Should This Game Still Be Considered A Beta?

[Wahooo]

Good stuff.

 

Does anyone from the pro beta label side wish to address the one-time events? That's the one bit I really havent heard much about.

 

 

Whose to say they will never ever be repeated?  From what I can tell of the events we were testing the system of how events such as these work and if the player base likes or dislikes the mechanics or part of the mechanics of them.  There has been a ton of feedback after every event, and once it goes live I would expect that feedback implemented making new events similar but better than the ones we've had.

 

Often enough in games there are perks for being a beta tester once things go live.  Sometimes it is unique items, and sometimes those items are OP, sometimes it is a unique cosmetic, some of those can be ugly and not mean much.

 

I'm also in the boat that just because there is a working cash shop doesn't mean NOT Beta... especially since there have been a bunch of games in the last few years that have done the same thing.  Cash shop model needs to be worked out as well.

[PsychedelicSnake]

I do agree. But some of their recent decisions have not seemed....fantastic, maybe they are in preparation for armour 2.0 or something else up their sleeve but we don't know that yet.

I'd personally say a lot of what we are seeing is in preparation for a larger plan DE has going. Armour 2.0 is a good example of what may be a part of that.

[lautalocos]

most free to play games have microtransactions on beta (planetside 2, blacklight retribution, hawken, etc.)

and you all have to consider this for a minute. this game is self-funded, it has no publisher. the only reason it exist is thanks to the microtransactions. why do you think the founder program is called FOUNDER program?

[Mercathin]

I believe the one time event, namely the survival one did bring to attention to AI quirks/bugs. These events I feel overall allow new areas to be heavily tested as well.

 

The events allow the player base to focus its play to a narrow area of the game thus exposing more bugs/glitches in a shorter time, and rewarding players for testing the game as a beta. These events could also be used for data mining purposes, drop rates, warframe usage, weapon usage, etc.

 

Side note, words meanings change over time, what was once considered a 'beta' may no longer be fitting for modern use.

[SabreUr]

That I don't agree with.

 

If the developer told me this game was an onion, they would be wrong. "Because they said so" is not a valid response.

 

I thinkt that this is not good metaphore - Beta is state of product, not "what the product is". If developer says that it is not ready, it isn,t. If tailor says that your suit is not ready, because it doesn't have collar, buttons and pocket flaps, you wont say "but it has sleeves and other relevant parts, I can wear it" and go on date in it.

 

 

Good stuff.

 

Does anyone from the pro beta label side wish to address the one-time events? That's the one bit I really havent heard much about.

 

I believe that:

 

a) testing the waters - what kind of events are welcomed and not, what kind of rewards satisfy players, what is better - community/personal focus... It is easier to contain any problem in smaller playerbase.

b) appealing to players who are playing this game, but are not feedback providing testers. As mentioned above, this is self funded -> so even during beta this game has to attract players willing to pay money -> game's world has to be alive.

 

And - all of rewards, maybe bar Lato Vandal were available to anyone who showed enough interest to install Warframe and play. They were not required to have beta keys or smth.

Edited September 5, 2013 by SabreUr

[JerryMouse13]

As I've said before Warframe is something of a freak of nature in just how early into the development process that we where given access. If you look back Warframe was only just exiting it's alpha phase at this time last year, and the open beta was launched earlier this year. Most games of this scale would still be in closed beta, or late alpha builds. One of the biggest reasons for this I think is DE's desire to self publish, however to do that they needed the cash shop, and a player base to support it.

 

It leaves them, and us, in this odd place where the game is clearly not feature complete, but we're paying for it as though it is (those of us who have bought plat). It's an odd beast, and arguments can be made both ways. However, I for one am quite content for now. DE has been fairly good at compensating players for mistakes, and listening to our voices. Which sadly seems to be something of a rarity these days.

[Silvershadow66]

 

Not that I think it's a huge deal, but I wanted to invite discussion on this topic.

 

 

There is no discussion, the game is in Beta bacause DE say its in Beta. That is the only fact that matters.

[Xriborg]

I thinkt that this is not good metaphore - Beta is state of product, not "what the product is". If developer says that it is not ready, it isn,t. If tailor says that your suit is not ready, because it doesn't have collar, buttons and pocket flaps, you wont say "but it has sleeves and other relevant parts, I can wear it" and go on date in it.

But if the developer says it's not ready, and then does things contradictory to that statement (such as releasing it to the entire public, advertising it on different sites, opening a cash shop) their definition of their own product could be taken as a mis-label.

Also...I might go on a date with it. Easier to take it off when things get frisky.

But everyone is making good points and I'm starting to think that perhaps the software development life cycle doesn't apply well to MMOs in this state. Beta doesn't really encompass what Warframe is. It's more than a beta, but it's not a finished release either.

Maybe we need a new term?

[Solstic]

Warframe is in open beta.

By making it open beta they expand their amount of testers and potential paying customers. DE isn't backed up by a publisher who can feed them money. DE needs money to continue to pay their small staff. Money problems? Go back to the beginning of this paragraph.

So hard to understand! My head hurts! Ughgh onii-chan~

[gallowsCalibrator]

I still don't understand why people insist that just because a game has micro-transactions means that it's no longer a beta or an alpha.

 

Beta and micro-transactions are not mutually exclusive. They don't refer to the same thing. One refers to the state of the game's completeness, and the other refers to its monetization strategy. You can pay for many games before they're finished, but nobody says those aren't betas.

Edited September 5, 2013 by gallowsCalibrator

[Agent_of_Change]

YES.

 

but if you want more detail, yes, it should.  Beta is a designation for a game that advertises that the game is still in progress.  What this means is several things:

 

1. For the purposes of development anything can be changed and changes WILL be made for the sake of balance and vision.

2. Content will be added and revised as the game moves towards it's "completed" read "launch" state.  this is determined solely by the developer.

3. Because of (1) and (2) as long as the Beta label is there you invest "at your own risk".

 

Now an open beta for a F2P MMo is a relatively new idea and there is no standardized look to it.  as F2P might imply they need to finance their development so yeah they are gonna sell stuff.  What is different about the F2P Open beta dev cycle is that the devs have a large testing community but they also have less of a free hand to change things lest they alienate their players.  It's a risk but at the end of the day a game is in Beta so long as the Devs say it is because what the "Beta" label represents is a reservation of rights to make drastic changes, additions and removals to further the development of the game.

[Xylia]

The fact the UI itself is still very buggy tells me that there's far too many bugs to call Warframe a complete game.

 

Now, maybe when the PS4 version comes out, hopefully we get a lot of that stuff fixed by then. I dunno tho, Nov15th is coming fast.

[JerryMouse13]

The fact the UI itself is still very buggy tells me that there's far too many bugs to call Warframe a complete game.

 

Now, maybe when the PS4 version comes out, hopefully we get a lot of that stuff fixed by then. I dunno tho, Nov15th is coming fast.

 

I would give Warframe at least another six months before calling it anywhere near feature complete, unless the Devs are some sort of wizards. It's more likely the the initial PS4 release will be it's own beta, and will grow into the full game along with the current PC version.

[Arlayn]

For all the bugs, unbalance and unfinished things it is still a beta.

For all the events and monetization it is not a beta.

It is a tricky little subject isn't it?

IT is beta... and the events are test to find out what works and what doesn't hence the events are also beta, the alerts are place holders, naked nick is a place holder, the bosses are place holders, the market is a place holder... Everything is a placeholder therefore Beta...

[awolin]

Whatever it is, I love it. I think this is how you make a game. Making what you think will turn out great (which sometimes doesn't turn out so great) then letting the community help make it better. This doesn't even feel like a F2P game it just feels like an awesome game with an awesome community. Sure there are bugs, but what game doesn't have them? Albeit, this one has a tad bit more than others, but it's always receiving updates and livestreams to keep us up to date with what the devs are doing.

[Silraed]

IT is beta... and the events are test to find out what works and what doesn't hence the events are also beta, the alerts are place holders, naked nick is a place holder, the bosses are place holders, the market is a place holder... Everything is a placeholder therefore Beta...

 

I was just adding to the conversation, expressing how I thought it was a tricky topic and the views some people might have.

I agree it is still Beta but I wish they would stop adding stuff that isn't necessary and get the core mechanics fixed and the 'Frames actually balanced.