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MPonder

Why "some" semi-auto exist

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Look at Akbolto prime, a fire rate of 7 bullets per seconds, sure I could map the shot key button to 2 keyboards keys and I'd probably be able to fire 420 bullets per minute.

But is this even healthy, and my keyboard lifetime, how about that too, not that I'm doing this, but just saying. I don't want to use macros, I already saw people getting banned wrong by automate system that detect hack, like League did like 2 times with people using curse voice. I don't trust this kind of stuff and if a ban happen, all I'm goingInsert other media to get is a ctrl+c - ctrl+v from the support.

Edit: sorry, should have expressed better what I was talking about. Talking about semis with low base dmg and sometimes also low cc and have a high fire rate to compensate that are semis.

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41 minutes ago, MPonder said:

sure I could map the shot key button to 2 keyboards keys and I'd probably be able to fire 420 bullets per minute.

This is assuming that you always, literally always, have a target in your line of sight to shoot at. Usually you don't. And I think that's why semi-auto exists.

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There are several secondary weapons that I really like and are fun to use, but I end up not using them precisely because of semi auto.

It's way too annoying, specially on a controller.

I don't mind if it is on one-shot powerful weapons for particular use cases, but that is generally not always the case for secondaries.

Would be awesome if DE addressed this, I'm sure lots of people would use those weapons more ( especially the people on consoles that can't do Macros ).

Even if there was a mod that changed semi to auto ... I would probably use it.

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Semi auto is made for being able to turn 180 and not be a lazy. In certain games, they give you the option to snap 180 and if people had the autofire on, they would be spraying all over the place while snapping to the next target. This gives those who have some control a way to get more precise shots on the target instead of recoil all the way.

That and there are some people who like Semi compared to other types. But lemme guess....since you do not like it, it should not be in the game? 

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Simple answer: Variation.

 

All weapons could be full-auto, but then most of the weapons would feel even more the same. I sometimes enjoy the different feel those guns have.

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41 minutes ago, DreisterDino said:

Simple answer: Variation.

 

All weapons could be full-auto, but then most of the weapons would feel even more the same. I sometimes enjoy the different feel those guns have.

I'm not asking for every weapon to be full-auto, I like the feel of Euphona and Aklex, aim, click, dead. But there are some semi-auto weapons that should not be semi-auto, like Lato, akbolto, etc, they have low base dmg and sometimes also low critical chance and a high fire-rate to compensate, but for that, you have to click from 420 to 600 times per minute to get the most of them, and this with out and fire-rate mod.

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Yeah I think that semi auto guns with more than 7 firerate are clumbersome on controllers. I refer to weapons like this as Tendonitis Prime (aka Akjagara Prime) that are semi auto but have low damage are horrible on consoles and has definitely been more painful to my hand to use than anything else. That 10 firerate is meaningless unless you can actually sustain that firerate and with mods bringing it to 16 (an Impossible to reach number on anything other than a scroll mouse or modded controller) means that the paper DPS of this weapon is nowhere near what the devs think it is, unless they made this gun specifically for scroll and modded controllers!

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Even if these weapons were full auto you could click the input briefly to fire a single shot but you cannot manually click the input 7+ times a second in many cases. So really it's just bad design.

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nothing wrong with semi-automatics, if you don't like having to pull the trigger every time, use an auto. it's OK to not like something, but it's not OK to say something needs changing based on your preference. if you don't like it, it's a you problem, nothing more. I wouldn't say I have the fastest trigger finger in the world but I do OK. years of shooters have helped me a lot, and I've worn down the inner pad of my R2 button, so it's a much lighter trigger than it would normally be (I can get a few seconds of ridiculous trigger spam that makes it look like I'm shooting an automatic, but it's actually me. can't do it ll the time though).

there's also another thing to bear in mind: RoF caps on smei-auto weapons. in games with lesser powered ones like one of many variations of 9mm Pistols the gun will fire as fast as you can pull the trigger, but in cases of things like Revolvers and more powerful weapons, the game only lets you fire every so often and won't register a trigger pull until the gun settles after a fraction of a second. this is done for the sake of balance more than anything, to ensure the higher powered guns don't render weaker ones totally obsolete. 

 

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7 minutes ago, (PS4)robotwars7 said:

nothing wrong with semi-automatics, if you don't like having to pull the trigger every time, use an auto. it's OK to not like something, but it's not OK to say something needs changing based on your preference. if you don't like it, it's a you problem, nothing more. I wouldn't say I have the fastest trigger finger in the world but I do OK. years of shooters have helped me a lot, and I've worn down the inner pad of my R2 button, so it's a much lighter trigger than it would normally be (I can get a few seconds of ridiculous trigger spam that makes it look like I'm shooting an automatic, but it's actually me. can't do it ll the time though).

there's also another thing to bear in mind: RoF caps on smei-auto weapons. in games with lesser powered ones like one of many variations of 9mm Pistols the gun will fire as fast as you can pull the trigger, but in cases of things like Revolvers and more powerful weapons, the game only lets you fire every so often and won't register a trigger pull until the gun settles after a fraction of a second. this is done for the sake of balance more than anything, to ensure the higher powered guns don't render weaker ones totally obsolete. 

 

To be fair, why not offer an alt fire to provide the choice to the player? So it defaults to semi-auto but offers a full-auto alt fire mode that has a slight delay between shots, it just doesn't make you press the input each time.

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Agree should allways be a hold down option for guns. At lest in menu a switch to turn on.

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52 minutes ago, (PS4)robotwars7 said:

nothing wrong with semi-automatics, if you don't like having to pull the trigger every time, use an auto. it's OK to not like something, but it's not OK to say something needs changing based on your preference. if you don't like it, it's a you problem, nothing more. I wouldn't say I have the fastest trigger finger in the world but I do OK. years of shooters have helped me a lot, and I've worn down the inner pad of my R2 button, so it's a much lighter trigger than it would normally be (I can get a few seconds of ridiculous trigger spam that makes it look like I'm shooting an automatic, but it's actually me. can't do it ll the time though).

there's also another thing to bear in mind: RoF caps on smei-auto weapons. in games with lesser powered ones like one of many variations of 9mm Pistols the gun will fire as fast as you can pull the trigger, but in cases of things like Revolvers and more powerful weapons, the game only lets you fire every so often and won't register a trigger pull until the gun settles after a fraction of a second. this is done for the sake of balance more than anything, to ensure the higher powered guns don't render weaker ones totally obsolete. 

 

It is not preference, I'm saying that a weapon that has it stats balanced around a high fire rate while been semi-auto is just, well, stupid. Are they really expecting people to click even half of that to get some dmg of them.

And are you really telling me that this is to balance things? Sorry, but if that's the case, anybody using a macro for it should be banned and should be blocked to set the mouse wheel shortcut for it. Doing this to balance is so stupid, are you trolling me or what?

 

And even if I can click at that speedy, do you really think I would do that with my mechanical keyboard or LG mouse?

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I'm of the opinion that semi-automatic weapons should not fire faster than about 300 RPM, or 5 RPS. Anything more than that and you're looking at an automatic weapon which encourages controller-damaging button-mashing, in which case just give it an automatic trigger. Now obviously if a player takes a normally slow-firing semi-auto weapon and upgrades it with rate of fire buffs into 10 RPS or some such... Fine. That's the player's choice. I'm still of the opinion that fast-firing semi-autos encourage button-mashing, binding fire to the mouse wheel and just straight-up auto-clickers. You can always single-click a full auto weapon without damaging your equipment, but the same isn't always true for a fast-firing semi-auto.

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In an ideal Tiltskillet world, semi-auto would only exist on weapons with a max fire rate of less than 5 rounds per second after mods.  It's just the silly, regular ol' world though, and I recognize that a lot of the other  people in it like what we've got.

That being said, it would be great to have more and better mods for tuning down fire rate.  Critical Delay and the like could be balanced  to be less of dps loss.  And it would be nice to get new +damage / -fire rate corrupted mods that would be a good fit on a wider range of weapons.

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Semi-autos with insane fire rate are indeed a bit silly. Sure, some semi-autos do give that feeling of power behind every shot — and I can understand that some people like it that way. But still I believe that gameplay should take precedence over those "feeling" arguments. So, in my opinion base fire rate should be used to determine if the weapon should be semi or auto. Something like if firerate is more that 4-5 (exact number is debatable, yes), the weapon should be auto-fire. If it's less — it can either semi or auto depending on how devs envision that gun.

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No wonder all my mice have to be trashed after a year or less because of a broken left button... A free rolling mouse wheel is only available on pretty expensive mice... I got fed up with hurting my mice and finger and macroed it. You can make macros as long as they do not play instead of you autonomously.

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Granted I don't play M&K because I'm on console... but I've never had any major issues with fast firing semi-autos, in fact Akbolto and Lato Vandal are staples for me.  

I like that I have more control out of the bullet output, and if I really need to I can ramp up the effort by mashing the trigger.  The funny thing is the Semi-Auto nature allows me to make the fire-rate fluctuate based on how fast I decide to shoot - something you will never get from full auto, since the fire rate is constant.  That's an actual gameplay based reason not to change them.  

 At the end of the day you will almost always have much more control over a semi-auto weapon, fast firing semi-auto has some of the greatest control one could achieve.  The best thing about Warframe is there's about 200 others weapons you can use, if these semi-autos with fast fire rate aren't for you - then don't you worry, there are semi-autos with bad fire rate too 🙂 Just because something is fast doesn't mean it has to be auto, it's nice to have choices of all types.

Also since this entire thread really is just personal opinion - let me say - simply holding a button is boring, to me.  When I have a semi-auto, it actually feels like I am taking each shot and pulling the trigger myself, especially considering our controllers have triggers.

    

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16 minutes ago, (PS4)lagrue said:

Granted I don't play M&K because I'm on console... but I've never had any major issues with fast firing semi-autos, in fact Akbolto and Lato Vandal are staples for me.  

I like that I have more control out of the bullet output, and if I really need to I can ramp up the effort by mashing the trigger. 

DE doesn't ban macros, by the way - this is pretty well established that as long as you are not abusing them to AFK and essentially bot, there is some leeway to their usage.  You are not allowed to automate, in essence - but changing trigger type to "full-auto" with a script that mashes the shoot button is within acceptable realms, so regardless of what you think people should be banned for, that is not a bannable offense.  It also isn't a necessity since most of these weapons are still more than useable without macros.    

Never said nothing about people should be banned for using macro, I said if that was the case.

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4 minutes ago, MPonder said:

Never said nothing about people should be banned for using macro, I said if that was the case.

Even if that was the case, it is not a bannable offense 🙂 so there is no point suggesting it.  Please do try to ignore the other user trying to provoke you and call your age out, we can discuss this civilly.  

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11 hours ago, Legion-Shields said:

automatic usually makes guns more boring. With semi-auto you can feel the power in each shot.

Boy howdy, I sure do enjoy feeling the power in each shot of my Tysis.

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