Ember World On Fire Plausible Re-work, Not Clickbait!

[.Heart.Heater.]

So, while in an interception today, something hit  me.

Why not convert World on Fire to a charge-up? It essentially would work the same as is. Tap 4 to activate, you would have the max range, but the percentage would not increase on it's own, and the energy consumption would be the same as is. Now when you charge-up, it would charge-up and use initial energy needed scaling to the % increase based on how the ability works as it is activated over time. So the charge would control how the ability already works based on it's % increase but at the user's command.

 

Feedback please?

Edited December 1, 2018 by Solo-Ash

[DiabolusUrsus]

The issue with WoF is that it is simply toggled on and forgotten as it sweeps the map of low-ish level mobs.

Here's what I would do to make it more viable and interactive:

New Ember passive - casting powers builds up an "overheat" gauge that increases her power strength and reduces enemy accuracy (heat distortion).

WoF rapidly vents Ember's accumulated overheating, dealing intense damage over time. However, it shuts off once all heat is vented.

This makes WoF into a more conditional nuke that requires some effort to build up... But ideally with a proportional payoff. The best part is that it is self-limiting, due to requiring heat buildup and trading a degree of defensive benefit.

[MirageKnight]

1 hour ago, DiabolusUrsus said:

New Ember passive - casting powers builds up an "overheat" gauge that increases her power strength and reduces enemy accuracy (heat distortion).

You mean her other abilities, correct?

1 hour ago, DiabolusUrsus said:

WoF rapidly vents Ember's accumulated overheating, dealing intense damage over time. However, it shuts off once all heat is vented.

I'm completely behind this idea. Great synergy and it stops WoF from being yet another brain-dead ability and an overpowered nuke / map clearer.

I haven't used Ember in a very long time, mostly because she's boring to use. Click 4 and run around shooting stuff while everything else burns around you as long as you have energy. Heck, some players don't even need to shoot.

This suggestion, however, would get me to actually use her.

[DiabolusUrsus]

1 minute ago, MirageKnight said:

You mean her other abilities, correct?

Derp, yes.

1/2/3 = heat up

4 = world actually on fire

1 minute ago, MirageKnight said:

I'm completely behind this idea. Great synergy and it stops WoF from being yet another brain-dead ability and an overpowered nuke / map clearer.

I haven't used Ember in a very long time, mostly because she's boring to use. Click 4 and run around shooting stuff while everything else burns around you as long as you have energy. Heck, some players don't even need to shoot.

This suggestion, however, would get me to actually use her.

🙂

[.Heart.Heater.]

1 hour ago, DiabolusUrsus said:

The issue with WoF is that it is simply toggled on and forgotten as it sweeps the map of low-ish level mobs.

Here's what I would do to make it more viable and interactive:

New Ember passive - casting powers builds up an "overheat" gauge that increases her power strength and reduces enemy accuracy (heat distortion).

WoF rapidly vents Ember's accumulated overheating, dealing intense damage over time. However, it shuts off once all heat is vented.

This makes WoF into a more conditional nuke that requires some effort to build up... But ideally with a proportional payoff. The best part is that it is self-limiting, due to requiring heat buildup and trading a degree of defensive benefit.

While this is a cool idea, I think you missed the target on my original post. I took what DE has already made, but introduced a way so that you can utilize the ability a little bit more effectively.

Edited December 1, 2018 by Solo-Ash

[--RV--Dopekoke]

1 hour ago, DiabolusUrsus said:

The issue with WoF is that it is simply toggled on and forgotten as it sweeps the map of low-ish level mobs.

Here's what I would do to make it more viable and interactive:

New Ember passive - casting powers builds up an "overheat" gauge that increases her power strength and reduces enemy accuracy (heat distortion).

WoF rapidly vents Ember's accumulated overheating, dealing intense damage over time. However, it shuts off once all heat is vented.

This makes WoF into a more conditional nuke that requires some effort to build up... But ideally with a proportional payoff. The best part is that it is self-limiting, due to requiring heat buildup and trading a degree of defensive benefit.

+1

[--RV--Dopekoke]

2 hours ago, Solo-Ash said:

So, while in an interception today, something hit  me.

Why not convert World on Fire to a charge-up? It essentially would work the same as is. Tap 4 to activate, you would have the max range, but the percentage would not increase on it's own, and the energy consumption would be the same as is. Now when you charge-up, it would charge-up and use initial energy needed scaling to the % increase based on how the ability works as it is activated over time. So the charge would control how the ability already works based on it's % increase but at the user's command.

 

Feedback please?

what you are suggesting is bringing it back to the way it was, which is why it was changed in the first place.  

[.Heart.Heater.]

2 minutes ago, Dopekoke said:

what you are suggesting is bringing it back to the way it was, which is why it was changed in the first place.  

Did you not read what I posted? I suggested exactly what you just quoted, be able to charge-up the ability, and use the same percentage to power ratios already implemented as the ability goes on over time. Or simply tap the ability once to leave it as 0% to utilize it's greater range.

Edited December 1, 2018 by Solo-Ash

[--RV--Dopekoke]

9 minutes ago, Solo-Ash said:

Did you not read what I posted? I suggested exactly what you just quoted, be able to charge-up the ability, and use the same percentage to power ratios already implemented as the ability goes on over time. Or simply tap the ability once to leave it as 0% to utilize it's greater range.

But that's the thing, nobody would charge it, they would leave it as a toggle ability and afk which was why it was changed in the first place; to avoid "set it and forget it"

[DiabolusUrsus]

28 minutes ago, Solo-Ash said:

While this is a cool idea, I think you missed the target on my original post. I took what DE has already made, but introduced a way so that you can utilize the ability a little bit more effectively.

Except it wouldn't change much, because...

11 minutes ago, Dopekoke said:

But that's the thing, nobody would charge it, they would leave it as a toggle ability and afk which was why it was changed in the first place; to avoid "set it and forget it"

^ this.

DE originally nerfed the ability because it was only used to sweep up enemies passively.

By allowing players to just sit at max range, you're essentially just reverting the changes and bringing the old problems back full force.

The real problem with WOF wasn't its range, or even its damage. It was that the power could just be toggled on and forgotten, serving as a cheap no-effort damage boost.

My suggestion is aimed at making it more active, and adding in "breaks" without unnecessarily restricting it.

[.Heart.Heater.]

32 minutes ago, Dopekoke said:

But that's the thing, nobody would charge it, they would leave it as a toggle ability and afk which was why it was changed in the first place; to avoid "set it and forget it"

You can afk with it right now? Except it has slightly less range..

 

17 minutes ago, DiabolusUrsus said:

Except it wouldn't change much, because...

^ this.

DE originally nerfed the ability because it was only used to sweep up enemies passively.

By allowing players to just sit at max range, you're essentially just reverting the changes and bringing the old problems back full force.

The real problem with WOF wasn't its range, or even its damage. It was that the power could just be toggled on and forgotten, serving as a cheap no-effort damage boost.

My suggestion is aimed at making it more active, and adding in "breaks" without unnecessarily restricting it.

You can toggle on and forget it right now even at 100%, I have two R3 Arcane Energize equipped and I just bullet jump around the map without ever having to do much of anything. There will always be ways to find a way to make something easy-mode. All I was suggesting was adding the option to use the ability with it's range, or it's power maxed. This wouldn't be reverting anything, because World On Fire at 0% is hardly AFK material.

 

And even the range at 0%, it's probably 1/10th as effective as the previous World On Fire, considering damage, range, and energy consumption combined as a factor.

Edited December 1, 2018 by Solo-Ash

[Naneel]

vor 3 Stunden schrieb DiabolusUrsus:

The issue with WoF is that it is simply toggled on and forgotten as it sweeps the map of low-ish level mobs.

Here's what I would do to make it more viable and interactive:

New Ember passive - casting powers builds up an "overheat" gauge that increases her power strength and reduces enemy accuracy (heat distortion).

WoF rapidly vents Ember's accumulated overheating, dealing intense damage over time. However, it shuts off once all heat is vented.

This makes WoF into a more conditional nuke that requires some effort to build up... But ideally with a proportional payoff. The best part is that it is self-limiting, due to requiring heat buildup and trading a degree of defensive benefit.

I like this idea, having played Ember a lot, this could really help her and definitely fits her theme.

[.Heart.Heater.]

2 minutes ago, Naneel said:

I like this idea, having played Ember a lot, this could really help her and definitely fits her theme.

I like it too, reminds me up the way Nidus works in a way with his stacks.

[Birdframe_Prime]

The 'charge it up' mechanic is not a bad idea, but I'd switch it to a charge up like Harrow's 4 instead.

Press 4, a short period activates where something charges up based on what you're doing, and then you have a short space of time where you get World on Fire at high range and massively boosted Strength, but then it ends and you have to do it all over again before you can go back to hitting things with it.

For example; Press 4, everyone in range gets casting-speed and reload-speed buffs (note; this is taken from an in-depth rework thread I've been working on, so yeah, the speed of casting increase is from Accelerant, moved here for this reason) and for the duration every bit of Heat damage counts up Ember's charge. This can be from weapons, abilities, ongoing Heat Status (the damage ticks over time) everything. As long as it's damage type is Heat and in range of your ability, it counts. After 10 seconds of damage, you unleash 15-20 seconds of World on Fire (which you can then mod with Duration).

The shorter duration of the actual damage effects would mean that players wouldn't be able to turn it on for the entire mission, but the charge up would mean that it's perfect for clearing a wide area quickly for that time. Couple it with the bonus from Accelerant and you've got a really high damage, burst duration 4.

Best yet, there's no way that your allies can ruin it, because with the other rework ideas that would be on the list, all your allies would be getting buffs of Heat damage to their weapons from your other abilities, and some of those other abilities would be causing consistent Heat damage and Status already.

Short of nuking the entire room with Day-quinox before you can charge up... there's no way you wouldn't get a good World on Fire cast out of the result.

[Mach25]

7 hours ago, DiabolusUrsus said:

The issue with WoF is that it is simply toggled on and forgotten as it sweeps the map of low-ish level mobs.

Here's what I would do to make it more viable and interactive:

New Ember passive - casting powers builds up an "overheat" gauge that increases her power strength and reduces enemy accuracy (heat distortion).

WoF rapidly vents Ember's accumulated overheating, dealing intense damage over time. However, it shuts off once all heat is vented.

This makes WoF into a more conditional nuke that requires some effort to build up... But ideally with a proportional payoff. The best part is that it is self-limiting, due to requiring heat buildup and trading a degree of defensive benefit.

That is freaking awesome!

[mac10smg--Toa_of_Green]

7 hours ago, DiabolusUrsus said:

New Ember passive - casting powers builds up an "overheat" gauge that increases her power strength and reduces enemy accuracy (heat distortion).

WoF rapidly vents Ember's accumulated overheating, dealing intense damage over time. However, it shuts off once all heat is vented.

This makes WoF into a more conditional nuke that requires some effort to build up... But ideally with a proportional payoff. The best part is that it is self-limiting, due to requiring heat buildup and trading a degree of defensive benefit.

Well, shoot.

I literally have a similar idea to this written down. It’s basically in a whole list of other Warframe changes that I’ve been hovering over for literal years now.

I mean, my idea has a lot more nooks and crannies to it and I call it afterburn rather than overheat, but still. Kinda surprising someone else thought of this.

[MirageKnight]

14 minutes ago, mac10smg-ToaOfGreen said:

Kinda surprising someone else thought of this.

Not really. Good minds think alike.

[mac10smg--Toa_of_Green]

6 minutes ago, MirageKnight said:

Not really. Good minds think alike.

Well, I suppose what I meant to say was that I was surprised someone thought of it a long time after I did. Like I said, years.

[DiabolusUrsus]

1 hour ago, mac10smg-ToaOfGreen said:

Well, shoot.

I literally have a similar idea to this written down. It’s basically in a whole list of other Warframe changes that I’ve been hovering over for literal years now.

I mean, my idea has a lot more nooks and crannies to it and I call it afterburn rather than overheat, but still. Kinda surprising someone else thought of this.

Fascinating!

I'm working on reworking all the Warframes to fix the foundational issues with energy economy.

I wonder what other ideas might overlap...

[Arcira]

9 hours ago, DiabolusUrsus said:

The issue with WoF is that it is simply toggled on and forgotten as it sweeps the map of low-ish level mobs.

Here's what I would do to make it more viable and interactive:

New Ember passive - casting powers builds up an "overheat" gauge that increases her power strength and reduces enemy accuracy (heat distortion).

WoF rapidly vents Ember's accumulated overheating, dealing intense damage over time. However, it shuts off once all heat is vented.

This makes WoF into a more conditional nuke that requires some effort to build up... But ideally with a proportional payoff. The best part is that it is self-limiting, due to requiring heat buildup and trading a degree of defensive benefit.

The charge up mechanic sounds good and I´m glad someone addresses Embers defense problem as well. But would an accuracy debuff solve her problem? She already has a lot of cc the actual problem is that enemies immune to abilities arn´t affected. I´d like to see some kind of energy shield related system instead simply because shields have been in a very weak spot for a long time and I´d like to see some viable alternatives for armor and hp stacking.

Edited December 2, 2018 by Arcira