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[DE]Marcus

[PC Update 23.5] Revenant Feedback Megathread

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I've also seen this, but the thing is that it is not consistent. Sometimes they immediately aggro on to nearby enemies and you have full thrall-set before you know it (usually by desperately mashing 1 against a heavy gunner in front of you, wondering why nothing happens before the situation registers ūüôā ‚Ķ).

My theory is that ping affects their behaviour (including if you are the host or not). That is, with higher ping/worse connection their reaction to what happens slows down a bit. Haven't tested it though (but it would be easy, just compare soloing a mission to teaming up).

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I don't agree that 20 is too much. You can get it down below 10/sec easy enough, or even lower. Considering the possible damage output and the ability to move (even quickly) there has to be some cap, or everyone would just disco through missions from start to end.

The "bad" thing is that the newer players don't necessarily have access to the mods necessary to mod accordingly, and thus don't get to experience the full power of the Revenant. However, that means there are still a need to loot, grind and something to fight for ūüėČ.¬†

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At least this confirms it's a real bug and it's not supposed that way thankfully because that would make the ability absolutely useless for any decent content.

Now we wait till they notice this thread and fix it¬†ūüėĀ

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7 hours ago, (PS4)iQuedas said:

I think the cost is fine. The ability is crazy strong.

It’s not that strong. It has high damage numbers but doesn’t attack as fast as peacemakers making its DPS significantly lower than you’d expect.

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10 hours ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said:

Or do what I did and remove fleeting and put in narrow minded. I have the drain down to just above 6 energy per second

Always take out Fleeting on Drain abilities, it's a net-neutral mod for those, what you gain in actual Efficiency, the negative Duration removes an equal amount of on the opposite side.

It's because energy cost isn't 'per second' it's 'per unit of time', and adding Duration extends the period of time it takes that energy for. I literally blew a Valkyr player's mind when I explained that to them ^^

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15 minutes ago, Thaylien said:

Always take out Fleeting on Drain abilities, it's a net-neutral mod for those, what you gain in actual Efficiency, the negative Duration removes an equal amount of on the opposite side.

Actually not true. One duration mod can easily counter quite a bit of the drain, while keeping the activation cost low. For Revenant's case, unless one is building range as well, there is really nothing stopping one from slotting a narrow minded. 

Also, a Max Fleeting + a Max Streamline can give max eff without even the need for duration, if you don't use transient fort.

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I've had a good play with Revenant since his changes and honestly he's in a much better place now, not perfect by a long shot, but a big step in the right direction.

This is a expansion of what I wrote quite a few pages back before he got his changes. (And with more sleep under my belt too) 

Before I jump into my thoughts on this again, let me say that I really do love the overall concept, style and feel this Warframe has! I've been using him more often now and it's been pretty fun at times! But he does have quite a few glaring problems that really hurt him in the long run and it all really boils down to his one ability: Enthrall. 

Don't get me wrong, Mesmer Skin, Reave and Danse Macabre have their issues too but have been covered in great detail in this thread, so repeating the same issues and problems again here might just seem counter productive... besides my issues mostly lie with his Enthrall skill and the Synergy between the other skills.

Enthrall as a skill is a cool idea, I love how it feels when using it, the pillars and the blasts coming off it, the ability to spread it around and how one Thrall can lead to 7 is all pretty dang awesome. The concept is great and sure it does look like a mishmash of Nekros' Shadows of the Dead and Nyx's Chaos but it feels unique and in it's own.

The pillars themselves are pretty cool too, the damage does feel a bit weak I'll say that but I do love the homing spheres they've added in! The pillars feel like little turrets now and that's awesome. 

However while Enthrall does have some pretty awesome elements with it, It also has it's problems and sadly they are pretty heavy ones. I've boiled them down to several points which I'll go over. 

  1. Casting and Spread.
  2. Living Thralls Problems. 
  3. Synergy 
  4. Thrall Cap

Casting and Spread

From what I understand Enthralls casting concept is: "Cast once and let it populate itself" Which in itself is a cool idea but in execution it doesn't quite end up there. The issue isn't so much with the casting but how it spreads and how Thralls while living work. Thralls draw aggro now, which if you have a couple of them is great,but if you're following what I believe is the casting concept and only  cast once rather then spamming the ability, you're going to find that the Thrall is going to swamped easily and quite often not spread the Enthralling to a new target, or if they do it's also likely they'll get swamped as well! 

So to fix that you'll have to pretty much fill the Thrall Cap yourself by spamming the ability, and if you are with someone running a strong CC frame too, that pretty much feels like all you'll be doing if you want to not only fill the cap, but have Thralls around long enough to work with your other skills synergy. 

What'd I change? Keep the single cast but allow the ability to charge up  by holding down the button for a few seconds, and on release allowing Enthrall to chain up to 3 targets and Enthralling them for a increased energy cost. 

This would give the Thralls a strong chance to spread around since the aggro would be spread over 3 targets instead of one, plus it would give you 3 quick Thralls to use Reave on to recover Health/Shield + Mesmer Skin.

 Living Thrall Problems / Synergy

Thralls are meant to die, that much is pretty clear! They draw aggro, take damage from allies, lose health when Reaved and so on! When a target is Enthralled it's pretty much a mark for death, and while I don't have a issue with that, I have a issue with how dependent other skills are for living Thralls.  

 His survival  infact depends on his Thralls being alive rather than being a pillar turret, He needs living Thralls for: Reaving Health and shields, drawing aggro, replenishing Mesmer Skin and Overshields made by Danse Macabre. 

The problem is though, I'm not exactly sure HOW to fix this without other issues... Allowing Pillars to be reaved for the same benefits, might work but by doing that you'd pretty much lose that need for living Thralls, only to have them as aggro sinks till they die. But this would have the knock on effect of making Revenant more static and can only move as fast as he's able to create pillars, Not to mention given how fast pillars are made, you'll essentially have a unlimited supply of Mesmer Skin recharges, especially if the pillars are grouped together. That would seem a little bit broken to me. 

Truth be told: I can't really think of anyway of fixing this skill and it's synergy without a complete rework into something else. That's not saying the idea is a bad one, quite the opposite! I love the idea of Enthrall and what it could do. But I just don't think it's had the result it was expected to get. 

Thrall Cap

From re-watching Devstreams with Revenant in it, there was a lot of talk about the cap and how many Thralls you could have under your control, I believe the number was between 15-20? then on release it got scaled down to 4. Now for what Revenant can do with his Kit 4 was far too low, and kudos to the team for quickly upping the cap to 7! Sadly I don't think this is enough either but the idea of 4 gave me a idea for a augment. 

I can understand not having a really high cap, anything like 15-20 does seem a bit too much as you'd pretty much control a single room at that point.  So a balance must be struck. 

From how I see it, since Thralls don't have increased health or damage like Nekros' minions (quite rightly) they need a advantage in another area and I think you've already got the right idea: Numbers. 

I think the cap should be increased to maybe 12-14. having a number like that would give Thralls plenty of numbers, and  able to replenish themselves a lot easier. (once the cap is reached)

Augment Idea: Elevate

This is also a expansion of a idea i had in a previous post in this thread, just tidied up a bit more and with more information!

Elevate is a Augment for Enthrall to allow Revenant to empower 2-4 Thralls to act as personal guards, (Recasting Enthrall on a Thrall will empower it) These guards gain a slight increase in damage and health (50-75%), draw aggro, ally damage immunity, but take slightly more damage then normal (10-20%) and glow red to so they show that they are empowered. 

Aside from all that. When Revenant starts taking Health damage he'll start leeching the life force of his empowered Thralls till either they die from the drain or enemy fire. (or both!) 

Just a off cuff idea really, but I hope you'll like it!

You have a really interesting take on a minion-master playstyle, Something completely different than Nekros' specialized/empowered shadows and Nyx's Chaos and Mind Control. But still feels pretty great to someone who likes summoners. I already like Revenant a lot and can't wait to see what you'll do with him.

 

 

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2 hours ago, Datam4ss said:

One duration mod can easily counter quite a bit of the drain, while keeping the activation cost low.

But that's an extra duration mod you have to put on, why would you literally nerf your Duration just for a tiny drop in the initial activation, when the longer you have the more efficient the overall ability is? If you're having to counter -60% Duration, just for 10 energy on the base cast? That doesn't make sense. You'll save all that energy in the first five seconds or so with the Duration.

I would normally agree with you, if the initial cast on an ability required you to make more of an investment, like 50 or 75, but as the base Danse Macabre only costs 25 at base, while the Drain is 20 per second at base, it's mathematically more sound to get your Drain under control than to worry about the initial casting cost.

I mean, sure, there's the other side, which is if you're only turning on the ability for three seconds a time because you're on an incredibly low-level mission, then maybe there's debate there, where bringing the Initial cost in line with the Drain cost might pay off.

To modify my earlier statement: Always take out Fleeting on Drain abilities if you plan on turning the ability on for more than five seconds at a time, it's a net-neutral mod if you aren't strobing the ability like a rave.

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4 hours ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said:

It’s not that strong. It has high damage numbers but doesn’t attack as fast as peacemakers making its DPS significantly lower than you’d expect.

Thank you for speaking some common sense. It is not as strong as Peacemaker (which is fine really) so the energy consumption is unneccessary. It really brings down his fun factor as his 4 cancels out his 1, you can only get overshields orbs from combining the 4 and the 1, and his 4 cost so much that using for 5 seconds feel terrible (Good job Rebecca).Sadly there will always be people saying that XYZ is fine the way it is. People were saying that about Nezha. People are saying that about Chroma. People will say that about Revenant even though his kit is almost done in my opinion and the whole thing about not wanting his 4 to be a "set and forget it ability" is BS. Octavia is the most OP frame in this game and all you do mostly is set it and forget it while standing still invisible so stop with that noise. I agree and I feel you. His 4's cost should be dropped back to what it was because he's too Zenurik hungry otherwise, and his 4 should make his pillars stronger; not delete them.

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13 minutes ago, Lior55 said:

Thank you for speaking some common sense. It is not as strong as Peacemaker (which is fine really) so the energy consumption is unneccessary. It really brings down his fun factor as his 4 cancels out his 1, you can only get overshields orbs from combining the 4 and the 1, and his 4 cost so much that using for 5 seconds feel terrible (Good job Rebecca).Sadly there will always be people saying that XYZ is fine the way it is. People were saying that about Nezha. People are saying that about Chroma. People will say that about Revenant even though his kit is almost done in my opinion and the whole thing about not wanting his 4 to be a "set and forget it ability" is BS. Octavia is the most OP frame in this game and all you do mostly is set it and forget it while standing still invisible so stop with that noise. I agree and I feel you. His 4's cost should be dropped back to what it was because he's too Zenurik hungry otherwise, and his 4 should make his pillars stronger; not delete them.

peacemaker would be complete and utter garbage if not for being linked to regulator pistols using secondary mods. if DM used either melee or primary mods link, forget it. dont know why people are compareing a power that is boosted by warframe and secondary mods to a power only boosted by warframe mods.

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8 minutes ago, Lior55 said:

Thank you for speaking some common sense. It is not as strong as Peacemaker (which is fine really) so the energy consumption is unneccessary. It really brings down his fun factor as his 4 cancels out his 1, you can only get overshields orbs from combining the 4 and the 1, and his 4 cost so much that using for 5 seconds feel terrible (Good job Rebecca).Sadly there will always be people saying that XYZ is fine the way it is. People were saying that about Nezha. People are saying that about Chroma. People will say that about Revenant even though his kit is almost done in my opinion and the whole thing about not wanting his 4 to be a "set and forget it ability" is BS. Octavia is the most OP frame in this game and all you do mostly is set it and forget it while standing still invisible so stop with that noise. I agree and I feel you. His 4's cost should be dropped back to what it was because he's too Zenurik hungry otherwise, and his 4 should make his pillars stronger; not delete them.

Pecaemaker requires you to stand still, which is a death wish late-game. Plus, it's not empowered by warframe, it's empowered by mods. If you had no mods on peacemakers, you would have an ability which damages like Inaros' 2.

His 4 cancels out his 1 because any damaging 4 cancels his 1. The thralls can take damage from any source, hence why your alowed multiple, otherwise nyx would have litterally no upside.

His 4 is meant for short bursts. You should never have it running for long, but that damage and mobility increase is so good, that most things will die quickly, likely before you run out of energy.

Nezha was ok as he was, but is pretty good now. But if anything, he consumes more energy than ever before. I haven't even heard of a chroma re-work yet, so what that second point is reffering to, I'll never know.

Rev's kit is done. His abilities work well, none have superiority over the other, and one can build for any ability had still be valid. The only weak one imo is reave, but that's just how I play him.

Invisibility in all cases is OP. Loki, however, is a worse offender imo than octavia. Atleast octavia has to do multiple button presses to get it, and it's her only ability which truely scales. her 1 technichaly scales, but as far as I can see, enemies can't shoot it when used with 2 (or at least in the 2's range).

BTW, last time I checked, the pillars don't just get deleted, they explode. Don't know the numbers on it, but they don't just dissapear into the void

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5 hours ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said:

It’s not that strong. It has high damage numbers but doesn’t attack as fast as peacemakers making its DPS significantly lower than you’d expect.

 

1 hour ago, Lior55 said:

Thank you for speaking some common sense. It is not as strong as Peacemaker (which is fine really) so the energy consumption is unneccessary. It really brings down his fun factor as his 4 cancels out his 1, you can only get overshields orbs from combining the 4 and the 1, and his 4 cost so much that using for 5 seconds feel terrible (Good job Rebecca).Sadly there will always be people saying that XYZ is fine the way it is. People were saying that about Nezha. People are saying that about Chroma. People will say that about Revenant even though his kit is almost done in my opinion and the whole thing about not wanting his 4 to be a "set and forget it ability" is BS. Octavia is the most OP frame in this game and all you do mostly is set it and forget it while standing still invisible so stop with that noise. I agree and I feel you. His 4's cost should be dropped back to what it was because he's too Zenurik hungry otherwise, and his 4 should make his pillars stronger; not delete them.

I can't say much for his whole kit, because I didn't enjoy Revenant.

As for Danse Macabre, it is a really good DPS ability with high mobility throughout the whole duration of the skill, and if you ever get low on HP, you can use Reave to regenerate some health WITHOUT turning off your Danse Macabre. And the status type being adapted to the enemy faction hit only makes this skill's scaling even better, not to mention the wide range it has.

So, I think Danse Macabre is a really unique and fine ability as is.

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4 hours ago, EinheriarJudith said:

peacemaker would be complete and utter garbage if not for being linked to regulator pistols using secondary mods. if DM used either melee or primary mods link, forget it. dont know why people are compareing a power that is boosted by warframe and secondary mods to a power only boosted by warframe mods.

Because their both Ult abilities and both are the 2 most expensive abilities in the game.

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6 minutes ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said:

Because their both Ult abilities and both are the 2 most expensive abilities in the game.

that is not enough to compare 2 completely different abilities. DE needs to remove the aimbot from peacemaker then let me see people talk about a power thats strong that no longer relies on gimmicks.

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Wall of text ahead. (I don't have experience from revenant so I'm just stating my 2 cents [Should've had said that earlier lamo])

21 hours ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said:

Or do what I did and remove fleeting and put in narrow minded. I have the drain down to just above 6 energy per second

10 hours ago, Thaylien said:

Always take out Fleeting on Drain abilities, it's a net-neutral mod for those, what you gain in actual Efficiency, the negative Duration removes an equal amount of on the opposite side.

It's because energy cost isn't 'per second' it's 'per unit of time', and adding Duration extends the period of time it takes that energy for. I literally blew a Valkyr player's mind when I explained that to them ^^

I heard efficiency has a greater effect than duration which is why I recommended it with narrow minded. So that you can have both low energy cost and good duration. Also, use this equation here (base drain/duration)(1-efficiency value+1)=total drain, the duration value and efficiency value are all in decimal format. Unless, you're gonna nuke with augur message, constitution, narrow minded, and continuity you're not gonna get a value greater than just streamline + fleeting.

18 hours ago, (PS4)CoolD2108 said:

He's a perfect shield tank, health tank, energy tank, ability tank....literally everything except for an armor/reduction tank honestly. It's ridiculous. Rage makes the difference there just how much you can really use reave/overdrive without canceling the spin. It's recommendable, it really is.

*remember's reave* Yeah I forgot that was a thing you could use when you're done taking damage with rage. I didn't see the use of rage without reave to restore your shields but if it fits a playstyle go ahead. I didn't think it would work well because of his low armor and high shields.

6 hours ago, Lior55 said:

Thank you for speaking some common sense. It is not as strong as Peacemaker (which is fine really) so the energy consumption is unnecessary. It really brings down his fun factor as his 4 cancels out his 1, you can only get overshields orbs from combining the 4 and the 1, and his 4 cost so much that using for 5 seconds feel terrible (Good job Rebecca).Sadly there will always be people saying that XYZ is fine the way it is. People were saying that about Nezha. People are saying that about Chroma. People will say that about Revenant even though his kit is almost done in my opinion and the whole thing about not wanting his 4 to be a "set and forget it ability" is BS. Octavia is the most OP frame in this game and all you do mostly is set it and forget it while standing still invisible so stop with that noise. I agree and I feel you. His 4's cost should be dropped back to what it was because he's too Zenurik hungry otherwise, and his 4 should make his pillars stronger; not delete them.

His 4 also makes the thrall pillars give a damage burst. Did you happen to read the patch notes that changed revenant with nezha? Those fixes really looked nice and seemed to make revenant more viable. Also, power strength doesn't directly affect peacemaker. It only affects the damage boost. So, without mods on peacemaker it won't do more damage. It will still do the same 50 damage.

5 hours ago, (PS4)iQuedas said:

 

I can't say much for his whole kit, because I didn't enjoy Revenant.

As for Danse Macabre, it is a really good DPS ability with high mobility throughout the whole duration of the skill, and if you ever get low on HP, you can use Reave to regenerate some health WITHOUT turning off your Danse Macabre. And the status type being adapted to the enemy faction hit only makes this skill's scaling even better, not to mention the wide range it has.

So, I think Danse Macabre is a really unique and fine ability as is.

Again check the patch notes for revenant. He was changed with nezha and they seemed really cool.

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6 hours ago, Thaylien said:

But that's an extra duration mod you have to put on, why would you literally nerf your Duration just for a tiny drop in the initial activation, when the longer you have the more efficient the overall ability is? If you're having to counter -60% Duration, just for 10 energy on the base cast? That doesn't make sense. You'll save all that energy in the first five seconds or so with the Duration.

I would normally agree with you, if the initial cast on an ability required you to make more of an investment, like 50 or 75, but as the base Danse Macabre only costs 25 at base, while the Drain is 20 per second at base, it's mathematically more sound to get your Drain under control than to worry about the initial casting cost.

I mean, sure, there's the other side, which is if you're only turning on the ability for three seconds a time because you're on an incredibly low-level mission, then maybe there's debate there, where bringing the Initial cost in line with the Drain cost might pay off.

To modify my earlier statement: Always take out Fleeting on Drain abilities if you plan on turning the ability on for more than five seconds at a time, it's a net-neutral mod if you aren't strobing the ability like a rave.

And that is only functional if you plan on only using Danse Macabre and nothing else. I mean if you build around Danse Macabre you probably would still want to upkeep Revenant's 2 and some duration is nice for his 3 anyway, although you wouldn't go for his 1. 

If you are talking about Excalibur's Exalted Blade or Wukong's Primal Fury I may be more inclined to agree. 

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Every time the ability is cast it creates another instance over the old one (which doesn’t disappear even after all Mesmer charges are used) and keeps accumulating. It gets to the point of being annoying. Please have this fixed or remove the smoke.

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20 hours ago, (PS4)CoolD2108 said:

Yeah, they use theyr normal AI with a different ally setting. That's also why you see nekros shadows, spawns that even actively draw aggro hide behind obstacles to avoid LoS.

It's been that way ever since nekros release, years since that issue appeared and was requested for the first time so don't expect it to change anytime soon.

Oh wow I barely noticed the shadows worked exactly the same, then again I primarily use them for tank builds but it's still an issue that I hope is addressed eventually, I'd rather be told if they are or aren't gonna fix it than not knowing entirely.

EDIT: I tested it out, Nekro's shadows are actually more aggressive than the Enthralled and attack all at once, while Revenent's Enthralled will only have 1 of a whole group of 7 attack a single target.

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7 hours ago, Goombpaler said:

Pecaemaker requires you to stand still, which is a death wish late-game. Plus, it's not empowered by warframe, it's empowered by mods. If you had no mods on peacemakers, you would have an ability which damages like Inaros' 2.

His 4 cancels out his 1 because any damaging 4 cancels his 1. The thralls can take damage from any source, hence why your alowed multiple, otherwise nyx would have litterally no upside.

His 4 is meant for short bursts. You should never have it running for long, but that damage and mobility increase is so good, that most things will die quickly, likely before you run out of energy.

Nezha was ok as he was, but is pretty good now. But if anything, he consumes more energy than ever before. I haven't even heard of a chroma re-work yet, so what that second point is reffering to, I'll never know.

Rev's kit is done. His abilities work well, none have superiority over the other, and one can build for any ability had still be valid. The only weak one imo is reave, but that's just how I play him.

Invisibility in all cases is OP. Loki, however, is a worse offender imo than octavia. Atleast octavia has to do multiple button presses to get it, and it's her only ability which truely scales. her 1 technichaly scales, but as far as I can see, enemies can't shoot it when used with 2 (or at least in the 2's range).

BTW, last time I checked, the pillars don't just get deleted, they explode. Don't know the numbers on it, but they don't just dissapear into the void

That's nice.

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So when Revenant takes Damage while using Danse the Damage also gets converted to help Danse deal more damage, but there’s one problem. Rev can’t take enough damage to make this useful. And even with Mesmer skin he can only take so many shots with it and incapacitates enemies meaning he’s recieving less damage and this dealing less damage.

Honestly this Scaling Damage gimmick makes no sense to be because the only place it would be useful is in higher levels, but Rev either can’t survive, or nullifies too many enemies to get any real use out of it.

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Isn't the damage he takes immediately spent on the next hit of the laser dance and not built up during the duration of the move? Perhaps if Revenant was durable like an Eidolon, and the damage built up and augmented the raw damage of all the lasers for the full duration, it could be a better move.

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54 minutes ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said:

So when Revenant takes Damage while using Danse the Damage also gets converted to help Danse deal more damage, but there’s one problem. Rev can’t take enough damage to make this useful. And even with Mesmer skin he can only take so many shots with it and incapacitates enemies meaning he’s recieving less damage and this dealing less damage.

Honestly this Scaling Damage gimmick makes no sense to be because the only place it would be useful is in higher levels, but Rev either can’t survive, or nullifies too many enemies to get any real use out of it.

I was able to make great use of the scaling damage against level 300 enemies while surviving and killing just fine. Also I'm pretty sure the whole point of scaling damage is that it's supposed to be mainly effective at higher levels. The real issue is the mesmer skin bug that gets revenant 1-shotted through mesmer skin. But thankfully there's a temporary solution for this bug until DE fixes it.

The bug for mesmer skin where it takes revenants EHP into account, also takes bleedout into account. To put it simply, when you bleedout you're technically not dead. You're just on the verge of death. So basically as long as you are in a squad and you're not last one alive, mesmer skin should protect you from being one shotted because it has bleedout to fall back on. Without living squad mates, mesmer skin has no infinite EHP pool to fall back on.

So for the time being it's best to play revenant with teammates or to have a sentinel with the sacrifice mod until the mesmer skin bug is fixed. I hope this was of help to you all.

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vor 4 Stunden schrieb (PS4)Grim_Dude:

Oh wow I barely noticed the shadows worked exactly the same, then again I primarily use them for tank builds but it's still an issue that I hope is addressed eventually, I'd rather be told if they are or aren't gonna fix it than not knowing entirely.

EDIT: I tested it out, Nekro's shadows are actually more aggressive than the Enthralled and attack all at once, while Revenent's Enthralled will only have 1 of a whole group of 7 attack a single target.

The difference is basicly theyr routing kicking in... it sure LOOKS LIKE they're more agressive since they're usually getting reset into enemies, rather then following a specific path to reach them before they attack them but they still can and will do...

It was painfully obvious back before his shadows weren't limited to seven and half the field consisted of shadows hiding behind corners eventually due to the much bigger duration they had to remain untouched....

Enthralled enemies shooting at you or running into the sunset is just that - untouched routing... it wouldn't exactly be to its disadvantage if thralls would recieve a similar reset on cast/spread.

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16 minutes ago, (PS4)CoolD2108 said:

The difference is basicly theyr routing kicking in... it sure LOOKS LIKE they're more agressive since they're usually getting reset into enemies, rather then following a specific path to reach them before they attack them but they still can and will do...

It was painfully obvious back before his shadows weren't limited to seven and half the field consisted of shadows hiding behind corners eventually due to the much bigger duration they had to remain untouched....

Enthralled enemies shooting at you or running into the sunset is just that - untouched routing... it wouldn't exactly be to its disadvantage if thralls would recieve a similar reset on cast/spread.

I can't think of many ways to reset the A.I. that doesn't involve killing them, best I got is have Enthrall spawn an eidolon spirit of the casted target or spawn a Vombolyst while the casted target becomes immobile like in a sleep-state and if killed anytime during the duration, it would become a power geyser while the separate spirit either explodes or keeps fighting.

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