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[DE]Rebecca

Daily Tribute Dev Workshop Part 2!

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Just now, InappropriateTennoName5009 said:

thats not evergreen choice a...

 

My bad, didn't see the "A". I only really want the kuva, forma, and weapon slots. Would be nice to never buy weapon slots again. 

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3 minutes ago, (XB1)Architect Prime said:

My bad, didn't see the "A". I only really want the kuva, forma, and weapon slots. Would be nice to never buy weapon slots again. 

at close to 3 years of logging in everyday(1050 days) its kinda hard to see how you dont have plat weapons slots and more forma than you could ever use tbh

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1 hour ago, (PS4)big_eviljak said:

I disagree... I have tons of warframe slots but am always running out of weapon slots as i got rid of many weapons early in my day and now are getting them back little by little...

2 weapon slots cost 12p

3 riven slots cost 60p and eventually max out at 90 slots.

There are a finite amount of weapons.

There are an infinite amount of riven combinations.

 

You can easily sell a riven for 12p or more depending on the riven, in the pursuit of purchasing a weapon slot.

Dont expect everybody else to be punished for your bad decisions. Weapon slots are a terrible idea no matter how you slice it.

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2 hours ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

1000 and beyond!

Starting at Day 1050, Evergreen reward choices will be rotated every 50 Days though the following options:

Evergreen Choices A (choose one):
3 x Forma
3 x Exilus Adapter
4 x Weapon Slots

Evergreen Choices B (choose one):
50,000 Kuva
7-day Boosters (Affinity, Credits, Resource)
30,000 Endo

Evergreen Choices C (choose one):
3 x Rifle Riven
3 x Melee Riven
3 x Secondary Riven

I don't understand this. Are we presented with one of option A, B, and C - in that I could get 3 Forma, and 3 Exilus Adapters, and 4 weapon slots OR 9 Rivens every 50 days? Or are we picking one of the three options from A on 1050, one of the three options from B on 1100, one of the three options from C on 1150, etc?

Our feedback is intended to help ensure that these rewards, especially the 1000+ evergreen rewards, remain gratifying for veteran players (who already have endo, forma, and rivens). In order to do that, we need to be clearly and unambiguously informed about these proposed changes.

If the reality is the latter situation, I feel it could be improved. I personally don't like or want rivens in my rotation. But if I'm getting them every 150 days whether I want them or not, I don't feel like I have much agency over my evergreen rewards, and when I approach them I won't be particularly motivated to login. The former explanation seems far less plausible, so this concerns me.

Some clarity would be appreciated.

Edited by Xavier
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2 hours ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

Starting at Day 1050, Evergreen reward choices will be rotated every 50 Days though the following options:

Evergreen Choices A (choose one):
3 x Forma
3 x Exilus Adapter
4 x Weapon Slots 

Why are weapon slots locked behind 1000 hours of play, we need them EARLIER not later.

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1 hour ago, (PS4)big_eviljak said:

Play the game or dont. Dont look for all the rewards without the effort.

So much effort typing in your password everyday. This isn't about wanting all the rewards without the effort. It's about the idea that a video game should not permanently remove or delay my ability to get cool things because I had family in the emergency room and couldn't log on. The system needs to be forgiving enough to not punish us because we have real life obligations. Don't get me wrong I'm happy with the changes because they at least let us skip to the good bits, but don't lie to people about daily login requiring any effort or loyalty. And especially don't lie about it rewarding those things either because there is nothing it does better than punish loyal players for just having more important things than one video game.

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On 2018-10-02 at 5:52 AM, [DE]Rebecca said:

Next: Milestones!

On the major Milestone days (every 50 days between 0-1000) you will be presented with up to 3 Choices! These choices will still respect the original chronological release, and by the next time you reach a given category, you'll see a new item appear in place of what you've already chosen (if applicable).

1. Sigils and Resources. Days 50,150,250, etc.
2. Primed Mods. Days 200,400,600, etc.
3. Weapons. Days 100,300,500, etc.

@[DE]Rebecca There must be some kind of mistake here. Primed Sure Footed is the login reward for day 900. If the Lodestar Armor Set is the reward for 1000 days and switches to to evergreen rewards on the next milestone, how will I be able to acquire the mod then? Have the people close to 900 been taken into account regarding this decision? I am only a week away from getting it.

Edited by CaesarSaladin
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1 minute ago, InappropriateTennoName5009 said:

at close to 3 years of logging in everyday(1050 days) its kinda hard to see how you dont have plat weapons slots and more forma than you could ever use tbh

It's not that I don't have that stuff now, it's that I'll never have to care about my supply since it'll be replenishing those things faster than new things come out. See?

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3 hours ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

Hello all - we have some changes to report since our last workshop that we wanted to lay out in writing for you!

First things first:
Cosmetic Tributes are back to permanent fixtures in your Warframe journey.
This means the Lodestar Syandana and the Lodestar Armor Set - they are married to day 800 / 1000 respectively.

Next: Milestones!

On the major Milestone days (every 50 days between 0-1000) you will be presented with up to 3 Choices! These choices will still respect the original chronological release, and by the next time you reach a given category, you'll see a new item appear in place of what you've already chosen (if applicable).

1. Sigils and Resources. Days 50,150,250, etc.
2. Primed Mods. Days 200,400,600, etc.
3. Weapons. Days 100,300,500, etc.

1000 and beyond!

Starting at Day 1050, Evergreen reward choices will be rotated every 50 Days though the following options:

Evergreen Choices A (choose one):
3 x Forma
3 x Exilus Adapter
4 x Weapon Slots

Evergreen Choices B (choose one):
50,000 Kuva
7-day Boosters (Affinity, Credits, Resource)
30,000 Endo

Evergreen Choices C (choose one):
3 x Rifle Riven
3 x Melee Riven
3 x Secondary Riven

Ok, it's cool to keep Lodestar armor/syandana at 800/1000. Eventhou 3 years of uninterrupted logins is truly uncalled for.

One thing I would consider is changing the pacing of Milestones. Make them 25 day intervals instead of 50. While keeping the 800/1000 ones. I know it might be hard (impossible?) to retroactively give truckloads of milestones to every player thou. But if it were introduced as some sort of a "skill tree/timeline" visualization that you can access after the change instead of forcing you to pick 10 milestones at once on login. This would reduce the time to get everything gameplay related within 1,5 years while giving a reason to play for 3+ years still. And having a greater impact with evergreens.

Also the 'Evergreens' should definitely be available on 100 days and onward. Or 50 and onward if pacing is reduced to 25 intervals. This would make the proposed rotations more appealing in general. And I mean that when you get to 100 days Milestone; You are presented with a following example choice:

Quote

Pick 1 out of 6: Azima/Zenistar/Zenith or 3Forma/3Exilus/4Slots

Also you should NOT BE FORCED to make the choice on login, but to have a choice to access the Login Milestone timeline/skilltree from Codex(?) and see how your choice will affect the upcoming options for next milestones. Aka; If I choose to take '4slots' on day 100, when will be the next time I can have access to Azima/Zenistar/Zenith or other RotA Evergreens? This is information I NEED TO KNOW when I'm making the final decision which item I pick. The game CANNOT assume that the player knows how the Milestone system is structured. It has to convey the information within the game before and after reaching the Milestone.

If the player has not progressed in game to have access to Kuva/Rivens these items should be shown as 'unknown' on the Milestone timeline/skilltree. Upon hovering over the 'unknown' milestone you are shown "complete The War Within quest to see this item". Ofc if you actually reach the Milestone which includes Kuva/rivens you can select them even if you haven't completed the quest yet. This scenario would still be highly unlikely imho. Or simply offer only Rotation A as evergreen until The War Within is completed?

If the player has not accessed the Milestone timeline/skilltree before the first Milestone, the player should be introduced to it right after.

There is a lot of opposite opinions concerning the Evergreen rotations. Some say that the values are ok and some say '3 forma is nothing' and 'I dont do anything with weapon slots after 1000 days'. Both sides are kind of right, because there is so many different situations progression-wise within the community. I think that changing the Milestone pacing to 25 days instead of 50 and introducing a timeline/skilltree would alleviate this issue. On top of making evergreens always an available choice after 2nd Milestone.

The Scaling changes seem good to me. We just need more content and resource sinks. Not one time heavy resource sinks like weapons (Hema), but something related to gameplay mechanics. Crafting costs for weapons/frames this year have been reasonable. Something that keeps us playing different planets dynamically with purpose and intent.

I'm not saying to retroactively double my login milestones, I'm saying that when I started playing Warframe and if I saw that I need to login for 3+ years to have all the stuff. I'd have never installed this game. I did not nor do play this game for the grind. I play it because how the gameplay feels, the mechanics, world/lore building. It encapsulates something that Half-Life series do. Gameplay fluidity, control, immersion, puzzles. If there is good content to play, I will sink an unhealthy amount of hours into this game. If there is only the grind for the sake of grind - I probably only pick up the login rewards for awhile; while waiting for something to use my resources on.

Don't make the gameplay easier, make it more challenging while making the rewards more impactful. I'm eager to see the new Jupiter rework and Fortuna enemy designs in gameplay aspect. Remove/replace the low tier bloat from highTier/uniqueLocation droptables. Example: Void (Hepit/Ukko) droptables after U23.9 - just replace the mods with relics and a 3% chance of Forma BP or something that actually feels good to have. All this ties together with the Login system and how it feels to acquire. The login system needs to support/augment your gameplay.

I hope this feedback helps. For perspective: I'm currently at 1033 days, which is 2 days behind the theoretical limit of Logins with almost 6k hours on Steam.

Edited by -Zr-Scroll
wording/phrasing/grammar
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Thanks for the update on this. 

I personally am a long way off from 1k logins, but the Riven reward choices seem a little odd.  I understand the appeal of 3x [weapon class] rewards if you have a particular weapon you want a Riven for, but what if you aren't looking for one particular weapon or class of weapon?  Or if you want shotgun Rivens?  I suspect that 3x shotgun packs might be considered a bit. . . much, depending on how you look at it; but maybe a 3x random class pack could be added in so that shotguns have some coverage from the rewards?

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1 hour ago, Drawer-san said:

Having a life is more effort than just loging in, but life comes first.

Everyo deserves a vacation.

 

So take a vacation... And wait for the rewards.

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12 minutes ago, DecadeX said:

So much effort typing in your password everyday. This isn't about wanting all the rewards without the effort. It's about the idea that a video game should not permanently remove or delay my ability to get cool things because I had family in the emergency room and couldn't log on. The system needs to be forgiving enough to not punish us because we have real life obligations. Don't get me wrong I'm happy with the changes because they at least let us skip to the good bits, but don't lie to people about daily login requiring any effort or loyalty. And especially don't lie about it rewarding those things either because there is nothing it does better than punish loyal players for just having more important things than one video game.

No punishment... Totally free rewards with as u said, little work involved. Is your family member in the e.r. every single day? 

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1 minute ago, (PS4)big_eviljak said:

No punishment... Totally free rewards with as u said, little work involved. Is your family member in the e.r. every single day? 

you know, there is some people whose Family may be on the room for a lot of time, just hope that yours won't be -_- 

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I do wonder if some purpose of a login system is getting lost because of all the fighting about the locked weapons and people with a lot of login days.

It's a system that's supposed to entice you to log in but really, 1000 days to finish the login system and go on to the evergreen rewards? I find it completely okay to lock the cosmetics at 800 and 1000 days (and by all means make them look good) but I think the system should go to evergreens a lot sooner and that way players don't need to have the expectation of getting some super rewards for logging in for 1000 days.

Like, is there any game out there that has a system that requires 1000 days of logging in to complete it? It's just completely absurd and of course it's not good for new players, it's completely unrealistic.

The pick and choose option is an improvement to player agency and investment. I like that but you should start evergreens at like 100 days or something (also, give a few weapon slots to new players). Like someone suggested, you can add the weapon/prime mod options into those rotations until players have selected them all.

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Glad to see these changes, the A evergreen rewards are a bit lacking but helpful anyways at least in a game like warframe that is always adding stuff or changing it.

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Is this retroactive? It would be nasty for people on 1002 days receiving the update on 1003 and missing the reward.

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So pretty much the 'pride and prestige' crybabies won and the rest of us are getting punished because of it.

Eh well. Some choice is better than none, the window-dressing of character greetings is nice, i do wish the resources given ramped up more but whatever.

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[DE]Rebecca Can we get an account anniversary login yearly? like a milestone login, but may with all past or maybe with the closest milestone as a reward

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If I'm going to be playing for 1000+ days and still need weapon slots I'm probably not playing the game 

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