My Version Of An Ash Re-Visit

[(PSN)Vexx757]

The point of this re-visit

·        Give Ash “proper” synergy.

·        Make his bladestorm more useful in a team.

·        Improve other abilities.

1^st Ability:

·        You can increase the damage of it by building up your combo multiplier with melee weapons.

 

(This will give you the choice to either deal massive amount of damage or to strip enemy armour with augment.)

 

·        If you hold the ability, depending what elemental mods you have on your melee weapon it will be applied onto it but only base elementals e.g. fire, ice, electric and toxins.

 

(Ninjas are known to adapt their arsenal in any given situations)

 

2^nd ability

·        Enemies that get ingulfed in the smoke will have a 5 sec stun duration and be more susceptible to damage.

• (EDIT) using it will make enemies that alerted by you now un-alerted.
• (Very good for stealth gameplay)

 

(May not be useful all the time but when the right situation comes around…)

 

3rd ability:

·        Make ash able to teleport through windows if there is an ally, enemy, npc or items with a health bar.

 

(If you know how teleporting works you will understand how good this is and what situation this can be used in.)

  

4th ability:

Give Ash the old bs but with slight changes;

 

·        Enemies that are red can be killed by players.

·        Make bs able to kill as many enemies that are within the radius of the enemy he`s aiming at.

·        (EDIT) If you press the ability your "clones" will do the killing, If you hold the ability you will join the bs animation. (This saves time in choosing wither to be involved in the animation or not instead of activating bs then pressing 3rd ability)

(

·        The number of enemies that are going to be killed by bs are shown.

·        The bs “clones” look like your ash instead of a holographic look.

 

4^th ability augment: enemies killed by bs will and x mare to where allies that step on it will recive increase running speed and melee damage by 30%.

(This will make him be an efficient killer but not a kill stealer because other player can take his kills, ash is just faster at killing like before plus It`s doesn’t matter how many enemies ash has within his radius he cannot kill them all)  

  

  Synergy;

2nd & 4th ability

·        Only If you are invisible before you use bs enemy bodies will disappear.

(This will give you a choice if you want the bodies to disappear or not when playing stealth and nekros can actually use his 3rd ability)

 

Fixes

·        Make Ash be able to teleport in and out of the same grates instead of just one direction.

 

With the original bs mechanic people weren’t upset coz ash was taking kills, they were upset because they could not take his kills. In my opinion this is the bs re-visit he should of had.

Edited October 12, 2018 by (PS4)Vexx757
better idea for bladestorm

[SenorClipClop]

10 minutes ago, (PS4)Vexx757 said:

Give Ash the old bs but with slight changes;

 

Enemies that are red can be killed by players.

Make bs able to kill as many enemies that are within the radius of the enemy he`s aiming at.

Another day, another forum user asking for press-4-to-win Bladestorm back...

[Atsia]

People were upset with the old BS mechanic because it was a mindless press-4-2-win with no interaction, DE aren't gonna return to that

[-.SP.-G43riel]

3 hours ago, (PS4)Vexx757 said:

·        Make his bladestorm more useful in a team.

ha... haha.....
hahahahahah

[(PSN)CoolD2108]

...did you really promote synergy only to say that you'd like his p4tw back?

[Gurpgork]

29 minutes ago, Atsia said:

People were upset with the old BS mechanic because it was a mindless press-4-2-win with no interaction, DE aren't gonna return to that

It's not like the ability realistically actually has any interaction the way it is now. Press to mark -> press again to attack isn't interaction. It's just the same boring P42W, only with cumbersome extra button presses and a massively increased energy cost. 

That's not to say I'm in favor of the whole "bring back the old ability but with QoL this time" idea, but Blade Storm needs work. 

[(XBOX)LightningRift]

I would like to see Ash get some sort of healing from his teleport finishers. Kind of like how Inaros can. Or perhaps a percent of the damage from the slash procs on his #1 heal you. With all the health he has, it would be nice to see some synergy that helps keep that up in end-game content.

[Gurpgork]

33 minutes ago, (XB1)LightningRift said:

I would like to see Ash get some sort of healing from his teleport finishers. Kind of like how Inaros can. Or perhaps a percent of the damage from the slash procs on his #1 heal you. With all the health he has, it would be nice to see some synergy that helps keep that up in end-game content.

I don't know that raw tanking power is something that an invisibility Warframe needs. Healing is certainly very strong and useful, but at the same time, avoiding damage is always the strongest form of defense, and invisibility accomplishes exactly that. 

[peterc3]

2 hours ago, (XB1)LightningRift said:

I would like to see Ash get some sort of healing from his teleport finishers.

Ash is not Inaros. There are lots of ways to gain health, you just need to use them.

[-.SP.-G43riel]

wish he had an exalted dagger / kunai
but that would need to change his BStorm to act  with more freedom like other exalted weapons 

i mostly play him only because his skins are awesome

Edited October 11, 2018 by -.SP.-G43riel

[(PSN)Vexx757]

20 hours ago, -.SP.-G43riel said:

ha... haha.....
hahahahahah

GROW UP

[EinheriarJudith]

there are 2 very good choices for healing for ash that make use of his very strong passive. Miter, Panthera both with their syndicate mods. he can heal himself by killing and from stealth no less.

[(XBOX)LightningRift]

22 hours ago, peterc3 said:

Ash is not Inaros. There are lots of ways to gain health, you just need to use them.

Ash isn't Inaros, but Oberon isn't Trinity, yet Oberon and Trin have abilities that perform the same functions, just in different ways. Inaros can easily produce finishers, just like Ash. So why not give Ash a way to heal himself similarly? I think giving Ash healing if an enemy is killed from a slash proc would be dope. That would really encourage the use of his #1 and #4.

[-.SP.-G43riel]

51 minutes ago, (XB1)LightningRift said:

That would really encourage the use of his #1 and #4.

those 2 are already the most used skills there's not need for encourage using them

[peterc3]

1 hour ago, (XB1)LightningRift said:

So why not give Ash a way to heal himself similarly?

His general theme is that of a ninja. Where in the general lore of ninjas is there a life-stealing or healing ability?

[(PSN)Vexx757]

Some of you ppl are really stupid. I talk about the other ability besides bs smdh.

[(PSN)Rafahil]

Keep in mind that combo multipliers won't mean much when melee 3.0 comes. This will be a huge indirect nerf to bladestorm because right now in high level content bladestorm is only good with some combo mult stacked for the damage. But still I do feel like Ash has no real place to belong even though I like his shtick. Also bladestorm is too slow. I'm down for a full-on rework though. Maybe remove the 3x marking and make it a 1 mark with the power of 3 marks to speed things up a bit instead of moving your camera around to paint them.

[Dabnician]

Ash doesn't need a rework, They need to rework Loki before they touch ash again, Loki has never been touched since release except for 5 patches and the last one was just to fix Octavia Syandana on him.

[(PSN)Ozymandias-13-]

On 2018-10-11 at 1:10 PM, Gurpgork said:

It's not like the ability realistically actually has any interaction the way it is now.

It has a lot more input than most abilities in the game, and does finisher damage so I think it's worth it. As an Ash main, I actually enjoy it compared to the boring 4 spam. But I'd prefer they made it cost 15 energy per enemy and automatically apply all 3 marks. If the enemy dies before that then it refunds the 5 energy per mark unused similar to how it is now.

[Conflux59]

9 minutes ago, (PS4)Riko_113 said:

It has a lot more input than most abilities in the game, and does finisher damage so I think it's worth it. As an Ash main, I actually enjoy it compared to the boring 4 spam. But I'd prefer they made it cost 15 energy per enemy and automatically apply all 3 marks. If the enemy dies before that then it refunds the 5 energy per mark unused similar to how it is now.

I very much agree with you, and having to pass over the enemy multiple times for marks has zero added benefit to the move itself, and obviously does nothing for the kit as a whole.  It would function much better with an automatic triple mark.  It's one of the most unique abilities in the game imo.

[Conflux59]

3 hours ago, Dabnician said:

Ash doesn't need a rework, They need to rework Loki before they touch ash again, Loki has never been touched since release except for 5 patches and the last one was just to fix Octavia Syandana on him.

I actually can't disagree with the Loki part... while personally I feel Ash would benefit greatly from some tweaks and attention, Loki does need some updating too. 

Frame updates and reworks shouldn't be in a single file line though... especially with the amount of total frames in game and the amount needing attention...  simultaneous adjustment needs to be a thing or DE will only keep getting further and further behind at their pace.  It would also eliminate the.. X frame doesn't need it because X frame does instead  ..argument that we see in abundance.

[(PSN)Vexx757]

22 hours ago, Dabnician said:

Ash doesn't need a rework, They need to rework Loki before they touch ash again, Loki has never been touched since release except for 5 patches and the last one was just to fix Octavia Syandana on him.

I have put up a post of some reworks/ re-visits to warframes including loki.

 

Edited November 3, 2018 by (PS4)Vexx757

[Arcira]

I like the general concept of the current Blade Storm. However energy cost are a problem and marking enemies takes too long. The problem with warframe abilities is that you can spam them which makes them quite difficult to balance. If there was a cooldown system especially ultimate abilities could feel awesome without breaking the game.

If Blade Storm had a small cooldown like 30sec or something they could remove the mark stacking mechanic (does essentially the same thing). But it would be much smoother and fitting for a fast-paced shooter.

[Gurpgork]

On 2018-11-02 at 12:30 PM, (PS4)Riko_113 said:

It has a lot more input than most abilities in the game,

Only in the most literal sense of the word "input," meaning it has more button presses than most abilities like it. That doesn't mean that it's better designed or that it has better gameplay. Just that the number of button presses to get something out of it is uselessly inflated. The marking mechanic, in its current state, adds no gameplay and accomplishes nothing other than hobbling the ability's power by saddling it with restrictions and a massively hiked energy cost.

Now. If the marks had any benefit on their own without the nuke, then this might be a different story, especially if the marks accomplished something different than the nuke does. If you got some kind of bonus (like movement/parkour speed, Shuriken damage, power strength, weapon damage, just to list a few examples), then there would be a reason to use the marks, and there would be a reason to mark as many targets as possible and keep them marked. It would also add the slightest amount of nuance to Ash's kit; either you can keep the marks up for the bonuses it gives you, or you can surrender those bonuses to nuke everything in the room. Bam. Now you have an ability that has some actual gameplay. 

[(PSN)Ozymandias-13-]

10 hours ago, Gurpgork said:

Only in the most literal sense of the word "input," meaning it has more button presses than most abilities like it.

Well, I'm not sure what would be to gain through using a figurative form of the word...lol. By definition it requires far more interaction than almost every ability in the game which is all I was stating, in contrast to the statement that it didn't really have any interaction.

The point of the change, along with many reworks lately, is to balance out the input vs output of abilities and gameplay. People should not be able to press one spam-able button and instant kill entire groups of enemies across all areas of the game if it negates the need to actually play the game. DE has stated this themselves.

10 hours ago, Gurpgork said:

If the marks had any benefit on their own without the nuke

I actually like that idea. I wouldn't mind it having two methods of usefulness, only to break up the massively redundant damage of 75% of his abilities. I still think his kit can be greatly improved with a few quality of life changes though, like the automatic 3-marks suggestion and a small circular targeting reticle rather than pinpoint. Incorporating his Smoke Shadow augment into the base ability for standard team utility would be nice. There was also a suggestion in another thread I liked for them to make Shurikens stick to terrain so they can be used as way-points for Ash's Teleport.

Bladestorm as it is could use tweaks but it's not useless. Ash's specialty is dealing with any enemy regardless of level or defense (which can obviously make him feel like he's falling behind in low level content but he blatantly shines in high level content). Bladestorm allows him to divide and conquer enemies where most other Frames are stuck focusing on groups by allowing him to sic his clones on a group while working on another group entirely on his own or even helping the clones out. In my experience a large number of players that complain about Ash's dps are usually the ones who are twiddling their thumbs while the clones do all the work then wonder why they're falling behind everyone else. If they were to continue playing the game as normal during that time their damage will skyrocket. 

The cost of the ability is irrelevant since, as it is, deals far more damage for far less energy per mark than using his first ability. My concern is that Shuriken is almost useless now since the rework unless you depend on the augment for it. For the amount of initial damage it deals and the type of damage it really isn't an issue since it's enough to kill just about anything until you get to the level 150 range. Another problem I frequently see is that players want to disregard the intense bleeds he's capable of. They want everything dead in one hit without realizing that the remaining bleed alone is almost guaranteed to finish the enemy off while he's fighting other enemies. He greatly excels at spreading his damage and attention across the battlefield if you let him.