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Vent Kids and the Environment


Almagnus1
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Can someone please explain to me how the vent kids don't turn into popsicles once they go out to Fortuna, especially since all the adults need mods to do work, presumably in cold temperatures.  I mean - unless the Orokin figured out how to turn a a planet with a mean surface temperature of 462C/864F (going by https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Venus ) into a snowball.

So... how do the vent kids survive the cold while the adults need to be modded?

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The kids are - if you look at them they've got miniature versions of the adult's rigs. They've even got that whole 'lack of a neck' thing going on. Plus, parts of their bodies light up when they talk, just like the adults.

So, it does seem that they're modded.

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17 minutes ago, Almagnus1 said:

Can someone please explain to me how the vent kids don't turn into popsicles once they go out to Fortuna, especially since all the adults need mods to do work, presumably in cold temperatures.  I mean - unless the Orokin figured out how to turn a a planet with a mean surface temperature of 462C/864F (going by https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Venus ) into a snowball.

So... how do the vent kids survive the cold while the adults need to be modded?

Did you really compare temperatures of real Venus to in game teraformed planet Venus? I mean its half the story that venus is teraformed and warmed up..that thing on sky is not sun.

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il y a 17 minutes, Mover-NeRo a dit :

Did you really compare temperatures of real Venus to in game teraformed planet Venus? I mean its half the story that venus is teraformed and warmed up..that thing on sky is not sun.

Actually that's the opposite, Venus is being cooled down by the orokin towers and real venus is incredibly hot.

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57 minutes ago, Almagnus1 said:

Can someone please explain to me how the vent kids don't turn into popsicles once they go out to Fortuna, especially since all the adults need mods to do work, presumably in cold temperatures.  I mean - unless the Orokin figured out how to turn a a planet with a mean surface temperature of 462C/864F (going by https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Venus ) into a snowball.

So... how do the vent kids survive the cold while the adults need to be modded?

Easy, our venus has nothing to do with the one in game. Steve said so himself

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3 hours ago, trst said:

They already are fairly modified though (judging from their necks they probably don't have lungs anymore) I do wonder why their arms and legs are perfectly fine.

Nah. It's more likely just the neck seal of their suits... which in some cases leaves their arms bare. Aesthetically it might make sense, but functionally it doesn't.

The same goes for the Fortuna cybernetics. Basically it is a large breadbox with limbs and a sensor cluster attached. Limbs are often organic, which requires an extensive, seperate support module for things like temperature regulation and nutrition, and all in all undermines the premise of cybernetic enhancement to withstand the climate. There's also the problem with cybernetics, that metal is very good at thermal transfer, meaning that any living tissue in contact with it will suffer from frostbite and hypothermia in very cold climates. Top that off with a lack of visible life support and proper shielding of exposed systems, and you get a concept that can't stand up to assessments based on realism. The only actual merit the cybernetics have here is a means to force people into indentured servitude. A servo assisted insulated suit would make leagues more sense.

It is also highly unlikely, that the kids sport cybernetics at such an early age, since the rate of growth will necessitate constant recalibrations and adjustment on systems embedded in soft tissue, and systems anchored to bone tissue would need to be replaced every few weeks, and even then the cybernetics would most likely cause the bones to grow crooked. There are reasons why some corrective procedures are best done at an early age, and some are best done once a person has stopped growing.

Fortuna have plenty of "Oh, we didn't think that one through..." elements, and kids running around with exposed skin in conditions that would crack the enamel off your teeth and literally freeze smaller bodyparts off is just one of them.

Edited by Yrkul
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49 minutes ago, Yrkul said:

Nah. It's more likely just the neck seal of their suits... which in some cases leaves their arms bare. Aesthetically it might make sense, but functionally it doesn't.

The same goes for the Fortuna cybernetics. Basically it is a large breadbox with limbs and a sensor cluster attached. Limbs are often organic, which requires an extensive, seperate support module for things like temperature regulation and nutrition, and all in all undermines the premise of cybernetic enhancement to withstand the climate. There's also the problem with cybernetics, that metal is very good at thermal transfer, meaning that any living tissue in contact with it will suffer from frostbite and hypothermia in very cold climates. Top that off with a lack of visible life support and proper shielding of exposed systems, and you get a concept that can't stand up to assessments based on realism. The only actual merit the cybernetics have here is a means to force people into indentured servitude. A servo assisted insulated suit would make leagues more sense.

It is also highly unlikely, that the kids sport cybernetics at such an early age, since the rate of growth will necessitate constant recalibrations and adjustment on systems embedded in soft tissue, and systems anchored to bone tissue would need to be replaced every few weeks, and even then the cybernetics would most likely cause the bones to grow crooked. There are reasons why some corrective procedures are best done at an early age, and some are best done once a person has stopped growing.

Fortuna have plenty of "Oh, we didn't think that one through..." elements, and kids running around with exposed skin in conditions that would crack the enamel off your teeth and literally freeze smaller bodyparts off is just one of them.

I'm wondering... it's almost as if DE needs a science adviser for some of their concepts >.>

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It's clearly cold in Orb Valli's, but it's uncertain just how cold it actually is. It snows, there seems to be a permanent amount of snow, but there's also short warm periods. The citizens of Fortuna can obviously survive outside with skin exposed with few harmful effects, possibly due to an amount of naturally evolved thermal resistance. The cybernetics are more than likely an act of control, with options towards better limbs if required for some reason. Keeping the real eyes, ears, nose etc sealed away is probably important due to the freezing weather, but exposed fingers don't seem to be as much of a problem (though they do seem to have enough meat and muscle that those extremities are less at risk of harm than the more sensetive features of the face.

 

How do the vent kids fit in with all this? I suppose their hover-heads are a better option because maybe they can pop off and be picked back up again through Bluetooth control of their whole body, without the risk of breaking anything major. How nutrients get transfered back and forth is anyone's guess. They can't stuff the head into the chest cavity probably due to the fact that they're still growing. It's hard to tell how it all works together.

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if there are all kinds of rats, birds and animals living in the surface, it cant be that cold for a heavily modified cybernetic body to survive, I'm just saying.

also the  warm periods of time that the surface suffer would be a nightmare ecologically speaking, also if those kids can survive no problem, is an obvious problem that the adults cant, it make no sense, there is suspension of disbelief and there is get the hell out.

My only conclusion is that, Adults are just not RAD enough to take the cold, represent!

Edited by -NightmareMoon-
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9 hours ago, Almagnus1 said:

Can someone please explain to me how the vent kids don't turn into popsicles once they go out to Fortuna, especially since all the adults need mods to do work, presumably in cold temperatures. ...

So... how do the vent kids survive the cold while the adults need to be modded?

Wait, was this mentioned anywhere in-game? I always assumed that the mods were there for job-related necessities, not necessarily for the cold weather.

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7 minutes ago, Gamma745 said:

Wait, was this mentioned anywhere in-game? I always assumed that the mods were there for job-related necessities, not necessarily for the cold weather.

I'm kinda fuzzy on this point myself.  Given how Mercury has a pretty wonky temperature range of −173 to 427 °C (−280 to 800 °F - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mercury_(planet)) and that the Sun is basically ablating away Mercury cause it's that close, and thus has no atmosphere to retain heat which is why the temperature range is bonkers, I could potentially see part of Venus being really cold if the Orokin managed to somehow introduce more nitrogen into the atmosphere to make Venus more Earth-like rather than the hellscape it is now.

As it looks like the Venetian atmosphere is breathable, I would suspect that the atmospheric composition has been changed, so it's really anybody's guess what the surface temperature range is.  We know that it's colder than 32F/0C, but not how much colder.  Anything that's between 20-32 F (-6 to 0C) would likely be fine for most unmodded humans ignoring the atmospheric conditions, however, I'm not sure what windchill would do to the human body as that would be a factor with what's essentially a rocket powered snowboard.

That said, as corpus have shields the cold effects could be handwaved away by saying the shield creates a bubble of warmer air around the vent kid that stays with them, rendering the need for thermal protection unecessary.  For all we know, that shield could be generated by the board, and the board itself could be a heating unit, so sitting on the board would be like sitting on a warm stone in the middle of winter.

It all really depends on how cold and humid Venus actually is.

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1 minute ago, Almagnus1 said:

I'm kinda fuzzy on this point myself.  Given how Mercury has a pretty wonky temperature range of −173 to 427 °C (−280 to 800 °F - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mercury_(planet)) and that the Sun is basically ablating away Mercury cause it's that close, and thus has no atmosphere to retain heat which is why the temperature range is bonkers, I could potentially see part of Venus being really cold if the Orokin managed to somehow introduce more nitrogen into the atmosphere to make Venus more Earth-like rather than the hellscape it is now.

The extent of Orokin terraforming does bound to be massive, since it somehow have a breathable atmosphere and moderate pressure, not the metal-crushing pressure our Venus have. It wouldn't be surprising if some nitrogen input is one of them.

 

5 minutes ago, Almagnus1 said:

As it looks like the Venetian atmosphere is breathable, I would suspect that the atmospheric composition has been changed, so it's really anybody's guess what the surface temperature range is.  We know that it's colder than 32F/0C, but not how much colder.  Anything that's between 20-32 F (-6 to 0C) would likely be fine for most unmodded humans ignoring the atmospheric conditions, however, I'm not sure what windchill would do to the human body as that would be a factor with what's essentially a rocket powered snowboard.

That said, as corpus have shields the cold effects could be handwaved away by saying the shield creates a bubble of warmer air around the vent kid that stays with them, rendering the need for thermal protection unecessary.  For all we know, that shield could be generated by the board, and the board itself could be a heating unit, so sitting on the board would be like sitting on a warm stone in the middle of winter.

It all really depends on how cold and humid Venus actually is.

I doubt the temperature is below the water freezing point on Orb Vallis, else the ponds and rivers would froze up. Unless those liquids are some kind of special coolant that stays at liquid form at sub-zero temperature. I just got some conflicting information regarding this and I don't know which one is correct.

You do raise a good point about windchill. Though from what I see, the Ventkids "armors" seems pretty solid to double as windshields. We can kinda assume it made with insulation, and the rigidity seems good to ignore wind. That's just what I see though.

Shields could be a good explanation, but I have a problem with it. The shields the Corpus (and we) have is generally weak against the cold. A cryogenic leak on some ships is enough to weaken it. I highly doubt that it's their primary method to protect themselves from the cold.

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9 hours ago, Marekthejester said:

Actually that's the opposite, Venus is being cooled down by the orokin towers and real venus is incredibly hot.

 

8 hours ago, Mover-NeRo said:

 

Ah right...my bad.

 

Yet still, while Venus is being cooled down  by the towers, the thing in the sky is not the sun, but a sattelite, redirecting the sunlight to Orb Vallis to heat it up, as it is located in the heart of a freezing maelstrom near the pole.

 

So @Mover-NeRo was right after all.

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vor 1 Stunde schrieb Gamma745:

I doubt the temperature is below the water freezing point on Orb Vallis, else the ponds and rivers would froze up. Unless those liquids are some kind of special coolant that stays at liquid form at sub-zero temperature. I just got some conflicting information regarding this and I don't know which one is correct.

Those lakes have been called coolant lakes in devstrean and their Surface coloring indicators its not only water, so its pretty safe to say the Liquid has a different freezing point.

Source for the word coolant lake:

 

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2 minutes ago, Eisdschungel said:

Those lakes have been called coolant lakes in devstrean and their Surface coloring indicators its not only water, so its pretty safe to say the Liquid has a different freezing point.

Source for the word coolant lake:

 

Thanks for that. It doesn't say that it's not a non-water liquid, but I suppose that's good enough for the freezing point argument.

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Adults do work in dangerous environment. Kids don't.

Orokin colonized the Solar System, had plans for expansion and loved to play with genetics. A baseline “human” in Warframe setting is probably someone heavily modified to be able to survive a lot of things that would kill us.

Still, it is one thing to play in the freezing wind and it is another to walk in coolant. Fortuna adults hide their heads and modify themselves so much because accidents happen all the damn time. Just look at Ticker cases. “Coolant inhaling” is pretty common.

That's my headcannon at least. Feel free to poke some holes in it.

Edited by rand0mname
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