Tridolons and future winter spider bounties should be locked untill you get your first built AMP and 10~MR

[(PSN)guzmantt1977]

5 minutes ago, Olphalarepth said:

Yeah, I can totally see masses of MR 10 and lower farming credits and endo on sedna and index, oceans of them. And they are super effective too since they have already maxed serration, high caliber, primed charge and other offensive mods. Not to mention they all have a 500K endo spare since they already maxed vitality, redirection and other frame mods.

 

demonstrably false, ok prove it. I'm here

He also got speed runs on video. I'm sure we can find that too if you really want to spend about 30 minutes watching it happen. 

Quod erat demonstrandum?

[Olphalarepth]

2 minutes ago, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:

He also got speed runs on video. I'm sure we can find that too if you really want to spend about 30 minutes watching it happen. 

Quod erat demonstrandum?

sure,and the video is where?

 

Oh, and btw. One person did it so it must be the normality, not the exception. OBVIOUSLY. When you claim something as big as MR is not skill level i want you yo show me how that is the truth, not that single one can do it while the other 99,99999999% cannot. If you play the game you notice it yourself, most of the times the  low MR can outdamage and get more kill than higher MR players is when we allow them to in order to level companions or crap we don't use or when you run around with a bullet weapon and they use ignis, lenz or other nuking frames or weapons. That is not skill. Skill is something else entirely you get by playing the game and ability to adapt and overcome.

Want to let MR 5 in an eidolon party? fine by me but at least let them know what they have to do or provide support since as I already stated most of the lowbies I have met did almost nothing. It's only a case that the best were high level or middle ones, rigth?

Edited December 7, 2018 by Olphalarepth

[Aldain]

Just now, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:

He also got speed runs on video. I'm sure we can find that too if you really want to spend about 30 minutes watching it happen. 

Quod erat demonstrandum?

Uhhh what is this supposed to demonstrate other than a dedicated solo player who powered through content by brute force using a very specialized set of gear?

[(PSN)guzmantt1977]

4 minutes ago, Aldain said:

Uhhh what is this supposed to demonstrate other than a dedicated solo player who powered through content by brute force using a very specialized set of gear?

That MR isn't a valid indicator of skill. Because someone asked me to demonstrate that their elitist view that MR isn't a meaningless metric, is bogus. So I did so by demonstrating that a player on a speed run was able to handle all the content up to Sedna without a high MR. 

[ZeroX4]

2 hours ago, lewdstick said:

and this is why things like eso, arbitrations, rivens frames and weapons etc.+ other sertain endgame content is locked to low mr and unleveld frames :p

There is big difference between asking for restricting someone from something and making tutorial for him.

I remember when i was on eidolon hunt as chroma with UW and some guy said to me "chroma with uw which don't know how to spawn wisps, im out"
And then he RQ, after which turns on 1 guy had fetch on his kavat.

But even if that would be the case if i fact would be incompetent, you see a difference between him saying "chroma with uw which don't know how to spawn wisps, im out"
And if he would say "if you don't know how to spawn wisps, stand between his legs and move little away from his then aim HIS left knee".

Do you see difference there?

Restricting someone from something won't help that person just postpone in time moment he will encounter same issues.
Tutoria/guide/test to pass, that is what would solve the problem.

[deothor]

@(PS4)guzmantt1977 I am more than sure a MR 3, that rushed the whole content game has to offer with breakneck speed or he played solo all this time will surely contribute with tridolon hunts.

He has no weapons nor frames to help out. A perfect tridolon teammate.

Do you even connect the things about what I am saying and what you write? This is exactly why I'd prefer not having MR1-9~ in tridolons. And you give it as an argument why it's okay? What the hell...

I'm MR 23. I've decided to check out how my perfect Amprex build (which is quite expensive to mod) would fare against TERALYST. With it I managed to destroy 2 limbs beforre running out of ammo. Because my secondary weapon was non radiation, it didn't deal any damage. I had to bail out.

Do you REALLY want to tell me this, or any other low MR will do better with alot worse equipment on bosses few times harder than Teralyst? Please, stop this nonsense.

Edited December 7, 2018 by deothor

[Aldain]

39 minutes ago, deothor said:

No. Please stop trolling and intentionally twisting what others say to fit your narrative. 

EDIT: Just FYI, I am against the idea there are only vomvalysts and Eidolons (and lua sentients) to farm cores. I'd love to see some kind of miniboss that'd fit perfect between vomvalysts and Teralyst and would reward players with exceptional core at very least. But this is something for different time. 

Stop with the personal attacks on my character and shoving the "narrative angle" into my mouth. I am not trolling (aside from the sarcasm in the first post, which I admit was entirely too much as out of line and apologize for) I am legit concerned over where the buck stops, and only over these kind of issues for currently released content, not future content.

I would agree as well on some better way to get cores that's between combing the fields or lua nodes for scraps (I still am not looking forward to the 30 cetus wisps I need for my 111 training wheel amp) but locking out content retroactively is a bad idea, and serves to only make DE look worse when simpler workarounds like making your own parties can solve the issue, for future content though? I could see some locks, as long as some more new player friendly things aren't also locked behind more endgamey locks. The quills just feel like they were badly designed to me when you consider how the mote amp is pretty much the same as no amp and how much it takes if you remove eidolons from the equation to get the basic standing for a 111.

[deothor]

8 minutes ago, Aldain said:

Stop with the personal attacks on my character and shoving the "narrative angle" into my mouth.

This is easy request as I haven't done that in the first place, so nothing changes.

You are dirty lier, though. Not an attack. Stating a fact.

No narrative angle (even though that is YOU who tried to make us look like madmen, want me to quote?).

 

8 minutes ago, Aldain said:

locking out content retroactively is a bad idea

it's content low level players cannot finish by themselves, even if they wanted it. This content is already locked from them by players that would have to carry them. Also the rewards this content have do not merit low MR players according to their contribution or overall progression in the game. They do not need arcanes. They do not need heavy focus boost with shards (even though they will get it from Teralyst).

If I were to say "lets lock whole void behind MR 10", then Yeah, that's something stupid, as void has resources everyone needs. it also has various levels and tiers and mission types, so everyone can find something reasonable for them to do. be it MR 5 or 20.

Gantulyst

Hydrolyst

Are

Not

Though

Edited December 7, 2018 by deothor

[Aldain]

Just now, deothor said:

This is easy request as I haven't done that in the first place, so nothing changes.

You are dirty lier, though. Not an attack. Stating a fact.

No narrative angle (even though that is YOU who tried to make us look like madmen, want me to quote?).

 

it's content low level players cannot finish by themselves, even if they wanted it. This content is already locked from them by players that would have to carry them. Also the rewards this content have do not merit low MR players according to their contribution or progression. They do not need arcanes. They do not need heavy focus boost with shards.

If I were to say "lets lock whole void behind MR 10", then Yeah, that's something stupid, as void has resources everyone needs. it also has various levels and tiers and mission types, so everyone can find something reasonable for them to do. be it MR 5 or 20.

Gantulyst

Hydrolyst

Are

Not

Though

Well I tried to rectify my mistakes and bury the hatchet, but if you're just gonna start calling me a liar (spell it right next time) then I can see we have no recourse and you have no intention of being a decent person for any reason.

So shove your self-entitled views back where they came from and crawl back into whatever miserable hole you decided to crawl out of, because I'm not going to bother any further with somebody who feels that one (already admittedly over the top snarky and poorly worded) forum post makes somebody a "lier" and narrative pusher. You want to perceive  me as such, then go right ahead, it won't change me, my stance, or the stances of anyone else who disagrees with you.

[deothor]

Just now, Aldain said:

Well I tried to rectify my mistakes and bury the hatchet, but if you're just gonna start calling me a liar (spell it right next time) then I can see we have no recourse and you have no intention of being a decent person for any reason.

So shove your self-entitled views back where they came from and crawl back into whatever miserable hole you decided to crawl out of, because I'm not going to bother any further with somebody who feels that one (already admittedly over the top snarky and poorly worded) forum post makes somebody a "lier" and narrative pusher. You want to perceive  me as such, then go right ahead, it won't change me, my stance, or the stances of anyone else who disagrees with you.

Showing true colors, that was fast.

I'm not calling you a liar (oh i am sorry for a typo), wasn't because you disagreed with me, but because you simply lied and tried to... what was that... show me under your specific "narrative angle". You didn;t try to bury the hatchet. Unless you wanted to bury it through my body so to speak. And I can quote you on your lies. It's there, you know. I'm not taking it out of thin air.

You disagree with me? Cool, there were plenty of people who also did that. None of them tried to besmear me while doing so, unlike you that is. And tbh I don't care about it either. But  you going full ballistic because I'm returning the favor? How lame one can get?

Anyways, lets agree to disagree and as a best forum-S#&$storm ending method I will simply block you. That way whether you, or me, want it or not, we won't have to talk with each other. Thanks.

[(PSN)Ochikomu-]

Well that was unexpected. Fun to watch (read) though. 🍹

  Back to the OP of said topic. Honestly, I truly do not care about these giant 5 story creatures of the night. They're the reason I had to waste money for arcanes because they are depressing as all hell to me whenever I try to capture them. I rather go back to 8 man trials.  I had fun doing those at least and fun to teach whoever wanted to learn.  I do like the idea of soft locking Eidolon bounties because it gives some of the players that thought process "what would happen if I do achieve/obtain said stats or items?" Also gives them a little rundown on how to capture with lures etc etc if the player really wants to seek further on the "rewards" that are given. Mastery Rank though...I don't care about that either. It's a number that means nothing lol. Every player eats, sleep, and bleed the same. 

[KubrowTamer]

If someone wants a fully equiped squad then its their fault if they dont a fully equipped team when choosing "public" instead of "invite only". Use recruiting chat. Its what its there for. That and people are only going to learn from experience. It dosnt matter how well equipped someone is they are not going to know what they are doing. "Looking at all of your mr 20+ players who go in pub with a chroma and a rivened rubico and get out damaged by the limbo with a pyrana."
Gear means nothing if the person with the gear cant use it properly. Its why MR is universally useless as a way to measure skill or experience.

[(PSN)guzmantt1977]

1 hour ago, Olphalarepth said:

sure,and the video is where?

Bounce through the ones in the youtube profile. I can't tell you if that's the fml.bat account, I get the impression that he's done several runs this year. 

Now you have your Q.E.D. 

1 hour ago, Olphalarepth said:

Oh, and btw. One person did it so it must be the normality, not the exception. OBVIOUSLY.

Ohhh I don't know about the whole "that's only one person" line you just tried to use. Pretty sure you can find a major content creator who said that they intentionally stayed at a lower level because the MR rank is meaningless. 

Do you need me to drop yet another Q.E.D. on you, or will you admit that being elitist based on MR alone is a rather untenable position? 

1 hour ago, Olphalarepth said:

Want to let MR 5 in an eidolon party? fine by me but at least let them know what they have to do or provide support since as I already stated most of the lowbies I have met did almost nothing. It's only a case that the best were high level or middle ones, rigth?

And I've already said that I have been in way too many groups with higher MR players who were as useless to me as the low level n00bs were to you. Worse because I can anticipate low MR players not knowing what to do. But the high MR noob in the meta frame with the meta gear and no flipping idea wtf to do with it all? Yeah they're a pain. 

How many times have I seen enough lures, and charged in place for the synovia popping, only to see the player run away with them? The player who is at least 8 MR ranks above me asking if it was my first time, when I have hundreds of Terry captures and they have single digits of Terry only? I can count the number of good volts I've done public runs with regardless of mastery on a single hand. I've had lower MR players decimate my Eidolon capture abilities and remind me of why I absolutely cannot count myself as anything more than middle of the pack. 

You want to know a little secret? I'm MR 16, but if you check how many points I have... Well you might see something just a weeeee bit higher than you might have expected. 

 

So no. MR is a very unreliable metric for anything. 

1 hour ago, deothor said:

@(PS4)guzmantt1977 I am more than sure a MR 3, that rushed the whole content game has to offer with breakneck speed or he played solo all this time will surely contribute with tridolon hunts.

He has no weapons nor frames to help out. A perfect tridolon teammate

Oh I don't know about that. A little bit of thought, would tell you that if he was able to pull that off, then he will be exactly the sort of player that can get themselves set up for hunting bear any time they feel like. But I guess that little bit is a bit much for some folks. 

1 hour ago, deothor said:

I'm MR 23. I've decided to check out how my perfect Amprex build (which is quite expensive to mod) would fare against TERALYST. With it I managed to destroy 2 limbs beforre running out of ammo. Because my secondary weapon was non radiation, it didn't deal any damage. I had to bail out.

Sounds like there's at least one MR 23 who I definitely wouldn't want in my group for a public hunt. Because if you couldn't figure out why what you were trying wasn't the best idea, then you probably won't really have a full grasp of what you are doing. 

And it really suggests that there are things that you clearly haven't thought through before doing them. A lot of your posts on this thread are probably some of them. 

[deothor]

17 minutes ago, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:

Sounds like there's at least one MR 23 who I definitely wouldn't want in my group for a public hunt. Because if you couldn't figure out why what you were trying wasn't the best idea, then you probably won't really have a full grasp of what you are doing. 

I did it solo. Just to see why noone uses anything else than sniper rifles. No need to make some jabs at me. 

 

17 minutes ago, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:

And it really suggests that there are things that you clearly haven't thought through before doing them. A lot of your posts on this thread are probably some of them. 

You on the other hand do not understand that someone without any tools cannot beat nor contribute against gauntlyst and hydrolyst. You ignore the issue here. Instead you make attacks on me to discredit my points.

DE designed those 2 bosses after Teralyst to be bulletspongy. You cannot beat them without correct, DE-approved tools. Even something as simple as Teralyst requires  certain conditions to be met (having an AMP and having a weapon with rad-element). Again, you ignore all of that.

And instead go with " BUT LOW MR CAN DO IT!" No. They can't. they leech on those who can.

I told you about my amprex experience because I tried it. I wanted amprex to work. But it simply doesn't. So as 99% of other guns. Not to mention "wrong" guns with no proper mods. And that was on first Eidolon out of 3. I don't have different opinion with you just to have different opinion. I simply been there, done that. At this point you disagree with how Eidolons function if anything. Again, I will repeat myself, stop this nonsense.

Edited December 7, 2018 by deothor

[Leyers_of_facade]

2 hours ago, deothor said:

Sure, but majority of clueless or lazy leechers will be out of equation. It's still a win for everyone who actually have the gear for tridolons. Noone loses here, really... Maybe except leechers.

I think you should leave logic to others, cause you fail at it.

All I am saying is: If you cannot contribute, you shouldn't be able to enter.

Devils advocate... Jesus Christ.

 

Rather amusing reply. 

My first reply is suggesting that we can use number of terralyst hunts as a requirement contrary to what you have suggested -Mastery rank and "suitable weapon". If you want to argue in a logical sense, you would have to rigorously define everything in your statement, how do you define a player to "have a weapon to contribute and knows what to do". As shown from the lack of rigorous definition of wording in statements, I assumed we are talking in a general sense rather than a fully rigorous mathematical logical sense. This is fine since we are arguing on a forum rather than writing a mathematical proof.

On your first reply to my suggestion you said "That's 5-10 leech runs without contributing to unlock your next zone to leech." This statement when stated without proper definition and context, can suggest many things.

1) everyone (new players) are a leecher and likes to be one -> to which I helped you clarify on my second response, since I don't think you are trying to suggest that.

2) leechers are the reason why my idea does not work. -> Basically, you used the possibility of leeching as a reason as to why my idea doesn't work. While a more "logical" way of arguing why the logic behind your response is flawed will be to show a contradiction of this statement to your own proposal.  As seen from the lack of necessity to write a formal thorough proof, I just gave you an example of how leechers will make your own point invalid at the same time to make my point quick. Obviously, you would find that the logic is flawed but it is highly amusing that you yourself didn't realize that when you used the same argument. (Which is exactly why I showcased how ridiculous your so called logic to my first post was in the first place 🤣)

 

Speaking of logic, you might want to know that you are making quite a few logical fallacies in your following responses.

1) By suggesting that I should "leave logic" and "I fail at it" because I showcased you why your original response was flawed is more of an "ad hominem", as the way you attempted to rebut was using the devils advocate to begin with.

Since I am replying a few hours since yours, I do get to see a few amusing addition to the amount of logical fallacy. 

2 hours ago, deothor said:

I'm MR 23. I've decided to check out how my perfect Amprex build (which is quite expensive to mod) would fare against TERALYST. With it I managed to destroy 2 limbs beforre running out of ammo. Because my secondary weapon was non radiation, it didn't deal any damage. I had to bail out.

Do you REALLY want to tell me this, or any other low MR will do better with alot worse equipment on bosses few times harder than Teralyst? Please, stop this nonsense.

Nice job, you literally made a textbook style example of a logical fallacy called "appeal to authority" 

An alternative note, by mentioning "perfect amprex build" and the expenses behind it, you are easily slipping into "red herring" as well. The amount of resources used to mod a particular weapon does not help justify your point at all. 

1 hour ago, deothor said:

 

You disagree with me? Cool, there were plenty of people who also did that. None of them tried to besmear me while doing so, unlike you that is. And tbh I don't care about it either. But  you going full ballistic because I'm returning the favor? How lame one can get?

Anyways, lets agree to disagree and as a best forum-S#&$storm ending method I will simply block you. That way whether you, or me, want it or not, we won't have to talk with each other. Thanks.

Nicely done tenno, you made another logical fallacy: ergo decedo

[Leyers_of_facade]

accidental double post

Edited December 7, 2018 by Leyers_of_facade
accidental double post

[(PSN)guzmantt1977]

30 minutes ago, deothor said:

I did it solo. Just to see why noone uses anything else than sniper rifles. No need to make some jabs at me. 

Was that a jab? I wouldn't have thought that you would think it to be one, based on the fact that I specifically addressed what you said, in relation to the topic of this thread, ie not wanting to be paired up with people who don't know what they are doing, based on things like MR. 

And doing it solo doesn't change anything about what I wrote. If you couldn't figure it out before making the effort, after all of those Mastery Ranks, that suggests that you may not understand the mechanics involved in this part of the game. I'd rather have a lower MR player who knows what they are doing and why. 

30 minutes ago, deothor said:

You on the other hand do not understand that someone without any tools cannot beat nor contribute against gauntlyst and hydrolyst. You ignore the issue here. Instead you make attacks on me to discredit my points.

I specifically addressed that point in my post. And saying that you're making poorly thought out posts isn't an attack, especially when your questionable posts are clearly visible. 

 

30 minutes ago, deothor said:

Even something as simple as Teralyst requires  certain conditions to be met (having an AMP and having a weapon with rad-element). Again, you ignore all of that.

You could easily contribute to the group effort with either. And since the Star Chart (where you get the required mods) can be completed soon after Sedna, leading to your first amp and excal umbra, then it should be obvious that the "lower level" players you claim wouldn't have access to those things, could have them, and possibly enough understanding of the game to make use of them instead of the meta build amprex from YouTube, that they use elsewhere. 

30 minutes ago, deothor said:

Again, I will repeat myself, stop this nonsense.

Oh trust me, I've been trying to stop the nonsense. You just don't seem to be like minded. 

Edited December 7, 2018 by (PS4)guzmantt1977
Auto correct got me good

[tipsy_princess]

i love how some people with no caps at all (even no teralyst caps) argue in this thread 😄  (and some under 10 hc makes no sense too since to get how drastic situtation with pub bounty would require a little bit more exp)

that only makes arguments about caps based lockdown in priority to mr even stronger ^_^

Edited December 7, 2018 by lewdstick

[SenariousNex]

Don't disable it.

Simpler solution: Prevent being able to queue up the tridolon bounty until you hit the req. 4 newbs should still have the freedom to go into open world and try to teamwork that content down. 

[Chaemyerelis]

They need to rework the whole eidelon hunt process before they think about capping anything.

[tipsy_princess]

7 минут назад, Chaemyerelis сказал:

They need to rework the whole eidelon hunt process before they think about capping anything.

but how you state this.. have you done at least one fight with em.....

 

i mean. rly. wth people here talk about something they never done even >_<

 

you all maybe not know this but we can actually check your stats to see if you done some hunts or not.
so pls. know this before you try to troll around.

 

Edited December 7, 2018 by lewdstick

[Chaemyerelis]

5 minutes ago, lewdstick said:

but how you state this.. have you done at least one fight with em.....

 

i mean. rly. wth people here talk about something they never done even >_<

 

you all maybe not know this but we can actually check your stats to see if you done some hunts or not.
so pls. know this before you try to troll around.

 

Listen I know about the stats and no one is trolling. The whole eidelon hunt is ridiculous. You're given an amp which is terrible for the first eidelon which you need to kill to get a better amp unless you want to farm volumnists which takes forever ( i know i did it) . Then add to the fact that to be effective you need a sniper ( preferably the lanka unless you have a riven for something else) then you need to mod that sniper with radiation or whatever its weak too and ontop of that your choice of frames is limited in order to be effective.

If you don't think that whole scenario is silly at best then you're just suffering from elitism. Which is more apparent given you're absolutely silly poorly though out recommendation.

[tipsy_princess]

17 минут назад, Chaemyerelis сказал:

 

If you don't think that whole scenario is silly at best then you're just suffering from elitism. Which is more apparent given you're absolutely silly poorly though out recommendation. 

i just want to believe it's simply trolling. because person talks about something he never completed (even one single time) but already having some position based on no knoweledge/experience at all trying to make change in subject he discuss..well. it's or a) troll (and this is normal) b) not gonna say how it calls since it's offensive and probably related with some kind of disability. so i don't wanna hurt anyone by using bad words ^_^

Edited December 7, 2018 by lewdstick

[Chaemyerelis]

4 minutes ago, lewdstick said:

i just want to believe it's simply trolling. because person talks about something he never completed (even one single time) but already having some position based on no knoweledge at all trying to make change in subject he discuss..well. it's or a) troll (and this is normal) b) not gonna say how it calls since it's offensive and probably related with some kind of disability. so i don't wanna hurt anyone by using bad words ^_^

You can have a position based on knowledge of others and research. If you didn't have the disability you eluded to you would know this.

[(PSN)Ashagin]

I'm starting to get the impressions in this thread that most players dont know that you can do a teralyst bounty, kill teralyst and still use the shard to summon the gauntalyst and then hydralyst.  In that way new players would still be able to do the tricap without hindering more experienced players who want to do the tricap bounty with too much grievance.  In my opinion tricap bounty should be locked behind mr rank 5 at least if not more and a certain amount of teralyst captures(not kills).  In that way I totally agree with OP in those regards.