Tridolons and future winter spider bounties should be locked untill you get your first built AMP and 10~MR

[deothor]

Hey guys. I have a totally wild idea.

How about we'd disable tridolons (and hard-mode spider) bounties from obvious no-amp, MR1-10 leechers who don't even know what they are doing?

Keep First Eidolon for everyone. Keep option to make a full tridolon hunt in any instance as long, as you put shards in the altar, but remove tridolon bounty from view untill you meet certain requirements.

If you want to carry your friend through whole tridolon, you will still be able to. But they, alone, won't be able to just go in to leech on other randoms.

 

Edit: Your Quill tier could also have some kind of influence whether you see the tridolon bounty or not. Just to make super extra sure you can't just skip it for tridolons.

 

Edit2: There seems to be a commotion about "why dare I want Tridolons being locked behind MR". For one reason, really. Higher MR means you had played the game longer. You have more weapons, more frames, more essential mods. In short by having, lets say, 10MR softlock, I know that whoever joins Tridolon hunt understands what elemental mods do, has those mods, has a weapon and can contribute in bringing tridolons down. Having just your first crafted AMP will sure help in some way, but there's still 4 limbs to be destroyed. Maybe I'm expecting bit too much, but I hope MR10 should have the gear to handle it. Especially if they did Teralyst few times already and they know what weapons should they bring. 

If tridolons (or even Eidolon) were meant to be taken with MK weapons and mote-AMP, they wouldn't be having so much health and armor thet requires expensive sniper rivens. Sorry, but tridolons are the so-called endgame content for players who have the gear to face them, not MR 5.

 

Edited December 7, 2018 by deothor
Because soup was too salty

[mikakor]

Doesn't look so bad, honestly. Why not. It's much better than a full hard-lock.

[Nez-Kal]

I for one have always believed that Eidolons should have been the higher level "Carrot" to draw Players towards progressing in the game:
"Whoa! What's that?!!" "Oh, that's an Eidolon. Yeah. You'll be able to take that beast on later after you've progressed some in the game." "Awesome!"

Apparently though someone at DE must have felt "If we don't give all the New Incoming Players EVERYTHING with this Open World major release they'll immediately stop playing our game!" (Which we know is actually the opposite in most games, as once you have everything and played everything only a few days in, you put down the game and most times never go back)

I am all for DE soft-locking Eidolons in some way, as very soon after release the Vomvalyst became great Quill Standing farms, so the excuse to keep Eidolons free and open was pretty much loss then and there for Players seeking to make their first Amps.

Edited December 7, 2018 by Tangent-Valley
Grammar, Sentence structure

[xcenic]

very sure that DE does not like the idea, it is more they promote the stupid way that someone just arriving in the area can join a bounty with a few clicks.

Hey i just come to fortune with my Excalibur level 10 and with MK-paris rank 3, let me enter this hunt Rank 5 and die every 2 seconds, bah does not matter.

A match for bounty was implemented in cetus tridolon, but it is simply terrifying to enter a group and see 3 umbra excalibur with no idea even how to load a Lure.

There still people joining Spy Sorties without a clue how to enter data room avoiding alert zones, clearly reason why most of competent player including myself Just SOLO whole Sorties.

There is a lot of people that need help in warframe, but the most just refuse to learn mechanics and work toward stuff as AMP, Arcanes, Focus School even basic Builds.  

Edited December 7, 2018 by xcenic

[ZeroX4]

This is so stupid idea i won't even comment on that.

You want to restrict someone from something then start from yourself not from others.

Only solution to achieve your "goal" (not to implement your idea) would be a test you need to pass on each bounty to unlock it for multiplayer use, which would guide you on what to do.

But when you think about it that is a no go. Warframe is designed this way not for players to leech but for players to test stuff by them self and figure out on their own how it works.

 

[tipsy_princess]

I have to note here mr lock is no need because chances to find 26mr saryn with flamethrower and basic amp ain't less than level 7 umbra.

pubs kinda can't even plug shard sometimes even with marking place and explain what they need to do. so nothing to say about rank, arcanes for amps, right aura and no serration on chroma and etc.

but some amount of done teralysts would be very nice adjust to pub bounty. also frustration comes not only for prepared players but for those who go there and can't perform anything. so it's for both types of players.

also before someone say go recruit chat - well ye, but some regions/time zones are not populated + forming team takes time and etc. so as long you are not trying speed run pub bounty should be quicker solution.

 

 

[tipsy_princess]

1 минуту назад, ZeroZX4 сказал:

You want to restrict someone from something then start from yourself not from others.

 

and this is why things like eso, arbitrations, rivens frames and weapons etc.+ other sertain endgame content is locked to low mr and unleveld frames :p

[Artekkor]

But how does one is going to build a new amp without farming standing from eidolons?

The small ghosts? are they even good enough for that?

[Olphalarepth]

3 minutes ago, lewdstick said:

I have to note here mr lock is no need because chances to find 26mr saryn with flamethrower and basic amp ain't less than level 7 umbra.

 

Despite the fact that I hate Saryn and call ignis as "easy mode: enabled" I disagree here. Everyone of us is guilty of this, we all go to missions where we want to get it done as quickly as possible and if we don't even have to aim it's better.

 

Personally I found many groups (I almost never use invite or pre formed groups for eidolon hunts) with low MR who didn't even knew to use the amp to damage shields. Once I even found a guy who couldn't make the jump to the island to insert shard (not kidding) and had no launcher. I still prefer the random factor in my groups but my worst experiences have been with low MR that made the hunt so much worse since the challenge changed from "capture eidolon" from "capture eidolon with MR 8 newbies".

If not a MR lock at least a bloody tutorial. That would fix a lot of problems, too many lowbies not having the slightest clue on what to do

[tipsy_princess]

1 минуту назад, Artek94 сказал:

But how does one is going to build a new amp without farming standing from eidolons? 

The small ghosts? are they even good enough for that?

first bounty (just teralyst, no gantu/hydro), vomvs, and rec/clan/mates who willing to babysit? ^_^ just some small wall for casuals to prepare them for content that requires at least check wiki for knowing basics.

[(XBOX)Skippy575]

1 minute ago, Artek94 said:

But how does one is going to build a new amp without farming standing from eidolons?

The small ghosts? are they even good enough for that?

The Teralyst bounty would still be available. The full Tridolon bounty would be locked until the requirements are met. But forming pre-made groups could still go Tridolon hunting.

[LazyBlissIV]

10 minutes ago, Artek94 said:

But how does one is going to build a new amp without farming standing from eidolons?

The small ghosts? are they even good enough for that?

OPs suggestion was directed towards operators with no amps what so ever. The first amp is straight up given to you for free after a quest. 

[xcenic]

15 minutes ago, Artek94 said:

But how does one is going to build a new amp without farming standing from eidolons?

The small ghosts? are they even good enough for that?

i farmed Vombalist for like 2 weeks doing prowl ivara method. Before exist the Eidolon hunt meta.

You can get some friend help and thats good, But people taking advance on auto match is pretty sad. They dont even invest 10 minute on youtube guides. 

[SneakyErvin]

MR limits are a waste since MR is no indication of skill and knowledge. Certain long time playing YTers have proven that in their "guides" already. The amp-gate I 50/50 agree with, but lets face it, just because you can build your first amp it doesnt mean you'll build a good one.

Also, why do you lump together eidolons with orbs? They wont even work the same, amps are very likely not a thing that will be needed for orbs to begin with.

[BrazilianJoe]

I think a "soft-lock" that hides the bounty, disables the selection of the bounty, but tells the n00b he needs to be more "experienced with the Eidolon hunt before he can hunt the Tridolon", but does not prevent joining if he is invited, would be good enough to provide a little bit of familiarity with the hunt. Either locking the tridolon bounty to some level of Quill standing, or just a plain counter of "X successful Eidolon hunts".

Requiring the player to have a non-Mote Amp equipped to select the Tridolon bounty, regardless of experience, is also in good taste.

 

[Erytroxylin]

Why? All you need is mr 5 to get amps. 10 is overkill.

[Erytroxylin]

4 minutes ago, BrazilianJoe said:

I think a "soft-lock" that hides the bounty, disables the selection of the bounty, but tells the n00b he needs to be more "experienced with the Eidolon hunt before he can hunt the Tridolon", but does not prevent joining if he is invited, would be good enough to provide a little bit of familiarity with the hunt. Either locking the tridolon bounty to some level of Quill standing, or just a plain counter of "X successful Eidolon hunts".

Requiring the player to have a non-Mote Amp equipped to select the Tridolon bounty, regardless of experience, is also in good taste.

 

This is a good suggestion. So long as Teralyst hunt is still left open for people to gain experience/standing/amp usage testing on. I especially like the part where you can be invited to bypass the lock to be taught by friends. I think it mostly addresses the issue while leaving openings for legitimate concerns.

[deothor]

10 minutes ago, SneakyErvin said:

MR limits are a waste since MR is no indication of skill and knowledge.

True, but they do indicate someone has basic understanding of the game. Even if all they did was Helene or Hydron.

At least I'll know they know how to bullet jump to the island with shrine to put eidolon shards on :P

[(XBOX)zThulsaDoomz]

Would fully support this idea, as it would also open the door to a few more tweaks into A.I. difficulty as opposed to a DPS race.  It actually considers players at multiple levels of experience.

Well played.

[(PSN)guzmantt1977]

29 minutes ago, lewdstick said:

I have to note here mr lock is no need because chances to find 26mr saryn with flamethrower and basic amp ain't less than level 7 umbra.

Can confirm, was recently asked by high MR player with single digit Terry kills and captures, and low Quills standing if it was my first time doing Eidolons in a run where I did the majority of the damage because nobody else could get the lead out. (I am MR 16, with dozens of times more captures than they have.) 

Having a lower MR doesn't mean that you're incompetent, and having a higher one doesn't make you any good at a specific task. 

1 hour ago, deothor said:

I have a totally wild idea.

By wild, did you mean it the way they do with horses, "not capable of being put to use until broken"? 

23 minutes ago, Olphalarepth said:

. I still prefer the random factor in my groups but my worst experiences have been with low MR that made the hunt so much worse since the challenge changed from "capture eidolon" from "capture eidolon with MR 8 newbies".

Can you capture it solo? If so then the newbs shouldn't be a major issue. 

[Fluff-E-Kitty]

Amp I could see. MR wont and shouldn't happen.

 

[SneakyErvin]

3 minutes ago, deothor said:

True, but they do indicate someone has basic understanding of the game. Even if all they did was Helene or Hydron.

At least I'll know they know how to bullet jump to the island with shrine to put eidolon shards on 😛

He should know that by the time he gets his free-bee amp around MR5.

I do think there should be a gate which atleast requires the Mote Amp.

[deothor]

15 minutes ago, Fluff-E-Kitty said:

Amp I could see. MR wont and shouldn't happen.

 

Personally I think Eidolons weren't made for low rank players. You need some killer weapons, or team setups to actually go and kill your first Eidolon. if you don't believe me, try destroying its limb without rad-elemental weapon, or a sniper rifle to begin with without a dmg-buffing frame like chroma/volt/rhino. It's doable, but i'd take you whole night.

Locking tridolons (not Eidolon, mind you) means that this content is for players who already have proper gear and can contribute in the hunts.

That being said, IMO MR lock is reasonable.

Remember, you can always bring your newbie friend to tridolon yourself. They simply won't be able to join by themselves.

[Olphalarepth]

27 minutes ago, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:

 

Can you capture it solo? If so then the newbs shouldn't be a major issue. 

I used to solo up to gantulist and only managed to take down a hydro alone once. I'm much stronger now and, with a better riven, I may even do it again. The point is not how soloable one can be but squad competence, if I bring a team is to make things EASIER not harder.

As I mentioned in another 3D I have a solo clan so I don't have people to invite. Random factor is my comrade and I have actually met a few incredible hunters, good hunters and lots of terrible ones. Call it bad luck or whatever but only a couple of lowbies managed to help (and they were both playing trinity). MR is not a reflection of skill but it's only true for higher levels, low MR don't have the knowledge (and gear and mods) to keep up with us

 

Besides. I didn't wrote I don't want them in a team at any cost. Once AGAIN I recommend for DE to give us an actual tutorial so we don't get people doing the wrong thing that will prove detrimental to the team such looking at eidolon to see the links with vomvalysts that make it immortal, or not destroying the bloom, or jumping around like idiots doing nothing.

21 minutes ago, SneakyErvin said:

He should know that by the time he gets his free-bee amp around MR5.

I do think there should be a gate which atleast requires the Mote Amp.

The guy that couldn't make the jump to altar to insert shard was around MR 8 or so (and by this we figured it was the first hunt), totally not above MR 10, He/she didn't knew about aim gliding.

Edited December 7, 2018 by Olphalarepth

[Aldain]

Why stop there? Let's just lock any Eidolon hunts until you are capped at max rank with the quills and MR 20+ also you must have at least 10 rivens and god knows what other kind of inane restrictions that people will place on things that usually should go into with a full prebuilt team if they want to avoid dealing with less-than-perfect randoms.

Seriously these complaints make me wonder why nobody just makes a full team of four for what should be endgameish content rather than walking into them and expecting that the public matchmaking should do all the work for them.