[PC Update 23.5] Revenant Feedback Megathread

[EinheriarJudith]

1 hour ago, MarrikBroom said:

I frankly don't get this mentalty. I hate when people going 'oh nerf this'

 

Joey here says it well. People going 'but x exists' is effectivly calling for other frames being nerfed and that ends up with 'nobody has nice things.'

dance macabre is an amazing skill and guess what? it doesnt map wipe. not like spore or maim. nerfing map wipe this something not only DE wants but what other players want as well. its ok to have high damage AOE skills but it is not ok to wipe the map with the press of a button.

[Nightchade2000]

That your thread is about to be merged with the megathread for feedback, pinned directly above this one at the time of my post.

[Darkvramp]

this is good

 

[atejas]

4 hours ago, rapt0rman said:

The damage type depends on what it hits, so I'd guess it would be all over the place with shields, armor, and infested flesh everywhere.

Yeah, I've gotten corrosive and magnetic in the same sweep. If an armoured target is shielded by a drone it'll also prioritise magnetic first so it seems to be based on the health type that it comes in contact with rather than a faction-by-faction basis.

[LSG501]

Honestly after levelling him once, he kind of feels like a one trick pony, and the only reason I'm adding forma is because his 4 seems to be fairly useful and well I've got nothing else to do.  I'll likely update this when I've finished adding the forma.

 

Passive : in all honesty I never noticed it doing anything and I know my shields got wiped out a fair few times while levelling.  Maybe it's lacking in range but something needs tweaking. 

 

1 - enthrall : I have no real easy way to see how many I've affected, a counter like nidus would be handy imo to go with the buff icon which can easily be lost when there are all the other buff icons up there. 

Had several occasions where I couldn't cast but didn't have any thralls either. 

Targetting could be improved, it was hit and miss for me on many occasions, often it was being blocked by things like metal hand rails and it felt like it either has a really short range and/or a tiny target area, maybe a wider 'target zone' could help

Visibility of thralls was pretty bad, especially a busy  too and, in my experience at least, they were dead before they'd 'infected' another enemy or the enemies they'd infected had died almost instantly.  

In essence it kind of feels like a pointless ability due to the speed enthralled enemies can die at.

 

2 - Mesmer Skin : Apart from a cloud I couldn't really tell this was active.  Didn't feel it really did much to those shooting at me which was the majority but then it could have just been that I didn't see them because again the visibility of affected enemies was pretty poor.  The amount of stacks needs to be a lot higher imo too, it's a fairly expensive ability for what it offers and at high levels those stacks won't last long. 

We should be able to cast while moving, you went back and fixed frames like loki (there are still others that could do with being changed, including nova and gara) so they weren't interrupted when triggering 'lower level' abilities yet you release revenant where it has a jarring stop every time you use abilities.  

I'd also like either the ability to recast while active or 'refresh it' similar to how gara can refresh splinter storm using mass vitrify, imo reave could be used for this.

 

3 - Reave : does what it's supposed to do but the graphics used are REALLY bad, it literally looks like a flat plane moving in front of Revenant with a moving texture applied to it, you can even make out where the edge of the plane is. 

Casting time is far too long though, it shouldn't have that 'animation' before turning into a cloud, it should be straight into cloud smoothly.  Think running along, press 3 and you fade into the cloud, when your duration is up you fade back into running. 

It's also far too expensive for what it does, maybe this could be used to refresh mesmer skin (although it still needs more charges) but would need a cost change to allow us to use it more often (maybe swap ability 2 and 3 costs if 3 can refresh 2).

 

4 - Danse Macabre : This seems to be the one thing that most people will say works pretty well and in fact it does but it does make it feel like revenant is a one trick pony because this is basically all we'll build for. 

Would be nice if we could get some 'vertical' movement (using jump button), even if it's just enough to get up a 'step' in the floor, and some additional 'vertical spread' with the beams, this just seems a little low imo. 

The bad thing with DM is that it's really bad for your eyes visually, which is kind of fitting because plenty of us complain about this issue with the eidolon effects.

A funny thing with DM is that it feels like I'm actually moving around the map faster when it's active than when I'm just running around so could we maybe get a buff on Revenants sprint speed, I don't want DM slowing down. 

Also, should this ability show our weapon when it's spinning around, I could see my phantasma while I was spinning round.

Can you make it so DM breaks containers etc, currently it just ignores them.

 

General: Activation/deactivation times on some abilities is a little too high.

I think Pyra syandana might not be aligning right, seems like the bottom part is too far away from frame.

 

A little request, could we get a syandana, ideally designed for Revenant, that uses the new energy texture/particles being used on Revenant, pyra and pyra prime textures move too fast and don't look right imo.   

 

Edited August 26, 2018 by LSG501

[atejas]

2 minutes ago, MarrikBroom said:

This is exactly why I hope DE doesn't nerf it instead of what i fear which is 'see simulacrum videos of high level impossible to see in real settings groups getting mowed down' and then goning 'oh S#&$ we have to nerf this... oh and incomming saryn and equinox nerfs too... even though both of those are only really 'broken' in ESO and even then I'd consider that their one best niche use and place to shine.

His dps is limited by LoS and angle, which are both huge limitations. He's much closer to Mesa, who hasn't been nerfed in years, than he is to, say, Saryn or Equinox

[atejas]

2 minutes ago, MarrikBroom said:

This is exactly why I hope DE doesn't nerf it instead of what i fear which is 'see simulacrum videos of high level impossible to see in real settings groups getting mowed down' and then goning 'oh S#&$ we have to nerf this... oh and incomming saryn and equinox nerfs too... even though both of those are only really 'broken' in ESO and even then I'd consider that their one best niche use and place to shine.

His dps is limited by LoS and angle, which are both huge limitations. He's much closer to Mesa, who hasn't been nerfed in years, than he is to, say, Saryn or Equinox

[peterc3]

This is wildly out of line with other passives. If they wanted this, they'd have just given him all HP, no Shields.

[LightningsVengance]

So this is probably gonna get merged into the feedback thread... So I'll type in now. inb4 "I want his old, innate life steal proportionate to energy" passive and inb4 merge.

[Mk.1]

7 minutes ago, peterc3 said:

This is wildly out of line with other passives.

Inaros, Nidus and Chroma also have passives that are wildly out of line. If it fits well with the theme, is there really a problem?

9 minutes ago, peterc3 said:

If they wanted this, they'd have just given him all HP, no Shields.

If they did that, he would no-longer fit the theme of an Eidolon.

40 minutes ago, Nightchade2000 said:

That your thread is about to be merged with the megathread for feedback

6 minutes ago, LightningsVengance said:

So this is probably gonna get merged into the feedback thread

I started this post off the main forum page, didn't know there was a megathread. Oops i guess. 

7 minutes ago, LightningsVengance said:

inb4 "I want his old, innate life steal proportionate to energy" passive

Didn't know that was a thing.

 

[antiqwiz]

Dance macabre : Would be nice to change the angle of lasers by jump/crouch keys >>> limbo + revenant = ultimate defense tower (+ vauban balls ) ultimate tesla defense tower!!!

[LightningsVengance]

1 minute ago, Mk_1 said:

Didn't know that was a thing.

It was in one of the Devstreams... But those days are gone from us now.

[Madway7]

I suggested reduced damage to shields before, but idk now. Even with your suggestion it runs counter to his best playstyle of keeping your 2 up as much as possible.

His current passive can be baked into his 2. 

I kind of want something to do with the magnetic waves. I just really want to see the frame do that eidolon cry and release the waves.

Maybe he has "undying" but it does that effect and its limited to once every 150 seconds? (I wanted to link it to the thrall mechanic but that mechanic is just bad imo)

[ujimax]

21 minutes ago, LSG501 said:

Would be nice if we could get some 'vertical' movement (using jump button), even if it's just enough to get up a 'step' in the floor, and some additional 'vertical spread' with the beams, this just seems a little low imo. 

I agree,

also, his base energy is fairly weak and base casting speed is really slow... maybe a boost to the range of his 4 wouldn't hurt either.

[Madway7]

6 minutes ago, LightningsVengance said:

It was in one of the Devstreams... But those days are gone from us now.

It was a bad passive for his kit. At least with how his 2 works.

As long as his 2 and 3 remain as is (in concept) anything that involves healing or damage reduction feels kinda redundant for a passive. 

[Sasquatchias]

My thoughts on Revenant and his abilities as of right now - 

General Feedback - Revenant is interesting, but feels slightly unfinished (his dash being an ugly wall of smoke for example) and the Thrall cap of 4 leaves him feeling fairly weak, not allowing him to take bigger advantage of certain abilities nor truly have a good place on the battlefield with an ineffective kit. 

1. Thralls - Cap needs to be increased to maybe 10 max so as to allow Revenant to truly have a noticeable effect during firefights, as it is right now only having 4 at a time leaves very little impact and the whole "Pillar of Pain" gimmick they have upon death is left fairly unused unless they happen to be killed in the middle of a door or common path. In addition I think ally abilities should have no effect on Thralls - they die easily enough due to indiscriminate fire, and letting every nuker blow them and every other enemy up effectively cripples Revenant.

2. Mesmer Shields - no current feedback as of right now, in general the ability feels slightly iffy to use given the flat amount of stuns it grants (and honestly in a horde shooter that amount feels a little low.)

3. Reave - Needs a better graphic effect / look, the giant smoke wall looks incredibly ugly and to me looks like some kind of placeholder more than anything.

4. Lazers - I like the ability well enough, but there is a big issue with even the slightest bit of vertical difference between Revenant and his targets just completely negating the ability.

[ujimax]

1 minute ago, MarrikBroom said:

I'm fine with his 4 having line of sight/not being able to rotate the lasers since that gives a natural sort of limit to his map nukability. It works as a good natural limit since that means people won't have to feel guilty about this ability being ballarina murder.

well saryn and equinox certainly don't have this problem, and don't need some friends like Volt, Rhino & Octavia (Nova *cough*) following you around to pew pew stuff. Then again they're no whirlwinding barbarian lookin'.

[CuteFoxyFox]

I made a diffrent thread for feedback but let me point some things again here.

- Casting speed is too slow for all abilities despite 4

- Can we use ALL of the abilities during 4?

- Enemies taken over by 1st skill dies to fast

- Flame left by Revenant's dying minions... would be cool if was affected by range mods

- Why 2nd skill doesnt mark on its own anymore? It was cool on a playtests! Or let us Click 2 again to take over all stunned enemies at once

- Better animations for 3rd skill

- Animation or any indicator that Revenant is gaining something by passing through enemies? Usually you do it and you pray it works

- Passive effected by range mods?

[Darkmoone1]

Threw him into some areas and it seems like my main issues stem around his 1st ability. Just to summerize it:

1. Four Enthralled enemies is too low

Having four enemies enthralled not only severly limits one of the main features of the ability (Enthralled enemies can enthrall other enemies), but barely leaves an impact in the overall scope of large fights. 

Increase the cap to at least 8 or 10. Even if you enthrall one, powerful enemy, it'll leave room for the ability to work its magic and hopefully enthrall others.

2. Teammates can kill enthralled enemies too quickly

Probably the biggest reason why Enthrall is so ineffective right now. Teammates will kill enthralled enemies faster than Revenant can make any use of them. 

Give them some form of damage resistance when enthralled.

EDIT: Scratch this, I have a better idea of how Enthrall works. Enthralled enemies are not meant to last, but should be killed or used as fast as possible to reap benefits (From regular means for damage pillar, additional lifesteal from 3, or overcharge shields from 4) 

3. Targeting one enemy at a time is still insanely boring

For such a defining ability, it is always such an annoyance to pick one enemy at a time to enthrall. I've been through this with Nekros, Limbo(You guys made strives to improve this, I will admit), and now Revanant. It's just not fun. 

Have Revanant shoot a small projectile, that creates a small aoe, to enthrall enemies. Make it moderately fast with a straight line to still allow room for aiming. 

 

Edited August 27, 2018 by Darkmoone1
Removing idea 2

[Rekkou]

Passive: A bit counterproductive, it trigger when shield is depleted but revenant has tons of shield. So it triggers very rarely

Suggestion: IMO it should trigger every 300 shield so it can see more use

Enthrall: No complaint, it's useful and very quick and easy to use

Mesmer Skin: So was the charge was based purely on hit? if it is then 6 are not enough, it can be depleted instantly when facing enemies with high fire rate weapons. The cast time is also too long.

Suggestion: Make each charge has 300-500 health so the ability can function as defensive ability better and make the cast time quicker

Reave: Cast time too long, using this ability is very unsmooth and can't be relied on an emergency situation.

Suggestion: Make the cast time faster, almost instantaneous if possible. Enemies should also get staggered for more cc capability

Danse Macabre:  It can only hit target with the same elevation as Revenant? 

Suggestion: Damage hitbox should be globe based

[ArchXDiablo]

Feedback on Revenant:

He looks amazing, his lore is interesting, but the skills are underwhelming for someone that is supposed to be related to eidolon energy. 

Passive - useless. I can't even see it work when my shields deplete. Range is atrociously small. 

1- Thralls limited to 4? What an army indeed. Cap needs to go to 10-12. Barely use the skill except in solo to have a laugh.

2- Good idea, bad execution. In many environments it depletes on the spot, long casting time.

3- Just what is this skill even for? An armor/life leech with horrid long casting time and a big block that looks like a placeholder. So many interesting options for an eidolon based warframe instead of this.

4- What 99% of Revenants do in-game. Good nuke, except for the fact that 1) can't hit enemies not aligned to your altitude which in almost every map means stop move and recast 2)since you can't do 1 you would expect to be able to move and jump but nope.

This is the single first warframe I bought because I neglected the quills until now and wanted to rush getting it. I had everything except the quill standing and hell this is my long weekend off work, did not want to wait. I feel underwhelmed, and I hope this frame gets a rework because it has so much potential of being an awesome frame but as of now is a spin-to-win one skill only till my energy gives out with the occasional shield that is not that convenient frame. 

[EinheriarJudith]

40 minutes ago, ujimax said:

I agree,

also, his base energy is fairly weak and base casting speed is really slow... maybe a boost to the range of his 4 wouldn't hurt either.

the range of his 4 is fine. it kills anything it touches.

[FluffyBoutique]

My thoughts on the revenant warframe and possible fixes for his weak spots. 

Enthrall 

Not enough thralls. 4 thralls is not a fiting number for a ability that should crowd controll enemies and the pillars are just useless ingeneral. The ability, in my opinion is just a waste of energy right now. specially on lower levels. 

I have two ways you could fix this issue: You could increase the cap of how many thralls you can controll at a time (for example 6 at base and make it scale with strenght mods at cap it at 12/double the normal power strenght. OR remove the cap and instead make it so your thralls have a chance to make another enemy a thrall (for example a 15-20 precent chance per hit that they become a thrall and "special" attack such as slams have a doubled chance)

But now lets talk about he energy pillars. I dont think they are very useful most of the time they just stop you from seeing things, i would suggest to reworking them into a more supportive part of the ability, basically make it so they give energy when you or friendlies pass them. (im thinking around 10 energy or an energy rate increase: 2/s for 5 sec + passing multiple "energy pillars* adds to your timer and makes it 3/s. i would say that this should be affected by durations mods and) 

Mesmer Skin

This ability is very random and inconsistent, by that i mean the ability sometimes wears off too quickly and the casting time is too long. 

so my suggestions are: increase the casting time and make it so when you lose a stack you cant lose another stack for 1-1.5 sec. or increase the " stack pool" to be 10 at base, once you reach 1 to 3 stack you are allow to refresh it.  

Reave

this ability is mostly fine, but the ability cost is very high, make it cheaper (25 base maybe) or keep the high cost but balance it like how nidus's one is, the more enemies you hit, the less energy it costs, and make it so when you pass an enemy you get a single stack of Mesmer skin.

Dont really have any suggestions for his last ablity Danse Macabre

but his passive is a little bit short. increase the range? 

[PrincessSapphire]

Funny frame, I cant seem to use the 4 alongside the other abilities, though, like, why would we use 1 when our 4 kill 'em? and the 3 doesnt seem to be working for me as intendeed, maybe is my build or so, anyways, nice frame, please dont nerf it to the ground ;w;

 

and the 4 limit for the 1 is quite small... couldnt we have a higher limits, or at least something like.... X addtitional energy cost per additional enthrall, not affected by any mods.

Edited August 26, 2018 by PrincessSapphire

[EinheriarJudith]

12 minutes ago, PrincessSapphire said:

Funny frame, I cant seem to use the 4 alongside the other abilities, though, like, why would we use 1 when our 4 kill 'em? and the 3 doesnt seem to be working for me as intendeed, maybe is my build or so, anyways, nice frame, please dont nerf it to the ground ;w;

yeah his enthrall needs tweaks. reave is just to allow you to move in one direction faster which you can cancel by pressing reave again. i still think for a dash its range is to long id rather it be a ethereal mode you enter that allows you to control its movement.

Edited August 26, 2018 by EinheriarJudith