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Octavia - Let's Be Real Here


Shadowh4nd
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The problem:

  • I can throw down my 1 and 4 and go AFK for the next minute. When I come back, and if I'm even barely competent with mallet placement, I will have vastly higher kills than my teammates.
  • Her 2 ability is buggy enough that it needs augmented to retain its effectiveness**.
  • Her 3 ability is off sync, and the only time it reliably affects teammates is when playing something like [Song: Headache Flower].

 ** This may be a little bit of a stretch, you can definitely still use your roller ball all over, but it's ineffective when you need it the most because it kinda goes on "adventures".

 

Suggested changes:

  • Her 1 is stupid strong if it's just left in spot and absolutely trivializes defense and mobile defense. To nerf it, and to encourage usage of her 2 in tandem, I suggest mallet be made in a directional cone with range affecting its width.
  • Her 2 would be the only way the mallet would have AOE damage.
  • Correctly hitting a buff from her 3 would buff all nearby teammates also, rather than requiring them to dance. (Which, admittedly, sounds like it would be less fun, but seriously, they can't get it. If you're using a custom song it's not going to happen.)

 

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 Let's be real here, then. How many times do you see an Octavia in random pubs? You would think, the way you put it, that she would always be in every flavor of Defense, if not multiples everywhere.

If you don't want her 1 to move, you don't use her 2. If you want it to move, you use her 2. There's a serious disconnect with the frame as presented in the game if you are complaining that her 1 and 2 together make it roam around and that's somehow unintended and/or unwanted on your part.

How would your 1 suggestion change its use?

Your suggestion for her 3 is absurd. If you want an Augment to do that at half effectiveness or less, sure. Not innate access for every ally with no input on their part.

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On 2018-11-20 at 7:42 PM, peterc3 said:

How many times do you see an Octavia in random pubs? 

Often but usually only in high density missions, where she can toss down her 1, hit 4 then 3 and twerk on her 3 to stay invisible for 99% of the mission while enemies kill themselves. 

 

Edited by (PS4)psycofang
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I play with Octavia a lot, and yes, she can be really boring to use, but my biggest issue with her is how her abilities work without her Mallet.

 

Her Resonator is great at distracting enemies, however, Mallet or not, the way it moves around makes it highly unreliable. It either stays in one place, refusing to follow you, or it goes off into the unknown never to be seen again, but in all cases, it's rarely in the area you'd like it to be. The augment can fix this, but I find it silly to give up a mod slot for such a basic functionality.

Her Metronome would be great, but sadly, besides rapidly crouching to get invisibility you can't reliably activate any of the other buffs it provides. Nor can your team, which means that only a fourth of this ability is actually usable, and even that mostly only by you. Some buffing ability, ain't it?

Her AMP is really good team damage buff, that can reach as high as a damage multiplier of eight, but again it's mostly tied to the Mallet and in general how noisy the environment is.

And on top of it all, each and every of her abilities effectiveness relies on the song you chose for her. Slower songs with less notes means less times her abilities activate, so less damage from the Mallet, less charm from the Resonator, slower buff build up on the Metronome and less noise made by your abilities for the AMP. So the "best" song for her is to fill out all the notes.

But a lot of people don't see these issues, because her Mallet is so good it essentially hides all this. Why buff the team or distract enemies when the Mallet will do that and reliably kill them by default?

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I always get so sad when i play octavia, i REALLY REALLY REALLY REALLY REALLY REALLY REALLY REALLY REALLY REALLY, wanted her. Like i was border line buying her but i was just missing neuros, so much i went out and learned all the other warframes i needed to get to where i could handle going into derelict survival like nothing....

then came the day i finally built her..... i was so excited, i started leveling her up and then about 15 waves into hydro i started getting bummed. at least she looks cool with the bundle only sydana 😞

Honestly wish they would make her 1,2,3 Hold to cast and have tap do an ability related to what it is, like mallet could be a targeted explosion on cast (with some percussion sound that plays with it) and the mallet deplyment on hold to cast.

Then they should change her 4 to be tap to cast and hold to change to a different saved song.

 

Edited by Dabnician
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17 hours ago, peterc3 said:

 Let's be real here, then. How many times do you see an Octavia in random pubs? You would think, the way you put it, that she would always be in every flavor of Defense, if not multiples everywhere.

I main Octavia and the only time I'm not top in kills is when there's a Saryn that keeps me from even seeing the enemies. Even then, it takes a single one to slip in and touch the mallet for me to take top kills again. I don't even have good gear. I have basic mods for range and duration. I sit there and crouch invisible for the entire wave, and I don't even need to go kill enemies with my weapons.

17 hours ago, peterc3 said:

complaining that her 1 and 2 together make it roam around and that's somehow unintended and/or unwanted on your part.

Not what I'm saying at all.

17 hours ago, peterc3 said:

How would your 1 suggestion change its use?

It would nerf her mallet to a smaller area, requiring her to use her 2 to make it a 360 degree AOE, which would also require more energy and make it less effective at defending (because it would no longer be stationary). It's a nerf.

17 hours ago, peterc3 said:

Not innate access for every ally with no input on their part.

Unlike every other buffing frame's ability?

You seemingly dodged the entire point of my post. The end result would be an Octavia that buffed her teammates more effectively without brainlessly topping charts with AOE.

Edited by Shadowh4nd
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8 minutes ago, Shadowh4nd said:

I main Octavia and the only time I'm not top in kills

Not what I asked, but OK. If I or anyone cared about topping the kill numbers, it might be a compelling argument, but it generally isn't. You seem overly concerned about the number of kills people make and that isn't a focus or even acknowledged by the game. So what if you get a bunch of kills?

9 minutes ago, Shadowh4nd said:

Unlike every other buffing frame's ability?

Look at what Metronome can do and then look at every other buff ability. If the list of things Metronome can do looks the same as everything else, then I don't know what to say.

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On 2018-11-20 at 7:23 PM, Shadowh4nd said:

The problem:

  • I can throw down my 1 and 4 and go AFK for the next minute. When I come back, and if I'm even barely competent with mallet placement, I will have vastly higher kills than my teammates.
  • Her 2 ability is buggy enough that it needs augmented to retain its effectiveness**.
  • Her 3 ability is off sync, and the only time it reliably affects teammates is when playing something like [Song: Headache Flower].

 ** This may be a little bit of a stretch, you can definitely still use your roller ball all over, but it's ineffective when you need it the most because it kinda goes on "adventures".

 

Suggested changes:

  • Her 1 is stupid strong if it's just left in spot and absolutely trivializes defense and mobile defense. To nerf it, and to encourage usage of her 2 in tandem, I suggest mallet be made in a directional cone with range affecting its width.
  • Her 2 would be the only way the mallet would have AOE damage.
  • Correctly hitting a buff from her 3 would buff all nearby teammates also, rather than requiring them to dance. (Which, admittedly, sounds like it would be less fun, but seriously, they can't get it. If you're using a custom song it's not going to happen.)

 

I honestly think that while Octavia can be boring, she is in a really good place right now. You actually have to do something to ensure your 3 gives you stronger buffs; wether that be jumping, crouching, or shooting to the melody. Probably the only problem she has is how to get her neuros, which was the most pain I have ever been through. Her other parts are quite fun to farm but this isn't the main topic rn.

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rolelrball shouldn't require energy or ability, it should also have upgrades/special abilities and growth, customization. Its small enough to operate without batteries,

  • even if it just collects bullets, distracts, and protects team mates, it should be small enough to be stealthy. (Ideally a costfree/pet that comes out or flies, that can react to sound and use energy to fend, and reacts to music/sound/ small enough like a ghost, deployable, like a furbee, evolve with ranks, change shells and functions), the rollerball looks exactly the same as a regular rollerball
  • . The music can be annoying and== too loud.
  • music innafected by map/level, damp, am starving...alot..gg, octavia.
  • as lontg as octavia gets some blade attacks, and skilsl that she can use while performing dodge / rolling and some mid-air energy attacks, maybe she can deploy several explosive mallets mid-air at a low cost, that can cause stasis or some detriment, elemental or sonic or resonator work..granades...octavia, it just makes sense,
  • the players should require to activate some mid-air and slowmotion/abilities to stop spam.
  • rollerball mods and types, rank up functions, sonic/laser/turret/gas/elemntal attacks with assist/energy.

i really just think octavia should get its own pet robot, or be redone completely, its too loud and cringy right now, and the abilities are boring and automatic for players dont always know how to join the music creation / editing, the pets and rollerballs are too extreme and unrealistic, and also look like regular steel meridian turrets, so some rankup changes would be nice to just get some new abilities and customization, like the ones that turrets and pets get, overall i really just like the smallish idea, summoners and pet based games allow for some special energy attacks, modyfyers and interesting reasons to want to play octavia in each level/map are missing, such as aquiring more songs, and parts, skill treeand other growth, lore, all i've seen is one gun that is rank 12, and some nodes laying around in some of the planets, i really coulnt find a way to edit music or make my own compositions before i was 30, and when i got to rank 30 there wasn't anything special or new passive traits to gain, so what is leveling up for in warframe, its pretty weird...i am just looking foward to more melee and animation changes, hidden blades, hedgehog spinning attacks, more animal stuff, like octavia becoming a mechanic rollerball like sonic the hedgehog, using some slicing gimmick spin, and small releases of music, i think because the music stays on and the ship atmosphere doesnt have its own music room in the ship or rewards for spending time creating, drop offs and materials, getting octavbia together means training her to be more deadly in combat and giving her more free instruments and pets to play clean.

  • since its a ball, it can scan enemies automatically, and also collect resources from rank 1, also it would be cool if it could overheat, as its getting shot at the music could demminish, and the energy could control the volume and deadlyness of the ability roller, some special bloom/shine and shields should keep the thing alive...etc.

her elbows look like machine guns, maybe each ability should allow octavia to gain access to hidden weapons and modes of attacking, this way she can enhance the weapons she is using and her acrobatic movements if she has energy to burn, i still think relying on distraction & music shouln't be the central focus of octavia and this makes her look like a regular average joe, when it comes to combat, since she can't just whip out a random aoe sonic dash, melee or x-men punch, something.

various slides and movements leave the warframe exposed to damage, 

repetitive abilities make her predictable and boring

warframe modes and attacks feel regular

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51 minutes ago, (PS4)santospizarro said:

~snip~

For the love of RNG dude, put everything into a single post. You've been told off for spamming before.

If you have another idea after you've submitted your initial post, make an edit.

https://forums.warframe.com/topic/1023872-add-weather-cause-and-effective-rewarding-gameplay-enhancements/?do=findComment&comment=10268020

Please re-read the above comment, posted by a moderator in one of your threads.

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On 2018-11-24 at 10:43 AM, (PS4)santospizarro said:

i really just think octavia should get its own pet robot

I disagree here and I think we're straying from balance concerns to design changes... Also, her music volume is adjustable on both sides of the table. 

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On 2018-11-20 at 6:23 PM, Shadowh4nd said:

The problem:

  • I can throw down my 1 and 4 and go AFK for the next minute. When I come back, and if I'm even barely competent with mallet placement, I will have vastly higher kills than my teammates.
  • Her 2 ability is buggy enough that it needs augmented to retain its effectiveness**.
  • Her 3 ability is off sync, and the only time it reliably affects teammates is when playing something like [Song: Headache Flower].

 ** This may be a little bit of a stretch, you can definitely still use your roller ball all over, but it's ineffective when you need it the most because it kinda goes on "adventures".

Brain dead play exists everywhere.  it's not a big problem like it used to be.  And no one cares who got more kills.

On 2018-11-20 at 6:23 PM, Shadowh4nd said:

Suggested changes:

  • Her 1 is stupid strong if it's just left in spot and absolutely trivializes defense and mobile defense. To nerf it, and to encourage usage of her 2 in tandem, I suggest mallet be made in a directional cone with range affecting its width.
  • Her 2 would be the only way the mallet would have AOE damage.
  • Correctly hitting a buff from her 3 would buff all nearby teammates also, rather than requiring them to dance. (Which, admittedly, sounds like it would be less fun, but seriously, they can't get it. If you're using a custom song it's not going to happen.)

 

Nerfing it isn't needed.  Because again many things in this game can trivalize content.  Her 2 exists if you want to take her style on the go.  People here are pretty against forced synergy.  Giving everyone every single buff her 3 can give without their input would be insanely strong and not needed.  She's someone you take with an organized group.  People who'd be playing around you.  Not a pub.

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On 2018-11-21 at 8:42 AM, peterc3 said:

How many times do you see an Octavia in random pubs?

Partly because Octavia performs much better solo than with another party member. A lot of frames greatly reduces Mallet's effectiveness.

Most CC frames like Rhino, Frost, Vauban, Khora, Nyx, Banshee, Nova, etc.prevents the enemies from hitting mallet and thus reduces the damage it deals, Limbo is the worst offender for the complete disabling and of the frequency of which he appears on a public match.

Meanwhile most non-CC frames are damage dealing / nuking frames that kills the enemies before they can damage the mallet, same end results.

And people simply don't use frames that aren't either of those.

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10 hours ago, (XB1)Knight Raime said:

Giving everyone every single buff her 3 can give without their input would be insanely strong and not needed

Equinox, Chroma do this with the click of a button... If being overpowered isn't an issue, why would a strong buff be out of the picture? I think changing her to a buffing frame with limited braindead AOE is warranted. The goal is just to make her more intricate, helpful, and less "easily powerful".

10 hours ago, (XB1)Knight Raime said:

And no one cares who got more kills

This is said to make the point that octavia physically does not have to be present for ~40 seconds at a time in order to render her teammates useless

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6 hours ago, Shadowh4nd said:

Equinox, Chroma do this with the click of a button... If being overpowered isn't an issue, why would a strong buff be out of the picture? I think changing her to a buffing frame with limited braindead AOE is warranted. The goal is just to make her more intricate, helpful, and less "easily powerful".

Unless i've had brain damage equinox only gives one kind of buff at a time.  And chroma's is semi balanced via the fact that he needs to take damage.  Octavia gives several buffs at a time.  The idea of something being incredibly strong isn't forbidden.  But the ways in which this happens have guide lines.  Giving everyone perm invis, multi shot, speed, and damage is insane for one ability.  The only way i'd be fine with this is if they removed most of the buffs.  But then that destroys her uniqueness.

6 hours ago, Shadowh4nd said:

This is said to make the point that octavia physically does not have to be present for ~40 seconds at a time in order to render her teammates useless

Which just loops back to the brainless discussion.  Effort is something that can be argued about sure.  But as I said Octavia really isn't a pub frame.  She's for organized teams.  This post comes off as change for the sake of change.  Which i'm not fond of.  I get the idea that you'd like to see more interactive Octavia play and have her seen more often.  But I don't think we should change her because of that.  I myself would love to see Valkyr more often.  But i'm not championing changes for her just because of that.

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4 hours ago, (XB1)Knight Raime said:

Octavia really isn't a pub frame.  She's for organized teams.

This just isn't true at all. Octavia is more than effective enough on her own to not require a group to support her. I see her all the time. The fact that her kit is so bland and lends itself almost entirely to a set and forget playstyle just makes that even worse.

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14 hours ago, AdunSaveMe said:

This just isn't true at all. Octavia is more than effective enough on her own to not require a group to support her. I see her all the time. The fact that her kit is so bland and lends itself almost entirely to a set and forget playstyle just makes that even worse.

By me saying she's not a pub frame i'm not stating she can't work in a pub requirement.  I'm saying she's MUCH better in an organized group.  Because those are the people who will play around her kit to use it to the best possible effect.

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She is pretty powerful, but I am not sure I would call her an AFK frame. 

It could be considered a lazy frame that can turn boring if you only use her 1and 4 to lock a room, but you still need to be actively playing for her other abilities to work. 

And the lazy play is limited to static single room defense missions. 

And being good at specific missions is not a bad thing. 

Other missions need to be more interactive for her to function well.

I Completely disagree with you on the "give buffs to all" unless the buff strength is limited or duration is significantly reduced or is effective in only a very small range around you. 

She can give far too many buffs and if I get a whole squad that has all buffs active at all times the Content will become boring again.

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