LarryYourWaiter Posted November 15, 2018 Share Posted November 15, 2018 When their heads get replaced with machines, are they not, at that point, robots with living tissue bodies? Or are they still “people” with robot heads? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WindigoTG Posted November 15, 2018 Share Posted November 15, 2018 (edited) They are a group of individuals. So yes, by definition, they are people. Edited November 15, 2018 by WindigoTG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndouRaiton Posted November 15, 2018 Share Posted November 15, 2018 They are cyborgs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Firetempest Posted November 15, 2018 Share Posted November 15, 2018 (edited) That's up to philosophy. Transhumanism is the idea we will evolve beyond our current physical and mental limitations with science and technology. Games like Soma, Deus ex, soon Cyberpunk 2077. They deal with it more. Soma is likely closest to the Solaris problem. Edited November 15, 2018 by Firetempest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
schilds Posted November 15, 2018 Share Posted November 15, 2018 Whoa, way to objectify and dehumanise them. Are you a corpus spy? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LarryYourWaiter Posted November 15, 2018 Author Share Posted November 15, 2018 7 minutes ago, WindigoTG said: They are a group of individuals. So yes, by definition, they are people. A flock of sparrows is also a group of individuals. Sparrows are people? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LarryYourWaiter Posted November 15, 2018 Author Share Posted November 15, 2018 2 minutes ago, schilds said: Whoa, way to objectify and dehumanise them. Are you a corpus spy? Haha naaah just careful with where I pledge my allegiances. Is it dehumanising if they’ve already previously been made inhuman? Wouldn’t copying your mind over to a machine make a digital copy and the original is still in your flesh head? Are their original brains dead now or sitting on a shelf somewhere in some sort of stasis? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jatgeirr Posted November 15, 2018 Share Posted November 15, 2018 (edited) Given the mention of "Brain shelving" (i believe was the term) as a potential punishment for Solaris I suspect that the heads still contain a brain. This is furthered by the fact that AIs were heavily frowned upon and avoided by the much more advanced orokin (while cephalon do exist they are digitized brains and thus a term; so Solaris would be refered to cephalons if they were digitized brains). So yes, even arguments of "is a digitized person a person" kinda get shut down when your still dealing with a physical brain. It would be like asking if someone with a pace maker or a fake limb is "still a person" Edited November 15, 2018 by Jatgeirr Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WindigoTG Posted November 15, 2018 Share Posted November 15, 2018 (edited) 5 minutes ago, LarryYourWaiter said: A flock of sparrows is also a group of individuals. Sparrows are people? They aren't sophisticated enough to be individuals. Individual as in person. A sparrow is a comparatively simple animal, an "it". A complicated thinking being is a person, a "they". A group of "they"s is people. A flock of "it"s is a flock. Edited November 15, 2018 by WindigoTG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(XBOX)GearsMatrix301 Posted November 15, 2018 Share Posted November 15, 2018 This is edging into a topic that I’m not comfortable with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kyori Posted November 15, 2018 Share Posted November 15, 2018 they are cyborgs now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LarryYourWaiter Posted November 15, 2018 Author Share Posted November 15, 2018 (edited) 4 minutes ago, WindigoTG said: They aren't sophisticated enough to be individuals. A sparrow is a comparatively animal, an "it". A complicated thinking being is a person, a "they". A group of "they" is people. A flock of "it" is a flock. Ok, so at what point is an animal sophisticated enough to be people? Chimpanzees have pretty complex relationships and societies... your argument is also very weak as it completely falls apart in any other language. also, people ARE animals. When an animal isn’t sophisticated, it’s not individual? Is it part of a collective hive-mind then? Edited November 15, 2018 by LarryYourWaiter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zsword Posted November 15, 2018 Share Posted November 15, 2018 Solaris do have BRAINs, and the kids are like actual biological kids. I think even the full 'mech' solaris have an organic torso that does the living thing. Spoiler To quote: 'Thursby's stable... well, as stable as can be with so much of him missing.' The guy is now a Robo head, on a apperantly robotic Torso, with MOA legs. What would need 'stabalizing' if he was fully robotic? There's probably still some lungs and a heart and a brain slotted in there somewhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LarryYourWaiter Posted November 15, 2018 Author Share Posted November 15, 2018 7 minutes ago, Jatgeirr said: So yes, even arguments of "is a digitized person a person" kinda get shut down when your still dealing with a physical brain. It would be like asking if someone with a pace maker or a fake limb is "still a person" I’m not sure those are comparable. Your brain is the seat of your consciousness. It’s what makes you, you. Which is why brain damage can drastically alter a person’s personality whereas a pacemaker doesn’t. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WindigoTG Posted November 15, 2018 Share Posted November 15, 2018 (edited) 11 minutes ago, LarryYourWaiter said: Ok, so at what point is an animal sophisticated enough to be people? Chimpanzees have pretty complex relationships and societies... your argument is also very weak as it completely falls apart in any other language. also, people ARE animals. When an animal isn’t sophisticated, it’s not individual? Is it part of a collective hive-mind then? Quote A person is a being that has certain capacities or attributes such as reason, morality, consciousness or self-consciousness, and being a part of a culturally established form of social relations such as kinship, ownership of property, or legal responsibility. Call me when a sparrow get to this level. Ok, I'll put it straight and simple: "People" is a plural for "Person" Plural for "Human" is "Humans" "Humans" is a term you're looking for for the discussion. Also, a bonus quick analysis: Greener are people, but they aren't humans any more. Sentients definately aren't humans, but they seem to be evolved enough to be able to be people. Depends on whether they have any society of their own to be a people of. Edited November 15, 2018 by WindigoTG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Infirito Posted November 15, 2018 Share Posted November 15, 2018 The important quesion here is whether or not they are bureaucrats. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HexJ Posted November 15, 2018 Share Posted November 15, 2018 "The Solaris United are a rebel group of the Solaris people, seeking to liberate their fellow unhappy laborers who work for Nef Anyo underground in Fortuna. The Solaris people possess body augmentations that make them appear as Corpus-machine hybrids, and are responsible for processing the underground network of Orokin terraformation coolant and refining it for use back on the scorched surface of Orb Vallis on Venus." - Warframe Fandom Wiki, Solaris United Any resident living in Fortuna (a labor camp under the plains of Orb Vallis, Venus) can be refereed to as a "Solaris" or "Solaris People" for plural. As stated in the quote, Solaris United is not a place, it's a group of rebels inside Fortuna. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LarryYourWaiter Posted November 15, 2018 Author Share Posted November 15, 2018 1 minute ago, WindigoTG said: Call me when a sparrow get to this level. Ok, I'll put it straight and simple: "People" is a plural for "Person" Plural for "Human" is "Humans" "Humans" is a term you're looking for for the discussion. Arguing semantics isn’t arguing the point.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghogiel Posted November 15, 2018 Share Posted November 15, 2018 A person is simply a legal entity these days. The law is simply a construct of my tenno, being the supreme arbiter of whatever the hell I want. So no, not people. Because I haven't granted them that status. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LarryYourWaiter Posted November 15, 2018 Author Share Posted November 15, 2018 Haha can’t believe there have been this many responses! Awesome Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PurrrningBoop Posted November 15, 2018 Share Posted November 15, 2018 (edited) 1 час назад, LarryYourWaiter сказал: A flock of sparrows is also a group of individuals. Sparrows are people? Yes!.... well more than some... you may have heard about such individual.(Sorry could not help myself) On topic: If we check warframe wiki: The Solaris United are a rebel group of the Solaris people. I think we can close this case. I would, personally, like to call them cyborgs, due to the fact that their bodies were enhanced to increase productivity (I think the reason for their modifications was mentioned in the "Vox solaris" quest, specifically in case of Thirsby/Legs). Unfortunatly calling them Cybernetic/Augmented, lorewise, would make them much less relatable Edited November 15, 2018 by PurrrningBoop Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)robotwars7 Posted November 15, 2018 Share Posted November 15, 2018 how dare you say they aren't people! check your privilege before I write angry Tumblr posts!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WindigoTG Posted November 15, 2018 Share Posted November 15, 2018 1 hour ago, LarryYourWaiter said: Arguing semantics isn’t arguing the point.. Different terms for different things exist for a reason. You're asking whether they are robots or not at this point and if they are people. They most definately do show signs of higher cognitive functions, which means that wherever the 'shelved' brains are, they are what is in control, perhaps via some analog of transference. So no, they aren't robots. A robot would be mindless automathon. They are clearly individuals with personalities and functioning society. So yes, they are people with robotic heads. This is the answer for the question as it being asked in the OP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cubewano Posted November 15, 2018 Share Posted November 15, 2018 Depends on what your qualifications for being a person are. Technically I guess the Solaris people could be considered cyborgs, humans with technological augmentations that push them beyond traditional human limitations, but I don't view that as being entirely separate from ones person hood. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seprent Posted November 15, 2018 Share Posted November 15, 2018 (edited) 16 minutes ago, (PS4)robotwars7 said: how dare you say they aren't people! check your privilege before I write angry Tumblr posts!!! this got a chuckle out of me on topic i think its boils down to perspectives in philosophy but ot me Yes they are people since you can be brain shelved and i assume that is being put in a feezer or fridge for years at a time just a floating brain in jar if we can control out warframes VIA void WiFi essentially the corpus can figure out how to plugin a brain into WiFi for their workers i think fallout new vegas old world blues covered this idea pretty well been while since i played it though Edited November 15, 2018 by seprent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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