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Chroma needs a rework


Aleksi134
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vor 3 Minuten schrieb (PS4)skingsrt8:

"Fire breathing dragon....."  His description is completely overstated for what he actually delivers.  Not going to dive in to thoughts on ability changes because there are already alot of good suggestions.  Just want to support the cause for a rework.  Right now he is more like a gecko with a zippo lighter and a can of hairspray. 

currently chroma just exhales "warm" air... pretty far away from breathing fire

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4 hours ago, Dark_Chroma said:

Wrong forum section, please report your thread so one of the mods can pull it there

Where exactly DOES this go to?

Fan concepts? Fan Zone? TennoGen + Steam Workshop?

There's literally no other good place to talk about a Chroma rework than the General Discussion threads where there are way more people that would talk about this and spark a big wave for the subject to spread and grow with ideas brainstorming between everyone.

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vor 6 Stunden schrieb Walkampf:

Changes to Elemental Ward

Disclaimer: Heat, Cold and Electric are fine in my personal opinion, the problemchild is Toxic.

Changes to Effigy

- Damage per second is effected by Vex Armors Fury buff.

- Effigy creates a second Aura of Elemental Ward and Vex Armor Auras, so the effects are not only granted by being near Chroma but also by being near his effigy, which is essentially part of him. (Of course, when players are effected by both instances those two don't stack, that whould be a bit overkill.)

Changes to Guided Effigy

- Damage is effected by Vex Armors Fury buff.

Elemental Ward: to improve the ice chroma tank the ice elemental ward needs to impact chromas "base armor" - as a result vex armor armor buff would scale with the higher "base armor". i can understand that if mods are included this dmg reduction would be kinda high but having the ice elemental ward synergize with vex armor would be good.

 

As you said Effigy should be affected by Vex Armor - not fury but both buffs. this would grant the turret way more survivability at higher levels.

or

another rework idea would be that Effigy becomes kinda a rage mode for Chroma. Having those 10energy/sec at base is allready high and most chroma builds i know go ateast at 70% efficency if not even 45% (as i do) - so its usually only up for a few seconds. -> to the actually rework: make effigy hover above chroma all the time - this helps with enemies being discracted and shooting at effigy incresing chromas overall survivability - and having effigy dish out a tone of dmg (scales with vex armor fury only).

 

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1 hour ago, Syfox97 said:

Where exactly DOES this go to?

Fan concepts? Fan Zone? TennoGen + Steam Workshop?

There's literally no other good place to talk about a Chroma rework than the General Discussion threads where there are way more people that would talk about this and spark a big wave for the subject to spread and grow with ideas brainstorming between everyone.

Feedback, warframes&abilities

 

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9 hours ago, m0b1us1 said:

You didn't play him that much if you think he is currently an "endless" tank. Before the nerf, he could get ludicrous amounts of EHP, now its a fraction of that. Endless tank would max out power strength and duration while leaving out range (because it was worthless for tank) and eff due to his high duration.

So what you are playing is the "new" Chroma, which is a fraction as tanky as the old Chroma and only useful in eidolons. Also that is the problem with Chroma, DE tried to shove him in the support role because he was one shotting eidolons due to the vex armor bug being applied multiple times to dual elemental stat damage.

If you are going 'support' then you aren't tanking range, which is pretty indicative that you haven't gone full tank. Before the nerf the only shared buff he had was on his ward, which would drop the moment an ally left your range (if they were close to you to begin with) unless you had the augment.

So no, Chroma is NOT in a great spot, unless you play eidolons. Outside of that he is a terribly unreliable and grossly overgated frame for what he brings. Just bring a rhino who is just as tanky, provides instant AoE damage buff, and has great CC. As for a "support", all he does is press 2 buttons and walks around his team. Even Trin has more interesting game play than that, Rhino has CC and a 1 that with an augment makes him crazy tanky, Oberon heals + CCs + armor buffs, so don't see how Chroma is in a great place for that playstyle. All you do is push 2 buttons, get damaged, and walk around.

Sure, he does well in eidolons. Though I loved to play him back when he was a monster of a tank and not just an over glorified aura machine.

He can easily go 60+ minutes in Mot. I use effigy for the mobility increase and the aggro draw on top of his 2 and 3... Have u played chroma in a while? Hes pretty great. Just needs tweaks

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vor 19 Minuten schrieb (PS4)big_eviljak:

He can easily go 60+ minutes in Mot. I use effigy for the mobility increase and the aggro draw on top of his 2 and 3... Have u played chroma in a while? Hes pretty great. Just needs tweaks

exactly 60min thats the point. before you could easily go 3hours. i once did 2 1/2 but forgot to do solo and had to go so i couldnt pause.... but currently he is just weak compared to his former days. i know bringing him back to the old tankyness wont happen - and speaking of the dmg buff. that will stay as it is. but chroma needs other abilities that synergize with his 3. or atleast support eachother somewhat. currently none of the abilities are affecting each other. i mean effigy would allready be way better if it would be buffed by fury. but that his own abilities dont work hand in hand just show how bad his overall ability design is. looking at the past released frames each ability usually interacted with one another. chroma doesnt do that. and i think that should change. he doesnt need a buff to his 3. but his other abilities should work with his 3. eg including ice elemental ward armor buff into the multiplication of vex armor. so the ability synergizes. (not speaking of poison and electricity they are just bad)

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ice vex armor would be fine if it just synergize with vex armor - currently vex armor multiplies base armor and than adds elemtal wards armor and mods. id like to see: vex armor*(basearmor+elemental ward armor)+mods. this way it would instantly make him tankier. making the ice the perfect ank choice and fire the healing choice... because atm fire is way stronger than ice in tankyness and in healing aspects.

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1 minute ago, DeadlyCreation said:

ice vex armor would be fine if it just synergize with vex armor - currently vex armor multiplies base armor and than adds elemtal wards armor and mods. id like to see: vex armor*(basearmor+elemental ward armor)+mods. this way it would instantly make him tankier. making the ice the perfect ank choice and fire the healing choice... because atm fire is way stronger than ice in tankyness and in healing aspects.

While I agree with wanting vex armor to better synergize with elemental ward, i disagree with fire being good for healing. It currently only applies a health buff. While it’s good when you’re in a pinch, it only lasts so long, and you’ll have to restore your health back to full some other way. It’s still my favorite element to use though, so i guess it’s got that going for it. My idea directly reinforces yours, Fire being used for healing. It might not be much, but it would be enough to restore your health a decent amount before the buff expires.

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vor 7 Minuten schrieb MrTitan123:

While I agree with wanting vex armor to better synergize with elemental ward, i disagree with fire being good for healing. It currently only applies a health buff. While it’s good when you’re in a pinch, it only lasts so long, and you’ll have to restore your health back to full some other way. It’s still my favorite element to use though, so i guess it’s got that going for it. My idea directly reinforces yours, Fire being used for healing. It might not be much, but it would be enough to restore your health a decent amount before the buff expires.

yeah true.. its not really "healing". i have my arcanes that do the job

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34 minutes ago, (PS4)big_eviljak said:

He can easily go 60+ minutes in Mot. I use effigy for the mobility increase and the aggro draw on top of his 2 and 3... Have u played chroma in a while? Hes pretty great. Just needs tweaks

So you used effigy to draw aggro, and kept up a max power strength vex armor and ward while not tanking your range? You aren't playing full tank lol.

The unreliability of effigy aside, that is an insane amount of energy consumption. If you use rage, then the effigy drawing aggro makes your energy regen unreliable, can't use zenurik because effigy is channel, and this gets into the problem with new Chroma. You need to build every single stat except for shields and sprint speed, so you aren't even playing with a high power strength Chroma unless you have an unhealthy addiction to energy pizzas. I can guarantee you that you aren't playing Chroma to his fullest tank capability and never have. An hour in Mot for old Chroma? A walk in the park.

I have played Chroma recently, and still do pick him up from time to time, although much less since old Chroma because new Chroma is pretty much a complete inferior version of old Chroma. Look, you can think what you want, but the reality is that he isn't "pretty great". He went from a monstrously strong tank to a one trick pony giving aura buffs to kill eidolons. As a tank, he isn't nearly as much of a damage soak as before. All we want is for him to be a solid tank in missions other than eidolons.

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56 minutes ago, DeadlyCreation said:

exactly 60min thats the point. before you could easily go 3hours. i once did 2 1/2 but forgot to do solo and had to go so i couldnt pause.... but currently he is just weak compared to his former days. i know bringing him back to the old tankyness wont happen - and speaking of the dmg buff. that will stay as it is. but chroma needs other abilities that synergize with his 3. or atleast support eachother somewhat. currently none of the abilities are affecting each other. i mean effigy would allready be way better if it would be buffed by fury. but that his own abilities dont work hand in hand just show how bad his overall ability design is. looking at the past released frames each ability usually interacted with one another. chroma doesnt do that. and i think that should change. he doesnt need a buff to his 3. but his other abilities should work with his 3. eg including ice elemental ward armor buff into the multiplication of vex armor. so the ability synergizes. (not speaking of poison and electricity they are just bad)

i disagree. nova, one of the top tier frames powers does not have any synergy within her kit. frames dont HAVE to have powers that work off each other to but usefull or powerful. there is also banshee. forcing synergy just to have it when it is not necessary? why?

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this thread still kicking? good. as for my opinion and i will try not to make it too long but here we go. also some bits are based some some things i have saw, or watched that i thought would be neat implementing.

make elemental wards current buffs his passive health fire, ice armor, electric shields, and toxin reload.

make effigy his first ability and have it open 2 ways of playing with his abilities one being a slow tank uses its abilities to control the environment. and have the other side be more speedy attacker that deals damage with fire arms and melee. if nessasary make the credit booster of old effigy as a augment. and make it a duration. ps i thought of this idea from remembering some old clips of dragon ball z where they dropped weighted gear.

rework elemental ward simbolise his wings and have it boost mobility with jumps & glides while giving a large trail, like a slow nezha but more based on jumping and gliding rather then speeds.

have vex armor give stats depending on which mode chroma is in. with higher defense in pelt and higher weapon damage out of pelt.

take spectral scream and rework it into a great active 4th ability, have chroma be able to store extra damage that he takes from enemies where he can release it in a extra long range narrowish breath beam. thought of this from remembering watching godzilla resurgence.

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vor 5 Minuten schrieb EinheriarJudith:

i disagree. nova, one of the top tier frames powers does not have any synergy within her kit. frames dont HAVE to have powers that work off each other to but usefull or powerful. there is also banshee. forcing synergy just to have it when it is not necessary? why?

yeah and i think that nova needs a rework.. she has literally one good ability. and as DE has shown with saryn they dont like the "press one key to win" frames. so i think nova needs a rework. yes.

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vor 3 Minuten schrieb maddragonmaster:

this thread still kicking? good. as for my opinion and i will try not to make it too long but here we go. also some bits are based some some things i have saw, or watched that i thought would be neat implementing.

make elemental wards current buffs his passive health fire, ice armor, electric shields, and toxin reload.

make effigy his first ability and have it open 2 ways of playing with his abilities one being a slow tank uses its abilities to control the environment. and have the other side be more speedy attacker that deals damage with fire arms and melee. if nessasary make the credit booster of old effigy as a augment. and make it a duration. ps i thought of this idea from remembering some old clips of dragon ball z where they dropped weighted gear.

rework elemental ward simbolise his wings and have it boost mobility with jumps & glides while giving a large trail, like a slow nezha but more based on jumping and gliding rather then speeds.

have vex armor give stats depending on which mode chroma is in. with higher defense in pelt and higher weapon damage out of pelt.

take spectral scream and rework it into a great active 4th ability, have chroma be able to store extra damage that he takes from enemies where he can release it in a extra long range narrowish breath beam. thought of this from remembering watching godzilla resurgence.

also i would love to see effigy hovering above chroma. so maybe holding down the ability makes it switch from passive to follow. so it feels more like the duality augment from equinox. chroma fights along his pelt and not letting it stand somewhere... it just feels out of place for me.

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2 minutes ago, DeadlyCreation said:

also i would love to see effigy hovering above chroma. so maybe holding down the ability makes it switch from passive to follow. so it feels more like the duality augment from equinox. chroma fights along his pelt and not letting it stand somewhere... it just feels out of place for me.

yeah and a interesting thing i would like to point out is the fact that having chroma's abilities be slightly similar to some frames can kind of fit due to how he is. he is basiclly a ember, volt, saryn, frost, and with a spice of rhino all rolled into one framed and flavored with dragon and a berserker like play style.

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maybe having his poison and electric taking over new aspects of protection. atm fire gives health, ice gives armor.. so if poison could give a resistance to status procs and electric aresistsnce to knockdown + giving the extra shields would be nice. 

Edited by DeadlyCreation
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3 hours ago, m0b1us1 said:

So you used effigy to draw aggro, and kept up a max power strength vex armor and ward while not tanking your range? You aren't playing full tank lol.

The unreliability of effigy aside, that is an insane amount of energy consumption. If you use rage, then the effigy drawing aggro makes your energy regen unreliable, can't use zenurik because effigy is channel, and this gets into the problem with new Chroma. You need to build every single stat except for shields and sprint speed, so you aren't even playing with a high power strength Chroma unless you have an unhealthy addiction to energy pizzas. I can guarantee you that you aren't playing Chroma to his fullest tank capability and never have. An hour in Mot for old Chroma? A walk in the park.

I have played Chroma recently, and still do pick him up from time to time, although much less since old Chroma because new Chroma is pretty much a complete inferior version of old Chroma. Look, you can think what you want, but the reality is that he isn't "pretty great". He went from a monstrously strong tank to a one trick pony giving aura buffs to kill eidolons. As a tank, he isn't nearly as much of a damage soak as before. All we want is for him to be a solid tank in missions other than eidolons.

Im not running max power strength no... There's no need. Besides im 40 years old and anymore than 60 mins and im peeing my pants lol.

I play chroma much more now than i did his older counter part. I use effigy in bursts... Pop effigy in the middle of a group of mobs... Run out in the open, parkour into the air, ground slam with jat kittag right in the middle,  pull effigy back... or Pull out gram or Galatine... Broken bull everyone into the abyss... Rinse repeat.

All the while keeping up with vex armor... Zenurik keeps energy up enough, and provided i stay mobile i dont have a lick of issues. 

That being said, a duration effigy would bring a huge QoL change over the energy per second.

Edited by (PS4)big_eviljak
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vor 23 Minuten schrieb (PS4)big_eviljak:

Im not running max power strength no... There's no need. Besides im 40 years old and anymore than 60 mins and im peeing my pants lol.

I play chroma much more now than i did his older counter part. I use effigy in bursts... Pop effigy in the middle of a group of mobs... Run out in the open, parkour into the air, ground slam with jat kittag right in the middle,  pull effigy back... or Pull out gram or Galatine... Broken bull everyone into the abyss... Rinse repeat.

All the while keeping up with vex armor... Zenurik keeps energy up enough, and provided i stay mobile i dont have a lick of issues. 

That being said, a duration effigy would bring a huge QoL change over the energy per second.

duration effigy would be huge! yeah from a casual perpesctive thus sounds good but if you want to go as far as possible chroma went from one of the best to mediocre. 

the fix for his vex armor is good and understandable but now he is lacking in power. he is just okay in every aspect. he does nothing great (vex armor being the best about him and his 1 and 4 the worst).  i honestly thing that changing some little things could make his while ability kit work we better together than before.

eg weaken effigy overal but make it being buffed by vex armor and duration based. and voila you have a synergy with the ultimate.

elemental wards eöements needs some tweaks aswell but i have stated solutions more than enough allready.

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42 minutes ago, DeadlyCreation said:

duration effigy would be huge! yeah from a casual perpesctive thus sounds good but if you want to go as far as possible chroma went from one of the best to mediocre. 

the fix for his vex armor is good and understandable but now he is lacking in power. he is just okay in every aspect. he does nothing great (vex armor being the best about him and his 1 and 4 the worst).  i honestly thing that changing some little things could make his while ability kit work we better together than before.

eg weaken effigy overal but make it being buffed by vex armor and duration based. and voila you have a synergy with the ultimate.

elemental wards eöements needs some tweaks aswell but i have stated solutions more than enough allready.

while i agree with the ideas of making effigy a better 4th ability i still hate it because it is a rooted ability that only draws mobs away and does some of the dragony stuff that i want to be doing instead of it.

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Rework or nah? I feel like his rework will drop the same day his Prime Access does (surprise, surprise!). 

Please give us some insight on him! Hints? Clues? Developer Workshop?

I would 100% buy his Prime Access if he'd get a rework, because he looks incredible. However, if no rework is due, I don't think I'll buy the access for the same stale, passiveless, monotonous and one-dimensional "dragon" 😔

Edited by (PS4)LoisGordils
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Rework or nah? I feel like his rework will drop the same day his Prime Access does (surprise, surprise!). 

Please give us some insight on him! Hints? Clues? Developer Workshop?

I would 100% buy his Prime Access if he'd get a rework, because he looks incredible. However, if no rework is due, I don't think I'll buy the access for the same stale, passiveless, monotonous and one-dimensional "dragon" 😔

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6 minutes ago, (PS4)LoisGordils said:

Rework or nah? I feel like his rework will drop the same day his Prime Access does (surprise, surprise!). 

Please give us some insight on him! Hints? Clues? Developer Workshop?

I would 100% buy his Prime Access if he'd get a rework, because he looks incredible. However, if no rework is due, I don't think I'll buy the access for the same stale, passiveless, monotonous and one-dimensional "dragon" 😔

i i might buy him. but i would advice that it might be better if they sell him a bit more cheaper if they don't include a rework since his abilities are too stressful to build around compare to other frames. cause i at least want to have at least some feel like a rampaging dragon/knight/berserker from him. yet all i feel is a berserkery form of rhino with elemental powers that trickle out like a sprinkler.

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