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[DE]Marcus

[PC Update 23.5] Revenant Feedback Megathread

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i was better before ...

4 nerf made it impossible being the higest energy cost of the game for that ability . 

Entrall is simply broken, works on bosses and your teammates kill them, also using it also bugs missions making enemies not to spawn.

So hearing the community was making his only good ability bad , and the bad broken abilities worse.

works on stalker and g3 too..lol

 

 

 

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6 hours ago, Xaranoth said:

Have you seen saryn or nidus?

The sad thing is, those aren’t even “extreme” buffs. Those are just fixes to make revenants abilities actually able to do what their intended purpose is without being stopped short by arbitrary and unnecessary hard caps. I really like your ideas there, hopefully this goes the way of the Oberon and hydroid reworks where they overnerfed and then brought back up to an actually somewhat useful state, but I’m not super hopeful after what happened with khora. Or rather, what didn’t happen with her after she got released.

Each frame has different ability sets, some are basic, 1st is ‘weak’ and 4th is ‘strong’, some have equally useful abilities, like nova for example, and some have them all over the place, like nidus and saryn, were their ‘strongest’ ability isn’t necessarily the 4th.....revenant simply belongs to the former, and there’s nothing wrong with that, thus it shouldn’t be changed 

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-More range scaling please: passive, Reave width and maybe minimum distance, Ult /range and punch trough)

-Enthrall pillars on death should afflict enemies (maybe even charm)

-Reave should restore stacks of Mesmer Skin;   maybe more dmg/healing on non-thralls and power strength scaling

!!! Efficiency is mostly a big problem because you dont have to build for strength/range so you can just go for efficiency and spam ult

 

-when ulting while sliding you stay crouched resulting in the camera staying near the ground and being crouched after exiting it

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20 minutes ago, Fatal_X said:

Danse Macabre: It's good now. Do not change.

Only it needs to be changed because it costs too much energy for damage that's easily topped by Mesa, who does more damage for less energy consumption. 

 

Saying it's good now is laughable. It's absolutely unacceptable to let these kinds of nerfs slide, and you saying "do not change" is telling DE "hey, let's make all good damage abilities bad". Revenant literally got Ember'd. 

 

 

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4 minutes ago, Fatal_X said:

Danse Macabre: It's good now. Do not change. 

I wholeheartedly disagree with this. his 4 was fine enough before they upped the energy consumption making the power basically worthless. The fact you can even say "This is fine" to this change makes me honestly believe the majority of the forums are delusional and don't actually play the same game.

  • Enthrall is essentially pointless because Thrall's don't really server any purpose and end up being a waste of energy
  • Mesmer Skin just gets chewed through at most things above level 30-40ish (Honestly what this ability needs is each charge of Mesmer Skin get's gated much like how Inaros's 4 augment works)
  • Reave is probably the most expensive and least useful movement ability out there, but other than the base 75 energy without mods, there's nothing wrong with this ability
  • Dane Macabre as I've said above is not really usable for very long, and the ability is more effective the longer you have it up, so it's counter productive and useless.

Now you can go on about how "Just use max efficiency" or "use prime flow as well" but that still doesn't change that the damage dealing ability relies heavily on being used for long periods of time, and yes you can half the energy a second, but this only applies to not holding down left click to increase the damage output, there's also the issue of not having enough mod space for both primed flow and the two efficiency mods, because on top of all these issues, Revenant is a tank who can't effectively tank, especially because of the problems with his Mesmer Skin.

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one the hit to revenants energy drain on his 4 is terrible and doesn't fix anything/ you shouldn't of even gave him his forth if you guys were trying to AVOID the press 4 to win or how you said it in this new update "set it up and done" how this whole thing is playing out is making you guys look like you were baiting us to buy the frame since the 4th ability was so enticing.

two the making revenants 2nd ability relfect status procs might of indecently make the ability worse as i am playing rev and for some reason his mesmer charges are going way too fast then they were before as the whole charges are gone in about 2-3 seconds. thats not going to save rev if he goes into a onslaught.

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We are repeating each other and or going completely different paths. I'm trying to list required changes that needs to happen and if we all focus on one answer with upvotes, maybe the devs will finally know what to do to fix the mess called Revenant. I would need feedback on my ideas that you can see at the link below (click red arrow top left corner), what do you guys/girls think of my ideas for a "rework"? 🙂

 

 

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4 minutes ago, VieuxPappy said:

We are repeating each other and or going completely different paths. I'm trying to list required changes that needs to happen and if we all focus on one answer with upvotes, maybe the devs will finally know what to do to fix the mess called Revenant. I would need feedback on my ideas that you can see at the link below (click red arrow top left corner), what do you guys/girls think of my ideas for a "rework"? 🙂

 

 

Yeah that'd be great if we could someone not include people who don't own the frame, because every low-mr turd that's been out damaged will just chime in on whatever kills the frame harder

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I Know you guys from DE say about why the new 2 hand katana is not comming with revenant, but why you put this weapon on the game with the revenant specter? She even has a stance with the specter C'mon DE! 

 

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Ok so someone else here has a great idea of making the enthralled targets more resistant to team mates damage. And that’s like a genius idea. Maybe make them as or 3/4 resistant as synthesis targets.

it both keeps team mates from instantly killing your thralls AND keeps Rev users from trolling in defenses cuz the thralls could be easily taken down with a squad of 4 wailing on it.

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I have experienced some bugs with enthral. I was playing a corpus survival relic mission solo. Sometimes my thralls would attempt to fight each other if they were members of a different faction. For example my enthralled corpus tech and enthralled corrupted gunner were attempting to kill each other, but they were unable to damage the other person. 

 

I was just playing the survival on Saturn (solo) to farm resources for then new event. I noticed that my enthralled napalm unit's fire could set me on fire. I tested on another napalm. I first enthralled him and waited for him to shoot an enemy. Once the fire was on the ground, I ran through it and was set on fire. Shouldn't this be friendly fire?

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I think this warframe is a pure disappointment for me.
When I heard that there would be a warframe based on the eidolon, I thought there would be similarities in his skills.
The first skill should represent what the phantasma shoot. his second ability would be the fact of creating an army, but not just 7 people but at least 10 people, especially when we see the damage of our subordinates. the third skill should change according to the color of energy like chroma. It would reproduce one of the skills of the three eidolon. and the fourth one, which for the moment is a bit too strong, should sacrifice its shield to reproduce the energy waves of the eidolon when they are on the ground. and as a passive, Revenant could ... I do not know ... when he loses his shield, instead of doing this tiny wave of energy, he could have a buff of damage for about 5 seconds. Honestly, without offending anyone in the team that made the most beautiful warframe, a weird warfare that we will get tired after a few weeks, I think my idea is better. Because for the moment these abilities are disgusting

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Thralls should maintain the current system of taking damage.

 

BUT

On death they should be like vombulysts and turn into void ghosts that explode when duration runs out. 

 

Solves literally all problems with Enthrall and makes it completely unique, mechanically, to any other ability in the game.

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So I played revenant a little bit more after 23.6 and the major problem still exist. Allies being able to kill the thralls and me wasting energy. This ability does nothing more than just hurt the warframe. There is no point in using this ability in public as my allies will kill them just as fast as I use my ability. I recommend to fix this problem is that when killed, like the vombulysts, they enter a ghost/void mode. While in this form, they maintain a limit(small) of health that the player can use for Reave or Danse Macabre while allies cannot kill them. Allies can kill them, if only they are in operator mode, just like the vombulysts. This way we do not have people holding an objective like holding the last enemies in elimination or defense. If recasted on them, they die releasing the damage spire.

I hope this really helps. 

 

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As it's seen in Warframe, so many abilities always seem familiar from other frame kits. But a lot of the time, they actually aim to serve a different purpose with summing up how a frame should be used. For example Nezha's ward being used more for support and Rhino's being used more for tankiness. Albeit the issue with the latter is more reliant on a augment to do so. But you're here for Revenant.

Passive: Something like better shield recharge may prove to be more beneficial to Revenant tbh. Or something like statuses affect his shields first and can only effect his health was shields are gone. Albeit that could be seen as OP.

Entrall: Already, his one seemed to be have made with very similar effects to Nyx's Mind Control and now even Adopting Nekros's Shadows of the Dead with the "damaging pillar" seemingly no more than a "patch" on the Warframe. After seeing some ideas from people on the Reddit, I think it can be made better that capitalizes more on these pillars rather than having "mind controlled" enemies. Pillars should also act like dance macabre and proc effect depending on enemy they're attacking.

Revenant entralls x amount of enemies for x duration. HOWEVER, if an enemy dies, the little thralls search for new targets to mind control and as long as an enemy dies, pillars would be erected. There is the issue where so many could pop up that it becomes op. But an easy solution would be than rather creating a fixed amount of pillars (entralls can still be fixed), duration decay to kept in mind instead. Where duration is carried over, or reduced by an amount when the thralls gain a new target. The pillars could also suffer the same duration decay as to avoid spam. The thralls would also need to search for new hosts, and if they fail to get into range of one, they disappear from the amount available to create new pillars unless the ability is recasted.

Mesmer Skin: Considering how it's not recastable, it should simply just become recastable and make it where it simply cannot disappear like it was nothing.

There's also another way to do it. Instead of damage redirection, it causes Revenant to pulse sentient energy, sending a wave of damage out to foes while stunning them. It would kind of look like Trinity's energy pulse. Honestly, I'm not sure if any of my ideas for this is good enough.

Reave: Just reduce the cost to 50, please DE. Why make it so expensive when it acts so simular to Hydroid's 2? Management with new 1 may become harder as thralls would potentially have more distance from one another. It could just only restore shields and health through pillars instead, to increase reliability and effectiveness. 

Dance Macabre: Return it to 12.5 energy a second and it's all good enough.

 

These are just my thoughts, any more suggestion would be appreciated. I'd just hate to see such a cool concept be so underused.

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Some Warframe have useless passive , so sad and hilarious. I willing ... no, GLADLY to sacrifice my Rhino's passive and 3/4 damage of the 4th skill if it increase Rhino's basic HP up to 150 with the 4th skill cost less energy. Everytime I hear Rhino's passive active I was like Idgaf because the range is pathetic, and actually when it was you fight with real enemies, make close range enemies fall off so the other behind them have clear shoot just WoW.

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I didn't read other posts, just hit reply.. lol.

Let's stay constructive..

1st ability: Just turning an enemy is bit boring, Nyx can do it, a hammer can do it, Nekros can do it. How about it supercharges it's target with void energy (or whatever his energy is called) speeding them up and increasing their damage, but also killing the thrall within x amount of seconds. The thrall would be more likely to run to an enemy and fight it and die. If the enemy kills the thrall it gets enthralled, if the thrall burns out it becomes a pillar.

2nd Ability: I don't really know what to say about this, he really needs a survival ability, this is a really good one.

3rd Ability: 33-50% chance to enthrall enemies passed through

4th Ability: increase range and damage, when trigger is held laser becomes a single focused projectile, increasing energy use and damage

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Hi im a founder and a Long time Player of warframe … 

 

I really loved his ult as it was a nice reward after collecting enough Energy in regular battle .. it was a constant up and down since it had a nice balance of usefullness and constraint  and as a result it was  really really fun to use it as Kind of reward for bulding back up your Energy supply...

 

The 20 Energy second Change is in all honesty too big and will be a too dangerous Downgrade since it will deplete all your Energy in seconds … i would say it completely destoys the simple fun i get from it since i wont be using it anymore attached with such a high Risk on use .. 

 

I really dont get it.. i had finally some real fun and felt rewarded to collect as much Energy as i could and you nerfed it to the Ground .. ther are many more characteres with stronger ult abilities and they Need even less Energy … 

 

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Can you guys plz fix, that weird thing with Reve's neck, it looks like playdoh. Btw, love the design but not the abilities

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Being able to re-cast his 2 would be fine. Removing the lockout on his 1 and reducing back to launch his 4 cost per tick would be more than enough to make him a decent multipurpose frame. 

If his minions are going to stay then his kit will need major changes to accomodate them.

His identity is somewhat confused - he is neither "really" eidolon themed nor vampire themed - I would prefer one or the other - both would be fine. Having enthrall replaced with short-lived vomba's would be great, but other synergies would need to be modified. Keeping his enthrall and going more "vampire" doesn't really match his aesthetic. I would rather see it transferred to a nyx re-work or to a truly "vampire" themed warframe. If that isn't on the table then increase their death pillar size and damage to accomodate team kills or cave to the many people asking for friendly-fire immune thralls so they can do whatever thralls do that's useful a little longer.

EDIT: I've removed the off-topic portions of this comment and revised it to stay on-topic with the purpose of this thread - a feedback channel for the developers to see what changes the community wants and problems they're facing. my feedback should have been directed at DE and not the community.

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On 2018-08-24 at 6:34 PM, SSI_Seraph said:

- Why limit the ability to 4 thralls only? As if bumping nyx's mindcontrol from 1 to 4 would make it any better. 4 is not enough to draw enough aggro and just forget the idea of them helping you deal damage because enemy damage on enemies is bad ( void spines (unairu) is a great exemple of why you guys should forget that type of damage mechanic)

- the thralls (if kept at a low number) need get aggro similar to saryn's molt rn. 

They also should make his entrhall ability like saryn spores, they spread and die, or like the mechanic with enemies that spawn othes and nekros, as a hyekka master spawns her hyekkas and nekros have control of them just because the 4th hability was on and 2-3 seconds after that happens

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The current energy pillar has a range of 2 meters, so I would suggest the

Overcharged Pillar- the one that is created when a thrall dies very quickly to have double that range and perhaps do more damage, perhaps a small aoe explosion that slows down enemies as well, this would end up creating two different playstyles for Revenant, one that is energy pillar centric and the other one that is thrall centric that would work in solo while the first one would work in a party setting.

The primary objective of this is by providing two different playstyles whenever he plays Solo or in a Squad which I believe would make him unique from all the other Warframes, Reave could also perhaps be used on these energy pillars in order to renew their cooldown or give him some sort of overcharge mode or even give him some health back based on the duration missing on the energy pillar

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1 minute ago, nokturnihs said:

Please people,  stop asking for thrall immunity or suggesting massive re-imaginings of him. He's OUT.

And like Khora some tweaks are needed to be less of a headache.

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Those concepts are great but should have hit prior to his launch

That's what the feedback thread is for, genius.

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Now all they're doing is filling this thread with incentive for the Devs to ignore the majority of the comments here.

They already are.

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I love the ideas, and hope they're included in future content. I mean that. But we don't need to recycle the purpose of other frames that do what he does better than him. He becomes unique by being different enough that he isn't any of those things.

He's already recycling Hydroid's Tidal surge, Nyx's mind control gimmick, Inaros's spinning move (and inaro's spin animation was the original for DM), and mesmer skin is basically a change-based iron skin. Lots of things are already recycled.

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He'll never be mesa

He'll never be Mag or Nyx or Vauban

he'll never be Inaros or Rhino.

 

And he won't be fixed if players don't speak up about issues they have with him.

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We I don't want him to be because we I already have them.

fixed that for you.

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And his Kit isn't bad. It's SIGNIFICANTLY better than Khora (looks aside). That's improvement. Let's get a basically functional Revenant as is and then talk about massive changes after he's solid.

And khora's kit was even worse before people brought it up in the feedback. That's what these threads are for: players letting them know what's up/wrong with the frame. The goal here is to get a functioning Revenant and even without the straight up ability changes basic things like MAKE THRALLS SAFE FROM ALLIES  are a big part of that functionality you're talking about since every ability of his kit interacts with thralls.

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The biggest issue with Revenant is obviously that one ability is really good and the rest are just mediocre or unusable in their current state, mostly due to the fact they all have poor or odd mechanics behind them, so here is my proposal to buffs/changes that I feel could help the doly boy our a bit.
Passive:

His passive has horrible range so the affect is barely noticed, but I feel its more hampered by the fact that it requires his shields to deplete, due to Revenant having the highest base shields in the game, not to mention his ability to regenerate overshields.
Proposal: 

Have the shockwave separated into 4 segments on the shield; for every 25% of shields he loses he emits a shockwave. The radius would increase by 25% for each burst (so the first proc at 25% shields would be as it is now, the proc at 50% would be 50% stronger etc. If damage goes past that amount it triggers the highest threshold, so a shot that does 51% shields will do the 50% proc instead of the 25%)
While still not an amazing passive, this at least allows him to survive longer thanks to the added CC while still sticking with the eidolon theme.

Enthrall:

Obviously the biggest issue with this ability is that allies end up killing your thralls way to quickly, completely removing the synergy half his kit has with them. Not to mention enemies are horrible at killing other enemies, but thats more so an issue with the game vs Revenant specifically. Additionally, due to a vast majority of the enemies in the game are ranged, they damage pools they leave behind are rarely ever effective due to enemies are never close to thralls pools, outside of the infested.

Proposal:

Have enemies that are Enthralled become melee while gaining 100% movement speed: This allows them to corner enemies easily, fixing the problem of the damage pools rarely hitting anyone and helping Revenants survivability thanks to them taking aggro, as well as bunches them up for Reave, allowing for better synergy between the two.               Enthralled units that die become ghosts, lasting for 50% of their remaining duration: This completely fixes the issue of allies killing the thralls and removing their usefulness. The thralls can still act and do as they will, without the issues of them taking up AI slots or dying to allied aoe abilities. For the damage pools, either have them proc twice (one for main death and one for ghost death) or only on one of them.

Mesmer Skin:

The ability just gets eaten up too fast by enemies to be made useful in most situation; warframe has you fight against constant hordes of enemies and having a small amount of charges to protect yourself just isnt enough when they're gone nearly right after cast.

Proposal:

Mesmer Skin has a grace period of 3 seconds where charges aren't consumed but still grant their bonuses: It's simple, its clean, its one of the most request changes i've seen when it comes to Revenant.
After hitting X amount of enemies with Reave, restore a charge of Mesmer Skin. Thralls count at two additional hits: Some nice synergy between two of Revenants survival skills; the amount hit would be for every cast not just one, so if the amount needed is 10, hitting 5 one cast and 5 another would restore the charge, and thralls would count at 3 hits each.

Reave:

Currently this ability is considered an over costed Hydroid 2, offering the same mobility with not very noticeable benefits unless used on thralls, which currently are either too out of the way or die too quickly to make use of this ability out side of moving around in Danse Macabre.

Proposal:

Reave will now siphon enemy health and shields to Revenant, in addition to restore: Essentially this means that for every enemy hit with Reave, that % or health and shields will be added to his own for a short amount of time; reasoning for this is to give him that bit of survivability while Mesmer Skin is down and also giving the ability a bit more utility by allowing it to reduce enemies health. The 8% reduction is still much weaker than Virals 50% so it shouldnt be too overpowered.
Reave will now go in the direction Revenant is aiming: Might just be me, but right now using the ability just feels clunky; it feels i should be able to go airborn with it due to the floaty nature of the affects (clouds and mist and all) but it feels way too grounded in its current state.

Danse Macabre:

This post is already becoming much longer than I planned for it to be, so for simplicity sake i'll just say Danse Macabre in my opinion is fine but revert the energy drain change that was made.

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