Hybridon Posted September 6, 2013 Share Posted September 6, 2013 My only problem is I dont use Focus when building Vauban only for CC... dunno how to fix this, cause Continuity and Stretch already have other uses on expanding Bastille, yet Im still not happy with the need to use Focus now if I want to hold more enemies... Other than that Im glad he was changed, this will bring back the need for more skill to stay alive on higher waves :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vansetti Posted September 6, 2013 Share Posted September 6, 2013 Nooo (( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whistleblower Posted September 6, 2013 Share Posted September 6, 2013 (edited) mixed feelings on this one, 12 guys being taken out of a fight is nice on most maps, but on defense it seems like more of a panic button now. in a raid, you can chuck it and take a large chunk out of the group rushing you. that being said, its defense that people are so angry about. lifting 12 moas or chargers is nice and all, you have another 60 infested lusting after your delicious tenno flesh (and the flesh in the cryopod). the biggest issue i see is the cost, throwing 2 bastiles is 150 energy and takes *24* guys out of the fight, but you could also only spend *100* energy and throw a vortex and have the AI run into it, and probebly take more out and KILL them... two ways it could be tweaked is to either 1: increase the number of things picked up but decrease the time. or 2: lower the energy cost to 50. just my view on it, im sorry if i angered anyone ^^' Edited September 6, 2013 by Whistleblower Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TurboMurderHobo Posted September 6, 2013 Share Posted September 6, 2013 This is a bad change, and I'm scratching my head a little bit on who thought the cap was the most intuitive way to reduce his effectiveness? What telegraphs when the maximum limit is hit? Do you have to count? I hope you guys at DE realises how unintuitive of a change this is. It might be a good idea to reduce his effectiveness on Bastille, but do it another way. Shorten the time limit on it, or shrink it a bit (it's friggin huge). This method however, is a baffling choice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tsukinoki Posted September 6, 2013 Share Posted September 6, 2013 (edited) @HateborneWhen has 12 ever been "exceptionally" high. Especially now that its dependant on RNG.How is it dependant on RNG?If you see an ancient in a cluster of enemies you either have to pray to a higher power that when you use it it will affect that ancient...or spam 4 or 5 bastilles to ensure that you stop the ancient.With no actual buffs to Vauban it removes his one ability that was actually decent. Edited September 6, 2013 by Tsukinoki Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HackShield Posted September 6, 2013 Share Posted September 6, 2013 (edited) really max monster that can catched? srious its the only useful skill vortex only a nice use for the bow or ogris so you kill now all defense chars so we scrubble 1 year to finish a frame or a weapon... sorry but if you dont change the other skills to more use give us the lovely bastille back >.> he got nothing else... btw why dont destroy the denfese fun fully =) give Snow Globle a max dmg it can take... >.> then where done with the frame to shrink them till we need only nova saryn or each frame for each kind of monster.... Edited September 6, 2013 by HackShield Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alencar Posted September 6, 2013 Share Posted September 6, 2013 NO! NOOOOOOOOOOOOO!! NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vicis Posted September 6, 2013 Share Posted September 6, 2013 cmon srsly ? why needed to change bastille ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tsukinoki Posted September 6, 2013 Share Posted September 6, 2013 Why did they make it a completely RNG based ability?With a max of 12 targets (I tested, once you hit 12 you cant capture any more even if you kill targets held in stasis (which is a REALLY stupid thing)) you are no longer gaurenteed of stopping the heavies in the middle of a group of enemies with it. And stretch actually HURTS you now, why? Because it just gives a higher chance that the heavies will be ignorred and you'll catch 12 trash mobs that makes your ability a 75 energy waste. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ngrazer Posted September 6, 2013 Share Posted September 6, 2013 So you nerfed the Bastille just because Necro has almost the same ability? Unexpectable! 12 enemies is waaaay too small amount, we need at least 20 or smth. Or make it so so that only enemies that were caught inside the Bastille during its cast would be trapped. 12 enemies on high-lv, compared to Vauban's useless Bounce, weak Tesla and weak Vortex... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LxLawliet Posted September 6, 2013 Share Posted September 6, 2013 I disagree with this particular change. It was clear that Vauban's abilities had to be tweaked somewhat, but this is not the way to do so. Reasons: [*] Vauban's Bastille is HIS ability, the one that defines his purpose. A cap (and that low even!) ruined this purpose, and left him with nothing more than random number generation and thus, pure luck when it comes to using Bastille [*] While it is true that one can simply throw more Bastille's to compensate for this, one must also consider the ones who are barely able to play Warframe. More Bastille's means more stress for the CPU and the GPU, and that alone cannot be tolerated. [*] To further elaborate on the RNG argument: it renders Bastille almost useless, because you have no chance to control WHAT enemies are being caught in that ability. Argument 2 applies. Please revert this change, or consider increasing the cap, because right now, Vauban's fate seems to be just like Volt's (sitting on a dusty shelf, waiting for his debut). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grandarex Posted September 6, 2013 Share Posted September 6, 2013 So with maxed focus, you can catch 15.6 enemies... I'm assuming. But the fact that you can't kill caught enemies to let it catch more is just stupid. That's the only major complaint I have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BangUrDeadTC Posted September 6, 2013 Share Posted September 6, 2013 well this seems to be a bad idea thanks for jacking up vauban for us Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atomsk42 Posted September 6, 2013 Share Posted September 6, 2013 I understand the idea behind this change, but i don't fully agree that the solution is right, Vauban is a very squishy frame, leaving him defensless against ancient infested(due to bastille being clogges with leapers and chargers) is harsh. As a solution to this problem, maybe leave the number restriction but make Bastille prioritize heavy units. Thus it will disable high threat from ancients and leave Vauban with a choice whether to eliminate them or deal with the small fish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angius Posted September 6, 2013 Share Posted September 6, 2013 "Vauban is great! I need him!" - buys him for Plat. "Nova is great! I need her!" - buuys her for Plat Vauban is no longer a source of income, since Nova came out and Necro is near, so DE can nerf him. "Necro is great! I need him!" - buys him for Plat. Nova is no longer a source of income, since Necro came out and XXX is near, so DE can nerf her. "XXX is great! I need him!" - buys him for Plat. Necro is no longer a source of income, since XXX came out and YYY is near, so DE can nerf him. Repeat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grodgen Posted September 6, 2013 Share Posted September 6, 2013 "Vauban is great! I need him!" - buys him for Plat. "Nova is great! I need her!" - buuys her for Plat Vauban is no longer a source of income, since Nova came out and Necro is near, so DE can nerf him. "Necro is great! I need him!" - buys him for Plat. Nova is no longer a source of income, since Necro came out and XXX is near, so DE can nerf her. "XXX is great! I need him!" - buys him for Plat. Necro is no longer a source of income, since XXX came out and YYY is near, so DE can nerf him. Repeat. If this is the case than the $300 I planned on dropping for Founders for me and my brothers is out of the question now. I'll be damned if I support marketing like that. I came here to have fun, not get jipped. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mak_Gohae Posted September 6, 2013 Share Posted September 6, 2013 Meh it won't work if the same enemies get caught twice. I would prefer it if it worked like Chaos than this. Havent tried it but i would think that it's unlikely that the same enemies would be counted. Anyone has tried this out? Launching two Bastille near each other? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ngrazer Posted September 6, 2013 Share Posted September 6, 2013 cmon srsly ? why needed to change bastille ? Because now people would buy Necro. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuntman_Bob90 Posted September 6, 2013 Share Posted September 6, 2013 I do not agree with this change of Vauban. It was excellent in defense and in this way it becomes virtually useless. Would have sufficed a lowering of the targets, for example 30 or 40. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steemship Posted September 6, 2013 Share Posted September 6, 2013 (edited) For a mod that served no direct offensive ability, the nerf seems kind of pointless. Compared to Frost's bubble which slows everything to a crawl and negates damage, Bastille needed to be super stopping to be balanced against it since that is all it does. Additionally, Vauban's other abilities are pretty weak and Bastille was the saving grace. Tesla is useless at higher levels, the bounce is fun, but useless at higher levels, and the damage output on Vortex makes it hardly worth it (although now it is a preferable) To recap: Vauban can't stand up as support role anymore because Frost's bubble is, all things considered, better now. To make it viable: reduce the cost to 50 like with Snow globe and increase the creature count to 25 (remove the focus boost since it doesn't effect Vortex/make it effect vortex) and allow it to stack. That way it can still be used in higher levels to stop charging enemies, but it will come at a greater cost. Also, 25 is just because it is a nice even number. It could be something like 20 or 18 so it'll be 24 with the Focus boost. Also, I thought you were done nerfing Warframes in favor of making them all equal? Edited September 6, 2013 by Steemship Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muccmaster Posted September 6, 2013 Share Posted September 6, 2013 Vortex is still laughably bad, how about making it worth using? Also once you kill an enemy that counts towards the bastille cap another enemy should take its place and get lifted up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wallace24 Posted September 6, 2013 Share Posted September 6, 2013 Scott is right, bastille is one of the rare skills that is infinitely scalable, in that it did the same thing to enemies regardless of their level. skills like rhino stomp and molecular prime do minimal damage to high level enemies, but they still were immobilized by bastille. this makes defense missions harder, yes, but I think we are up to the challenge Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grodgen Posted September 6, 2013 Share Posted September 6, 2013 For a mod that served no direct offensive ability, the nerf seems kind of pointless. Compared to Frost's bubble which slows everything to a crawl and negates damage, Bastille needed to be super stopping to be balanced against it since that is all it does. Additionally, Vauban's other abilities are pretty weak and Bastille was the saving grace. Tesla is useless at higher levels, the bounce is fun, but useless at higher levels, and the damage output on Vortex makes it hardly worth it (although now it is a preferable) To recap: Vauban can't stand up as support role anymore because Frost's bubble is, all things considered, better now. To make it viable: reduce the cost to 50 like with Snow globe and increase the creature count to 25 (remove the focus boost since it doesn't effect Vortex/make it effect vortex) and allow it to stack. That way it can still be used in higher levels to stop charging enemies, but it will come at a greater cost. Also, 25 is just because it is a nice even number. It could be something like 20 or 18 so it'll be 24 with the Focus boost. Also, I thought you were done nerfing Warframes in favor of making them all equal? Equal? You believed that? lol No because people... no "Power Gamers"... were capable of getting 8 hours on the survival event, Vauban gets a frame breaking nerf. So basically, people built him to use one skill that made it possible for him to be pure support. And those 100+ players get looked at and because of their actions 45000+ other players get to suffer and lose out on their fun/money/time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moriginal Posted September 6, 2013 Share Posted September 6, 2013 Vauban 9.8: Feedback Thread Basitille: Now will have a set number of targets Good job De nerfing the best selling frame.Really good marketing strategy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dragonslayer667 Posted September 6, 2013 Share Posted September 6, 2013 good job nerfing yet another frame. bastille was for infested as snowglobe is for the other factions. you gonna nerf that next? add a damage cap for it now? this is a freaking joke. back to chaos being the ultimate skill again. what ever happened to bringing other frames up to the good ones levels not nerfing the only playable ones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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