Required Solo Sortie Qualifier

[SneakyErvin]

40 minutes ago, DatDarkOne said:

Not quite true fellow Tenno.  There is still the Sortie Rescue on Lua.  Which can be failed if RNG isn't with you. 

edit:  I just realized that might be the Void.  Get the two maps confused sometimes. 

Na you got it right, I was just refering to Spy missions.

[Kakatilenche]

Any average player should be able to solo every sortie if they've equipped the right weapons / warframe (with the right builds).

More experienced players should be able to do the sorties with a random loadout and with noob teammates.

Yes, for spy it is annoying if someone fails them, but for every other mission I have 1 advice to you: Git Gud

[Cubewano]

On 2018-09-13 at 4:25 PM, (PS4)vidare said:

Spy missions should not be in sorties at all, they don't get harder what ever modifier there is or enemy level. 

What do you mean?! Public matchmaking on sortie spy can be the greatest difficulty modifier around. 

[Ada_Wong_SG]

On 2018-09-14 at 2:33 AM, Almagnus1 said:

DE should have the following missions as a sortie qualifier, done at Sortie 1 difficulty solo without items and none of the usual sortie modifiers:

• All of the Corpus spy rooms
• All of the Grineer spy rooms
• All of the Kuva spy rooms
• All of the Uranus spy rooms
• All of the Lua spy rooms
• All of the boss fights
• 5 minute survival
• 5 wave defense
• Hijack
• Capture
• Rescue
• One of each of the Sabotage missions

If a player can do all of the above, then they get to sortie, otherwise they're locked out of sorties until they complete the qualifier.

 

• All of the Corpus spy rooms with no alarm raised and 3 data extracted without using cipher
• All of the Grineer spy rooms with no alarm raised and 3 data extracted without using cipher
• All of the Kuva spy rooms with no alarm raised and 3 data extracted without using cipher
• All of the Uranus spy rooms with no alarm raised and 3 data extracted without using cipher
• All of the Lua spy rooms with no alarm raised and 3 data extracted without using cipher
• All of the boss fights with 0 revive
• 20 minute survival on MOT (Void) 0 revive
• 40 wave defense on Sechura (Pluto) 0 revive
• Hijack (level 30 and above) 0 revive
• Capture (level 30 and above) 0 revive
• Rescue (level 30 and above)  with no alarm raised and prisoner not downed with 0 revive
• One of each of the Sabotage missions with 3 resource caches extracted and 0 revive
  
  
  I suppose given the ability to solo sortie if you can qualify all of the above, a team is not needed.
  
  
  Added awesomeness check list for challenges
  
  Solo Yodyanoi (Sedna level 80 - 85 arena)  [I did it with Mesa spamming peacemaker]
  Solo Amarna (Sedna dark sector survival) Melee only 20 minutes with 0 revives

Edited September 17, 2018 by Ada_Wong_SG

[W4RM3CH4N1C]

To the OP, i actually kinda like the idea, we've been talking about this in clan, things like Primes requiring non-prime variant parts to craft, rather than straight up "skip to the end/best"

Sortie qualifiers should technically be TWW quest but alas it won't prepare you for someone who simply wants to be carried.

E.g. if Spy missions actually had 4 vaults then one player wouldn't be left feeling like he's a spare wheel in a 4 man squad.

I think the main issue is people who are clearly under geared for the task in hand, join sortie and will get specifically carried (whether they expected to or not is another matter), and still have not learnt anything.

[xcenic]

I hate spy sorties due the rate of failing with random PUG. And more i hate the reason that i need to do it alone adding the fact its take me more time to get the 3 data than a full party with competent player. And DE know people hate it, and that i s the reason Spy sortie are now at 60% of proc. 

Sadly the only thing we can do to prevent bad time its solo sortie.

mobile defence: Solo Limbo

Spy:  Solo Ivara

Defence: Solo Octavia

Assesination: Depend the boss: Solo mesa, Mag, Oberon

Hijack: Solo Inaros

More and More High rank are preferring to solo sorties, including me. 

[-Temp0-]

В 14.09.2018 в 01:33, Almagnus1 сказал:

DE should have the following missions as a sortie qualifier, done at Sortie 1 difficulty solo without items and none of the usual sortie modifiers:

• All of the Corpus spy rooms
• All of the Grineer spy rooms
• All of the Kuva spy rooms
• All of the Uranus spy rooms
• All of the Lua spy rooms
• All of the boss fights
• 5 minute survival
• 5 wave defense
• Hijack
• Capture
• Rescue
• One of each of the Sabotage missions

If a player can do all of the above, then they get to sortie, otherwise they're locked out of sorties until they complete the qualifier.

So one would assume you're qualified and can do all of the above. Now's the question,

Why the **** you join pug instead of solving them solo if you can do it and already did it?

Цитата

So, why should we expect public groups to suck?

Cause most players suck. And the only reason why most join public especially spy is that they suck so badly they can't complete it unless they get carried.

Цитата

Also, why Lua spy as part of your list? It never pops as a sortie spy.

It does. But rarely.

Edited September 17, 2018 by -Temp0-

[SneakyErvin]

The problem with threads like these is that they try to imply that sorties are actually hard and that they need some pointless gating tests.

[Erytroxylin]

How does this help? They will just retry it till they get an easy one like I used to do on Weekly Ayatan runs. Then they will still not know anything. It takes practice to learn, and nobody is going to practice sortie style run without either being forced to(bad game design), or being given appropriate sortie level reward for it. Pub sortie is what it is. If you don't like it, then you can fix your own issues by doing solo or making a group of friends to do it with, like your clan. That way you have a better experience without harming someone else. 

What you are asking for is instead to make the experience worse for others to make it better for yourself, and that's not cool man. Not the Tenno way.

Edited September 17, 2018 by Erytroxylin

[KotoKuraken]

I have a very simple solution:

Do the Sortie completely solo if you can't trust other people. Or invite some friends, if you have any

You get to complete the Sortie without worrying about other people failing (I trust you can do the Sortie solo considering your proposal for "qualifications"), and the rest of everyone else gets to attempt Sorties like normal

Edited September 17, 2018 by KotoKuraken
Kittens and Tentacles

[(XBOX)zThulsaDoomz]

The bottom line is, you play Public, you get random teammates.  RANDOM, as in you may get 3 experienced players where it all goes smooth, 3 who will struggle, or a something in between.  This thread is highly elitist and the 'solutions' to this non-existent problem are laughable.  I'll say it again, in no way is this thread serious, and should be treated as such...

[Ovakyn]

On 2018-09-13 at 2:33 PM, Almagnus1 said:

DE should have the following missions as a sortie qualifier, done at Sortie 1 difficulty solo without items and none of the usual sortie modifiers:

• All of the Corpus spy rooms
• All of the Grineer spy rooms
• All of the Kuva spy rooms
• All of the Uranus spy rooms
• All of the Lua spy rooms
• All of the boss fights
• 5 minute survival
• 5 wave defense
• Hijack
• Capture
• Rescue
• One of each of the Sabotage missions

If a player can do all of the above, then they get to sortie, otherwise they're locked out of sorties until they complete the qualifier.

I'll agree if I get 20k mastery for doing it all.

[Rakosta_Kai]

On 2018-09-13 at 11:33 AM, Almagnus1 said:

DE should have the following missions as a sortie qualifier, done at Sortie 1 difficulty solo without items and none of the usual sortie modifiers:

• All of the Corpus spy rooms
• All of the Grineer spy rooms
• All of the Kuva spy rooms
• All of the Uranus spy rooms
• All of the Lua spy rooms
• All of the boss fights
• 5 minute survival
• 5 wave defense
• Hijack
• Capture
• Rescue
• One of each of the Sabotage missions

If a player can do all of the above, then they get to sortie, otherwise they're locked out of sorties until they complete the qualifier.

I'm really torn on this one as the intent behind the idea is something I completely disagree with (a useless hurdle that would get cheesed in days).

But the idea, itself, is great (imo) with a few extra flourishes...

Give all of these missions a Sortie 1 modifier in solo Modifier option requires is be completed once per week, month, or (ideally imo)season but can be done as much as once a day for extra rewards.

Once completed, it could open up a new daily sortie category and the ability to choose rewards rewards from a list or tokens to purchase better rewards for that season.

[(XBOX)zThulsaDoomz]

5 minutes ago, Almagnus1 said:

And this reads like someone is afraid they'd fail the qualifier, so has to fight tooth and nail against something because they know they'd never sortie again if it was implemented.

Maybe you're really the type of player that makes the public spy missions hell for the rest of its?

And I'll say again, yes, it is a serious thread.  Just because you don't like it doesn't mean it's not serious.

Bait 2/10

I run solo sorties, so this wouldn't affect me at all.  But it would affect a vast majority of other players due to your failure to either recruit your own team, play solo, or accept that YOU made the conscious decision to enter public matchmaking and proceed to come whining on the forums when you got random results with random teammates.  You have to be willfully dense to not see the flaws in your own 'reasoning', 

Attempting to filter out players because they don't perform according to your standards in public matchmaking is a joke, and attempting to goad someone instead of presenting a reasonable case for this.....idea shows us a lot about the kind of player you really are.

 

 

[FireSegment]

On 2018-09-14 at 3:53 AM, Almagnus1 said:

... Have you ever seen a public spy mission sortie?

At least forcing players to complete all the spy chambers once with the usual sortie settings would help with that situation tremendously because players would either need to figure out how to cheese the chamber so they can complete it, or they'd actually be forced to learn how to complete that spy chamber.

oh ... so then even if they newbie player actually found someone who willing to carry him, or show and instruct him on how to do it in mission, they still being locked away from it? because they have to complete EVERY irrelevant spy mission before they can even start a sortie? everybody would just not doing sortie 

And may i ask you, even if everyone already done that requirement, what would ensure that they remember how to solve it 6 month later when Lua spy show up again? (not counting the fact that player suppose to run spy multiple time to really understand the in and out of it) 

face it dude, your problem may be real but your solution is S#&$. frame it as a requirement do not help anybody, your proposal would only make pub sortie became as desert as the rest of the star map.

[Almagnus1]

39 minutes ago, (XB1)Thy Divinity said:

Bait 2/10

0/10 Needs more thought plz.

39 minutes ago, (XB1)Thy Divinity said:

I run solo sorties, so this wouldn't affect me at all.

Then why are you commenting in this thread?  This isn't for you, it doesn't affect you, so why are you here?

39 minutes ago, (XB1)Thy Divinity said:

But it would affect a vast majority of other players due to your failure to either recruit your own team, play solo, or accept that YOU made the conscious decision to enter public matchmaking and proceed to come whining on the forums when you got random results with random teammates.  You have to be willfully dense to not see the flaws in your own 'reasoning', 

So what's wrong with asking for tools to help raise the bar a bit and ensure that the public matchmaking experience isn't a complete disaster in certain sortie mission types?

As far as the vast majority of players, once they complete the qualifier, they wouldn't need to touch it again, so it's a bit of an inconvenience that will (in the long run) make everyone's life better because everyone will have demonstrated basic competency for the sortie missions so the missions should have less facepalm inducing frustration because people don't know how to do things.  There's nothing wrong with putting a final exam of sorts into the game to ensure that things go as expected, especially when most solo games (especially certain Zeldas) do so with the final boss for a given level.

39 minutes ago, (XB1)Thy Divinity said:

Attempting to filter out players because they don't perform according to your standards in public matchmaking is a joke, and attempting to goad someone instead of presenting a reasonable case for this.....idea shows us a lot about the kind of player you really are.

So like how you're goading me into giving an emotional response by weaving flame and insult into your response, especially when it's something that won't affect you in the least?

If you're the opposition and as unreasonable as you are, I need not do anything other than let you talk to have you disprove yourself for me.

[Almagnus1]

33 minutes ago, FireSegment said:

oh ... so then even if they newbie player actually found someone who willing to carry him, or show and instruct him on how to do it in mission, they still being locked away from it? because they have to complete EVERY irrelevant spy mission before they can even start a sortie? everybody would just not doing sortie 

I highly doubt that, especially if the only way to get rivens are in sorties.  That said, the current sortie rewards need an across the board increase so providing more incentive to run with decent rewards would go a long way to providing players incentive to complete the qualifier.

33 minutes ago, FireSegment said:

And may i ask you, even if everyone already done that requirement, what would ensure that they remember how to solve it 6 month later when Lua spy show up again? (not counting the fact that player suppose to run spy multiple time to really understand the in and out of it) 

Most recommend either Ivara or Loki for spy missions, and how do you get Ivara?

33 minutes ago, FireSegment said:

face it dude, your problem may be real but your solution is S#&$. frame it as a requirement do not help anybody, your proposal would only make pub sortie became as desert as the rest of the star map.

So do you have another way to resolve the issue, or are you here just saying mine sucks?

[FireSegment]

 

54 minutes ago, Almagnus1 said:

Most recommend either Ivara or Loki for spy missions, and how do you get Ivara?

Not from Lua spy, at least in my case cuz it got her long before Lua is a thing. And also side note, but any1 who complete 2nd dream prob already run spy uranus (mostly solo i imagine) already cuz of the quests

edit: my point in the original post is that even if they cheesed it, they won't remember how to when the next time they need to do it come, so the requirement are pointless 

54 minutes ago, Almagnus1 said:

So do you have another way to resolve the issue, or are you here just saying mine sucks?

the emphasis is "may be" because it may look like a problem that need a fix from your side, but a non-issues for others. There are always that "solo" setting in matchmaking and the option of invite some1 to help. There are still that great feeling of seeing a sorties spy going smoothly with every1 each take a vault. There are still ppl that don't mind carrying all 3 vault and not care much if even if the mission failed (and the rarest of allL seeing a failed squad do not disband and trying the 2nd time). 

My guess is that the "There are still that great feeling of seeing a sorties spy going smoothly with every1 each take a vault" is the result you looking for when you propose the idea, which is good but ... eww ... nah it won't work.

If the devs want to address this problem, they have much more powerful tool to use than "requirement" and "solo" tatic that only clans using for their rank up test.

so ... yeah mainly just saying your idea suck, but .... more than that i hope.

54 minutes ago, Almagnus1 said:

I highly doubt that, especially if the only way to get rivens are in sorties.  That said, the current sortie rewards need an across the board increase so providing more incentive to run with decent rewards would go a long way to providing players incentive to complete the qualifier.

It's not about the reward dude.

Edited September 17, 2018 by FireSegment

[puppycorpse]

This is beyond stupid.  Probably had a bad experience like some people and thought crying here would make a difference. Just let it go and play the game.

[Cubewano]

6 hours ago, SneakyErvin said:

The problem with threads like these is that they try to imply that sorties are actually hard and that they need some pointless gating tests.

Apparently they are since you still run into people who need carrying/have no idea what they are doing in them. Sorties may not be challenging to competent players, but that seems like the point of the requirements, to make sure you are the base line of capable before doing sorties. For those who find sorties ez mode these challenges should be a cake walk if even that. 

[Aleksundar]

I would normally say yes, but a solo modifier t3 interception sortie would be pretty frickin difficult to anyone other then the best of players

[Almagnus1]

4 minutes ago, Aleksundar said:

I would normally say yes, but a solo modifier t3 interception sortie would be pretty frickin difficult to anyone other then the best of players

That's why I left interception off of the requirements, as it's intended to be a baseline check, rather than a fully exhaustive skills assessment.  However, in the case of spy missions, when one chamber goes south the entire mission is over at that point.

[(XBOX)Arxcervus]

Do we have to have Gjallarhorn too?🤔

[(PSN)supernova_girlie]

I kind of agree with OP. Hear me out on this...

The Uranus spy missions and anything to do with Lua that is not just an exterminate or survival should be something anyone coming in to a sortie should be familiar with in order for things to go a little more smoothly. Full disclosure: there's one spy "puzzle" on Lua that I have trouble with and I just did that Lua rescue for the first time like a week or two ago. Also, a lot of players are not aware that they don't have to hack the initial consoles on certain rescue missions and that there are alternate routes to reach the hostage. I think it's only fair that players coming into sorties should be familiar with the objectives to some degree.

[Rakosta_Kai]

32 minutes ago, (PS4)supernova_girlie said:

I kind of agree with OP. Hear me out on this...

The Uranus spy missions and anything to do with Lua that is not just an exterminate or survival should be something anyone coming in to a sortie should be familiar with in order for things to go a little more smoothly. Full disclosure: there's one spy "puzzle" on Lua that I have trouble with and I just did that Lua rescue for the first time like a week or two ago. Also, a lot of players are not aware that they don't have to hack the initial consoles on certain rescue missions and that there are alternate routes to reach the hostage. I think it's only fair that players coming into sorties should be familiar with the objectives to some degree.

Everything you say is true but it still boils down to the fact that you undertake that risk playing in group for Sorties (likely knowingly).

There are some missions where a Pug won't hurt the chances you complete the mission, some where a group is ideal, and others where the chance of success drops the more people there are in it with you. 

IMO, if everyone who could complete spy sorties solo chose to only run them that way for 6 months, what you would have is a bunch more people capable of doing spy sorties solo by necessity.