Power Donation possibly detrimental to Speedva. Change Speedva?

[Zeclem]

2 minutes ago, Joe_Barbarian said:

Yeah because they are banging their heads against the wall with people like you that create niche situation and not let it go. Your niche situation isn't a problem, stop making a mountain out of an ant hill.

how the actual hell that simply mentioning a problem is "making a mountain out of an ant hill"? sheesh, fine. we shall all pretend game is all flawless and perfect and should never mention anything at all. thats a great way to have feedback from players isnt it? 

[Namah]

6 hours ago, (PS4)Taishin_Ishu said:

Tbf, Nova's Speed Up wasn't intentional to begin with...just kinda left it as a happy accident.  That being said....answer is simple:  Recruit, Talk to other Tenno.  It's not hard, and certainly not worth complaining about a new mod.

People complain about lack of content....but then complain about things we DO get.  Can't friggin' win...

For a co-op, people really do only think of themselves ... smfh..

So are you saying nobody should tell DE what's wrong?

[Zeclem]

2 minutes ago, Joe_Barbarian said:

Calm down and listen. You said that not everyone has time to squad up via recruit but if you are adamant on bringing a specific warframe and a specific build on that warframe then you resign yourself to any possible hiccups a public matchmaking will give you.

As you said:

im quite calm, it takes more than some pointless forumers commentary to unsettle me. and yes, people have every right to be able to use the builds they want without having its function completely changed by factors they got no control over. its not a problem for any other build or frame cept this one. but since you clearly got no interest in having a constructive discussion with anybody, im not going to bother explaining this situation again to you. enjoy your S#&$posting. 

[Blade_Wolf_16]

Everybody's talking about how it could make Speedva less effective, yet doesn't see how beneficial it can be for most frames and easely used by some to greatly help teammates. 

 

It's literaly 1 specific build for 1 specific frame. And besides, I prefer slowing down enemies in a 22m Radius with a Slowquinox (while reducing their damage on top of the attack speed) than speeding them up and greatly increasing their DPS just to make things go faster.

Imho, if you join PUGs just to cheese it as fast as possible, go solo or find a team that wants to do the mission fast. Tbh I think PUGs should be casual games with randos and pre-made squads for specific types of gameplay. 

[Taranus]

6 minutes ago, Blade_Wolf_16 said:

Everybody's talking about how it could make Speedva less effective, yet doesn't see how beneficial it can be for most frames and easely used by some to greatly help teammates. 

 

It's literaly 1 specific build for 1 specific frame. And besides, I prefer slowing down enemies in a 22m Radius with a Slowquinox (while reducing their damage on top of the attack speed) than speeding them up and greatly increasing their DPS just to make things go faster.

Imho, if you join PUGs just to cheese it as fast as possible, go solo or find a team that wants to do the mission fast. Tbh I think PUGs should be casual games with randos and pre-made squads for specific types of gameplay.  

Going solo isn't an option if you're trying to speed things up. The increase in DPS is irrelevant. Who cares if it's one specific build? It doesn't mean it isn't a problem. I'm only trying to provide feedback here, and bring this to everyone's attention.

 

Most people prefer to play Hydron with a Speedva, but who looks in recruiting for a group for Hydron? Or low level Fissures? People don't usually squad up for the things Speedva is used for.

Edited October 11, 2018 by Taranus

[Joe_Barbarian]

1 minute ago, Zeclem said:

im quite calm, it takes more than some pointless forumers commentary to unsettle me. and yes, people have every right to be able to use the builds they want without having its function completely changed by factors they got no control over. its not a problem for any other build or frame cept this one. but since you clearly got no interest in having a constructive discussion with anybody, im not going to bother explaining this situation again to you. enjoy your S#&$posting. 

You've yet to bring anything constructive to the discussion other than the entitled "I want to use what I want, when I want" What situation you've literally explained nothing more than wanting to use a speednova with the new aura on a whim in a public match.

Lastly people don't have every right to be able to use the build they want without having it's function "completely changed" Very dooms day of you, as you've said, suck it up. You have no rights in this game. Someone is modifying your build with their aura then you can just QUIT THE MATCH. If you don't like it GO RECRUIT. Haven't got time for recruit? Then PICK ANOTHER FRAME. 

 

[Thaelyn2]

I certainly don’t have an encyclopedic knowledge of all of the frames in this game, so I may seek be overlooking something. Off the top of my head I cannot think of any build for any frame (apart from speed nova) that would be hampered by this.  There are some for whom more strength won’t help in any real way, but I can’t think of anything else that would actually be hurt.

 

Is there anything besides speed nova that would suffer as a result of this aura?  If not, do you all think DE will change the aura because of a single build on a single frame? (Please don’t interpret that as an opinion from me, just thinking through my fingers, attempting to expand the conversation, and trying to take a broader look at he topic). 

Edited October 11, 2018 by Thaelyn2

[Taranus]

Just now, Thaelyn2 said:

I certainly don’t have an encyclopedic knowledge of all of the frames in this game, so I may seek be overlooking something. Off the top of my head I cannot think of any build for any frame (apart from speed nova) that would be hampered by this.  There are some for whole more strength won’t help in any real way, but I can’t think of anything else that would actually be hurt.

 

Mid there anything besides speed nova that would suffer as a result of this aura?  If not, do you all think DE will change the aura because of a single build on a single frame? (Please don’t interpret that as an opinion from me, just thinking through my fingers, attempting to expand the conversation, and trying to take a broader look at he topic). 

Then DE could change the way that Speedva works.

[(XBOX)YoungGunn82]

 I feel like this gif is relevant for a few Tenno in this thread. 

Omgoodness what's going on?

[Helch0rn]

2 hours ago, SneakyErvin said:

 With +100 strength Loki's and Limbo's #4 will in fact deal damage. It is also a 40% power strength difference between a full group using GP vs the new aura. So there is no scenario where the new aura will be better

literally noone plays a power strength disarm build.

155 energy for 2k impact damage is a waste of energy.

[Blade_Wolf_16]

il y a 3 minutes, Taranus a dit :

Going solo isn't an option if you're trying to speed things up. The increase in DPS is irrelevant. Who cares if it's one specific build? It doesn't mean it isn't a problem. I'm only trying to provide feedback here, and bring this to everyone's attention.

 

Most people prefer to play Hydron with a Speedva, but who looks in recruiting for a group for Hydron? Or low level Fissures? People don't usually squad up for the things Speedva is used for.

And how is it not an option? There are less enemies, so it's easier to kill them all. 

It's weird how people always tell me that if I don't want people to cheese, I have to go solo or recruit, but when I tell people that they don't need a team to cheese the mission, going solo and/or recruiting is "not an option". It boils down to "you want to play casualy? Find a team of casuals or play by yourself while I do whatever I want wherever I want because you have no tell me what to do". 

About the DPS, it does feel irrelevant when you can kill enemies before they attack you, but speeding them up by 70% does increase their attack speed by 70%. Forget one high level enemy on Mot or in a IPS/Elemental/Rad Sortie that is affected by the speed buff and you'll probably get downed in just a few sec if you're not using a tanky frame. Hel, even on Saturn a Nox can be very annoying and even deadly w/o the speed buff.

Now, the build. Nova is one frame out of 36. This is only 1 of the possible build out of maybe 2-4 advanced builds. You're telling me that because this Aura can be detrimental for 1 build of 1 frame, the mod is bad? Blind Rage/Transient Fortitude/Power Drift/Growing Power aren't usefull at all for Loki, but does it mean they're bad mods? Don't think so. Sure, it can be problematic for a Speedva to get more power strenght, but that doesn't mean that the mod is trash nor that it ruins the frame. 

She's not mandatory for anything, not even Hydron. Just because there is no Speedva won't make the mission impossible. Hel, even a Slowva woud just make things easier, but slower. What you say is that people who play on Hydron assume that everybody is there to cheese through it and that Speedva is good for that. It's just a proof that nowadays, people use that kind of stuff/build to make the game as ininteractive as possible in the name of efficiency.

[Sloan441]

10 hours ago, Taranus said:

 

What does everyone think?

Less speed Novas in PuGs is a good thing. 

Two thumbs up on Power Donation in that respect. 

However, I doubt you'll see this aura in much use in random games. It's something you'd agree to equip with a premade group to reap the full benefits. Otherwise, there are far better auras to use when you don't know what your potential teammates might be bringing to the dance. 

[Taranus]

7 minutes ago, Blade_Wolf_16 said:

And how is it not an option? There are less enemies, so it's easier to kill them all. 

It's weird how people always tell me that if I don't want people to cheese, I have to go solo or recruit, but when I tell people that they don't need a team to cheese the mission, going solo and/or recruiting is "not an option". It boils down to "you want to play casualy? Find a team of casuals or play by yourself while I do whatever I want wherever I want because you have no tell me what to do". 

About the DPS, it does feel irrelevant when you can kill enemies before they attack you, but speeding them up by 70% does increase their attack speed by 70%. Forget one high level enemy on Mot or in a IPS/Elemental/Rad Sortie that is affected by the speed buff and you'll probably get downed in just a few sec if you're not using a tanky frame. Hel, even on Saturn a Nox can be very annoying and even deadly w/o the speed buff.

Now, the build. Nova is one frame out of 36. This is only 1 of the possible build out of maybe 2-4 advanced builds. You're telling me that because this Aura can be detrimental for 1 build of 1 frame, the mod is bad? Blind Rage/Transient Fortitude/Power Drift/Growing Power aren't usefull at all for Loki, but does it mean they're bad mods? Don't think so. Sure, it can be problematic for a Speedva to get more power strenght, but that doesn't mean that the mod is trash nor that it ruins the frame. 

She's not mandatory for anything, not even Hydron. Just because there is no Speedva won't make the mission impossible. Hel, even a Slowva woud just make things easier, but slower. What you say is that people who play on Hydron assume that everybody is there to cheese through it and that Speedva is good for that. It's just a proof that nowadays, people use that kind of stuff/build to make the game as ininteractive as possible in the name of efficiency.

I never said the mod was bad. If there's anything that needs to change it's Nova. I'm not advocating for anyone to play Speedva on higher level missions either. You're putting words into my mouth and building a strawman.

By your logic, I could just argue that people who want to run Power Donation should go solo or find a dedicated squad. But that's a poor solution too.

Solo means fewer enemies, which means less experience.  The majority of people like playing low level defense missions with Speedva, but might not know how the would be detrimental. I don't think DE intends on hampering Speedvas, but they just might not have thought of this.

 

If anything Nova should just change so you can select speed or slow.

[(PSN)JustJoshinEnt]

8 hours ago, Zeclem said:

novas speed buff being unintentional does not mean a thing for a long time, and especially not for this discussion. and people "complain" cus the new "content" can hurt their playstyle in a way that they dont really have anything to do to prevent it from happening. 

i know the "use recruit system" excuse would pop up sooner or later. problem is, recruit is nowhere as quick as public missions at all and not everybody has the time to wait for a squad to pop up for their missions. 

Yes, it's called a "trade-off".   You pay a price for convenience.  You can either have speed at the cost of efficiency, or efficiency at the potential cost of speed.  Life ain't perfect, but to pretend there isn't a solution just because you don't LIKE the solution is ludicrous (and a major issue with this community)

[(PSN)JustJoshinEnt]

8 hours ago, zombiedeadhead said:

In this game, no one is going to give up power stregth, especially not to help team mates. There will be a niche for this in organised groups, but will people randonmly play Hydron with this equiped? Never happen.

Depends on the frame.  Not all frames require Power Strength.

[Zeclem]

19 minutes ago, (PS4)Taishin_Ishu said:

Yes, it's called a "trade-off".   You pay a price for convenience.  You can either have speed at the cost of efficiency, or efficiency at the potential cost of speed.  Life ain't perfect, but to pretend there isn't a solution just because you don't LIKE the solution is ludicrous (and a major issue with this community)

sorry but that solution doesnt exist for many people. you might have the time to spend around recruit chat, but not everybody has it. and no, its not a major issue within the community to give feedback to possible problems. 

[Joe_Barbarian]

4 minutes ago, Zeclem said:

sorry but that solution doesnt exist for many people. you might have the time to spend around recruit chat, but not everybody has it. and no, its not a major issue within the community to give feedback to possible problems. 

As it's been said multiple times. If you don't have time to spend in recruitment chat then why are you insisting on wasting your time with a specific build on a specific warframe?

If your goal was truly to point out a "possible problem(s)" then the problem you've created is exactly that, a problem YOU created. Being so stubborn to want to play a specific build on a frame but having a time restriction just means you're not valuing that time as you thought you was because if time efficiency was your problem then you would run the most optimal frame & build that can solo carry the mission with or within public members in the group.
TLDR: This is a player created problem, not a DE problem.

[Miser_able]

If your running in a team with a speedva, don't use the aura. It's that simple. 

And if you're using speedva in pubs or without warning you're team, you're kinda being rude and shouldn't expect them to cater to your needs. 

Edited October 11, 2018 by Miser_able

[(PSN)JustJoshinEnt]

14 minutes ago, Zeclem said:

sorry but that solution doesnt exist for many people. you might have the time to spend around recruit chat, but not everybody has it. and no, its not a major issue within the community to give feedback to possible problems. 

If you don't even have the time to put together or join a quick leveling team, you probably are too busy to be playing a video game in the first place.

Again, just because you don't like the solution doesn't mean there isn't one.

[(PSN)JustJoshinEnt]

2 hours ago, Namah said:

So are you saying nobody should tell DE what's wrong?

1.)  "Wrong" is subjective.

2.) I'm saying SOMEONE posting about an issue is one thing..... we don't need continuing rants.  This is a text-based forum.  DE can read it at their leisure.  One rant is more than enough.

3.) If y'all REALLY want to give feedback to DE....  stop using General Discussion.  There is LITERALLY a feedback section called, wait for it........  "FEEDBACK".

[Khromm]

2 hours ago, GrayArchon said:

Growing Power does the same thing almost. In the end, I don't think there are enough cases where negative power strength is desired for this to be an issue. It's mostly just speed nova. There are always bound to be things that upset other people's play, but as long as it's minimal, I don't see much of an issue with it. I think the mod is interesting enough overall that it's worth it.

Coaction Drift only affects the aura of the player with Coaction Drift, not anyone else's. I have a Nekros with Regeneration aura (weird, I know) and Coaction Drift. If I bring him to a mission, his Coaction Drift isn't going to be working on anyone else's Power Donation, just my Regeneration.

Not 100% accurate there re. Coaction Drift. From the Wiki:

 

Aura Strength increases the effect of your aura on everyone. Aura Effectiveness increases the effect of everyone's auras on yourself.

 

So, while it won't increase the effect of PD being used by other players on other players, it will on yourself, as well as increasing the effectiveness of your own PD on yourself. 'Course, the numbers aren't generally going to be massively meaningful with the Speedva build, unless the Speedva is using CD (and all three other players are using PD), but figured that this needed a little clarification.

 

(For reference: http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Coaction_Drift )

[GrayArchon]

8 minutes ago, Khromm said:

Not 100% accurate there re. Coaction Drift. From the Wiki:

Aura Strength increases the effect of your aura on everyone. Aura Effectiveness increases the effect of everyone's auras on yourself.

Hm. That is indeed what the wiki says. I'm suspicious of that, but in the absence of my own testing I'll accept it.

[SneakyErvin]

3 hours ago, BallisticSalsa said:

I feel like the problem is temporary.

-30% power strength isn't something that everyone is going to want. It will likely find a spot in ESO, eidolon hunts, or in premades where every player can benefit from  +90% power strength without the need for CP (four tuna maybe?).

Speedva is still good and nothing will happen to her role and nothing says she shouldnt pack the aura herself both to open mod space and buff the group further.

It is just +60%. You are at -30% already from your own aura so you only get a bonus of +60% from the other 3 members. So it is far behind Growing Power even in a premade.

The only place it would be useful over GP are in scenarios with status immune mobs. But in the only case we currently have, CP or Dead-Eye are already better.

[(XBOX)motionROTATION]

I can’t see any random using this unless they are a Speed Nova. You can never count on your teammates so it’s unwise to run a mod that hinders oneself unless it’s the only aura you have for mod slots. This is a non-issue 

[peterc3]

Oh no, a potential means of ruining a Speedva that shows up in Public. A quirk that was popular enough to stay in the game but not explicitly part of Nova's kit and therefore unlikely to be protected in case an idea comes along that might interact with it.

Oh no, fetch me my fainting couch.