if stalker mode cannot be opt out.

[(PSN)N7_Dredgen]

Honestly if they add PVP Stalker I will flat out quit the game.  I saw Scott's interview and I don't give a damn for all of his excuses of players sometimes make mistakes an AI wouldn't etc.. 

I play Warframe, and have played Warframe for FIVE YEARS because I like PVE.  If I wanted PVP I would go into the garbage conclave nobody likes.  If PVP becomes a forced aspect of the game I will straight up leave and they will feel the sting of losing a couple thousand more dollars over time.  For me any semblance of forced PVP, no matter how minor, is a grievous sin for this game. 

And if I don't quit, I will just grieve stalker players by shutting my game down anytime one comes after me.  I know the difference in movement styles beween AI and human so it won't exactly be hard to quit to menu.

Edited December 8, 2018 by (PS4)lagrue

[FlusteredFerret]

49 minutes ago, (PS4)Zero_029 said:

Just to say it real quick.

I'd personally prefer a cinematic quest where we pursue Stalker & like with Umbra we join with him.

I guess in Stalker's case it might be one where we show him our side of the end of the Orokin, where we also take responsibility for our actions & thus soothe his pain, quell his rage, & forgive his hate.

We bring him peace & thus he joins us finally.

If he is indeed a Warframe with no Tenno (he could be like Umbra, which is that he might be an Orokin or Dax or a Soldier that was below the Dax ranks) then he could be like Umbra & be active when we're not in Transference with him.

Either way. I'd like a deep, moving, & High Quality Quest that unlocks him as a Warframe once & for all.

Would definitely like a quest...but would rather have Stalker become an ally, like Teshin, rather than a playable frame.

I think he deserves to be a character in his own right.

[Falconer777]

33 минуты назад, MystMan сказал:

Not maybe, it is 100% certainty as to why other games that have pve/pvp do it well, and why people often bring them up as an example of "why it can work"

They were built from the ground up with the pve/pvp formula in mind. It was already part of the primary design blueprint when the game was just an idea.

There are no balancing issues or content favoring or locking out one group over the other when done well.

This does not apply to games like this one that attach a new genre years later as an add-on like a new thing.

In principle, it is logical.
I just don’t know if the PvP regime was in the original version of the Warframe (in 2013)?

Цитата

The players who want this mode, I wonder why/how they seem to believe this will be a great thing to add. When I look at DE's track record of pvp design, I see.... not good things. The writing's on the wall, if you want great pvp experience, you're not going to get it if DE makes it. Other developers simply do it better. There's no such thing as "fourth time's the charm."

If they make the Grineer vs. Corpus option, I think this option will fire.                                                                                                              Or (and) PvE version, which is slightly higher suggested by @SilentMobius. I liked his idea.
Or at least attract more players. 
A Сonclave with Lunaro of course ... not very impressive.

Цитата

While Gunz may no longer be officially supported anymore, it does have a community server, you'll get a better fleshed out experience there instead of waiting all these years here in Warframe hoping for a good pvp experience that will never happen. It's like people playing unfinished Early Access games they are not enjoying but stick around for years hoping for its "great potential" to reveal itself (which never happens). I advice to stop wasting years of your lives doing that and just go straight to games which offer directly what you want in a finished state. 

I do not think that there are people who are so directly "waiting for years" for normal PvP-mode in Warframe, exhausting themselves for the hateful PvE mode) Rather, people do just that.
At least I don’t play Warframe now at all, I play PvP (and sometimes PvE) in the other games. 

But. This is the outflow of some players.
Profitables players (my friends and I did not play for free - we bought both platinum and prime access).
And, judging by this forum, quite a few players stopped playing due to the lack of interesting PvP and the endgame in Warframe in general.
If such an interesting mode appears - many of the players who have left will return. Is it bad for the development of the game?

 

 

[(PSN)Zero_029]

18 minutes ago, FlusteredFerret said:

Would definitely like a quest...but would rather have Stalker become an ally, like Teshin, rather than a playable frame.

I think he deserves to be a character in his own right.

To be fair we have yet to see how Umbra will factor in moving forward.

He might be both a Character & a player controlled entity.

I'd rather Stalker (like Umbra) walk that medium.

[FlusteredFerret]

5 minutes ago, (PS4)Zero_029 said:

To be fair we have yet to see how Umbra will factor in moving forward.

He might be both a Character & a player controlled entity.

I'd rather Stalker (like Umbra) walk that medium.

Well the difference is Umbra is a recent introduction to the game and we know more about his back story - how he came to be. He was a sort of "lost soul" and we "rescued" him...or at least took away his pain and gave him a purpose.

 

Stalker has been a character in the game for some time, but all we know is that he was ordered (by Hunhow?) to hunt down the Tenno. Think we probably need to know more about who / what he was before he became Stalker and what his motives are. He clearly has similar (or greater?) capabilities to Umbra in that he can act independently, but what were the circumstances of his creation? Would he want / accept our help, like Umbra eventually did, or is he at peace with what he is?

[MystMan]

32 minutes ago, Falconer777 said:

And, judging by this forum, quite a few players stopped playing due to the lack of interesting PvP and the endgame in Warframe in general.

This is not a bad thing.  No game is meant to be played forever. After you spend (let's say) 1000 hours on a game and have spent money on it and you leave it on a high note to play other games: everybody wins.

You win because you got your money's worth of entertainment for a long time.
The developers win because they made a game that entertained you for a very long time, so much that you willingly paid them for it for a job well done.

Do people really think they need to play the same F2P game forever and pass their accounts to their children after they die or something? 

It's when a majority of people play a F2P game for 10 hours and leave disappointed, that is when a game is bad and dies out. Warframe has so much content and a long ladder for new players to climb, it will take them a long time to reach that "I'm bored" phase. By then they will have spend a lot of plat (their own or through trading). And that is why Warframe has been doing so well for this long, it gives new players a lot to look forward to. Vets are free to stay or leave, they have fulfilled their purpose, got their long-term entertainment and generated enough income during their long stay to keep the game running for more years to come so other new players get to enjoy what the vets went through.

I'm actually glad that I have less things to do in Warframe now after 8000+ hours, so I can play other games. For the past 4 years I have played Warframe SO MUCH that I haven't played anything else. My backlog of other games I want to play is so huge now. I have a lot of catching up to do.

 

32 minutes ago, Falconer777 said:

If such an interesting mode appears - many of the players who have left will return. Is it bad for the development of the game?

Like I said in this post: "Adding pvp is one thing, adding GOOD pvp is another."

Many players return when new content is released, that's a given. People returned and tried out Dark Sectors.... Lunaro....Conclave....
and what do they have to show for it 2 months later?   Exactly. One shouldn't have a high expectations when DE releases pvp content in Warframe.

We have no idea if this Stalker mode will be good or if its mechanics will meet the expectations of the pvp players.

But I'm a pragmatic fellow, I just look at history and tell you what the possible outcomes will be:

• It doesn't get released at all.  Minority Pvp players will be angry. Majority Pve players will be happy.
• It does get released. Minority Pvp players will be happy. Majority Pve players will be angry.
• It does get released . Minority Pvp players will be angry because it doesn't meet their expectations, too many issues, unbalanced, bugs, griefing, etc. Majority Pve players will be angry.

This is just bad all around the board. They simply should never have brought this up. It's like playing with fire. and a dynamite stick. while in a bomb storage building.

 

Edited December 8, 2018 by MystMan

[Fireclaymore]

I think that you're delineating too much between PVP and PVE players. People are able to enjoy both. Simply classifying someone who likes an aspect of PVP doesn't only make them PVP players. It's like the right vs left S#&$ in politics when the majority of people pretty moderate and need actual details of policies to actually say what they stand for. Though I know what you mean. We are in a playerbase that enjoys a predominantly PVE experience.

Given the fact that it'll be opt-in this shouldn't be any trouble as long as they don't release something non-trivial for its exclusively. If it's a mod drop, then PVE exclusive players would need to buy it from the market. Not particularly fond of that idea, and I've stated my case for options before. Whatever rewards come from it shouldn't greatly effect gameplay, like a weapon or Warframe. I'm among those that dislike login mods and weapons. This is a very similar dealing to me in that regard.

[MystMan]

18 minutes ago, Fireclaymore said:

I think that you're delineating too much between PVP and PVE players. People are able to enjoy both. Simply classifying someone who likes an aspect of PVP doesn't only make them PVP players.

You're right, but the people who play pvp here in Warframe are the very people you mentioned: they like pve and pvp.   Players who like only pvp, they don't exist here in Warframe. This game never catered to them by design. It's all just a matter of numbers, you cater your game towards the majority. Having alternate separate modes that cater to the minority, that is fine.  There are many games that have pve and pvp servers for example.

But when you start merging them together, that is when things tend to go south.

[SneakyErvin]

All I know is that if they add it as a forced mode with rewards tied to it I will quit every single mission where the Stalker shows up aswell as troll the #*!% out of the mode when I get the chance to play Stalker. This just in order to show just what a terrible idea this was to begin with.

There are so many things that this game already needs, some halfassed PvP mode for a 4th time is not one of them.

[(XBOX)VaricBreem]

You  people Defending this  mode, Promise and Keep your word  The PVE aspect of the game will not be effected at  all By this game  mode, as in no nerfs  to the power fanatasy , No Nerfs  to Guns   warframes  ect.. because this game mode and  I will Glady support , and Curbstomp every invader witha  smile.. 

 

But You cant, You all know  that  the PVP  crowd will not  enjoy  getting squadded  up  on , one  shot ,, wailing on  an inaros  for hrs while he goes and makes  lunch , getting near  perma  slowed  by  Nova , Mind controlled  by nyx,, or seeing some one in squad drop and acient healer specter

 

The tears    and salt will flow, Leading To  nerfs across the board  affecting  our PVE gameplay  ,  Just to satisfy a  small segment of our community. Hell   all the people that Opt  out will Still get all the nerfs  Because   people Like  me will Opt in just  to pugstomp   invaders  till  they get  why  This game  mode is  a bad  Idea, and  Ones the  devs  start  Nerfing the PVE fashion frame  Crowd  what  do you think will happen?

[PawPaWuFF]

id laugh if they released theyve been playing as stalker for the past year, i feel it needs to be stated that this is likely a weekly encounter type thing no one person or group will be spamming stalker missions 24/7 more like a round robbin hey its your turn for 1-2 stalker invasions accept?

Edited December 8, 2018 by PawPaWuFF

[BloodKitten]

i'll just throw a suggestion, if stalker mode will have an opt out for tenno, a stalker player should be able to go after spectre like tenno based on currently equipped frame, weapon, and somewhat scaled down damage mods, atleast that way it would be fair for everyone, if there is a score or points to get something, spectre would worth half the points, while actuall player would worth full points with multiplier of how much players are in the mission, people that ops out cannot go after players, so it would be a choice of grind more, or grind less with massive disadvantage.

atleast that is how i think it should be.

[rand0mname]

57 минут назад, SneakyErvin сказал:

All I know is that if they add it as a forced mode with rewards tied to it I will quit every single mission where the Stalker shows up aswell as troll the #*!% out of the mode when I get the chance to play Stalker. This just in order to show just what a terrible idea this was to begin with.

There are so many things that this game already needs, some halfassed PvP mode for a 4th time is not one of them.

This is as reasonable and effective as fishing, while others do bounties, as some kind of revenge on leachers.

What a strange take on “if you can not win, join them”.

[SneakyErvin]

2 hours ago, rand0mname said:

This is as reasonable and effective as fishing, while others do bounties, as some kind of revenge on leachers.

What a strange take on “if you can not win, join them”.

Well since I dont do that I dont know.

And in the case of Stalker the "join them" part would simply be to use the mode as intended instead of showing the flaws in hope of a final "win" and proper adjustment. A system where it is possible to do what I descirbe shouldnt even go live to begin with.

[DatDarkOne]

13 hours ago, SneakyErvin said:

All I know is that if they add it as a forced mode with rewards tied to it I will quit every single mission where the Stalker shows up aswell as troll the #*!% out of the mode when I get the chance to play Stalker. This just in order to show just what a terrible idea this was to begin with.

There are so many things that this game already needs, some halfassed PvP mode for a 4th time is not one of them.

I see someone else has developed the same idea I had.  hehe.

10 hours ago, SneakyErvin said:

A system where it is possible to do what I descirbe shouldnt even go live to begin with.

Exactly

[Falconer777]

19 часов назад, MystMan сказал:

This is not a bad thing.  No game is meant to be played forever. After you spend (let's say) 1000 hours on a game and have spent money on it and you leave it on a high note to play other games: everybody wins.

You win because you got your money's worth of entertainment for a long time.
The developers win because they made a game that entertained you for a very long time, so much that you willingly paid them for it for a job well done.

On the one hand, of course. I have no regrets, got a great time in a good game.

On the other hand, this is a very good amount of time for offline games (such as Witcher 3), but somewhat small for online mmo. Which depends not on the sales of copies of the game, but on the online and constant sale of content.

One more thing. You started playing a few years ago - and received content for 8,000 hours. I started to play this year - and in the same and finished, about 1000 hours. We make an amendment, of course, that I love PvP content, and that the two of us are clearly not enough for a complete statistical picture. But nevertheless, even if we look at this forum, there is a tendency to reduce the content reproduced by players.
You yourself confirm that the game is now focused on beginners.
The problem is that beginners very quickly become veterans. With boosters, platinum and buying warframes and weapons - even faster.
And for them there is no content. They are going away. Forever, or until the new update. But they leave.

Naturally, the question arises - when the moment will come when the outflow of players will no longer be compensated by the influx of new players. And this moment will come, if such a tendency continues with a focus only on beginners.

There is also such an important thing as public opinion. The veterans of the game in many ways created a positive picture on YouTube and on forums on the Internet. When I started to play, I saw very few negative reviews, most were positive.
Since this summer, according to my observations, the situation has begun to change. There were a lot of negative reviews - and it was from veterans. Content drought, no endgame, and more. Fortune did not correct the situation. Because this is just a little altered Eidolon Plain + skateboard + animal rescue.
All this is also not very good for the game.

Therefore, I still think that adding content for veterans with the possibility of its replaying is only a plus for the Warframe)

Цитата

Do people really think they need to play the same F2P game forever and pass their accounts to their children after they die or something? 

 I am imagine the faces of the heirs ...

Not forever, of course, but for a little more time than now)

Цитата

We have no idea if this Stalker mode will be good or if its mechanics will meet the expectations of the pvp players.

We can definitely say that the idea itself for PvP fans and for many PvE players is at least very interesting. Therefore, I think that it is worthwhile to implement it. Moreover, the mechanics of the regime itself is already ready - almost no development resources are required.

Цитата

But I'm a pragmatic fellow, I just look at history and tell you what the possible outcomes will be:

It doesn't get released at all.  Minority Pvp players will be angry. Majority Pve players will be happy.
It does get released. Minority Pvp players will be happy. Majority Pve players will be angry.
It does get released . Minority Pvp players will be angry because it doesn't meet their expectations, too many issues, unbalanced, bugs, griefing, etc. Majority Pve players will be angry.

I am also a pragmatist, but I also see the fourth option - the mode will be interesting for PvP fans, and will gradually entice PvE fans with its interesting, fast, non-stressed mechanics) In general, we will wait and see.
The last word will still remain for the DE.

[Corvid]

1 minute ago, Falconer777 said:

non-stressed

As I've just explained in another topic, this is untrue. The possibility of PvP in my missions gives me stress.

[Falconer777]

28 минут назад, Corvid сказал:

As I've just explained in another topic, this is untrue. The possibility of PvP in my missions gives me stress.

Firstly, I wrote "some". Not all PvE players will find this mode interesting and enjoyable, obviously)
Secondly, it is already known that this mode will not be "mandatory" for all players. Only at will.                                                                      Thirdly, in comparison with the Conclave, it is really eazy, it is just as obvious)

[Corvid]

40 minutes ago, Falconer777 said:

Firstly, I wrote "some".

 

1 hour ago, Falconer777 said:

the mode will be interesting for PvP fans, and will gradually entice PvE fans with its interesting, fast, non-stressed mechanics) In general, we will wait and see.

"Some" not found.

[Zanchak]

Pretty sure they said it'd be opt-in (or out, either one.. I think in) They aren't gonna let people just spend entire days trolling randoms as stalker without giving people the option to turn it off. It is a business, and they are not stupid.

[Kainosh]

It depends on how they implement it.

 

 

Currently, Stalker leaves once he kills you ONCE .  If that mechanic is kept, then its fine.

Like this:

Stalker kills You (One of the team) =  Stalker despawns and gets rewarded, while You revive and continue your mission.

You kill Stalker =  Stalker despawns,  You get rewarded for killing Stalker and continue the mission.

 

Its safe for both sides.    And it would be actually fun.     I mean....It will be hella hard to dodge Shraksun blasts.   Or Klebrik.    Playing as Stalker is also pain.

[--DSP--Jetstream]

Why do you guys think this will ever be implemented, these thread is just like warframe:battle royal threads.

Even if its implemented i can just give the stalker 1k ping experience since peer to peer and host always be king..

 

[Zanchak]

8 minutes ago, Kainosh said:

It depends on how they implement it.

 

 

Currently, Stalker leaves once he kills you ONCE .  If that mechanic is kept, then its fine.

Like this:

Stalker kills You (One of the team) =  Stalker despawns and gets rewarded, while You revive and continue your mission.

You kill Stalker =  Stalker despawns,  You get rewarded for killing Stalker and continue the mission.

 

Its safe for both sides.    And it would be actually fun.     I mean....It will be hella hard to dodge Shraksun blasts.   Or Klebrik.    Playing as Stalker is also pain.

Except the stalker should never be rewarded, since its meant to be stalker mode, and stalker gets no rewards except for your kill.

[Corvid]

Copy-pasted from another thread:

I. Don't. Like. Fighting. Against. Other. People.

If that's not enough for you, then here's why: My formative years have made me into a person who feels physically unwell if placed into a situation in which I'm forced into conflict with another person, even if simulated (in fact, I can't even throw a punch without my body reflexively slowing or diverting my arm). As a result, my ability to play the game is impeded for the duration of the conflict, and for quite a while afterwards (so even tanking the revive wouldn't help). My ability to aim and track targets measurably drops, for instance. And since playable stalker would turn any mission into a potential PvP scenario, I would be extremely reluctant to risk putting myself through that.

And once again, the PvP side frames the discussion as "why don't you like this thing you don't like?". The reasons are ultimately irrelevant. We (PvE players) do not want this feature. No amount of saying "But it'll be really fun if done right!" is going to change my mind, because from my subjective viewpoint, that statement is false in its entirety. And to those saying "It would only be a rare occurrence!", you are missing the point. The possibility of any missions forcing this on us is the issue.

I don't expect DE to fix my issue. In fact, I don't want it fixed at all, as being conflict-averse has made my life rather pleasant (note that conflict-averse =/= being a doormat. I'm willing to stand and make the case for what I believe, as long as things stay peaceful).

I'm simply explaining the reasoning behind my opposition to the mode.

Also, given the general quality of my internet connection, it would be fairly obvious to me if I was going up against another player. I'm always up for AI upgrades though, even if I think some players look at that particular subject the wrong way (I typed up a more long-form comment on the subject of perceived AI intelligence a while back, and I could link it here if you want). Edit: Just went back through my post history, and it's not there. I guess the thread it was in got deleted.

[Kainosh]

Just now, Zanchak said:

stalker gets no rewards except for your kill.

Not true.

Stalker DOES get rewarded by all 4 factions. Sentients, Grineer, Corpus and even Infested.  Pretty sure he makes a contract with them before going on a "hunt"

Otherwise he would not be able to maintain himself. 

 

If Stalker mode is not rewarded, then "normal" players will not play it.  Only PvP "maniacs" will (dont need reward...just wanna gib you).  And that would be troublesome.