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[DE]Rebecca

Nyx & Titania Dev Workshop

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Also had some time to test the Nyx rework.

  • MC is okay, but I don't like the shoot to amplify damage mechanic, especially on infested, they immediatly run away and you can't buff them properly, also sometimes it does not even work at all, and can they die now within the duration of the ability ? 
  • the effect on Psychic Bolts is nice, but please get rid of the limitation of only 6 targets, this is really annoying and making it spammable wouldn't be OP, also the Bolts target your MC target, they don't do anything, but this is a waste, especially if you can only cast once, also the slow on infested doesn't seem to work properly and doesn't really seem useful at all, maybe give them back their damage and make it scale with max. HP of enemies
  • Absorb still seems useless
  • I can't tell if her passive is working or not, a lot of enemies are still hitting you, maybe she just needs a higher %

To sum it up, she mostly plays as before. Bolts now are nice but the limitation is just to annoying. MC does not deal any remarkable damage (maybe my weapons are just crap, because I didn't manage to reach more than 500%), and Absorb is still as useless as before. I would like to see an amplification of your MC target via your skills, as this would better fit her theme and maybe not waste that much time for the short lifespan the MC target has and you will still need good weapons, as she does no significant damage with her skills.

As a side note : It would be nice to get some actual feedback from the developers on our ideas and concerns. The little changes you did to Nyx and Titania feels like you are completly ignoring the feedback you are getting here. So maybe a little update every now and then on the greatest concerns would be nice. Maybe also some short explanation why some things are not working or taken into account, for example why can't we have a pet in Razorwing ? I am not sure if this was already answeared, but I can't remember any note on this.

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Is it normal that enemies can still shoot at me even Lantern is on?

They kept moving as well though...

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The only thing done properly about the nyx rework was the 100% debuff capability. Apart from that:

1. Resetting 2 takes way too long of a hold. This makes her augmented 2 nearly useless since we can't spam it and since resetting takes too long.

2. I honestly can't feel her passive because in the high levels I am still easily shot.

3. Her mind control enemy still has trouble being useful even if it's shooting unarmored/unshielded targets. The damage multiplier is too low for that flat damage to actually kill any enemies. Unless a weapon slot is sacrificed to use a sniper rifle, the average damage boost is 430% which isn't enough for npc vs npc to be beneficial apart from what chaos already does.

3. Her 3 when synergized with 2 still does not cause enemies to easily kill each other, especially since only 6 can be debuffed. I tested in real matches and the simulacrum, and I can confidently say that they take forever to do worthwhile damage to each other. I had to recast her 2nd 3 times and no enemy had yet to kill another.

4. Her charged 4 still does laughable damage to others even if you use your 2 on the enemies first. Also, it drains way too much energy in the high levels where this ability is needed most. In the low to mid levels, chaos is enough to save you and there are just way more efficient weapons and frames for killing over her 4. If 4 is going to remain as a bad damage ability then please make it a much more energy efficient tanking ability in the high levels where it's mostly needed.

 

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45 minutes ago, ShockBurst said:

The only thing done properly about the nyx rework was the 100% debuff capability. Apart from that:

1. Resetting 2 takes way too long of a hold. This makes her augmented 2 nearly useless since we can't spam it and since resetting takes too long.

2. I honestly can't feel her passive because in the high levels I am still easily shot.

3. Her mind control enemy still has trouble being useful even if it's shooting unarmored/unshielded targets. The damage multiplier is too low for that flat damage to actually kill any enemies. Unless a weapon slot is sacrificed to use a sniper rifle, the average damage boost is 430% which isn't enough for npc vs npc to be beneficial apart from what chaos already does.

3. Her 3 when synergized with 2 still does not cause enemies to easily kill each other, especially since only 6 can be debuffed. I tested in real matches and the simulacrum, and I can confidently say that they take forever to do worthwhile damage to each other. I had to recast her 2nd 3 times and no enemy had yet to kill another.

4. Her charged 4 still does laughable damage to others even if you use your 2 on the enemies first. Also, it drains way too much energy in the high levels where this ability is needed most. In the low to mid levels, chaos is enough to save you and there are just way more efficient weapons and frames for killing over her 4. If 4 is going to remain as a bad damage ability then please make it a much more energy efficient tanking ability in the high levels where it's mostly needed.

 

Mind Control shouldnt have this windup to buff dmg, Mind Control target should use their maximum 30% of their health as damage. And allow them to gain elemental/physical damage based on your Nyx's current equipped weapon's mod is great too. Ammo waste = for dmg buff is waste

 

Psychic bolts should be spammable cast. The bolts should have mechanic where it tell Mind Control and Chaos target to attack the victim hit by the bolts.

 

Chaos should stay the same. Allowing psychic bolts to command them is great to prevent nyx and allies getting shot at.

 

Absorb should have base range of 20m than 10m. Allow to proc status based on the elemental and physical dmg based. Remember that Absorb make Nyx invincible, is a strong panic button ultimate thats better as survival tool. Turning absorb into nuke is bad, but allowing for different utility like proc status, or atleast give allies some Damage reduction based on absorbed damage is great too.

 

Passive should be scaling power.

 

Enemies that affected by Nyx's debuff (all her abilities cc and debuff types) will make her abilities stronger. Which means

 

Enemies debuffed = stronger absorb, psychic bolts, chaos, and mind control

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25 minutes ago, XenMaster said:

Mind Control shouldnt have this windup to buff dmg, Mind Control target should use their maximum 30% of their health as damage. And allow them to gain elemental/physical damage based on your Nyx's current equipped weapon's mod is great too. Ammo waste = for dmg buff is waste

 

Psychic bolts should be spammable cast. The bolts should have mechanic where it tell Mind Control and Chaos target to attack the victim hit by the bolts.

 

Chaos should stay the same. Allowing psychic bolts to command them is great to prevent nyx and allies getting shot at.

 

Absorb should have base range of 20m than 10m. Allow to proc status based on the elemental and physical dmg based. Remember that Absorb make Nyx invincible, is a strong panic button ultimate thats better as survival tool. Turning absorb into nuke is bad, but allowing for different utility like proc status, or atleast give allies some Damage reduction based on absorbed damage is great too.

 

Passive should be scaling power.

 

Enemies that affected by Nyx's debuff (all her abilities cc and debuff types) will make her abilities stronger. Which means

 

Enemies debuffed = stronger absorb, psychic bolts, chaos, and mind control

If your suggestion is too complicated for them to implement, I think that the mind controlled enemy should absorb the status percentage and elements/combos of your weapon when you shoot at it and the multiplier should be greater for higher damage since enemy vs enemy damage is really ineffective without any worthwhile boosts. 

2. I agree that psychic bolts should be spammable because despite the enemies being debuffed, they still take longer to kill compared to what a mesa, saryn, equinox, whip khora, etc. can kill in an instant in the casual lvl 1-100 content.

If we can't spam then I think psychic bolts should cause enemies under chaos, as you said, to target those affected by psychic bolts for 100% aggro. Targeting them is a great suggestion by you to allow a creative synergy. 

I think the knockdown radius of absorb should be much wider. About 3/4 the radius of your modded chaos. The damage does not have to go that far but at least the knockdown to make it a better panic button. The move is very energy inefficient so a very wide knockdown would be very beneficial. However, I would still want absorb to only have a passive energy drain rather than having a passive drain along with additional drain depending on the damage. It is too ineffective in the high levels because of the high energy drain that scales with enemy damage.

 

Your passive synergy suggestion is good. If they think it may be too op then I think they should have the passive cause debuffed enemies to take 100% aggro.

 

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Titania's "rework": fail

What was given were basic qol necessities that should have been there since the start.

- #1 and #3 are redundant with each other / fold together

- #2 tributes are near irrrelevant in game due to being aoe debuffs with small areas and ignorable effects, dutst in particular is - 50% hit chance on enemies, pity enemy hit chance can scale above 100%! and that all other defensive abilities are 100% effective + it should be additive to razorwing passive

- #3 should be a combo of #1 and razorflies cast / power not working, enemies ignore lantern in favour of shooting players 90% of the time / area is mediocre without edge builds

- #4 still oneshotted in both the Plains of Eidolon and Orb Vallis by any kind of anti-air fire, still missing a way to deploy more razorflies, still no interactions (opening lockers, picking up things, hacking panels, reviving alies) while skywing can and adds a 2nd layer of health and shields to the carried frame!

Sorry but i'm plenty convinced that you guys at De are trolling us every time you announce a rework

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Hello,  Nyx update long post incomming.

The main problem with Nyx now, that actually wasnt that much of a problem before.

I wanna talk a lot about Nyx's best most underestimated, misunderstood and underappreciated skill, OLD augmented Psychic Bolts, and why the NEW Psychic Bolts is actually bad on its own currently, and for the direction of her overall playstyle. So yeah, Before the update there was a concern that I had with a specific interaction with the new Nyx Psychic Bolts, but held off as it was stated that the new Psychic Bolts would also deactivate Infested Ancient Aura so that NEW Psychic Bolts could at least cover the most important practical function the old version did especially regarding Ancient Healers. Radiation Proc have a specific interaction with Ancient Healers where if a linked enemy in the group got a radiation proc the Ancient Healer was imediately isolated. This made the Old Psychic Bolts super effective when it came to dealing with Healers (if say Chaos was unavailable or too risky due to longer cast time, or if a Healer couldnt be directly targetted due to corners or spawning out of bounds (yay void rifts) etc).

First, to understand what was good about the OLD Psychic Bolts, break the skill down into three parts: 
 

  1. Radiation Procs - The most important part, a quick way to disrupt enemy ranks, especially efficient with breaking up Ancient Healers as mentioned before.
  2. The stun or 'confuse' duration - Tied to the Psychic Bolts augment mod, while not as important as the radiation proc above, this is still a quick easy way to make an enemy group chill out for a few seconds.
  3. The old slash procs and damage, meh - Yay, you can kill stuff on Mercury with this, but later on, real Nyx players dont care about this aspect of Psychic Bolts.

Next considering Nyx's overall Playstyle, Identify the threats is the enemy group, disrupt, take out your big gun/sword and clean up. Even though the third aspect of Psychic Bolts is pretty meh the stronger and more heavily armored the enemies become, the first and second aspects of the skill are still great at contributing to overall playstyle of Nyx. Chaos is more for mass confusion and tile-wide disruption when a Psychic bolts cast isnt enough, and Mind Control is more for grabbing a specific enemy that you would rather have on your side then your enemies' . 


So I took Nyx into direlect and void rifts today, then took the 'anomalies' to the simulacurum and discovered the following:  

With regular infested groups, If the Ancient Healer is effected by the new Psychic Bolts debuff, then the damage absorbtion links are broken, and 'minions' are not protected by the Ancient Healers Link ability (yay). If the 'minions' are effected but the Ancient Healer is not, the minions are still protected by the Ancient Healers Link ability (this is a problem, boo). It's even worse with Corrupted groups where, whether the Corrupted Ancient Healers are effected by the Psychic Bolts debuff or not, they still Damage Link with their groups (boo). 


Damn. So my initial though on the change to Psychic Bolts was, okay, ditch the old damage/slash proc for the new debuff, because hey, thats good, I can throw psychic bolts into a group to make them chill, then because of the debuffs the above Nyx playstyle is rewarded with extra damage when we go in and clean up with big gun/sword,  and hope the 'deactivate Infested Ancient Aura'  functions well enough to make up for the loss of radiation proc, but nah, alas. As I said, I like the debuff as a replacement for the old meh damage, but can we please get that radiation proc back, even if its attached to the augment.

Also whatever this cooldown, wait for Psychic Bolts to end on current enemies before being able to recast stuff is, it's dumb, and it's going to get us killed. If I want to burn my energy to get an optimal casting of Psychic Bolts, please let me do so.


Other Nyx things: 

A note on skill design VS playstyle. There's a recent trend with warframe skill/ability design to have things interact and combo with each other like say, Saryn Spores + Toxic Slash etc, and thats cool where it is appropriate. However I feel that this not appropriate for Nyx. Sure now you can cast Chaos and then debuff enemies so its easier for them to kill each other but remember, Nyx generates ZERO affinity when a Mind Controlled or Chaos effected enemy kills another enemy, and also at this point because of how New Nyx works, she's casting too many skills, for very little effect and the end result is rather dumb, considering she could have just been stabbing/shooting things herself. When I go to my loadout and I pick Nyx, I pick her, because I want to kill things with my weapons, and not stand around casting too many skills in succession. I think looking at Nyx's playstyle of Disrupt and Clean up, the old Nyx suited that much better with Mind Control, Psychic Bolts and Chaos, being their own tools for specific ways to disrupt enemy ranks then get your hands dirty and clean up with your weapon of choice. Perhaps some warframes like Nyx would rather benefit from being built like tool boxes, having a specific skill to cover a specific situation, without the real need to do skill combo setups.

The passive, I'm okay with it, Nice touch deactivating the passive while channeling Absorb, that was one of my other concerns, big yay! Still seeing other Nyx's getting shot down randomly though. Perhaps the Mind Freak, Mind Control augment can be adjusted to have a Mind Controlled puppet siphon a percentage of Nyx's incomming damage. 

Oh, the ingame text in the arsenal abilities section still has the passive displayed as the old disarm passive. *edit*


In closing:

I've had these concerns with Nyx rework since the devstream announcement way back, but really only posted now because after the last reworks (I'm looking at you Saryn ♥️) I'm pretty sure we can all see that the real rework only happens once the stuff goes public and all of us are able to play test and give DE feedback on what's actually good, what looked good but actually sucks, bugs, polish etc etc.. So, thank you DE for doing these devworkshop threads with the community, especially for paying attention to them after the stuff initially goes live.

Edited by -Trixxy
*edit* (s) were made.

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About the Nyx Rework.

 

I feel like the rework is very dated compared to everything new coming out and how newer Warframes work. It may be you wanted to keep the core Nyx experience for most of the userbase however, being a Nyx main until Khora came out myself, I would say you're guys are being limited too much by it.

I won't be offering too much feedback about the rework as most of the posts here reflect that already, but I'd be going for suggestions instead.

Mind Control might be better if the target would draw aggro from Chaos'd enemies. If that target expires and the duration of the ability is still active, it'll transfer that control to the enemy that did the finishing blow and this process will repeat itself until the duration is up. Aggro range is based on ability range.

Her new passive really feels weak and pointless (If it even really works). Her being one of the softest frames around and she's not even a DPS type of frame really is frustrating to play and even if some of the bullets miss, it doesn't really matter if it only takes 1-10 bullets to take you out which only takes a second to happen on missions with 40-60 enemites. MOA's and even Mirage, Ember and Nova has more armor than her. She does have the Shield and Vitality to compensate for the lack of armor, but that takes up two mod slots and even more to maximize.

What can be done instead to increase synergy with Chaos. Maybe it'd be better if she have crazy evasion only to targets affected by Chaos. Perhaps this one might be more complicated to implement.

Edited by HellHeart
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So I've playtested Titania.  Does the rework department have a return policy?  And like... can I just return or exchange parts of the rework?  Like y'all can have the three extra lanterns back, as well as the changes to-... you know what, just take the whole Tribute, just the whole thing, gimme a warframe without a 2, and I'll just take a single lantern that doesn't go anywhere when it's shot at.  I'm keeping the energy buff and razorwing vacuum, though.  Would that work for you?

Edit the lantern is also still stupidly inconsistent and half the time doesn't do what it says on the tin and enemies still shoot at me, reach the lantern, decide it's not worth their time, and go back to shooting me.

Edit2 y'all had 4 years and 4 months of feedback and this is all you got for us?  Did anyone think to even show Pablo a picture of Titania?

Edited by GideonWilhelm
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Titania needs more help, because 99% of the players still only play her just because dex pixia looks cool:

cast time reducement and actual damage on her 1, better buffs, and no fall off in case you fall off the map on her 2, and a sprint scaling on her 4

for buffs my recommendations would be

dust- 50% reduced enemy accuracy and 200% reflected damage on melee hit (reflect scaling with ability power)

thorn- +25% damage (also scaling with power strength)

entangle- flat -25% movement speed, -50%fire rate and attack speed for enemies (attack debuffs scaling with ability power)

full moon- 15% ability strength both for frames and pets, scaling with ability strength, and 15% flat aura effectiveness

just for clearness, "flat" marks the elements not scaling with anything

 

her 1 should do a flat 5% health damage, rising to 20% if the target was lured by the lantern

(while here lets mention her lantern augment technically is useless on her, and no matter what, titania never has enough energy and has too long cast time to make full use of razorwing augment either)

Edited by Air-mage
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On 2018-11-29 at 2:28 AM, Eiddew said:

Titania is a frame entirely built upon contradictions. Actively anti-synergy. Her passive does literally nothing when using Razorwing. Full Moon previously nothing when using Razorwing. Her Damage Reflect is reduced by decreasing enemy accuracy. Her damage reflect is reduced by having evasion. Her damage reflect is reduced because enemies shoot slower with thorns.

Modding her is a pain because her 2 just isn't affected, but you can either mod for 1 and 3 and gimp 4 or mod for 4 and awkwardly run in to melee range when you need to cast to activate Razorwing Blitz. You get however many razorflies but need to cancel and recast 4 to get them back, losing any razorwing blitz stacks.

It's like someone actively designed the frame around being forma hungry and having only two ways to play. Maybe in development Titania was two frames that were merged in to this one amalgamation we have.

don't worry about her being forma hungry, i have 6 on her and she still sucks, and her only usable thing is her pistols (which are still weaker than my main pistols and weapons)

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These are two of my favourite characters but despite the update, I always play them the same: Chaos, Absorb/Assimilate Nyxia and Razorwing cute pixie Pixia. 🦋

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Nyx seems to go down alot more now after the update in that moment coming out of absorb.. that needs to be fixed, also has anyone else noticed self damage doesn't seem to work with absorb anymore either?

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6 hours ago, Air-mage said:

don't worry about her being forma hungry, i have 6 on her and she still sucks, and her only usable thing is her pistols (which are still weaker than my main pistols and weapons)

Don't worry, sink another 6 in and you'll have an all-round build.  Drop Narrow Minded and Fleeting Expertise though and you'll need an Arcane Energize or two.  Do wish Lantern did something other than make grunts feel pretty as they walk past them to the objective.

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As expected the new passive is at best meh (is it like a 5% chance to miss?) but imo way worse than the old one. Please explain to me like im a very stupid child how a) spammable abilities taking enemies guns so they cant shoot you and have to resort to weaker melee (for the entire team) is worse than b) a random/fixed (?) tiny miss chance for Nyx alone. The old passive description is still there, not that much work to just revert it to how it was before, pretty please 😛

I think the the argument was that Nyx needs to be hit and so the old passive runs counter to that, but absorb disables it anyway? Besides that absorb is and always has been crap for damage, it was always about the invulnerability more than anything else.

Mind controlled/chaosed enemies still cant kill stuff as effectively as a good gun or another frame, what else is new, was that ever the point. Its CC. Hit em with chaos, kill em while they run around like headless chickens or move on - or if its a defense take a nap while they attack anything but the objective. Who for the purpose of actually killing stuff stands there pressing chaos over and over until the enemies have killed themselves half an hour later

You had the foresight to not fiddle around with chaos, whew. Change to 1 and 2 are interesting, could use some work still it seems

Reasoning for the changes was Nyx is in bottom 10% of used frames (and oh that deluxe skin coming up). DE tries to keep old frames fresh, thats good but please not at the cost of messing around with her kit  to maybe make her more appealing to players who didnt play Nyx before and wont play her now either. Stop trying to make Nyx a DPS frame. Its a CC frame, it has its niche and unless you totally revamp the kit to something else entirely people will still play her 10 minutes, go "room doesnt explode when i press 4, weak" and go back to Mesa or Saryn. Its not for everyone but still works, please dont break it

Ill keep maining Nyx since now its like in ye olden days when there wasnt any passive and the rest of the changes dont break her too bad (yet) but this aimless fiddling is worrysome.

In case anybody from the dev team reads this thread (seems not) heres another thread with some pretty good suggestions in it

Merry Christmas

 

Edited by Howtoshootgun
typos, clarification
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Nice changes to Nyx ! But could you please change Absorb to make it not react to friendly fire anymore. This would make it into a really great defensive ability. Right now it is more like a pseudo Magnetize because 60% of the teammates do not realise they are shooting at it (because they are inside the bubble or stuff like that) and the other 40% are trolls who want to drain the energy of the Nyx player. So please, please with sugar on top, change it, that would be really awesome.

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Like Nyx's rework so far, but the damage still seems lacking versus lv 50+ enemies cuz of the armor. I think the dmg needs more rapid scaling or bonus damage on psych'd units.

Titania's "rework" still plays more like a tweak than a rework. You basically do the same thing you've always done but you don't have to spam as often.

Still recommend looking at this DE, 't got 13 upvotes despite being burried within the thread.
--------------------------------------------

Give her a proper rework:
Passive - Swarm: A swarm of Razorflies always accompany Titania, attacking enemies and drawing aggro. If Razorflies are destroyed, they can be respawned slowly over time or by casting abilities. Razorflies deal more damage to enemies affected by Titania's abilities
Other: Increase base energy and half her casting times

1. Spellbind: On cast, halts enemy movement before casting them into the air to prevent momentum from moving them too much. Razorflies will be attracted to and attack Spellbound enemies.

2. Tribute: Rather than target-based, now attacks in a radial AoE around Titania. All enemies affected will have their damage heavily reduced and drop their souls on death. Razorflies are attracted to affected enemies. Allies receive all Tribute auras that Titania has active. Casting Spellbind on Souls will automatically pick them up for Titania

- Dust: Nearby enemies suffer reduced accuracy. More Souls increase the accuracy reduction
- Thorns: Scales off of health %'s. More souls, more damage, ie: 1 soul, 1%, 10 souls 10% hp (capped to 10) dmg over xx seconds.
- Entangle: Nearby enemies are slowed. More Souls Increase the slow effect 
- Full Moon: All companions and Razorflies receive increased damage.

3. Lantern: Tosses a glowing light a short distance, which then hovers in place and attracts nearby enemies. A second Swarm of Razorflies is spawned as well, luring in and attacking enemies. 

4. Razorwing: All ability costs are reduced while Razorwing is active. If Tribute is cast during Razorwing, Titania will pull all drops within range towards her

Miscs:
- Have all abilities not lock you in place whilst casting, it interrupts the flow so much of this agile warframe.

TL;DR
Passive - Adds survivability
Her 1 - Adds utility and spellweaving
Her 2 - Adds utility to a lacking buff-system currently in place.
Her 3 - Adds utility,Survivability, Spellweaving and increased defensive options
Her 4 - Removes the vacuum conflict with channeling ability (sucking up 25 energy orb with 199/200 energy)

Edited by Yukain
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Tried Titania's rework. Got very disappointed because it's not an actual rework.

1) Spellbind

I don't have got much to say. I know many players say that 1 and 3 are practically the same, but to my eyes they aren't. I use Spellbind to disable a massive group of mobs and its does that job correctly.

2) Tribute

Making it only 1 to get a tribute's full power is welcome, but the tributes are still useless if we can't have strength, duration and range affecting them. When I have 150% duration, I expect the tributes to last 180 seconds instead of 120 seconds. When I have 150% range, I expect the Dust aura to be 45m instead of 30m. When I have 150% strength, I expect dust to have 66.7% accuracy loss by the mobs (1 chance to miss out of 3). And by accuracy loss, I mean an extra accuracy layer, which means that they have a 66.7% chance to fail hitting if all the previous rolls came to a successful hit. As for the Thorn, likewise when I have 150% strength I expect 66.7% of the damage to be reflected back to the attacker. Same goes for the two last tribute effects, you got the idea.

If strength, range and duration did have some effect on tribute, we could have Titania builds that are specialized in the usage of Tribute in various ways :

-strength for maximal damage reduction / companion buff / speed debuff

-range for maximal control / team buff coverage / a general wider safety area

-duration to be good to go for 3 Minutes (2 minutes for companion buff)

3) Lantern

I couldn't care if I had 1, 4 or 10000 lanterns, because as long as they don't do their actual job properly (sticking a mob in place) they're absolutely useless. Just make them work... They need a range buff too : a little buff for the attraction range (25m instead of 20m would be fine IMHO), and a huge buff to the damage dealing area (5m instead of 2.5m wouldn't be abusive TBH). Explosion range looks OK.

4) Razorwing

The changes are nice, but I'd still like to be able to renew the razorflies automatically. Maybe at a constant rate that can be enhanced with duration and/or strength. And probably have the razorflie's level be equal to the map's mobs instead of being level 30 at all times, that'd make sense.

Passive)

The passive still sucks. The self-boost for bullet jumps is fine, but frankly the trampoline for team mates is useless. I'd welcome a passive a bit similar to Hydroid's instead : being able to spawn a razorfly by killing a mob affected by spellbind or something like that. Oh wait, I just killed two birds with one stone : I found a nice way to renew razorflies in archwing mode and something that makes the 1 feel a bit more different than the 3. ^^

 

Anyway, I've always been a hardcore player of Titania, I tend to use all her abilities, but frankly I do understand quite well why most players still wont use her even after that "rework" that doesn't deserve the name "rework". No offense DE, but you haven't thought hard enough. And you haven't played that frame enough aswell.

Edited by Decondelite
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Really quite depressed regarding the Titania "fix" on her 3.  I had a theoretical build ready for multiple Lanterns but that went down the trash after seeing the mobs nonchalantly ignore the lantern and continue to shoot me/the objective.

Also somewhat annoying, there has been a grand total of 1 (THAT"S ONE!) Youtube video detailing Titania post-patch.  Sure, dozens of videos on orb fights, plenty of videos with Garuda/Baruuk.  There's Life of Rio pontificating Garuda tweaks, most of the others going over new weapons/Prime Access.  Total attention given to Titania's past, present solved/unsolved problems?  ONE video by Aweblade4.  Oh whoops, Rahetalius posted a video  20 hours ago which snuck in a sidenote to Titania's squishiness.

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Since the core complaint regarding Titania’s rework pertains to the vacuum and channeled abilities like Razorwing, I have a suggestion.

Only allow energy pickups when you’re missing the amount of energy that is going to be restored.

If you aren’t missing at least 25 energy, you can’t pick up an energy orb. And when you do, you only pick up one energy orb. Same goes for health orbs.

Although this fails to take into consideration Arcane Energize, so it’s probably not enough.

 

Alternatively. Make Vacuum innate for all Warframes, and let us adjust the range in options. (3 to 11.5 to anywhere in between)

Actually, just do that anyway.

 

@[DE]Rebecca

Edited by (NSW)Gregory
typo

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I must say I am loving the Titania rework for the most part. The increased energy pool, not having to recast Tribute as often to refresh the buffs, and Razorwing's vacuum allows you to stay in Razorwing a lot longer. But I still hope DE takes another look at Lantern it is still the least used part of the kit for me. Even with 4 Lanterns up enemies still attack me or my Razorflies. Giving us more cast hasn't solved the problem of the ability not functioning properly. I'm hoping DE takes a look at some of the suggestions posted in the forum and thinks about changing Tribute altogether.

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Yo, this is one addition that is totally needed for Nyx mind control...AUTO MARKED. So annoyed seeing everyone trying to kill the mind controlled target. If a giant ALLY tag can be place on the target and automatically removed when duration is over would be a perfect QoL addition. PLEASE MAKE THIS HAPPEN!!!

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So far Titania's "rework" bugfix has barely improved on her overall status:

- tribute needing only one per type is an improvement alongside the cost reduction... the effectivenes and range of the debuffs is still bad or unreliable, they are unmoddable as their effects doesn't scale with power strenght, duration or range; current ranges are insulting: 10 m aura slow, 30 m aura miss chance and companions boost, 40 m damage reflection (as if she can survive any incoming damage) they would be acceptable if were the result of modding intentionally sacrificing range for other stats, not as the maximum ummoddable fixed ones... considering that all tribute effects are debuffs and need enemies to be and remain in range to work

Dust, Titania's only defensive buff, evaporates in effectiveness with enemy level and distance (30m what of largish tiles or the existing landscapes?) - it's the only defensive power that needs to be "picked up" instead of activating on cast and it's quite conditional on top as it doesn't guarantee protection (having a 50% chance is a coin toss and RNG generation in Warframe is baffling at the least!) and it's a -50% that is apparently subtracted from enemy hit chance, chance that raises with their level apparently (anyone with better info is welcome to correct me on this point - this is only at the moment empirical evidence)

The only other frame with conditional activation powers that comes to mind is Octavia and her powers are actually effective (can't be shot if the enemy can't see you) and due to their nature are buffs on self and allies, de facto infinite range.

- Spellbind and lantern still induct targets in the Tenno Space Program or TSP for brevity, completely defeating lantern effect... when it actually works.

Scratch the above: all knockback, bounches and the like are out of whack with things bouncing out of surfaces, enemies and allies like Bouncy balls https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bouncy_ball        ofthen with hilarious and/or lethal consequences (tonkor and penta grenades murdering the shooter by bounching back in their faceplate with 30° acute angles! and lethal momentum)

- Lantern "aggro" is nonexistant, with enemies ignoring it in favour of murdering Titania & Co

- still no way of renew the swarm of razorflies even when lanthern does in fact spawn its own when it isn't stripping away Titania's fighter escort

- Razorwing is still precluded from all [X] interactions while all other exalted weapons/forms  and the archwing/skywing and sharkwing themselves haven't this limitation

- Razorwing standard speed is still utterly mediocre, even slower than Titania's full size dashing or parcouring and makes Razorwing Blitz a mandatory mod, not an option or utility

- 2 exalted weapon to forma beyond Titania herself ofthen totaling in the order of 7-9 forma, depending how many primed mods players try to fit. Of them only one is actually viable.

- ground slams and similar effects affect razorwing even when non in contact with the ground;

- razorwing is treated as an archwing in both landscapes, further screwing Titania over negating her even this niche as all anti-air attacks in those locations are meant to knock skywings out leaving the carried warframe grounded. guess what? this downs Titania instantly regardless of EHp buffs, effects etc.

- the only part of Titania's kit that is actually of interest, her selling point, it's her razorwing form. Nothing was done to accomodate this fact by adapting the rest of her kit around it.

when she was originally launced there were plans to incorporate a 50% discount or efficency buff in all her other powers when cast during Razorwing, it was never implemented

- except razorwing all titania's abilities depend on having enemies or allies on hand to target, none works per se. The worst offender is Spellbind that's got a self status removal in it but needs to be cast in the ground for Titania to benefit.

Final point of all this wall of text the rework workshops themselves:

every time DE has posted a "workshop" about a rework, every solution that required more work than minimal numbers tweaking has been completely ignored and discarded, leaving the affected frames barely changed or severely diminisced - only exception was Saryn - because it was a pet project and one that went unfortunately quite awry making her even more obnoxious than before by switching her element to the best to contrast armor scaling - sorry [DE]Pablo, if you wanted to reign her in you really dropped the ball this time, pity because Nidus and revenant are excellent compared to her and don't destroy other teammates enyojment of the game...

near zero response or aknowledgment of suggestions, problems and/or wants except when response was blatantly negative like melee 2.5 or the issues were so blatant not even a blind would miss them.

frames that had to wait years in the queque and are more than underutilized got barely a glance a spit of polish and a kick back into oblivion.

So far of all reworks the best have been Excalibur's and Nezha, Volt's wasted more time on speed opt in or opt out, riot shield and inanities like that instead of actually rebuild the frame in an actual starter frame with a learning curve, ember's and banshe's augment were directly a nerf resonating quacke needed only to lose the damage buff, ember hasn't got actual damage in higher levels or decent survivanility tools and still makes a nuisance of herself at lower levels burning everything to ashes in lower starmap levels.

Saryn's rework is the trainwreck we all know already, Chroma got "fixed" because it was too effective against eidolons... and half his owers are unusable or too expensive for their benefit (#1 and #4)

Limbo has become a good deal more squad friendly than before but can still potentially become a trollframe, Zephir's kit is still a mess... tentacle pervert Hydroid got a bit of polish...

Khora, Revenant and Garuda both needed emergency fixes on launch and still have some of the worst cobbled together kits so far due to their launch amidst the chaos of Plains Of Eidolon and Fortuna...

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