Rework Set Mods Pls!!

[clxrffdman]

All the sets are fine except hunter imo.

 

[JohnKable]

8 hours ago, rand0mname said:

I think Plains set mods and their bonuses were added for newer players mostly. Easy to max, most of them are easy to farm... Vets get something to experiment with too. If only the drop rates for gold ones were less brutal, they would be perfect. Thankfully, Vallis mods are easy to farm. If only companions would stop running in one place and start attacking enemies... grrr.

Anyway, I am not sure if upgrading set mods to an end game levels of OP is a good idea. That niche is more suited for something like Umbral mods dropped from a Sentient boss, is it not?

They are ok as it is. Well, Augur puzzles me. Mods themselves? Good. But the bonus... Meh. IIRC, Plains sets were created then DE played with the shield gating, right? And since they dropped that idea it is what it is. Or am I missing something and shields are useful?

I see your point and kinda agree. Never talked about upgrading them to OP levels that would be just bad.
I hate OP mods in general and tend to never use broken things like maiming strike and blood rush (that will hopefully ger trashed with melee 3.0)
Just saying that since its a BIG DEAL fitting a full set, and you have to give up alot for that (power strenght, duration etc) in most cases for  more basic and less useful stats like survivability, they should have an exponential bonus.
If you can fit 4 mods of a set you should have a greater bonus to make up for the losses. Again as they are now, are just dual stat mods that happen to share the second stat (and i really cant stand that a single mod gives you set bonus... where in the world is 1 of a thing a set?)

[Veridian]

Please, no semi-primed vitality and such. Simply buffing them will only add to power creep and making them compete with the normal mods kills diversity.

They are fine, since they are not direct competition to their normal counterparts, nor are they obligatory. 

They allow for focused builds, their low capacity cost helps for umbral builds, their set bonuses are useful if a player wants to take advantage of them.

Also, once I've put in Vitality, Intensify, Continuity, Flow, Streamline (of which some I may not even need E.G. Streamline for Harrow, Intensify for Nyx, Continuity for Saryn...etc.) and let's say two corrupted mods, what am I going to put in the last slot? Undying Will or Provoked?

They are more or less the finishing touch to a build, to add a little something, when you value stats over utility.

 

 

[N2h2]

Il y a 10 heures, (PS4)big_eviljak a dit :

No it doesn't bypass. U still get up to a 90% dmg reduction. I love my melee mag.

🤐
Long survival run in MOT I assume /s


No shields are still weak, stock pilling health is a wast. All thoses frame with 1500 HP/2300 shields you see playing with random people. IT make them still super weak as soon as you go for lvl 80+ npc, they are barely usefull because of their frame ability lacking of range/strength/duration. And you still spend your time reviving them because they rely more on their shield/hp pool instead of dodge mechanics.

But I'm not surprised by that, too many stream / "best build ever" videos are promoting putting max shield/health/armor.
I won't deny it can be usefull to run lvl 5-60 missions... because everything work within this range. Then same people come to arbitration / mot survival.
At best they leave after 10 mins, at worst they keep dying and blaming other members that don't want to leave at C rotation OR they post on forum "that frame is weak, it require a buff / rework"

Remember to tell what lvl you're aiming at with thoses kind of advices.

Moreover, Adaptation can proc with shield... still damage reduction only apply on health pool.
 

Edited December 28, 2018 by N2h2

[(XBOX)Darthgollum 01]

7 hours ago, JohnKable said:

I see your point and kinda agree. Never talked about upgrading them to OP levels that would be just bad.
I hate OP mods in general and tend to never use broken things like maiming strike and blood rush (that will hopefully ger trashed with melee 3.0)
Just saying that since its a BIG DEAL fitting a full set, and you have to give up alot for that (power strenght, duration etc) in most cases for  more basic and less useful stats like survivability, they should have an exponential bonus.
If you can fit 4 mods of a set you should have a greater bonus to make up for the losses. Again as they are now, are just dual stat mods that happen to share the second stat (and i really cant stand that a single mod gives you set bonus... where in the world is 1 of a thing a set?)

You don't need to give up much actually the set mods take two of the frame ive found (2 warframe and the other 4 split across the rest) well except auger thats 3 but even then 5/6 spots still free to mod however you want plus the set mods have their base effect too which for augur effects the abilities and shields.

 

Though i think the gold ones should be less rare since afaic they're basically just the same as the rest of the set in terms of strength of the additional benefits (the actual effect of the mod)

[(PSN)big_eviljak]

7 hours ago, N2h2 said:

🤐
Long survival run in MOT I assume /s


No shields are still weak, stock pilling health is a wast. All thoses frame with 1500 HP/2300 shields you see playing with random people. IT make them still super weak as soon as you go for lvl 80+ npc, they are barely usefull because of their frame ability lacking of range/strength/duration. And you still spend your time reviving them because they rely more on their shield/hp pool instead of dodge mechanics.

But I'm not surprised by that, too many stream / "best build ever" videos are promoting putting max shield/health/armor.
I won't deny it can be usefull to run lvl 5-60 missions... because everything work within this range. Then same people come to arbitration / mot survival.
At best they leave after 10 mins, at worst they keep dying and blaming other members that don't want to leave at C rotation OR they post on forum "that frame is weak, it require a buff / rework"

Remember to tell what lvl you're aiming at with thoses kind of advices.

Moreover, Adaptation can proc with shield... still damage reduction only apply on health pool.
 

You haven't played with people that kno how to play obviously. Shields eat up faster to be sure. They dont gave a mechanic like armor to reduce how fast they burn. Well now  they do, but i digress.

However they are endgame capable with right player. Even before adaptation... My shield empowered frost, mag, harrow, zephyr, nyx, chroma was wrecking shop in 60 minute MOT's and tier 3 sorties... 

Do Shields need their own mechanic similar to armor for health? Yep, they do... But saying shield focused frames aren't endgame viable? Nah. Thats a false statement.

Dmg reduction from adaptation applies to shields. Dont believe me? Test on max shield Rev or harrow. Adaptation dmg reduction applies to shields, over shields as well as health.

Edited December 28, 2018 by (PS4)big_eviljak

[Almighty_Jado]

18 hours ago, clxrffdman said:

All the sets are fine except hunter imo.

 

Yeah, the set bonus sucks, but at least Munitions and Adrenaline are useful.

[JohnKable]

23 minutes ago, (PS4)big_eviljak said:

Dmg reduction from adaptation applies to shields. Dont believe me? Test on max shield Rev or harrow. Adaptation dmg reduction applies to shields, over shields as well as health.

we all know you can be tanky in many ways. the point is that either you dont need it (level 100 or lower enemies) or you will get oneshotted no matter the damage reduction you apply (level 400+)
Thats why many people think that survival mods in general are a waste of slots that can be used for something else, even moreso the lesser version of survivability mods because those arent even good at what they do. And equipping both a vitality AND the lesser set version of it is a double waste to my eyes, and im not the only one thinking this way.
Anyways to each their own, not saying that people shouldnt enjoy face tanking more shots that i do. In fact im saying that if those set mods had better buffs, more people like me, that usually dont like survivability mods, would start taking into consideration those mod sets.
It would be a win win scenario, and honestly they are so far from being OP that im not worried about making those mods mandatory because that wouldnt be the case

[(XBOX)Darthgollum 01]

8 minutes ago, Almighty_Jado said:

Yeah, the set bonus sucks, but at least Munitions and Adrenaline are useful.

I find the effect of hunter helps but the problem is the actual mod effects (bar adrenaline) additional slash chance and having the pet attack slashed enemies aren't too useful 

[(XBOX)Darthgollum 01]

11 minutes ago, JohnKable said:

we all know you can be tanky in many ways. the point is that either you dont need it (level 100 or lower enemies) or you will get oneshotted no matter the damage reduction you apply (level 400+)
Thats why many people think that survival mods in general are a waste of slots that can be used for something else, even moreso the lesser version of survivability mods because those arent even good at what they do. And equipping both a vitality AND the lesser set version of it is a double waste to my eyes, and im not the only one thinking this way.
Anyways to each their own, not saying that people shouldnt enjoy face tanking more shots that i do. In fact im saying that if those set mods had better buffs, more people like me, that usually dont like survivability mods, would start taking into consideration those mod sets.
It would be a win win scenario, and honestly they are so far from being OP that im not worried about making those mods mandatory because that wouldnt be the case

Why stay till level 400+ then? If you're making a tank build my experience is stay as long as you can then leave before you die. Same with anything really sure it might be difficult to tell.

Plus are we really playing the "it cant deal with level x enemies"?  Make a build that can take on literally everything then deal with the infinite levels of enemies that the game has to offer then I'll stop but until then yer just playing the kid who doesn't agree with something so they make up a situation where it doesn't work

[JohnKable]

1 hour ago, (XB1)Darthgollum 01 said:

Why stay till level 400+ then? If you're making a tank build my experience is stay as long as you can then leave before you die. Same with anything really sure it might be difficult to tell.

Plus are we really playing the "it cant deal with level x enemies"?  Make a build that can take on literally everything then deal with the infinite levels of enemies that the game has to offer then I'll stop but until then yer just playing the kid who doesn't agree with something so they make up a situation where it doesn't work

I thought my statement was pretty clear. Aint about "cant deal with level x enemies" but more in the lines of "its not needed under that level and its useless above that level"
And since the whole game revolves around level 100 or less enemies and alot of players find survivability mods totally unnecessary at those levels... well then everything i wrote before, not going to repeat.
Everything becomes useless at some point, but if something is found from many useless even before that point then maybe it could use a buff.

Sorry if i sound like a kid that doesnt want to agree, probably i couldnt make my point clear enough because english is not my language. I have 3000+ hours in the game, and dont want to sound elitist just because a few times i fighted level 500 enemies. I did just because i wanted to and that shouldnt be taken into account for game balance.
Still think that for normal gameplay (level 100 or less) enemies, survivability mods are very close to be pointless. And downgraded versions with a minimal bonus as a second stats look even worse to me. Sure still can have some value for build variety, but can certainly get a buff and gain the favor of more people (and thats what the whole topic is about)

[(PSN)big_eviljak]

1 hour ago, (XB1)Darthgollum 01 said:

I find the effect of hunter helps but the problem is the actual mod effects (bar adrenaline) additional slash chance and having the pet attack slashed enemies aren't too useful 

Unless ur using ardarza. That dmg bonus on top of 60% flat cc increase is epic... Hunter synergy and make sure u have a primary over 90% crit chance... Its a Gawdly combo.

Or use a kubrow with mecha overdrive plus set bonus... Hunter synergy and at least one other hunter mod, say hunter adrenaline, a primary with high crit and status like cernos prime... Endgame as they come.

Edited December 28, 2018 by (PS4)big_eviljak

[N2h2]

Il y a 2 heures, (PS4)big_eviljak a dit :

You haven't played with people that kno how to play obviously. Shields eat up faster to be sure. They dont gave a mechanic like armor to reduce how fast they burn. Well now  they do, but i digress.

However they are endgame capable with right player. Even before adaptation... My shield empowered frost, mag, harrow, zephyr, nyx, chroma was wrecking shop in 60 minute MOT's and tier 3 sorties... 

 

I clearly don't know what I'm speaking about. And I probably play only with noobs indeed.

You take lvl 100 NPC as endgame... which can be done with almost everything, you don't even need to use a skill at that point...

I was more like speaking about that:




Lvl 600+ doesn't care about any form of shield, that's exactly why I was asking... because there is what you call endgame and what is really endgame.

Personal opinion, i can't call endgame any mission that can be rushed in less than 2 minutes (AKA tier 3 sorties). sorry we were not speaking about the same thing at all...

[rand0mname]

49 минут назад, N2h2 сказал:

I clearly don't know what I'm speaking about. And I probably play only with noobs indeed.

You take lvl 100 NPC as endgame... which can be done with almost everything, you don't even need to use a skill at that point...

I was more like speaking about that:




Lvl 600+ doesn't care about any form of shield, that's exactly why I was asking... because there is what you call endgame and what is really endgame.

Personal opinion, i can't call endgame any mission that can be rushed in less than 2 minutes (AKA tier 3 sorties). sorry we were not speaking about the same thing at all...

Oh my. Octavia. 2 Octavias, if I am not mistaken. A real test of ones ability to watch invisibility buff like a hawk and do not die from boredom while enemies kill themselves. If you enjoy that, more power to you. But if you think that this is the one and only true endgame in Warframe, you are missing a lot.

For example, know what is true endgame for Octavia besides Fasion Frame and mushing crouch button? Search for “Oxium Sity” on YouTube.

[N2h2]

Don't feed the troll... don't...

Well... ok

[Sovereign991]

40 minutes ago, N2h2 said:

Don't feed the troll... don't...

Well... ok

Lmao his point is solid. What you call endgame, is an irrelevant glorification of cheesing pointlessly high level mobs. Just like running with nidus and just spamming 1 and 2 while a Spector does all your scaling damage. Wow, nice endgame.

 

Less than .1% of the playerbase cares about what people like yourself think is warframe's "endgame", because it's non-interactive tripe that doesn't prove anything, nets you zero rewards for going so long into endless, and serves as a warrantless source of smug elitism from idiots who think it means they're better because they can no life a 4 hour survival.

[N2h2]

Well solid point cannot be builded with false statments.. sorry.

And "warrantless source of smug elitism from idiots". Did I told everybody should do it? Elitist idiot was answering he probably played with good player... sorry that it trun it you soo mad. I don't envy you...
 

 

[spirit_of_76]

On 2018-11-17 at 10:07 PM, AndouRaiton said:

Gladiator set; mini bloodrush THAT STACKS WITH BLOODRUSH for a total of 230 % CC that stacks with combo counter, i.e. red crits in seconds. Although with melee 3.0 we don't know how good this will be but for now it's amazing

more to the point is works on exalted weapons that don't have access to blood rush and if done right can be nuts on a valk

[Dreddeth]

Set Mods as they exist serve 2 purposes:

Firstly, they're great to have as a newer player when your staples are only half-ranked, if you even have them.

Secondly, they're great to have as an older player when you want MOAR STATS but can't justify using a Corrupted Mod to get them.

The set bonuses themselves are more like gravy on top of having another half-mod's worth of stats with no reduction in some other stat attached. Aside from the "enhancement" effects of Umbral/Sacrificial mods, of course. If you have leftover slots after fitting your core build in, or don't have enough mods to constitute a core build, that's exactly the sort of thing these mods are good for.

You can also put a fair number of them on Companion weapons if you'd rather not grind up a whole second set of mods for that.

Also, throwing out Level 600 mobs in a discussion over whether or not something is "good" in the context of normal gameplay is a pretentious crock. That's like saying Mirror's Edge should have been balanced and designed around all the crazy glitches you can do to go out of bounds and basically fly across its levels, or that Bloodborn should have been completely rebalanced around the Arcane Rifle Spear exploit instead of having it patched away.

Warframe will never be balanced around Level 600, and it's only even possible to get there thanks to shameless cheese "strategies" and overtuned mistakes which DE themselves are gradually, glacially patching out of existence. You're probably not supposed to fight even a Level 300 enemy; you're supposed to run or die.

Edited December 29, 2018 by Dreddeth
Addendum

[(PSN)big_eviljak]

4 hours ago, N2h2 said:

I clearly don't know what I'm speaking about. And I probably play only with noobs indeed.

You take lvl 100 NPC as endgame... which can be done with almost everything, you don't even need to use a skill at that point...

I was more like speaking about that:




Lvl 600+ doesn't care about any form of shield, that's exactly why I was asking... because there is what you call endgame and what is really endgame.

Personal opinion, i can't call endgame any mission that can be rushed in less than 2 minutes (AKA tier 3 sorties). sorry we were not speaking about the same thing at all...

600+ as a mark is retarded. Your trolling me at this point. Are u truthful about 600+ plus? Probably... But that isnt endgame. Thats beyond endgame, in a place where few tread.  I dont play beyond level 250ish because i have a wife that wants to br able to spend a few hrs a day with me between wrk and sleep and enemy scaling takes too long to get there, also i cant hold my urine that long lol.

The top 10% of players probably play in-between lvl 250 and lvl 500 enemies and thats the top 10%. This discussion includes players below that.  Im not talkn about 2 min missions... Im talking about endurance runs... So we are talkn about the same thing. Though u aren't talking in an "applied" sense... Ur trying to construe the topic. 

Shields can reasonably handle lvl 250ish enemies... So yes, they canhandle "endgame" content. Though the term, "endgame" is different for everyone... Im speaking in a general sense. Generally, people dont tread 600+ waters. Understand?

If ur trying to impress me?... Im impressed, u can handle endgame content from the compfort of invisibility and  u take a beautiful screenshot. Good job.

Edited December 29, 2018 by (PS4)big_eviljak

[N2h2]

not trying to impress anyone, but when you're telling me i don't know what i'm speaking about / nor i didn't played with good player...
Relying on shield, even for NPC far below that is actually a waste.

Why as soon as you put somthing it's for showing off? do you realise that's far from people playing 10h in same survival.

On your side, any 150+ NPC take down a shield in a single shot. you actually clearly cannot rely on that for any content above lvl100. Actually it would be good if shields could bring somthing different than an HP pool without resistance on it. But it's no more thant that, because there are no mitigation on damage it take.

[CyberPrimate]

On 2018-11-18 at 5:07 AM, AndouRaiton said:

Mecha set; allows spreading of Status effects to nearby enemies. Amazing (if it worked) for CO builds

Mecha set will transfer slash procs. Mecha Pulse mod for your frame will give you 60% for every enemy killed in 30m radius. 10 enemies - 600% armor. Put that on Inaros or any decent DR frame and you are nearly unkillable.

Heres a vid i made for Ivara. (obviously not caring about the armor buff here)

 

 

[(XBOX)Darthgollum 01]

On 2018-12-28 at 7:54 PM, JohnKable said:

I thought my statement was pretty clear. Aint about "cant deal with level x enemies" but more in the lines of "its not needed under that level and its useless above that level"
And since the whole game revolves around level 100 or less enemies and alot of players find survivability mods totally unnecessary at those levels... well then everything i wrote before, not going to repeat.
Everything becomes useless at some point, but if something is found from many useless even before that point then maybe it could use a buff.

Sorry if i sound like a kid that doesnt want to agree, probably i couldnt make my point clear enough because english is not my language. I have 3000+ hours in the game, and dont want to sound elitist just because a few times i fighted level 500 enemies. I did just because i wanted to and that shouldnt be taken into account for game balance.
Still think that for normal gameplay (level 100 or less) enemies, survivability mods are very close to be pointless. And downgraded versions with a minimal bonus as a second stats look even worse to me. Sure still can have some value for build variety, but can certainly get a buff and gain the favor of more people (and thats what the whole topic is about)

Everything is like that though lol the whole reason there's so many different builds for each warframe is because people stay as long as they can then evac they're called endless missions for a reason because no matter how many enemies you kill the algorithm generating the next batch is still there so they keep coming and keep getting stronger plus how long would it even take to get level 400 enemies appearing? From my experience an hour on survival (malva cuz i was xp farming) doesn't even have level 100 enemies so what 5 hours? 6 hours? To get level 400 i don't think anyone honestly has that amount of time to spend

As for the second part apologies if i seemed to kinda explode i just keep seeing everyone going on about dealing with over lv 100 and since below lv 100 is the entire system and the set mods are attainable from earth venus or trading i think buffing them to be more suitable for over lv 100 enemies makes them too powerful for what's effectively early game gear yesterday i traded a new player about 3 augur mods intensify and stretch for ammo drum (cuz they were new) said to em that it makes things a lot easier if they can fit it in their build then i saw they were mag so augur set is even better cus she's ability heavy but imagine if it was buffed up and the new player who has been playing for 3 days suddenly has endless shields and super mods if it was me id get bored and leave cuz its too easy

However if there was a later version only accessible to players who have the entire system unlocked maybe have it on sedna or eris and call them "(set name) (mod name) prime" or something like that have it so they cant be used in addition to the normal one they have better stats as usual prime stuff does but they should only be accessible from a few late game missions

[(XBOX)Darthgollum 01]

On 2018-12-28 at 11:28 PM, Sovereign991 said:

Lmao his point is solid. What you call endgame, is an irrelevant glorification of cheesing pointlessly high level mobs. Just like running with nidus and just spamming 1 and 2 while a Spector does all your scaling damage. Wow, nice endgame.

 

Less than .1% of the playerbase cares about what people like yourself think is warframe's "endgame", because it's non-interactive tripe that doesn't prove anything, nets you zero rewards for going so long into endless, and serves as a warrantless source of smug elitism from idiots who think it means they're better because they can no life a 4 hour survival.

Trur personally i beat the more annoying bosses with a slightly more glitchier cheese though...i stayed out of aggro range XD

[(XBOX)Darthgollum 01]

On 2018-12-29 at 1:28 AM, N2h2 said:

not trying to impress anyone, but when you're telling me i don't know what i'm speaking about / nor i didn't played with good player...
Relying on shield, even for NPC far below that is actually a waste.

Why as soon as you put somthing it's for showing off? do you realise that's far from people playing 10h in same survival.

On your side, any 150+ NPC take down a shield in a single shot. you actually clearly cannot rely on that for any content above lvl100. Actually it would be good if shields could bring somthing different than an HP pool without resistance on it. But it's no more thant that, because there are no mitigation on damage it take.

I see yer point though there's a difference between relying on shields and simply prioritizing them i personally favour shields cuz they recharge and have an entire set dedicated to charging them up and making them better however i always make sure to add a couple health mods in to take care of stuff that ignores shields like gas toxin and bleed (those are the main ones i know of) i make sure ive enough health to survive a few rounds of the gas ospreys and mostly leave it at that since the augur set does ability stuffs and shields simultaneously everything else i can tailor fit to the frame for example loki has the spare slots as duration and range stuffs with i think a speed mod or two for mobility whereas nyx and valkyr pretty much all duration 

As soon as im able to reliably top up my 'second health bar' and i can survive some hits straight to my health i don't need anything more and while im still learning decent combinations and im definitely not a seasoned veteran or anything im pretty sure that being able to immediately gain a ton of shields and do ability stuffs simultaneously is pretty overpowered another example kinda obvious but take trinitys 2 the "energy well" my current trinity is tanky cuz i wanted a laugh but imagine her with augur equipped using her 2 gaining shields and overshields from using the abilities then gaining the energy back whenever a gas drone comes by zap someone with yer 1 punch around to heal and kill the drone then once again zap something with 2 for energy back all the while max shields max health max energy granted its a specific build but its using shields a set and little health my trinity isnt even max level yet but im pretty sure that build would be able to take care of quite a lot any problems id say rely on the weapons not the frame build

Im no meta player and i prefer to just mess around and have a laugh trying crazy builds like tank healers but i don't think shields or set mods need buffed they just need more thought when being applied in a build