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IS Galantine Prime still strongest melee weapon?


Marakai
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I just watched this video from Life or Rio but it's 8 months old so I wonder if it's still as good as on this video or if there is better melee weapon: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i7VpCC405Qo

I am currently using Lesion (maxed out for Condi.Over + 60/60s etc.) but it's nor even remotely as strong. I was just wondering what next melee weapon to build and was thinking about Maiming Strike Atterax but this Galantine got me interested. Is this video still viable?
 

 

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it never was 'the best' to begin with.

does it do a lot of Damage though? sure.
if you're looking for Melee Weapons that will do you for Enemies of undefined Level, what you're looking for is something that is good at both Crits and Status. one or the other is good, both is monumentally better.

Edited by taiiat
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16 minutes ago, taiiat said:

it never was 'the best' to begin with.

does it do a lot of Damage though? sure.
if you're looking for Melee Weapons that will do you for Enemies of undefined Level, what you're looking for is something that is good at both Crits and Status. one or the other is good, both is monumentally better.

I like Polearms but no way to get Kripath now and I wonder if Lesion is good enough till I can get Kripath 😞

Edited by Marakai
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glaives are pretty strong too, they aren't talked about that much. a throw build can be deadly. i personally like them as i prefer ranged combat vs up close and personal but i still have the option to melee if need be.

this is first im hearing of galatine as best weapon. i recall however it was best for its category, until gram prime snuck in. lol

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Kirpath is over hyped really. I dunno why. Maybe just the level range people play or improper testing but being primarily Puncture damage with roughly 5% chance to proc Viral doesn't scale all that well compared to Cyath with 75% Slash weight. Esp on a polearm which easily pair with Zakti since their quick attacks are better DPS than stance attacks.

A Cyath + Zakti will shred lvl 400 armor without even using damage boosting abilities.

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Compared to Gram P, Galatine P at least has better attack speed. So if you want Galatine to have DPS close to Gram's, go for Hybrid build which heavily focuses on Slash : Vicious Frost and Virulent Scourge for high status and viral, no primed Fever Strike ! Last slot you can either use Condition Overload or Relentless Combination for huge number of combo.

So Galatine P is no longer best DPS melee (in terms of DPS only) due to Gram P's ridiculous stats and its ridiculous riven disposition. Some even dealt 5~6m dmg on a red-crit strike with it. Thanks to its ridiculous stats, it leads to 3rd ridiculous fact that you can make even more diverse build with Gram P, either more range, or more attack speed, or more status, etc. Because, really, it can still kill everything with all builds.

Still, both are not best melee for me since Heavy blades limit my movement too much. Unless you're soloing survival, there're a lot of cases your DPS with these 2 blades will lose a lot.

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53 minutes ago, Diangelius said:

Compared to Gram P, Galatine P at least has better attack speed. So if you want Galatine to have DPS close to Gram's, go for Hybrid build which heavily focuses on Slash : Vicious Frost and Virulent Scourge for high status and viral, no primed Fever Strike ! Last slot you can either use Condition Overload or Relentless Combination for huge number of combo.

 

Pure physical build will produce more Bleed DPS though require more investment.

Since the Umbra mods there's not much reason to use Viral + Slash on melee unless you have a Riven. Using both Umbra mods can have build conflicts with Rivens but even just using Sacrificial Steel solo is slightly more bleed DPS. Bleed of course works well against Corpus and you can swap back to Primed Pressure point having room for Primed Fever Corrosive against Infested. Heh, the Umbra mod hype is focused on the wrong mods IMO. The melee ones are pretty easy to fit and stupid strong with Blood Rush.

https://goo.gl/HSctEG

Pure Physical: 146,795 Bleed DPS, 1 Active status, x3 Berserk at 3x combo

https://goo.gl/9uLBdr

Viral + Slash: 102,304 Bleed DPS, 2 Active status, x2 Viral, x3 Berserk at 3x combo

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4 hours ago, Xzorn said:

Kirpath is over hyped really. I dunno why. Maybe just the level range people play or improper testing but being primarily Puncture damage with roughly 5% chance to proc Viral doesn't scale all that well compared to Cyath with 75% Slash weight. Esp on a polearm which easily pair with Zakti since their quick attacks are better DPS than stance attacks.

A Cyath + Zakti will shred lvl 400 armor without even using damage boosting abilities.

if you use Pox or Zakti to shred armor, Plague Kripath is better with the Chance, even if small, to proc viral

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6 hours ago, Xzorn said:

Kirpath is over hyped really. I dunno why. Maybe just the level range people play or improper testing but being primarily Puncture damage with roughly 5% chance to proc Viral doesn't scale all that well compared to Cyath with 75% Slash weight. Esp on a polearm which easily pair with Zakti since their quick attacks are better DPS than stance attacks.

A Cyath + Zakti will shred lvl 400 armor without even using damage boosting abilities.

What's the build for Cyath? I mean Cyath strike abviously but what other parts?

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5 hours ago, Xzorn said:

 

Pure physical build will produce more Bleed DPS though require more investment.

Since the Umbra mods there's not much reason to use Viral + Slash on melee unless you have a Riven. Using both Umbra mods can have build conflicts with Rivens but even just using Sacrificial Steel solo is slightly more bleed DPS. Bleed of course works well against Corpus and you can swap back to Primed Pressure point having room for Primed Fever Corrosive against Infested. Heh, the Umbra mod hype is focused on the wrong mods IMO. The melee ones are pretty easy to fit and stupid strong with Blood Rush.

https://goo.gl/HSctEG

Pure Physical: 146,795 Bleed DPS, 1 Active status, x3 Berserk at 3x combo

https://goo.gl/9uLBdr

Viral + Slash: 102,304 Bleed DPS, 2 Active status, x2 Viral, x3 Berserk at 3x combo

Why put condition overload on first build if it only has 1 status? 

Also doesn't in the end (dunno) slash + viral scale better in end-game due to enemy armor?

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35 minutes ago, Marakai said:

What's the build for Cyath? I mean Cyath strike abviously but what other parts?

I run a Cyath+Shtung+Ekwana Jai. It works great for a crit/status hybrid using Blood Rush while having enough base speed to get away with only using Primed Fury or 50-55% attack speed on your Riven. It also works well with viral, corrosive or gas as the element of choice.

It still doesnt outperform my Kripath atm since it can combo both viral+corrosive or viral+gas really well. People that complain about the low proc weight on viral simply miss the point that you dont want it to proc more than around once each 8 seconds. And in most cases you wont need the viral proc to begin with, things die before it would even make a difference. This applies to levels well beyond 100 i.e content you rarely bump into for starters.

Other than Zaw polearms there are also the Zaw heavy blades that are supposed to be good aswell as Gram Prime (with enough attack speed). Galatine Prime is still probably in the top 5.

Edited by SneakyErvin
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2 minutes ago, SneakyErvin said:

I run a Cyath+Shtung+Ekwana Jai. It works great for a crit/status hybrid using Blood Rush while having enough base speed to get away with only using Primed Fury or 50-55% attack speed on your Riven. It also works well with viral, corrosive or gas as the element of choice.

It still doesnt outperform my Kripath atm since it can combo both viral+corrosive or viral+gas really well. People that complain about the low proc weight on viral simply miss the point that you dont want it to proc more than around once each 8 seconds. And in most cases you wont need the viral proc to begin with, things die before it would even make a difference. This applies to levels well beyond 100 i.e content you rarely bump into for starters.

Other than Zaw polearms there are also the Zaw heavy blades that are supposed to be good aswell as Gram Prime (with enough attack speed). Galatine Prime is still probably in the top 5.

I just did Cyath polearm and took it on EOS but it does not outperform my Lesion. Lesion still out dps it and out damge it, especially since with extra toxic damage from Lesion I only have to put 3 60/60 mods because Lesion will make electric mode do corrosive anyway. 

But Cyath has definitely more range! But I use Lesion with shocking speed volt anyway so I don't need reach that much. 

I will try later to slap Blood Rush on Cyath and see how it then compares to Lesion.

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5 hours ago, Marakai said:

Why put condition overload on first build if it only has 1 status? 

Also doesn't in the end (dunno) slash + viral scale better in end-game due to enemy armor?

 

In most cases CO is still more DPS with 1 status than other mod options. It also turns the 25% chance of puncture / Impact procs into something useful for the Bleed DPS and synergizes with Zakti or frames with elemental effects. Even a Sentinel.

Viral status just halves enemy health at the point of the proc. If you proc first hit it will effectively double your damage. This is giving Viral status it's best possible performance. If it procs 2nd, 3rd or later hits than it's not doing double damage and the longer it takes to proc the less it's helping. This goes for pretty much any build as well. If you proc Viral when the enemy is already 50% health. It's not doing a lot. Also if a Viral status happens to fall off it's very counter productive due to the way the status effect works.

 

4 hours ago, Marakai said:

I just did Cyath polearm and took it on EOS but it does not outperform my Lesion. Lesion still out dps it and out damge it, especially since with extra toxic damage from Lesion I only have to put 3 60/60 mods because Lesion will make electric mode do corrosive anyway. 

But Cyath has definitely more range! But I use Lesion with shocking speed volt anyway so I don't need reach that much. 

I will try later to slap Blood Rush on Cyath and see how it then compares to Lesion.

 

Blood Rush is required for a physical bleed build. They're hybrids though I wouldn't be surprised if Lesion acts better in an Onslaught since last I checked it resets your combo counter every time you zone and these builds are made to hang around 3x - 3.5x combo.

This is Cyath unaided at 3x combo killing lvl 150 Napalms in 3-5 hits with 20-50k bleed ticks. It would technically kill in less hits if I let Bleed do it's job though it's kinda hard to show performance of something like this without using number of hits or similar because the enemy just isn't high enough level to see a difference. With Corrosive you can get a TTK and be done with it but Bleed is different. Throwing Zakti in against lvl 150 Napalms would just one-shot them. I always test against Alloy armor because Corrosive as a damage type will skew results when hitting Ferrite armor.

 

Mine is using Cyath + Kroostra + Ekwana Ruhang II instead of Shtung. I don't think Shtung was out when I made this weapon though 0.717 base is just on the cusp of tolerable attack speed using Berserk for myself. The Shtung would indeed be more Bleed DPS using Ekwana Jai though.

On another note the Zaw Heavy Blades happen to have the longest reach of any heavy blade. About the same as Orthos Prime ~10m. This makes them great Crit based Infested mowers but they're poor stat distribution makes them meh for other factions.

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19 hours ago, Xzorn said:

 

In most cases CO is still more DPS with 1 status than other mod options. It also turns the 25% chance of puncture / Impact procs into something useful for the Bleed DPS and synergizes with Zakti or frames with elemental effects. Even a Sentinel.

Viral status just halves enemy health at the point of the proc. If you proc first hit it will effectively double your damage. This is giving Viral status it's best possible performance. If it procs 2nd, 3rd or later hits than it's not doing double damage and the longer it takes to proc the less it's helping. This goes for pretty much any build as well. If you proc Viral when the enemy is already 50% health. It's not doing a lot. Also if a Viral status happens to fall off it's very counter productive due to the way the status effect works.

 

 

Blood Rush is required for a physical bleed build. They're hybrids though I wouldn't be surprised if Lesion acts better in an Onslaught since last I checked it resets your combo counter every time you zone and these builds are made to hang around 3x - 3.5x combo.

This is Cyath unaided at 3x combo killing lvl 150 Napalms in 3-5 hits with 20-50k bleed ticks. It would technically kill in less hits if I let Bleed do it's job though it's kinda hard to show performance of something like this without using number of hits or similar because the enemy just isn't high enough level to see a difference. With Corrosive you can get a TTK and be done with it but Bleed is different. Throwing Zakti in against lvl 150 Napalms would just one-shot them. I always test against Alloy armor because Corrosive as a damage type will skew results when hitting Ferrite armor.

 

Mine is using Cyath + Kroostra + Ekwana Ruhang II instead of Shtung. I don't think Shtung was out when I made this weapon though 0.717 base is just on the cusp of tolerable attack speed using Berserk for myself. The Shtung would indeed be more Bleed DPS using Ekwana Jai though.

On another note the Zaw Heavy Blades happen to have the longest reach of any heavy blade. About the same as Orthos Prime ~10m. This makes them great Crit based Infested mowers but they're poor stat distribution makes them meh for other factions.

Actually Lesion at full combo meter can also kill them as fast, but Sim is not a good way to compare imo two weapons, I will have to take Cyath on few mission and see how it performs there since Sim is never accurate to real-game scenario. However I will use Cyath anyway for now just to use different polearm 😄

Thanks for all the help!

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On 2018-11-30 at 11:20 PM, Xzorn said:

It would technically kill in less hits if I let Bleed do it's job though it's kinda hard to show performance of something like this without using number of hits or similar because the enemy just isn't high enough level to see a difference.

You can use Drekar Manic Bombards, they have the same armor, but almost 3 times more health (1750 vs 600).

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39 minutes ago, vector77 said:

You can use Drekar Manic Bombards, they have the same armor, but almost 3 times more health (1750 vs 600).

 

Ah, never noticed they have Alloy. They would be much better for CPx4 testing than Corrupted Heavy Gunners. Flat HP testing in general. I've been using Napalms for years cuz they're generally the more common ( since starmap revamp ) and hardest  to kill Alloy units. The thought process is generally if you can kill a Napalm well you can kill pretty much any other armored unit the same or better.

5 hours ago, Marakai said:

Actually Lesion at full combo meter can also kill them as fast, but Sim is not a good way to compare imo two weapons, I will have to take Cyath on few mission and see how it performs there since Sim is never accurate to real-game scenario. However I will use Cyath anyway for now just to use different polearm 😄

 

Simulacrum testing can be useful if it's done right. Like I mentioned you can't really compare Corrosive against Bleed since one is kill speed and the other is more a per hit parse. Like the players testing Adaptation against a room of Heavy Gunners just gives me a headache. Bleed and Corrosive are in many ways doing the same job just differently.

I actually have a Nekros Lesion + Zakti video lvl 340 from a while back and still feel Cyath is better. Now that Djinn can't die and Companions have Vacuum he can probably push further. The weapon DPS even without buffs wasn't holding Nekros back in that run. The problem was no Vacuum for Health Conversion once the Sentinel dies and once Nekros dies even once at that level it's possible but difficult to recover since he loses everything on the pet list. ( Had a Grenade thrown at me while summoning RIP )

At any rate you'll probably have to push lvl 300+ to see any difference. Melee in general with no buffs can easily deal with anything under that level.

 

Edited by Xzorn
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