Tachmag

Lock Conclave Feedback to Typhoons

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Lock the ability to post in this section to players who have achieved Typhoon only, please. 

This section is currently plagued by posts from players who have barely dedicated any time to the gamemode and just beat the same deadhorse subjects (implement stamina, double/triple weapon damage, "I am entitled to PvP rewards").

Edited by Tachmag
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I agree with him. Tachmag and I are both really old Conclave Veterans (1 yr old or +), and we aren't the only ones.

Also fix glorious Celestia Syandana not being lit in Dojo / Cetus / Relays etc...

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The problem with this idea is that Conclave is complete trash. In order to potentially improve it players just starting out with Conclave need to explain to DE why no one wants to play it or what issues they have starting out. Your idea is to let only players who already like it to dictate feedback when a literal 99% of the player base won't touch it because it's no good to begin with. That's flawed.

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6 minutes ago, (PS4)Riko_113 said:

The problem with this idea is that Conclave is complete trash. In order to potentially improve it players just starting out with Conclave need to explain to DE why no one wants to play it or what issues they have starting out. Your idea is to let only players who already like it to dictate feedback when a literal 99% of the player base won't touch it because it's no good to begin with. That's flawed.

Players who play a couple matches don't have a clue as to what to expect from Conclave. They're used to playing generic slow-shootyman games and when they enter Conclave and get overwhelmed by the faster gameplay, they go to the forums and post a wall of text with "an original idea to fix Conclave" without giving the game mode any serious chance.

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Meh.

If someone came from decent fast paced PvP games like Titanfall 2 or such, they will not really bother getting Typhoon here. 

But that doesnt mean these people dont know what would be good or how to improve it. 

 

Limiting feedback only to vets is not a solution.     All you have to do is to keep Good threads up and alive.   And ignore "lame" ones so they would get "down" fast.   Simple as that.

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2 minutes ago, Kainosh said:

Meh.

If someone came from decent fast paced PvP games like Titanfall 2 or such, they will not really bother getting Typhoon here. 

But that doesnt mean these people dont know what would be good or how to improve it. 

 

Limiting feedback only to vets is not a solution.     All you have to do is to keep Good threads up and alive.   And ignore "lame" ones so they would get "down" fast.   Simple as that.

You don't need to be a vet to reach Typhoon. You can easily reach it in less than a month.

 

You can't really make the bad threads down since this section is plagued by people who think they are the messiah of Conclave balance and just circlejerk-bump each other.

Edited by Tachmag
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38 minutes ago, Tachmag said:

Lock the ability to post in this section to players who have achieved Typhoon only, please. 

This section is currently plagued by posts from players who have barely dedicated any time to the gamemode and just beat the same deadhorse subjects (implement stamina, double/triple weapon damage, "I am entitled to PvP rewards").

COOL!, a sub-forum for a 2 digit players whom achieved "Typhoon" in PVP! YAY!.

What's next? A sub-threat for players who's MR is 30, so they can tell DE, what content should be given for players on MR30?

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6 minutes ago, low1991 said:

COOL!, a sub-forum for a 2 digit players whom achieved "Typhoon" in PVP! YAY!.

What's next? A sub-threat for players who's MR is 30, so they can tell DE, what content should be given for players on MR30?

MR is in no way correlated to Conclave rank.

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Well, but you see, people who have not played conclave extensively usually don't have much knowledge on the subject matter, most just keep repeating "Conclave trash, why can't I get my conclave skins". And to be quite honest, steamrolling/farming Recruit Conditioning with a broken weapon is not really playing conclave. 

Restricting access to Typhoon rank, which is very easy to acquire, is a good idea. Keeping the game mode afloat and giving good feedback is more important than constantly whining about it being "too hard", and not worth your time. Conclave is struggling as it is, pointlessly hammering in the point that you don't enjoy it, and bashing it 24/7 is just pointless, keep that in mind.

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Not sure if or how could DE do it, but getting rid of the usual "DeLeTe CoNcLaVe" and "cOnClAvE iS tRaSh" that add nothing to feedback threads would be much appreciated.

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Before we get the "Vets only" argument, it's important to say that experienced Conclave players have good knowledge of what is an OP weapon / frame, and what isn't that.

> May I remember you, that Conclave was being torn apart by Arca Plasmor fall off bug lastly (the 2 shot machine) ? It lasted for 1 month more or less... Who made use of that bug ? Pretty all those who say "conclave is cancer", this was even happening in Recruit Conditioning where PvP is supposed to be balanced and fair. But let's move on the main point.

Veterants are players who dedicated like 3 or 4 months~ in Conclave, by LEARNING it, INVESTING TIME in it, trying to IMPROVE, and MASTER it. Yes believe it or not, you can reach a really high level with motivation, and practice. Moreover, you can even boost your progress by asking other talented Conclave Players how to improve faster and become better, we even have a discord server for it. 

We even held Tournaments with plat prizes to attract people into PvP, some of the contestants were new to PvP.

Tachmag is right when asking for Typhoon rank needed to post in this section, because by reaching this level, we prove that we are people who invested time in PvP and we had time to forge our point of view about this gamemode. I don't like when some MR 26 comes and spit that "Conclave is Cancer", when they haven't even reached the first Conclave Rank. To sum it up, Typhoons would have a better understanding of what could help PvP to grow as a popular gamemode instead of being trashed by the PvE community. But instead of blocking the access to this section for Typhoons only, maybe restricting the access to ONE SPECIFIC THREAD for Typhoons only, so that we can keep a clean thread, giving feedback, arguing on what could be better for PvP, balancing, removal/adding of weapons... helping Digital Extremes improving Conclave.

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53 minutes ago, -CheffDegu said:

Restricting access to Typhoon rank, which is very easy to acquire, is a good idea

The best this will accomplish is making sure the feedback becomes a room that is restricted to only 12 players out off the 20 that do Conclave sitting together smoking cigars, all patting each other on the back for the posts that only they are allowed to make with no contradiction. 

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10 minutes ago, (PS4)Riko_113 said:

The best this will accomplish is making sure the feedback becomes a room that is restricted to only 12 players out off the 20 that do Conclave sitting together smoking cigars, all patting each other on the back for the posts that only they are allowed to make with no contradiction. 

First off, If someone is not willing to put menial effort into getting the rank of Typhoon, he definitely won't be of much help. No time played, no knowledge that is needed to form opinions.

Second off, you would be surprised how many players achieved the Typhoon rank, it definitely isn't some impossible herculean task that only a few of the select demigods have completed.

Last point, without knowledge about the game mode you cannot give proper feedback, nor discuss how the game should be balanced.  

Edited by -CheffDegu
fixed typo
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il y a 13 minutes, (PS4)Riko_113 a dit :

The best this will accomplish is making sure the feedback becomes a room that is restricted to only 12 players out off the 20 that do Conclave sitting together smoking cigars, all patting each other on the back for the posts that only they are allowed to make with no contradiction. 

Alright, 20 people you just said ?

https://prnt.sc/lr33cr

And this is without Asian* Community. 

** -3 if you count the bots 😶

Edited by zeymV4
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18 minutes ago, -CheffDegu said:

No time played, no knowledge that is needed to form opinions.

-Enable Passive Queuing in the Liset

-Maybe a Tutorial could help

-Have new players starting weapons be in the Conclave arsenal! 

These are actual threads in Conclave feedback at this very second. Please explain how your elitism would improve feedback on these issues that players can identify from the first second they attempt Conclave, issues that could prevent them from wanting to come back to Conclave ever again?

 

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18 minutes ago, zeymV4 said:

Alright, 20 people you just said ?

https://prnt.sc/lr33cr

And this is without Asian* Community. 

** -3 if you count the bots 😶

My numbers were clearly meant as hyperbole.

Now to show you mine. Guess who's is bigger?

"Warframe Reaches 38 Million Players for Its 5th Anniversary.Mar 13, 2018"

Conclave is nothing. If DE doesn't want to give it real attention (which they've said flat out that they don't) then you need to accept feedback for everyday improvements for anyone that will give it. 

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3 minutes ago, (PS4)Riko_113 said:

-Enable Passive Queuing in the Liset

-Maybe a Tutorial could help

-Have new players starting weapons be in the Conclave arsenal! 

These are actual threads in Conclave feedback at this very second. Please explain how your elitism would improve feedback on these issues that players can identify from the first second they attempt Conclave, issues that could prevent them from wanting to come back to Conclave ever again?

 

1

1. Passive queuing in the orbiter would definitely revitalize conclave and fix the broken weapons and interactions.

2. Convlave tutorial? Oh ok, do you honestly think that a tutorial would help with anything in conclave? What would it bring to the table? Do you remember playing the advanced movement tutorial? Did it teach you anything? 

3. I don't quite understand this one, starting weapons that you already sold? Or should those be there by default, cause if you picked mk-1 braton as your starting weapon it is gonna be equipped in your concalve arsenal if you still have it. 

Everything that you have mentioned here would not help with the current state of conclave at all. The only worthwhile tip was the first one, and by worthwhile I mean not completely irrelevant or construed on false information. 

 

 

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7 minutes ago, -CheffDegu said:

1. Passive queuing in the orbiter would definitely revitalize conclave and fix the broken weapons and interactions.

You act as if the feedback section is called "The grand scheme of Conclave". It's called Feedback, which includes big and small issues.

9 minutes ago, -CheffDegu said:

2. Convlave tutorial? Oh ok, do you honestly think that a tutorial would help with anything in conclave? What would it bring to the table? Do you remember playing the advanced movement tutorial? Did it teach you anything? 

It's not about what you or I want. There are players who don't find certain things obvious and decided that would beneficial. The point is that the thought that restricting that kind of input to players that have already mastered PvP is ignorant.

11 minutes ago, -CheffDegu said:

3. I don't quite understand this one, starting weapons that you already sold? Or should those be there by default, cause if you picked mk-1 braton as your starting weapon it is gonna be equipped in your concalve arsenal if you still have it. 

Yeah, that one you had to actually read the post to get the full point. Sorry, hehe. Apparently it's common, according to that post - people seemed to be agreeing, to find new conclave players with gear not equipped because the arsenal doesn't fill those slots by default on the conclave loadouts. New players are coming in and not realizing that it uses a different loadout than what they've been learning to use the last few hours and keep coming in naked.

Some of those issues could actually help, just not with the problems you have or the grand scheme of things. You just seem to have the idea that if it's not a PoE size update to PvP then it's not worth even entertaining. In that regard I slightly agree only because PvP does need a complete overhaul. That each of those smaller things contribute to that kind of overhaul. It's not just one solution that will fix the endless list of problems Conclave has at it's core.

 

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il y a 11 minutes, (PS4)Riko_113 a dit :

My numbers were clearly meant as hyperbole.

Now to show you mine. Guess who's is bigger?

"Warframe Reaches 38 Million Players for Its 5th Anniversary.Mar 13, 2018"

Conclave is nothing. If DE doesn't want to give it real attention (which they've said flat out that they don't) then you need to accept feedback for everyday improvements for anyone that will give it. 

https://prnt.sc/lr3lxb (sauce : Steamcharts)

Nice try, this number 38 Million, is irrelevant, you may have a point because we're on a multi-platform Game that now has conquered Switch, but yet again, this is not what we're talking about (the amount of player that plays Warframe).

Now, prove that DE said they doesn't give real attention to PvP. Because if they really didn't care AT ALL about PvP, in the Fortuna Update 24.0 they would have left the arca plasmor as it was before.

Citation

The previous Mainline update of Chimera 23.10.0 included a sneaky bug that removed falloff damage from the Arca Plasmor and the Shwaak Prism. The Arsenal continued to state the always present falloff (10.0 - 20.0) but it wasn’t truly applying. We have fixed this bug, which resulted in adding falloff damage back to the Arca Plasmor and Shwaak Prism, and thus returned it to its original falloff state prior to Update 23.10.0. This also fixes the Conclave Arsenal displaying the incorrect falloff damage for the Arca Plasmor. Fixed misangled pause Menu when attempting to invite another player to a current Conclave match. Fixed the Harpak doing more damage than depicted in the Conclave Arsenal.

Also, could you give me info on how experienced you're in Conclave just out of curiosity (Rank, KDA).

 

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12 minutes ago, (PS4)Riko_113 said:

You act as if the feedback section is called "The grand scheme of Conclave". It's called Feedback, which includes big and small issues.

Right now? Definitely, small issues can be addressed whenever, QoL should not be a priority when conclave has many broken mechanics that need to be fixed ASAP.

14 minutes ago, (PS4)Riko_113 said:

It's not about what you or I want. There are players who don't find certain things obvious and decided that would beneficial. The point is that the thought that restricting that kind of input to players that have already mastered PvP is ignorant.

Ok, how about instead of making conclave feedback Typhoon only, DE would make it Tempest (3rd rank) or higher, would that be a better option? 

 

16 minutes ago, (PS4)Riko_113 said:

Some of those issues could actually help, just not with the problems you have or the grand scheme of things. You just seem to have the idea that if it's not a PoE size update to PvP then it's not worth even entertaining. In that regard I slightly agree only because PvP does need a complete overhaul. That each of those smaller things contribute to that kind of overhaul. It's not just one solution that will fix the endless list of problems Conclave has at it's core.

Smaller things are cool, and I never have mentioned a "PoE sized update" just a small rebalance of broken weapons that are way more powerful than intended would be much appreciated. 

Small note: Keep in mind that I don't fault players for not liking conclave after playing it, I just really dislike threads being flooded with unnecessary spam about how bad the game mode is even though most of the players that really like posting messages like that have never actually played conclave. Also, a huge portion of players is led away from conclave by that. And I still don't blame them for not playing after that, but I do blame the people that bash on conclave constantly because it's cool. Hating it because everyone else is hating it is very disruptive.

Broken weapons in conclave are the main reason why people are leaving the game mode for good, be it new players or old ones. 

I'm so passionate about this issue because conclave is basically the only thing that keeps me playing this game, and it's not in a good state.

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46 minutes ago, -CheffDegu said:

Small note: Keep in mind that I don't fault players for not liking conclave after playing it, I just really dislike threads being flooded with unnecessary spam about how bad the game mode is even though most of the players that really like posting messages like that have never actually played conclave. Also, a huge portion of players is led away from conclave by that. And I still don't blame them for not playing after that, but I do blame the people that bash on conclave constantly because it's cool. Hating it because everyone else is hating it is very disruptive.

There you go, I wish the conversation was started like this so we can see where this is coming from, the OP as it is currently just reeks of elitism. Ruling out newbie opinions simply because they're newbies might cause you to miss out on insight that may not be applicable to pros.

As for hating it because it's cool, I personally don't see that. Those requests for movement reduction and tutorials I feel, comes from a desire of making the whole Conclave accessible to the potential players (though of course having concrete ideas on how to implement it, I admit - is rather sparse), rather than "dumb down" mechanics that make WF pvp unique. And no, the "bashing" isn't really pushing me away from Conclave, it just makes me think it needs work.

Btw, I'm the one who who came up with the thread for passive queuing (though not the first one to come up with it), and it's fueled by my desire to get started. So of course, Typhoons may find my sugg completely useless, but that doesn't mean I'm not allowed start a conversation about it.

I mean if DE is not putting the energy, time and money on Conclave because it doesn't have the right amount of players, then I guess it's just fair that some members of community will first focus on suggestions that prevent newbies from going in unprepared and confused and just getting a getting a bad experience out of it. We get more players having fun in Conclave, the more likely DE might deem it worthy of devtime, is what I'm saying.

Edited by MandzPH
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But that would mean i couldn't meme under Conclave threads, Reee!

But in all seriousness, you can see the same kinds of discussions in pve related threads.

Wouldn't it be easier to just put them in megathreads?

And i doubt it would be technically possible, they can't even make certain tags to be admin/mod only right now.

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2 hours ago, (PS4)Riko_113 said:

My numbers were clearly meant as hyperbole.

Now to show you mine. Guess who's is bigger?

"Warframe Reaches 38 Million Players for Its 5th Anniversary.Mar 13, 2018"

Conclave is nothing. If DE doesn't want to give it real attention (which they've said flat out that they don't) then you need to accept feedback for everyday improvements for anyone that will give it. 

There is a huge difference between "38 millions of registered players" and "38 millions of active players"; and i'm sure DE meant the former on the data you're using to make a point, which renders it completely moot.

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personally on the one hand I understand how you feel, but the same thing happens in pve many people see a difficult incursion and ask to be deleted from the game, or do not want to spend resources on archwings and ask to remove them without spending time on them.

But for example I usually contribute suggestions to the forum about conclave I am Whirlwind rank (game 99% of the time PvE), and I do not contribute suggestions that change the base of the game. I like the game fast and frenetic. For me to fix the conclave is to add more rewards, that new players start with weapons, and have 20 games for example to practice once those games end play normal with the other players, you can do Void Fissures in Conclave, which raise the weapons faster level in conclave, but the base of the game seems great worked by DE but separated from the rest of the game ☹️.

I think everyone should have the right to express their opinion even if there are opinions that bother.

Excuse my English.

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5 hours ago, zeymV4 said:

https://prnt.sc/lr3lxb (sauce : Steamcharts)

Nice try, this number 38 Million, is irrelevant, you may have a point because we're on a multi-platform Game that now has conquered Switch, but yet again, this is not what we're talking about (the amount of player that plays Warframe).

Either way the Conclave playerbase is a laughably small amount of the actual playerbase. Warframe has 38 million registered accounts: even assuming 90% of those are inactive/smurfs/dead still leaves us with 3.8 million active players to Conclave's whopping... below 3 thousand. Unless we assume the Asian community has a nice 35 thousand active Conclave players Conclave does not even reach 1% of the playerbase. More realistically, Conclave is between .1%-.3% of Warframe's playerbase at best.

 

5 hours ago, zeymV4 said:

Now, prove that DE said they doesn't give real attention to PvP. Because if they really didn't care AT ALL about PvP, in the Fortuna Update 24.0 they would have left the arca plasmor as it was before.

That change was primarily for PvE to fix a mechanical bug that falloff was not applying. Saying this means they care about PvP is silly, since the primary change was fixing a PvE bug and porting the bugfix over to Conclave also.

It's pretty telling the major Conclave changes are straight up ports of PvE changes with no additional changes, or minor bugfixes. DE does not spend any noticeable time or effort on this gamemode.

5 hours ago, zeymV4 said:

Also, could you give me info on how experienced you're in Conclave just out of curiosity (Rank, KDA).

I'm going to answer this since you'll probably ask anyway. I'm a Typhoon and by some of the vets' own standards would be considered a 'veteran' of Conclave.

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