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[DE]Rebecca

Daily Tribute Dev Workshop!

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I'm assuming the syandana and armor are fixed at 800 and 1000 days and will be excluded from the choice-every-milestone system? Since they're purely cosmetic and would satiate the vets with their exclusive thingies.

Edited by Chronozilla
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vor 2 Minuten schrieb rune_me:

There is however no "working for it" with the login rewards. No effort is required to type in your password. Thinking that that is work, and that by logging into an account you deserve a special price (because yay, you remembered your password) IS the very definition of "generation entitlement". Oh look, I was there, now give me a trophy.

It's about persistence. Nothing in this game you really have to work for. You just need to be persistent enough to farm the same boss 15 times to get that last BP or run 20 relics to get the rare. In Warframe being persistent is bascially the work you put in. See it as you will but the argument just because something seems overwhelmingly easy for you it can't be worth a reward doesn't make too much sense when the narrative that drives the login rewards is the same for the entire game.

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1 hour ago, (PS4)GamerGodLink said:

Learn to read. Timing for each category isn't changing.

gFBQeDR.png

100, 300, 500... Each step is 200

500 + 200 = 700

700 + 200 = 900

900 + 200 = 1100

Weapons and armor is now at 900 and 1100. The new armor was at 1000

Edited by -InV-igo95862

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4 minutes ago, GA-Bulletproof said:

It's about persistence. Nothing in this game you really have to work for. You just need to be persistent enough to farm the same boss 15 times to get that last BP or run 20 relics to get the rare. In Warframe being persistent is bascially the work you put in. See it as you will but the argument just because something seems overwhelmingly easy for you it can't be worth a reward doesn't make too much sense when the narrative that drives the login rewards is the same for the entire game.

Which is why I will never support a login system in any form. Rewards should be given for things you do in the game, not just for logging in. Like I said, a login system is just a "participation trophy". You don't even need to be persistent. I could just login and then immediately log out again. I could be MR 1 and have done nothing in the game but still have 600 days of logging in. Which is also why I don't think X number of days should be more rewarding than 1 day, or 10 days. 

Edited by rune_me

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Sounds lovely, the only concern I have in regards to the new system is that you (DE) make it clearly visible if a player already has a certain item or make it impossible to pick a dublicate of things like sigils, weapons or primed mods, so you don't end up making a boo boo and accidentally picking a double.

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I think the current plan is fine as it gives players choice. Digital Extremes promised player choice, not faster login rewards. I believe the only additional changes that should be made are more rewards for players approaching 1000 days. Hopefully this is addressed when they said "evergreen rewards".

Edited by Voltage

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Scaling 'day to day' based off of our MR.. could you maybe remove some of the rubbish rewards like gallium that a higher MR isn't going to need and give us things we actually need like kuva.  I have ZERO need for most of the current reward resources, weapon/frame blueprints etc outside endo and forma that drops from logins.  Also to be perfectly honest, (I'm at over 800 days and MR25) 250 endo is kind of nothing when you consider we're the players going after maxing mod levels mods that cost up to 40,000 endo and 2mil credits

 

Things like rivens mods, imo, shouldn't be in the early stages either, considering that most rivens have a higher MR requirement they're kind of a pointless reward for the lower days, not to mention it could completely skew a new players experience. 

 

Adding forma as a reward is nice idea but maybe they could have an increased drop rate on the normal daily rewards depending on your MR, they're already in the drop table but really rare in my experience, instead of being a '50 day reward'.  If I need to wait '50 days' to pick one I'll have basically built 50 in that time by doing them daily in the foundry.

Also why no large quantity of Kuva, I'm not on about 6k like for sortie, I'm on about a really good lump of kuva like 30k or even a bit higher. 

 

Can we at least keep some sort milestones as milestones to show we've put the time into getting them.....even if it's just things like the syandana and armor.  Before people say it I'm at around 820ish days so I'm still 180 days from the armor using the current system.  I'm personally fine waiting that time, even though there's a completely pointless booster, reactor (I'm swimming in them at mr25) and sigil at 950 days and a primed mod I'm never likely to use at 900 days. 

 

Also a little side note based on what's written here, the irony in this rework is that the milestone changes don't actually give any options to those in the 800+ day range other than giving us a choice of bundle on the 850 and 950 day intervals, at 900 we'll pick the only primed mod left for us to pick and at 1000 days we'll pick the armor, they're the only options we have...  So could you maybe expand a little on what you intend to do after 800 days where things aren't quite as 'clear cut' as when it comes to the order of items.  I'm assuming they'll be sticking to the existing days too as if we go by the changes mentioned it could actually take longer to get some items.

 

7 hours ago, [DE]Rebecca said:



 

Under some amount of debate is also Milestone rewards such as Primed Mods and Weapons, being tradable. At this time, we are removing this from the plan.

Good, they should not be tradable, it's bad enough things are being changed so people can get things that some of us have spent 700 days working to get in far less time but to allow them to be traded is just plain wrong and to put it bluntly (imo) insulting to those of us that have spent the time getting them prior to this intended change.  IMO you should also only be able to get the items once too.

 

Also as others have said, hopefully our current time investment isn't going to be reset. 

Edited by LSG501
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1 hour ago, Duduminador said:

A Reminder:

On every game out there. Login Rewards are invitations, not prizes on their own. It's meant to encourage players to come back often for the occasional rewards and check the game, see what's going on. Maybe you caught that alternate helmet for one of your favorite frames on the alert? Maybe there is a Catalyst invasion up, maybe you are really not into playng that particular momment, but you still checked in.

Let me point this out: it HAS to be encouraging, instead of shoving an almost 2 year long run of logins, that's NOT encouraging, it's in fact discouraging.

It's NOT about your prestige, it's not about keeping people from getting the Sigma & Octantis that you just got. The prestige excuse does in fact the opposite purpose of what login rewards exist for.

Agreed. Well said.

Basic Skinner behavior modification at play with log in rewards. But there is a sweet spot for how long you leave people to wait for that positive reinforcement. 2 years is too long. I get some people have done all of them. But DE what percentage of the population do they represent? 5%? And is that really the best way of getting folks to log in?

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So, with the original iteration of this Dev Workshop, people who were approaching the 300-day milestone were upset that their Zenistar access was being pushed to 400 days. Now that the Dev Workshop has been edited, there are people upset that the new armor set seems to have been pushed from 1000 days to 1100 days.

In addition, there are people that have suggested that they would prefer all milestone content be available at every *50 day milestone.

I suggest a compromise: All *50 day milestones remain as they were in the original version of this Dev Workshop. The *00 day milestones would then allow players to select from *all* daily tribute primed mods, weapons and cosmetics (syandanas, armor sets, etc.). This ensures that everyone is still acquiring items at relatively the same rate - which I think is the primary concern with regards to letting every *50 day milestone allow every item, that everyone would opt for the cosmetics and boosters last.

And it gives players more agency to decide whether they would like to prioritize their mod collections, mastery, or cosmetics. I think this resolves a few of the issues currently being faced with the 200 day rotations at the same time as preserving most of the original intent of this Dev Workshop.

Thanks again for all the hard work!

Edited by Xavier

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Everyone seems to be royally pissed at the upcoming implementation of the Login Reward system. Veterans for particular reasons and others because they are waiting for those weapon rewards.

Here's how i think DE should implement the system based off what I've heard.

Rather than cleaning the state at 0 to 200 and making tenno wait more days than they should..You should begin the process so everyone gets something for their efforts thus far.

Day 1 Implementation

IF LoginDays <= 50, Give the player selection to a cache

IF LoginDays >= 100, Allow the player to select any weapon or accessory

This will clear up all the anguish and your new system can run its course without the disdain of the community.

Love you DE!

-Daystroyerkun

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These changes are nice, and will mark a mild improvement to the current login reward system.   It is also highly appreciated that feedback has already been taken into account and changes are still being made.  That's very important, because this current draft of the login reward rework does not include a means of "catch-up", which is the MOST CRUCIAL issue for the login reward system. As it currently stands, either veteran players who have missed login days cumulatively over the course of years, or new players who are starting out about three years behind, can NEVER catch up with the current login counter.  This is the most fundamental issue with the system as it stands.  Even if players can choose individual items at intervals, they can never catch up, and each day missed irrevocably widens the gap.

Can I propose a solution?  As an example, Black Desert Online, a Korean MMO with a daily login reward system, counts logins on the weekend as two days.  I believe it starts at Friday at 5 PM PST, through Sunday at 5 PM PST.  That means logging in for 7 consecutive days actually counts as 10 days.  So a new player could reach their first 50-day milestone in 5 weeks, rather than 6.  A very diligent new player could reach the 1000-day milestone in exactly 100 weeks, which is still just a month shy of two whole years of consistently logging in every single day, but it is markedly better than the 143 weeks it would have taken them otherwise.  In the meantime, they've caught up in the system by 10 whole monthsTHAT'S how you reward dedication.

That also means weekend logins include two rewards instead of one, further incentivising logging in and playing on weekends to scoop up additional rewards.  While there may be some concern of a "weekend warrior syndrome", as in player traffic dipping on week days and spiking in favor of weekends, I believe it would have an overall positive effect on play time and player retention. As for the players already caught up with the system?  Once caught up, they're "on track" with current daily login reward milestones.  They still get two random rewards on weekends, but their login days count as only one for the purpose of reaching milestones.  They're on track, and more players over time, rather than fewer, will join them.

I strongly believe that an improvement like the one I propose, combined with the ones already set forward in this Dev Workshop, will make daily login rewards more substantial for players, make milestones feel less insurmountable, and thus incentivise more consistent player activity, and greater retention.  I hope you consider this feedback moving forward.

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Give all weapons and mods to Baro, all cosmetics to the market...

 

Only allowed for login reward system are potatoes, rivens, endo and so on...maybe with a little scale (but let be honest...the crying will start a few weeks later).

 

 

 

Edited by Xolpan

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4 hours ago, Xavier said:

I didn't notice until you pointed it out, but it appears they switched the mod and equipment milestones. Previously, the [100, 300, 500, ...] set was the weapons and the [200, 400, 600, ...] set was the primed mods. I feel like this should be consistent with the current system.

That still puts us at 1100 days for all of the "equipment" and 800 days for all of the mods. It's not great.

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1 minute ago, TGDM said:

That still puts us at 1100 days for all of the "equipment" and 800 days for all of the mods. It's not great.

Right, but the original announcement on Devstream #100 specified that players would get more agency in terms of how they progressed through the login system, not that it would be a shorter amount of time to acquire all of the content. I don't think that this change prevents DE from making further changes in the future to accommodate some "catchup" mechanic (albeit it might take a while).

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7 hours ago, ArtiSylv said:

Still not entirely keen on the idea of weapons and primed mods with unique mechanics being locked behind hundreds of days. This doesn't feel like enough of an improvement, considering it'll still take literally over two years to get all of them assuming you're consistent with logging in

Good thing there are 500 other weapons to choose from with unique mechanics of their own.

Even better none of these are necessary to do anything. A one year commitment is nothing for an mmo, you must be new to the genre.

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vor 9 Minuten schrieb Xolpan:

Give all weapons and mods to Baro, all cosmetics to the market..

 

 

Ohh no, than you have to wait for Baro...and maybe the weapon or mod of your choice is not offered...ohhh no

OK, lets make Baro permanent...than you can buy everytime everything you want...

...

...

...

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im few days to 700 days weapon i hope this doesnt f*up this for me when im close to it

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Still believe an easier way to fix this without being anti-fun by blocking weapons and mods from players who can't log-in on daily basis or just joined is:
 

1. Sigils and Resources every 50 days. 50, 100, 150, etc. Sigils could be like the ones talked about in the recent streams, they shine brighter every tier. Forma and Orokin Reactor. All existing packs will be an option for these intervals.
Includes evergreen packs like 3 x Riven Mod and we are considering adding 3 x Forma.

2. Primed Armour Parts and Primed Syandana every 100 days. 100, 200, 300 etc.

3. Ship Cosmetics, Captura Cosmetics every 200 days. Days 200, 400, 600, etc. Specially with the up coming Railjack ship.

 

The weapons from milestone could even be added to the drop pool of the new Lvl80+ Alerts talked in the new stream.

PS: Being able to log every day doesn't equate to being a veteran, there's people who just log in and out every day without playing.

Edited by Brufh

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I am at ~150 days logged in and this crushed my soul. I literally only login to get the Zenistar as of two weeks ago (I play different games a lot). It changes NOTHING for players between 101-200 days logged in. This is a large portion of players. These players are those that are deicated and are likely to become long time players of the game. Now they have to wait 100-200 days to get the Zenistar, one of the most unique, fun, powerful, and well-designed weapons added to Warframe. Instead of making players less angry of these changes, you made even more players angry. You still have the salty veterans that are angry because noobs have to put in less time for a Zenistar. You now have players that are past 100 days that are angry because the have to wait another 200 days to get the Zenistar or any weapon. The players who have gotten 101 to 2XX days should get a weapon choice or at least an option to trade the Azima for one of the weapons.

IN DE I TRUST, except for melee 3.0

.64a42fec3-1.jpg

Edited by WendysBaconator
Clarification
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1 hour ago, (PS4)Daystroyerkun said:

Everyone seems to be royally pissed at the upcoming implementation of the Login Reward system. Veterans for particular reasons and others because they are waiting for those weapon rewards.

Here's how i think DE should implement the system based off what I've heard.

Rather than cleaning the state at 0 to 200 and making tenno wait more days than they should..You should begin the process so everyone gets something for their efforts thus far.

Day 1 Implementation

IF LoginDays <= 50, Give the player selection to a cache

IF LoginDays >= 100, Allow the player to select any weapon or accessory

This will clear up all the anguish and your new system can run its course without the disdain of the community.

Love you DE!

-Daystroyerkun

YES

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7 hours ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

EDIT - 2:31 PM EST
After reading your feedback, we are switching the tracks for Primed Mods and Weapons/Equipment to respect current milestones. The main post has been edited to reflect this change, here's the list of updated tracks for posterity:


1. Sigils and Resources. Days 50, 150, 250, etc.

2. Weapons and Equipment. Days 100, 300, 500, etc. 

3. Primed Mods. Days 200, 400, 600, etc.

 This plan is nice but i still prefer weapons and equipment are locked every 50 days but with this kinda of setup:
 

Sigils and resources, weapons, equipments and primed mods are obtainable every 50 days but:
Sigils and Resources are unlocked at Day 50

Weapons and Equipment are unlocked at Day 100

Primed Mods are unlocked at Day 200

This encourages more newbie players to login everyday for the weapons with minimal effort via number of logins, but gives a potential of not logging in back because of remaining "unnecessary" login reward. But at least it gives a more diverse choice of what does a player really want for login rewards.

I'm around 780+ day login now and if I got lodestar syandana at Day 800, maybe it'll be nice if I'll get the lodestar armor set at day 850, just saying.

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Hi DE! This reward system is not giving more then choosable rewards with no progression help. For example: In my case I reached 300 days a couple days ago that means I got the Zenistar and i really want to get the zenith (500 day) and the sigma & octantis (700 day) so if you planning to add this the only change you give is to choose which one I want first the zenith or the sigma & octantis and i still have to wait the same ~400 days to get both guns which is more then 1 year... Any way in my opinion lower the milestone from 50 to 25 day or even 30 would help and I know there are players who logged in through almost 1000 days and they definitely deserve something that represent what they are been through.I hope you guys come up with better system for this and keep up the good work.  🙂

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