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Host Migration in Fortuna is Torture for Players with High Loading Time


walter100
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I enjoyed fortune, however, the extremely time consuming Loading when I enter a Group, discourages me a little, but this does not make me lose desire to play

But frankly, Many Players' Mania are aborting the mission because they have succeeded or failed, and being forced to go through a 1 Minute Host migration if I am the Host, or 5 Minutes if I am not, it discourages me to a point makes you lose your desire to play fortune

The best solution would be a new Host system, but that other players will not be harmed by Host's fault, whether it is intentional or accidental, it would be good for the whole game

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Um, fortuna does not take anywhere near 1 minute to load, let alone 5 minutes but then I am running on an i7 with 16GB ram and the game is installed on an ssd. 

I can only assume that the real issue is the pc/laptop you are playing it on as you don't seem to mention you specs, at a guess I'd say a laptop with a 5200rpm hard drive, lower amount of ram and low end cpu.

Now don't get me wrong people leaving when they're host is annoying either way but it's nowhere near as bad as you're making out unless you're playing on a system that likely isn't really suited to the game. 

Edited by LSG501
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Sorry but no. If the host chooses to leave and you have poor loading time then the issue is on you, not the hosting system.

Even if the issue is hosts dropping connection due to DE's end it doesn't matter if your computer can't keep up.

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12 minutes ago, LSG501 said:

Um, fortuna does not take anywhere near 1 minute to load, let alone 5 minutes but then I am running on an i7 with 16GB ram and the game is installed on an ssd. 

I can only assume that the real issue is the pc/laptop you are playing it on as you don't seem to mention you specs, at a guess I'd say a laptop with a 5200rpm hard drive, lower amount of ram and low end cpu.

Now don't get me wrong people leaving when they're host is annoying either way but it's nowhere near as bad as you're making out unless you're playing on a system that likely isn't really suited to the game. 

My PC is not one of the most Tops, but it is not Weak, maybe the biggest of the problems is the Memory, but I have to see if the Warframe is installed on the internal or external HD, but comparing with your SSD is Bullying T-T But the problem is when I'm not Host, Being Host or playing solo Fortuna Loads so fast

Edited by walter100
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3 minutes ago, LSG501 said:

Um, fortuna does not take anywhere near 1 minute to load, let alone 5 minutes but then I am running on an i7 with 16GB ram and the game is installed on an ssd. 

I can only assume that the real issue is the pc/laptop you are playing it on as you don't seem to mention you specs, at a guess I'd say a laptop with a 5200rpm hard drive, lower amount of ram and low end cpu.

Now don't get me wrong people leaving when they're host is annoying either way but it's nowhere near as bad as you're making out unless you're playing on a system that likely isn't really suited to the game. 

I don't see the OP denying that anywhere either.

Title:

Host Migration in Fortuna is Torture for Players with High Loading Time

 

So yes. PC spec and connection quality will play a role. But that is not what this post is about now isn't it. This has been true now and years ago for that matter. Having a lot f the mission data only stored on the host PC is prone to lag and lost items for those in this situation. It really is not that hard to see that this system has big issues.

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7 minutes ago, trst said:

Sorry but no. If the host chooses to leave and you have poor loading time then the issue is on you, not the hosting system.

Even if the issue is hosts dropping connection due to DE's end it doesn't matter if your computer can't keep up.

My only problem is with Fortuna, the rest of the game is Okay and my PC is not bad compared to MANY other PCs that we have here, if I have these problems imagine someone with less memory or a worse HD, improve the Host System or achieve some way to remove this Host Migration would be good for the whole game

 

5 minutes ago, chinhnguyen said:

get an ssd

Will you give me an SSD for free ??

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5 minutes ago, Airwolfen said:

I don't see the OP denying that anywhere either.

Title:

Host Migration in Fortuna is Torture for Players with High Loading Time

 

So yes. PC spec and connection quality will play a role. But that is not what this post is about now isn't it. This has been true now and years ago for that matter. Having a lot f the mission data only stored on the host PC is prone to lag and lost items for those in this situation. It really is not that hard to see that this system has big issues.

Basically what I'm complaining about,
I know Loading is time consuming and the problem is from my pc / connection, and I will never complain about it, but Host Migration has nothing to do with me, but I'm forced to go through an unnecessary and uncomfortable process

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38 minutes ago, Airwolfen said:

Host Migration in Fortuna is Torture for Players with High Loading Time

But the player only has a high loading time because of the PC being slow/low end...as I pointed out with my post there are no slow loading issues if your pc is of a high enough spec to play the game...

40 minutes ago, walter100 said:

My PC is not one of the most Tops, but it is not Weak, maybe the biggest of the problems is the Memory, but I have to see if the Warframe is installed on the internal or external HD, but comparing with your SSD is Bullying T-T But the problem is when I'm not Host, Being Host or playing solo Fortuna Loads so fast

I don't see how pointing out that the issue is down to you trying to play on lower end hardware is 'bullying'...  the fact that I have a system that is above the recommended specs (which are far too low for fortuna in all honesty) for the game and doesn't have the slow loading issues shows that the game does run smoothly when used with suitable hardware. 

The ONLY time I have ever seen slow loading is when I'm 'forced' to join a host who has a slow loading time and/or low end rig and as a client I have to wait for their toaster to load the level, basically my game can't load until the host has decided on the 'layout' of the map, fortuna doesn't have this issue as it's a fixed layout and is basically just loading assets. 

You say your pc is not weak, so tell us what the specs are and we'll tell you exactly what the issue is. 

 

 

I do wish DE would hurry up with those minimum spec changes, it's pretty clear that far too many people are still trying to play this game on hardware that is far from suitable.

Edited by LSG501
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47 minutes ago, walter100 said:

The best solution would be a new Host system, but that other players will not be harmed by Host's fault, whether it is intentional or accidental, it would be good for the whole game

Saying "add a new host system" doesn't really do anything to convey how this "new host system" would actually beneficially change the way people with high load times would interact with the game.

 

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Yes. It does suck. But what do you propose be done about it?

The only way a new host system could solve that is to basically make every client a host and they all talk to each other for synchronization. However, that will dramatically increase the effects of latency. We'd be trading load time for constant lag and weird desync issues.

It would also increase overhead. People with good computers wouldn't notice, but potatoes, which this community has an absurd number of, would feel it badly.

If you can think of another solution I'd like to hear it.

Edited by Erytroxylin
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6 minutes ago, LSG501 said:

But the player only has a high loading time because of the PC being slow/low end...as I pointed out with my post there are no slow loading issues if your pc is of a high enough spec to play the game...

And as I said. That is not the issue the OP is talking about.

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31 minutes ago, Airwolfen said:

And as I said. That is not the issue the OP is talking about.

It is when it's 'every time' like the OP is suggesting....there is no way that the OP would be put with lower end pc's than theres every time they try to play fortuna, while we all know the host selection code sucks it isn't 'that' bad.

Edited by LSG501
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32 minutes ago, Oreades said:

Saying "add a new host system" doesn't really do anything to convey how this "new host system" would actually beneficially change the way people with high load times would interact with the game.

 

 

26 minutes ago, Erytroxylin said:

Yes. It does suck. But what do you propose be done about it?

The only way a new host system could solve that is to basically make every client a host and they all talk to each other for synchronization. However, that will dramatically increase the effects of latency. We'd be trading load time for constant lag and weird desync issues.

It would also increase overhead. People with good computers wouldn't notice, but potatoes, which this community has an absurd number of, would feel it badly.

If you can think of another solution I'd like to hear it.

The "All Host" System would be interesting, but could bring Lag as it said, (it is rare to see but has lag in the current Host system), Another solution would be to filter what Host is transferring, decreasing processes that can be made by the Player without needing Host, This can decrease the Loading time caused by the Host, but I think this leaves the game heavier, but can be solved by creating a hybrid system based on the Spec of the user's PC

But I do not know much about these things so I can only talk bullS#&$ if what I say may be possible is another story

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8 minutes ago, LSG501 said:

It is when it's 'every time' like the OP is suggesting....there is no way that the OP would be put with lower end pc's than theres every time they try to play fortuna, while we all know the host selection code sucks it isn't 'that' bad.

You get that, I get that, and even the OP gets that. but the issue is brought up is not against the load times, But in the way the hosting system itself functions. And that, honestly, is outdated.

For example. if the host crashes, of flat out quits the game. you can actually lose progress and items because the game could not get those files from the host on migration. And that can happen even with a proper connection and PC. It is simply showing its age.

Its not Like I go around telling people having a toaster is fine either (I update parts of my PC from time to time). But the hosting system that warframe uses is simply out of date and could be way more efficient. Like backing up more info client side and defaulting more often to hosting yourself if another host takes too long to load over flat out kicking you. Those issues can happen to literally everyone, no matter your PC's specs.

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13 minutes ago, LSG501 said:

It is when it's 'every time' like the OP is suggesting....there is no way that the OP would be put with lower end pc's than theres every time they try to play fortuna, while we all know the host selection code sucks it isn't 'that' bad.

Just to remove the misunderstanding, My PC and an I5, GTX 1060 6gb, HD 1T (I just saw and the game is in the internal HD), and 8 Ram memory, (I want to increase to 16 on Black Friday but this very expensive where I live, I can try to get an SSD but only if there is money left over) My problem would be memory, but like I said, My problem is not the Loading time, it's the "Host Migration"

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The usual.
You make a good post and white knights come to say that the fault is on you or derail the post to something that wasn't even mentioned.

Everything that you do in Fortuna takes a long damn time, even showing the profile. Deal with it. It's a problem that is on that specific map and not just in Orb Vallis. It's inside of Fortuna's gates as well. If something blocks for more than 3 seconds you get a host migration and it's a damn plague. It's just loading a lot of random stuff that's not even in the screen nor anywhere near you, otherwise it wouldn't be a 50/50 to load anything and get blocked.

Denying that won't make the problem disappear.

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1 hour ago, walter100 said:

Just to remove the misunderstanding, My PC and an I5, GTX 1060 6gb, HD 1T (I just saw and the game is in the internal HD), and 8 Ram memory, (I want to increase to 16 on Black Friday but this very expensive where I live, I can try to get an SSD but only if there is money left over) My problem would be memory, but like I said, My problem is not the Loading time, it's the "Host Migration" 

Not sure which i5 but you shouldn't be really struggling with that unless your hard drive is like a 5200rpm one, have you tried defragging?.  As I said the host migration system isn't that bad that it will cause things to take up to 5 mins to reassign a host and 'reload' the game so I still say there is something on your end which is causing it rather than it being the game code, if it was the game code that was the issue far more people would be complaining about host migrations in the 5 minute range.   Are you or anyone else in the house doing anything else with the pc or network while you are playing the game, did you open all the required ports?

 

1 hour ago, Airwolfen said:

You get that, I get that, and even the OP gets that. but the issue is brought up is not against the load times, But in the way the hosting system itself functions. And that, honestly, is outdated.

For example. if the host crashes, of flat out quits the game. you can actually lose progress and items because the game could not get those files from the host on migration. And that can happen even with a proper connection and PC. It is simply showing its age. 

Its not Like I go around telling people having a toaster is fine either (I update parts of my PC from time to time). But the hosting system that warframe uses is simply out of date and could be way more efficient. Like backing up more info client side and defaulting more often to hosting yourself if another host takes too long to load over flat out kicking you. Those issues can happen to literally everyone, no matter your PC's specs.

Now we can all agree the host selection code is pretty poor but the host migration system works fine in my experience, but then my pc is 'higher end' and my internet is stable/fast enough (both speed and pings) to do things smoothly.

Don't get me wrong, I've seen slow loading or 'failure to load' of a level (ie when it gets stuck at 50% while we wait on the host) when joining a new mission due to the host selection being bad (this does need to be 'fixed') because for some reason it will pick the player with potato pc's and dial up internet (exaggeration but not far off).  But I don't get this sort of issue with host migrations, it happens smoothly and quickly. 

 

 

Edited by LSG501
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  13 hours ago, Airwolfen said:

Host Migration in Fortuna is Torture for Players with High Loading Time

But the player only has a high loading time because of the PC being slow/low end...as I pointed out with my post there are no slow loading issues if your pc is of a high enough spec to play the game...

  13 hours ago, walter100 said:

My PC is not one of the most Tops, but it is not Weak, maybe the biggest of the problems is the Memory, but I have to see if the Warframe is installed on the internal or external HD, but comparing with your SSD is Bullying T-T But the problem is when I'm not Host, Being Host or playing solo Fortuna Loads so fast

I don't see how pointing out that the issue is down to you trying to play on lower end hardware is 'bullying'...  the fact that I have a system that is above the recommended specs (which are far too low for fortuna in all honesty) for the game and doesn't have the slow loading issues shows that the game does run smoothly when used with suitable hardware. 

The ONLY time I have ever seen slow loading is when I'm 'forced' to join a host who has a slow loading time and/or low end rig and as a client I have to wait for their toaster to load the level, basically my game can't load until the host has decided on the 'layout' of the map, fortuna doesn't have this issue as it's a fixed layout and is basically just loading assets. 

You say your pc is not weak, so tell us what the specs are and we'll tell you exactly what the issue is. 

 

 

I do wish DE would hurry up with those minimum spec changes, it's pretty clear that far too many people are still trying to play this game on hardware that is far from suitable.

    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

Yeah well i have an I9 with 64 gbs ram and a gtx 1080 TI dual ssds for games with nvme boot fully liquid cooled and i still have issues even with a solid 50/50 mb connection. and i know this game will run on a dual core with 4-8 gbs ram on a mech hdd just fine, its the fortuna update for me. pretty sure your mid tier specs have nothing to do with it. And im pretty sure your telling someone thier pc sucks,and thats is the issue when you just don't know what your talking about is going to help.

And no i wont fix the grammer, I'm too tired.

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On 2018-11-17 at 7:15 AM, TKOINCOGNITO said:
  13 hours ago, Airwolfen said:

Host Migration in Fortuna is Torture for Players with High Loading Time

But the player only has a high loading time because of the PC being slow/low end...as I pointed out with my post there are no slow loading issues if your pc is of a high enough spec to play the game... 

  13 hours ago, walter100 said:

My PC is not one of the most Tops, but it is not Weak, maybe the biggest of the problems is the Memory, but I have to see if the Warframe is installed on the internal or external HD, but comparing with your SSD is Bullying T-T But the problem is when I'm not Host, Being Host or playing solo Fortuna Loads so fast

I don't see how pointing out that the issue is down to you trying to play on lower end hardware is 'bullying'...  the fact that I have a system that is above the recommended specs (which are far too low for fortuna in all honesty) for the game and doesn't have the slow loading issues shows that the game does run smoothly when used with suitable hardware.  

The ONLY time I have ever seen slow loading is when I'm 'forced' to join a host who has a slow loading time and/or low end rig and as a client I have to wait for their toaster to load the level, basically my game can't load until the host has decided on the 'layout' of the map, fortuna doesn't have this issue as it's a fixed layout and is basically just loading assets. 

You say your pc is not weak, so tell us what the specs are and we'll tell you exactly what the issue is. 

 

 

I do wish DE would hurry up with those minimum spec changes, it's pretty clear that far too many people are still trying to play this game on hardware that is far from suitable.

    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

Yeah well i have an I9 with 64 gbs ram and a gtx 1080 TI dual ssds for games with nvme boot fully liquid cooled and i still have issues even with a solid 50/50 mb connection. and i know this game will run on a dual core with 4-8 gbs ram on a mech hdd just fine, its the fortuna update for me. pretty sure your mid tier specs have nothing to do with it. And im pretty sure your telling someone thier pc sucks,and thats is the issue when you just don't know what your talking about is going to help.

And no i wont fix the grammer, I'm too tired.

I would have replied sooner but you kind of failed at quoting, not exactly a good start to try and prove you're 'better'... if you have an i9 then the issue for you might actually be too many cores, it's rare but some games actually perform worse when there are too many cores due to some weird smt coding by the devs and lets be honest warframe isn't exactly good at using multiple cores.  I'm guessing you've tried this already as you know how to buy expensive hardware but you could try running it with less cores active on the game (ie affinity if you need to go into taskmanager rather than having a program that can do it for you) and see if it makes a difference. 

You do know that 90% of the issues that people 'complain' about with regards to slow loading/performance are due to running the game on toasters or running something like a torrent in the background/another pc.  While I won't say fortuna is perfectly optimised or bug free a well set up and up to date system with above recommended spec hardware (the current listed is too low) should have zero issues migrating/loading fortuna, yes it's heavier than the rest of the game but it's not that much heavier than PoE.

Edited by LSG501
corrected term.
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  • 3 weeks later...
On 2018-11-20 at 9:02 AM, LSG501 said:

I would have replied sooner but you kind of failed at quoting, not exactly a good start to try and prove you're 'better'... if you have an i9 then the issue for you might actually be too many cores, it's rare but some games actually perform worse when there are too many cores due to some weird smt coding by the devs and lets be honest warframe isn't exactly good at using multiple cores.  I'm guessing you've tried this already as you know how to buy expensive hardware but you could try running it with less cores active on the game (ie affinity if you need to go into taskmanager rather than having a program that can do it for you) and see if it makes a difference. 

You do know that 90% of the issues that people 'complain' about with regards to slow loading/performance are due to running the game on toasters or running something like a torrent in the background/another pc.  While I won't say fortuna is perfectly optimised or bug free a well set up and up to date system with above recommended spec hardware (the current listed is too low) should have zero issues migrating/loading fortuna, yes it's heavier than the rest of the game but it's not that much heavier than PoE.

No my problem was a tablet issue as far as the quoting issue, but a hotfix seems to fixed the issue for now... i had tried different affinities amd even tried disabling core to no avail. 

i don't use torrents and i run lean on my software.. nobody else was using internet here and was sure to try when it wasnt peak hours. even tried recently on a dual core celoron 2.5ghz 4 gbs of ddr2 ram on a 500gb mech and hey it works fine.. hopefully they can keep it that way and stop breaking p2p.

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