though Student X didn't even take it.

How do you feel about that?

Those that are for this change: Your best and only argument is that the weapons and mods shouldn't be locked behind such a long time. Any other argument is just pure nonsense. Many of us just kept playing even though we knew it would take 400 days to get Primed Vigor. The best mod Primed Fury is at day 200, what is all the fuss about mates? Can't really use Primed Shred on the best weapons because it causes them to shoot so fast that you run out of ammo and spend most of your time reloading the weapon. I say "man/woman" up and meet the challenge. Why should you be rewarded if you're only going to play Warframe until the next D2 update anyways? That's like me showing up at MIT, demanding a Ph.D in Mathematics be handed to me, getting it and then immediately running off to Harvard. Meanwhile I'm telling the MIT math majors that actually bothered to study that they are elitist, entitled snobs.

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This is really disappointing.  I've played Warframe on and off for five years and have spent 1765 hours in-game, I'm MR 25 and the only things I haven't mastered are the Plague Keewar (Hok please), Vauban Prime (WIP), and the daily tribute weapons.

I'm at like...I don't know, 140-something logins, I think.  I played a lot before the game started tracking logins, and now that daily tributes are all that's keeping me from having max non-Founder mastery, I was really excited to hear you were reworking the system.

But it looks like the only things you're changing are favoring daily logins over MR with the endo (it's negligible endo anyway, but I still sighed when I read it), and making it so that people can pick what reward they get when they reach a milestone.  That's...better, but it's a little like trying to put a fire out by spitting on it.  Why bother?

I'd gently argue that mindless daily logins aren't the best indicator of how much a player values the game, but here we are. 

Edited by ShaSeng
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I am glad you have rethought the rewards but here are my 2credits (or 2mil, depending);

I would be glad if weapons and primed mods came about a bit more often. It still seems to be 200 days between each weapon/primed mod -which is quite a while. Sure, for people like me, it's no biggie as we already have everything that's come out, but it still promotes elitism and people that login, get the daily, log out. No, I'm NOT saying you should turn login rewards to having to do 1-2-3-120 missions to get it. Just saying; make weapons/mods that come from loging come either more often or be possible to get through alternative means. Playing for 200 days to get a cosmetic and then another 200 days to get the second part to that cosmetic (i.e. Lodestar Syandana and Lodestar Armor set) brings the total to 400 days, MORE THAN A YEAR.Most people would either burn out or just quit. Bring them in more often, please.

Also; if those rewards don't include Primed Chamber, I'm going to be REALLY angry. It's high time this mod became available to everyone!

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  • Old system, final login reward weapon on day 700
  • New proposed system, final login reward weapon on day 700

Doesn't this sound wrong?

I propose this: Every milestone (50 days, currently) let players pick whatever they want from the reward table just like Syndicates. Simple, no fuss. It gives players control on what to prioritize - do they just want evergreen packs? Cool, they can. Do they want sigils? Cool, they can. Do they want weapons? Cool, they can.

I like MR. It's what I chose to focus on. I'm MR25 and maxed out on everything accessible to me well before day 300. For me, neither the current or the proposed system is an incentive to log in for over a year to finish that out, it's a problem! But if players could just choose every milestone, they're in control, they get to make real choices, and they get real rewards. Much more carrot, much less stick.

Time-gate cosmetics to "must have logged in at least x days to pick this" if you want, but primed mods and weapons should be accessible every milestone imo.

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OMG De, just dont. You can include ALL this scalin system the customization and everything good you have in mind, BUT DO NOT CHANGE THE MILESTONES. No one asked for this, this is screwin up ppl. Just don't. You guys are really nice, but this seems just like you were bored and decided to change something that did not needed change at all.

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1 minute ago, (PS4)FurryZenJustice said:

If time investment was the only consideration I wouldn't have a problem with it. The issue is that I would need a time machine to go back and start playing the game earlier. If you said, I put 1000 hours in and you should put in the same, I'm on board. But even if I spent all-day, every-day playing Warframe it doesn't count towards log-ins.

The argument against a more progressive system isn't about time investment. For a lot of people, it's about maintaining status.

It's not status. It's not like the majority of people are gaming it and only logging and logging out. Most of those people are playing when they sign in. Those rewards mean something. They earned them. All you are saying is that you are too lazy or disinterested to work for it. And that's fine. Play the game as much or as little as you want. But you are not entitled to get everything if you don't do the work for it. You are guaranteed very few things in this game, most it take time farming to get. Kinda like the login reward system.

What they really need to do is make the days in between more meaningful. Those rewards are nothing except the boosters, and those almost always guaranteed game play as you don't want to waste them. if they made more of those everyday rewards like somehow, i bet a lot of people wouldn't mind the wait so much

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I also agree with a 30 day period instead of a 50 day one. it just fits a calendar better. or at least have some nice special things every 10 days, maybe a random 24 hour booster every 10 days?

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FFXIV just recently gutted their "Veteran Rewards" system to only have a few cosmetics that require a year to get all of them and moved the rest of the stuff to a new system where you exchange a special currency obtained by earning in game achievements for them. Perhaps the mods/weapons and maybe even some other "evergreen" things could be the same way here?

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3 minutes ago, ThingInABox said:

It's not status. It's not like the majority of people are gaming it and only logging and logging out. Most of those people are playing when they sign in. Those rewards mean something. They earned them. All you are saying is that you are too lazy or disinterested to work for it. And that's fine. Play the game as much or as little as you want. But you are not entitled to get everything if you don't do the work for it. You are guaranteed very few things in this game, most it take time farming to get. Kinda like the login reward system.

What they really need to do is make the days in between more meaningful. Those rewards are nothing except the boosters, and those almost always guaranteed game play as you don't want to waste them. if they made more of those everyday rewards like somehow, i bet a lot of people wouldn't mind the wait so much

If the people are playing when they sign in, then the system isn't that meaningful. I'm MR 24, 600+ hours in. It's probably more, but I haven't checked in awhile. I've played the game for almost a year exclusively. But even if I made the game my entire life, the amount of time it's going to take to collect the meaningful log-in rewards remains the same. That's my problem.

I'm fine with a put X hours in, get X hours out. But this isn't an argument for doing the work, this is an argument for having been there at the right time.

And by-the-by, I could literally go through the login process an extra 1000 times to put in the same "work" and it wouldn't count. There is no argument here for "putting in the work".

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I do not like the endo reward scaling. Getting a few hundred endo for someone who played over a year or two does not seem very rewarding. By day 1000, we'd have a way to farm endo and the amount would be basically chump change. If that's the intention, by all means, but the endo rewards should eventually equate to the amount of a completed Ayatan Sculpture at least in my opinion. Even if the endo equates to the lowest rewarding Ayatan sculpture, it's more than getting a few hundred endo that won't have use for a player who is several hundred days of logging in.

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The things i wish to see for milestones :

  • allow us to bought schemas (in the market) of the weapon if we unlock it, for allow us to bought more (ex : for have 5 of the same weaps for have a lens of different Focus Schools for have the same weap but with a different Lens, or for have more than 3 builds).
  • allow us to change rank of a mod as we wants if we reach the rank (ex : for a 10 ranks mod, if we reach the rank 10 of this mod, we can put it on a build at rank 10 or less. If we reach rank 5, we can put it on a build at rank 5 or less, but not at rank 6 or more until we reached the rank. This change can help us to put Legendary mods at the rank we wants (really useful for Umbra/Sacrificials/Daily Tributes Mods we only have ones, and for have only one Mod of each))

Thanks for reading me 😉

Edited by (PS4)Crazy_Mr_J
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I can't seem to see any benefit or actual change whatsoever with the proposed changes, at least not with my current log-in count. Still need to wait the same number of days to unlock what I had the most interest in, or all the gameplay stuff.

Also just funny to think of all the people that will stop logging in until the change is implemented because they are close to an undesirable milestone...

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1 hour ago, f3llyn said:

Beta player here. Couldn't care less that other people can get those weapons. In fact I'm happy for them, if that's actually true. I haven't looked into it since my return to the game a few weeks ago.

Also, I absolutely love when people pretend to be offended on behalf of others.

I don't. It's so patronizing. So stop doing that.

Aside from that you listed one specific thing out of dozens and maybe hundreds of things DE has changed or added to the game in the last year. I hardly call that catering to new players.

Did you read that I said I don't care if they're giving away beta and other items? That they're taking away my "toys". I just want them to acknowledge the dedication of old players. They could make alerts for any item that hasn't come back yet, and I wouldn't really care. Just acknowledge the dedication of your older players, even if it's just something tiny and almost insignificant.

Edited by PoisonHD

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30 minutes ago, (PS4)supernova_girlie said:

You got a test in class two weeks from now.

You study your pa-tooty off.

Two weeks have passed and you're now about to take the test.

As the teacher is passing out the test in class, enters Student X.

Student X argues "There was too much material to cover and I wanted to hang out with my homies, please just give me an A"

The teacher gives Student X an A on the test even though Student X didn't even take it.

How do you feel about that?

I mark an F on your post and scribble in small text "see me after class" for this abhorrent excuse of a comparison. When the test is literally 'use your keyboard for 5 minutes each day' to claim a free reward that requires no additional effort I don't think the teacher cares if you've managed to do it for 50 days or 500 days. The task you've been given is inane and minimal effort, and if your ability to do it more than others is the only thing defining you from those that come after you then the teacher would be thoroughly disappointed at how much you've wasted the bastion of opportunity the school represents.

34 minutes ago, (PS4)supernova_girlie said:

Those that are for this change: Your best and only argument is that the weapons and mods shouldn't be locked behind such a long time. Any other argument is just pure nonsense. Many of us just kept playing even though we knew it would take 400 days to get Primed Vigor. The best mod Primed Fury is at day 200, what is all the fuss about mates? Can't really use Primed Shred on the best weapons because it causes them to shoot so fast that you run out of ammo and spend most of your time reloading the weapon. I say "man/woman" up and meet the challenge. Why should you be rewarded if you're only going to play Warframe until the next D2 update anyways? That's like me showing up at MIT, demanding a Ph.D in Mathematics be handed to me, getting it and then immediately running off to Harvard. Meanwhile I'm telling the MIT math majors that actually bothered to study that they are elitist, entitled snobs.

The fact that you upped the ante by going from test to Ph.D. and claiming that someone who logged in for 800 days in a video game is equivalent to someone who went through the spectacularly brutal effort required to specialize yourself in a specific field to the point that you can have the title "Doctor" before your name is more insulting than calling them elitist snobs would've been. Push off with this garbage.

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2 hours ago, [DE]Taylor said:

Quoting for visibility! Sorry for the TNT there, Tenno!

Alright, I'm sold now. Thanks for fixing it.

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A Reminder:

On every game out there. Login Rewards are invitations, not prizes on their own. It's meant to encourage players to come back often for the occasional rewards and check the game, see what's going on. Maybe you caught that alternate helmet for one of your favorite frames on the alert? Maybe there is a Catalyst invasion up, maybe you are really not into playng that particular momment, but you still checked in.

Let me point this out: it HAS to be encouraging, instead of shoving an almost 2 year long run of logins, that's NOT encouraging, it's in fact discouraging.

It's NOT about your prestige, it's not about keeping people from getting the Sigma & Octantis that you just got. The prestige excuse does in fact the opposite purpose of what login rewards exist for.

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