Garuda Feedback and Discussion

[Phyrak]

I have made some additional thoughts to the first post.

[MickThejaguar]

5 hours ago, Me.Church said:

The health siphoning ability is basically a single Nezha impalement with a sort of Nidus-like Link.

So a completely different ability? 

5 hours ago, Me.Church said:

The shield is clever but is also a mix of Volt's shield and Nova's Antimatter Drop 

So a completely different ability?

5 hours ago, Me.Church said:

 The ability where you can reduce your health is kinda unique, but isnt that just like Inaros' Scarab armor? Instead of armor, you're gaining power strength with Garuda.

So a kind of similar ability but with a different effect? 

5 hours ago, Me.Church said:

But there's far too much recycled content here for a frame that's supposed to be unique in its theme and gameplay.

No there isn't. Just because her abilities have minor similarities to other doesn't just straight up make them recycled content. The abilities have similar looks but function almost entirely differently.

[WarBaby2]

9 hours ago, TonySal said:

Like Excalibur 1th but nonstop?😀

Or like a slower, farther reaching version of Ash' 4... maybe with leaving surviving enemies impaled on a spike?

[Kracken]

I agree - and here is something similar:
 

 

[Endrian]

Chroma knows well the pain of a sustained limited-range ability that also prevents weapon usage. Oh, yes.

[WarBaby2]

The iffy 4 aside, I really thought her meat shield would be actual body parts impaled on her blades... and why is front facing? It doesn't have the same utility as Volt's shield, so there is really no reason for the directional limitation.

Edited October 20, 2018 by WarBaby2

[Bouldershoulder]

I'd rather have her passive increase her critical damage multiplier (all of them) rather than flat damage. Multipliers scale better and it's thematically more appropriate. Rather than getting stronger the weaker she gets (is that a pUnnn?), she becomes more dangerous since she is "refined and elegant" rather than "vicious and brutal". From the start I imagined her akin to Drow from Forgotten Realms - those cunning, lethal sadistic things. But what I saw looked rather like Blood Fiend

[Phyrak]

1 minute ago, Bouldershoulder said:

I'd rather have her passive increase her critical damage multiplier (all of them) rather than flat damage. Multipliers scale better and it's thematically more appropriate. Rather than getting stronger the weaker she gets (is that a pUnnn?), she becomes more dangerous since she is "refined and elegant" rather than "vicious and brutal". From the start I imagined her akin to Drow from Forgotten Realms - those cunning, lethal sadistic things. But what I saw looked rather like Blood Fiend

Interesting take on her.

Refinement through violence perhaps?

In my opinion, she would need some form of exalted weapon to get the most out of that - perhaps something akin to the glaive to throw her spears.

Relentless combination works well for her thematically - then comes the scaling damage you mentioned

[WarBaby2]

1 minute ago, Bouldershoulder said:

I'd rather have her passive increase her critical damage multiplier (all of them) rather than flat damage. Multipliers scale better and it's thematically more appropriate. Rather than getting stronger the weaker she gets (is that a pUnnn?), she becomes more dangerous since she is "refined and elegant" rather than "vicious and brutal". From the start I imagined her akin to Drow from Forgotten Realms - those cunning, lethal sadistic things. But what I saw looked rather like Blood Fiend

I dunno... she kinda is the anti Harrow, in that regard. Personally, rather than making it damage or crit, I think it should be a ramping up slash proc.

[Phyrak]

Just now, WarBaby2 said:

I dunno... she kinda is the anti Harrow, in that regard. Personally, rather than making it damage or crit, I think it should be a ramping up slash proc.

Ramping slash proc sounds wonderful!

[Bouldershoulder]

But we already have Ash for ramping slash procs :3 And Harrow's ult boosts critical chance.

[Phyrak]

1 minute ago, Bouldershoulder said:

But we already have Ash for ramping slash procs :3 And Harrow's ult boosts critical chance.

Perhaps consecutive ramping procs - increasing based on combat flow?

Procs will always stay at 35% but rather than applying a single proc, procs are applied at increased frequency or value as health scales or combat rages on?

[WarBaby2]

3 minutes ago, Bouldershoulder said:

But we already have Ash for ramping slash procs :3 And Harrow's ult boosts critical chance.

True, but Garuda could go further with it... like, actually adding procs to all her attacks, depending on how hurt she is.

[(XBOX)Lmacncheese]

Why  does DE always make the same mistakes

[Bouldershoulder]

1 minute ago, (XB1)bioblaze10656 said:

Why  does DE always make the same mistakes

Because at some point they decided to make the game alike to dynasty warriors.

[Phyrak]

3 minutes ago, WarBaby2 said:

True, but Garuda could go further with it... like, actually adding procs to all her attacks, depending on how hurt she is.

Bloody brilliant...heh...

2 minutes ago, (XB1)bioblaze10656 said:

Why  does DE always make the same mistakes

It seems like the 4 button is stuck again

[MythiC-Q]

Hey fellow Tenno

I want to share a few improvements I would give Garuda, because I know my ideas are solid, sorry for sounding arrogant and overconfident, I want Garuda to feel and be great, like all of us. Let's go :

Soul Bulkwark : As some suggested in other forum topics, it would work like Excal Slash Dash, damaging foes in her path, or maybe stun/incapacitate them. The soul shield should provide damage reduction all around Garuda, otherwise her gameplay feels to static.

Sanguine Siphon : Holding the button would make the ability affect multiple enemies within a certain range, with greater damage, but wouldn't allow for health regen but instead energy regen for teammates, both effects affected by power range. Longer casting time when hold

Life sunder  : Good ability, make the visuals last until she is fully healed, so players don't have to keep a constant eye on the health bar ^^. Also you should have a certain amount of energy to be able to cast this ability

No more Engulfing blades, let's give place to Pernicious Elegance : Garuda would by her charming beauty pacifiy enemies who are in line of sight, affected by power range. When her 1-Soul Bulkwark is active, she instead throws the "soul ball" towards the player chosen direction, and pacify/seduce enemies in this area. Pacified/Seduced enemies take greater Physical damage. Also we would get a sexy move we were most of us waiting for from Garuda
Casting her 2-Sanguine Siphon on a seduced enemy would instantly make every enemies affected by her 4 impaled, dealing damage

Impaled enemies should somewhat pose like enemies affected by Condemn's Harrow ability
I like the theme of this frame, I really want her gameplay to feel good

Thanks a lot for reading my suggestions, please share with us what you think about these. If you like them please feel free to share and expose them to make them known, and bring life to them 🙂

Take care and love your selves  😉

Edited October 20, 2018 by MythiC-Q
Clarification

[WarBaby2]

Ok, here's what I would do...

Passive: Either make it an added slash proc starting from 25%-100% with extending tic time... or maybe add some form of panic mechanic to her attacks, the bloodier Garuda gets.

1. Make it an actual meat shield by sticking an enemy body part to her blades, and give her up to 95% damage reduction from all directions for the runtime. At any point, the hunk of flesh can be thrown, doing some damage and putting enemies in an area into a state of panic.

2. Is fine, but the spike should be floating, slowly following Garuda around... which could be an augment, though.

3. Is fine.

4. Is ok in general, but it's missing the elegant killer feel... maybe don't make her float, but make her jump gracefully from enemy to enemy, shredding them one at a time... or go with the blade throw approach, which could be added to the existing 4, using alt fire.

Edited October 20, 2018 by WarBaby2

[HEYORI]

As mr25 player with 4k hours in this game, I look at her abilities and it doesn't look that great. Like many previous warframes it's neat concept at glance, but after few hours I will probably stop using half of her kit. Stuff like life leaching lance requires you to stay in one place, in game where you supposed to move constantly.


My suggestion is to add certain guide principles to a design or redesign process.

  
Concept needs to be enduring, which is the ultimate quality control test. If testers struggle to use all abilities or develop playstyle after 4-6 hours mark, it's a clear sign something is off.   

Warframe needs adequate tools to deal with variety of situations in the game. Tools like mobility, crowd control, aoe damage variant of crowd control, survivability. 

Synergy between this tools needs to be relevant to game realities. For example melee, close combat oriented frame like Garuda feels really weird without mobility in her kit, and other abilities not designed with mobility in mind. But you need to get close to enemies time and time again, it's a major design flaw with Garuda imo.



Hope this ideas are useful.            

Edited October 20, 2018 by HEYORI
fixing auto corrections

[WarBaby2]

I agree about the shield and about the lasting blood effects... but I really don't see the seduction angle. She is supposed to be an elegant yet cold and efficient killer, not a charmer. Personally, I'd put some panic mechanics into her display of blood and gore. Also, do more with enemy body parts... her shield looks far to slick and abstract.

[Phyrak]

5 minutes ago, WarBaby2 said:

Ok, here's what I would do...

Passive: Either make it an added slash proc starting from 25%-100% with extending tic time... or maybe add some form of panic mechanic to her attacks, the bloodier Garuda gets.

1. Make it an actual meat shield by sticking an enemy body part to her blades, and give her up to 95% damage reduction from all directions for the runtime. At any point, the hunk of flesh can be thrown, doing some damage and putting enemies in an area into a state of panic.

2. Is fine, but the spike should be floating, slowly following Garuda around... which could be an augment, though.

3. Is fine.

4. Is ok in general, but it's missing the elegant killer feel... maybe don't make her float, but make her jump gracefully from enemy to enemy, shredding them one at a time... or go with the blade throw approach, which could be added to the existing 4, using alt fire.

I am about to tweak the passive a little on the front page - I think she needs to scale a little harder than just a slash proc.

The 1 seems a little more along the lines of Valkyr than the elegance of Garuda - perhaps reshaping the blood? A flower of blood or blood hardened to a crystal form?

I do like the heavy damage reduction.

Augment for 2 seems reasonable

She needs control over her blades - elegence is all about control within the romantic sense. Garuda is stylistic and gratuitous violence with a sense of apathy - she controls the situation

[Erl-King]

My suggestions:

1 - Claws/Blood ball = Tap for claw attack, hold to throw the blood ball. No frontal shield. Additional claw attacks charge blood ball increasing its blast range and damage. Enemies affected by blood ball can be Spiked without energy cost.

2 - Spikes = Spiked enemies could be killed. When a spiked enemy dies, spike with the corpse remains for the rest of duration. There could be only one spike with living enemy and up to 5 spikes with corpses. Each corpsed spike, in addition to healing, boosts Garuda's passive multiplyer by 1 up to +600% damage with 5 corpsed spikes and zero health.

3 - Blood armor - Instead of giving energy it works like Iron skin, but with zero base armor and decaying with time. Can be recasted, nullifying current armor. Consumes Blood ball if Garuda have it, increasing invulnerability-charging time by 1 second per Blood ball power (number of Claw kills).

4 - Blades = Allows to cast other abilities during Ultimate at half cost. Left click for first power (with a damage boost), right click for spikes, middle button for Blood armor. Casting Blood armor stops ultimate.
 

The idea is to give Garuda more offensive potential to be able to compete with other frames (like Chroma), but also maintain balance, preventing her becoming a one-trick pony.

Blood armor would be great defensive tool, but harder to use than Iron skin or other barrier powers. With armor decay and health cost, it would be impossible to stay at 2 hp all the time, making player to use Spikes or other means to heal for recast.

Allowing to cast powers during ultimate will give it mobility and won't lock out player from combat.

Thoughts?
 

Edited October 20, 2018 by Erl-King

[(PSN)WeeMalk5]

Garudas ability I thought similar to Revenants.

Also the 'at early stage' Atlas skin on the stream looked very like revenant to me. Not very Atlasy.

[Phyrak]

Further additions to her passive and ultimate ability

[Phyrak]

3 minutes ago, Erl-King said:

 

My suggestions:

1 - Claws = Tap for claw attack, hold to throw blood ball. No frontal shield. Additional claw attacks charge blood ball increasing its blast range and damage. Enemies affected by blood ball can be Spiked without energy cost.

2 - Spikes = Spiked enemies could be killed. When a spiked enemy dies, spike with the corpse remains for the rest of duration. There could be only one spike with living enemy and up to 5 spikes with corpses. Each corpsed spike, in addition to healing, boosts Garuda's passive multiplyer by 1 up to +600% damage with 5 corpsed spikes and zero health.

3 - Blood armor - Instead of giving energy it works like Iron skin, but with small base armor, slightly longer invulnerability-charging time and decaying with time. Can be recasted, nullifying current armor.

4 - Blades = Allows to cast other abilities during Ultimate at half cost. Left click for first power, right click for spikes, middle button for Blood armor. Casting Blood armor stops ultimate.

 

Interesting mix

I appreciate the synergy 🙂