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Bone to pick with Fortuna and its Vallis


Akaruy
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When Fortuna was first announced, I was thrilled. Another open world area where I could explore, and either do my own stuff or do the missions prepared for it.

But then Fortuna first dropped, and it was missing half of its content it seemed. No hunt, no quills alternative, shallow bounties... and while this is a personal issue and not the devs fault, I was also extremely disappointed in the fishing and the conservation hunting, as the fishes are just ugly and uninspired (except for the Orokin ones, which of course are locked behind "high level" bait) and the hunt is way too finnicky.

So I dropped Fortuna and went on to other games, hoping that in their already announced future update things would be better. After all, this was just a first opening, I knew there were still bugs to patch and issues to balance.

But then the new update came in, and I find that bounties are still the same boring shallow stuff; instead of a decent Operator focused syndicate we got Quills 2.0... no, actually Quills 0.5 since now we even lack the mysticism that made the quills intersting in the first place; hunt is locked behind a grindwall of bounties, sounds needlesly complicated (though this one is personal taste), and the rewards do not seem all that interesting.

But all this was just a side issue for me, as I usually don't even do bounties or hunts all that much. I spent hours in plains of eidolon just relaxing and fishing, enjoying the ambient sounds, the beautiful background and the freedom of movement. When I tried to do the same in Fortuna, I find that fishes are just boring machines, the background is just a snowy wasteland, and the enemies have such an incredibly huge aggro range that I can't even do a simple conservation hunt without getting swarmed. And that last one is the biggest problem I have with all of this: I can't do anything without the game shoving combat down my throat in the Vallis. In PoE, you could spend a full day-night cycle and never fight an enemy if you wanted to, In the Vallis it's impossible to spend thirty seconds without someone shooting you. It's like DE is yelling "YOU WILL KILL CORPUS AND LIKE IT!". How can someone enjoy themselves in this place if they just want to fish or hunt?

Also, can Biz shut the F up?

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The run up to November steam charts show there were about 55,000 Weekday to 85,000 Weekend these were the "Content Drought" numbers.

Now First Fortuna weekend peaked at 131,000 players the first week was about 85,000 players.
Second weekend peaked at 106,000 (25,000 player drop in a single week) Weekdays dropped to around 70,000.

This week since Fortuna 2.0 dropped? 85,000 peak to 50,000 low and it's only going to keep haemorrhaging numbers. 

 

 

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1 minute ago, Joe_Barbarian said:

The run up to November steam charts show there were about 55,000 Weekday to 85,000 Weekend these were the "Content Drought" numbers.

Now First Fortuna weekend peaked at 131,000 players the first week was about 85,000 players.
Second weekend peaked at 106,000 (25,000 player drop in a single week) Weekdays dropped to around 70,000.

This week since Fortuna 2.0 dropped? 85,000 peak to 50,000 low and it's only going to keep haemorrhaging numbers. 

 

 

That bad uh?

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3 hours ago, Akaruy said:

But then Fortuna first dropped, and it was missing half of its content it seemed. No hunt, no quills alternative, shallow bounties... and while this is a personal issue and not the devs fault, I was also extremely disappointed in the fishing and the conservation hunting, as the fishes are just ugly and uninspired (except for the Orokin ones, which of course are locked behind "high level" bait) and the hunt is way too finnicky.

Sounds like you want to switch to consoles. Given them more time to polish stuff, and while there are still bugs, the worst ones usually get patched up before release. 

Speaking as a casual, mid level player who does a couple of runs here and there, gaining standing isn't that bad, and I'm a day or two away from having all of the baits in the game. So honestly, the grind isn't as bad as people say, and the impression I get is that some folks just want everything handed to them on a silver platter, so they can go back to complaining about content drought. 🙄

3 hours ago, Akaruy said:

I have with all of this: I can't do anything without the game shoving combat down my throat in the Vallis. In PoE, you could spend a full day-night cycle and never fight an enemy if you wanted to, In the Vallis it's impossible to spend thirty seconds without someone shooting you. It's like DE is yelling "YOU WILL KILL CORPUS AND LIKE IT!". How can someone enjoy themselves in this place if they just want to fish or hunt?

🤔 Have you been trying to do this stuff during bounties or something? I go mining and fishing every so often, and fishing has been pretty serene, just like on the plains, only time I have to share out a beating is when I just moved to a new area, and they haven't realised that as long as they let me fish or mine in peace, I won't have to kill all of them.

Of course I'm doing that solo, so... Nobody trying to get a full alert level while I'm doing my thing. 

Went in public once, saw a poor dude try to hunt beasties, while 2 other dudes were busy dropping in on him, blowing stuff up and being general idiots. I left the area and went sightseeing instead. Floating around, visiting the outer regions, jumped into the Pearl-hole to see what was at the bottom, the usual tourist stuff. 

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3 hours ago, Joe_Barbarian said:

The run up to November steam charts show there were about 55,000 Weekday to 85,000 Weekend these were the "Content Drought" numbers.

Now First Fortuna weekend peaked at 131,000 players the first week was about 85,000 players.
Second weekend peaked at 106,000 (25,000 player drop in a single week) Weekdays dropped to around 70,000.

This week since Fortuna 2.0 dropped? 85,000 peak to 50,000 low and it's only going to keep haemorrhaging numbers. 

 

 

Yeah, let's pretend that warframe exists in a vacuum, and no other major titles got released since September. Good plan  I rate it a solid 5/7. 👍

 

Maybe we can ask what other games the OP went on to play. You know, just for reference. If I had to guess I'd say minesweeper, pinball, and Pokémon go, but I could always be wrong. 

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I remember how almost everyone was so sure that the bounties will be upgraded once Fortuna 2.0 update comes. More missions, better variety, better spread on different locations

 

Spoiler: it didn't

Edited by deothor
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5 hours ago, Joe_Barbarian said:

The run up to November steam charts show there were about 55,000 Weekday to 85,000 Weekend these were the "Content Drought" numbers.

Now First Fortuna weekend peaked at 131,000 players the first week was about 85,000 players.
Second weekend peaked at 106,000 (25,000 player drop in a single week) Weekdays dropped to around 70,000.

This week since Fortuna 2.0 dropped? 85,000 peak to 50,000 low and it's only going to keep haemorrhaging numbers. 

 

 

Those numbers are rather meaningless. WF is on more than just pc, and that doesn't account for players who don't have steam. Its normal for players to come and go. 

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8 hours ago, Joe_Barbarian said:

The run up to November steam charts show there were about 55,000 Weekday to 85,000 Weekend these were the "Content Drought" numbers.

Now First Fortuna weekend peaked at 131,000 players the first week was about 85,000 players.
Second weekend peaked at 106,000 (25,000 player drop in a single week) Weekdays dropped to around 70,000.

This week since Fortuna 2.0 dropped? 85,000 peak to 50,000 low and it's only going to keep haemorrhaging numbers. 

 

 

I’m willing to bet those two 50,000 figures are the same loyal player base that keeps this game going. The spike that occurs after each major update are just casuals that were never going to have a lasting impact anyways.

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8 hours ago, (XB1)Eminem2420 said:

Those numbers are rather meaningless. WF is on more than just pc, and that doesn't account for players who don't have steam. Its normal for players to come and go. 

Yup actual statistics is "Fake News" 

8 hours ago, Legion-Shields said:

I’m willing to bet those two 50,000 figures are the same loyal player base that keeps this game going. The spike that occurs after each major update are just casuals that were never going to have a lasting impact anyways.

You claim loyal, but are they really loyal if they are supporting bad game decisions. I've not seen a single post saying "We love these new grind walls keep it up!" It's attitudes like that that drives games into the ground. As long as people keep paying DE will keep releasing "content" like they have where you have to grind to get access to another grind to get a new warframe and weapons.

I've not even touched on the subject of the 2 pain in the rear end to farm Warframes that DE were using to bait people into watching Warframe twitch streamers in the form of twitch drops. Yeah instead of fixing the issue with the farm, lets just band aid the problem and use it as a opportunity to inflate some statistics.

So excuse me chuckling at the term "loyal" when it's more like "suckers"

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2 hours ago, Joe_Barbarian said:

Yup actual statistics is "Fake News" 

You claim loyal, but are they really loyal if they are supporting bad game decisions. I've not seen a single post saying "We love these new grind walls keep it up!" It's attitudes like that that drives games into the ground. As long as people keep paying DE will keep releasing "content" like they have where you have to grind to get access to another grind to get a new warframe and weapons.

I've not even touched on the subject of the 2 pain in the rear end to farm Warframes that DE were using to bait people into watching Warframe twitch streamers in the form of twitch drops. Yeah instead of fixing the issue with the farm, lets just band aid the problem and use it as a opportunity to inflate some statistics.

So excuse me chuckling at the term "loyal" when it's more like "suckers"

What grind walls would that be? Not the one I keep breaking because I have a bunch of bonds and gems, right? Or the one that I found out I was doing because I had some little doohickies and whatzits to trade in when I talked to the nice young lady that my mumsie warned me about? Must be the one that's done by actually grinding on a hover board? 

I'm so confused. Right now. 

 

Oh and regarding your statistics, remember what old Sam Clemens had to say about those? No? It's OK. Neither does anyone else, according to a statistic I found. 

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3 minutes ago, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:

What grind walls would that be? Not the one I keep breaking because I have a bunch of bonds and gems, right? Or the one that I found out I was doing because I had some little doohickies and whatzits to trade in when I talked to the nice young lady that my mumsie warned me about? Must be the one that's done by actually grinding on a hover board? 

I'm so confused. Right now. 

 

Oh and regarding your statistics, remember what old Sam Clemens had to say about those? No? It's OK. Neither does anyone else, according to a statistic I found. 

It's apparent that you're confused.

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12 minutes ago, Joe_Barbarian said:

It's apparent that you're confused.

Yeah, so tell me, is there a PC exclusive grindwall that we haven't gotten on console yet? Because we still have some left over pitchforks and torches. 

Wait.. Is that the grindwall, do you guys have pitchsporks? Torch Prime? Aaaarrrrgggghhh, why can't we get the new grindwall? They take forever to release new content to us. 😠

Edited by (PS4)guzmantt1977
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7 minutes ago, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:

Yeah, so tell me, is there a PC exclusive grindwall that we haven't gotten on console yet? Because we still have some left over pitchforks and torches. 

Wait.. Is that the grindwall, do you guys have pitchsporks? Torch Prime? Aaaarrrrgggghhh, why can't we get the new grindwall? They take forever to release new content to us. 😠

You have to have max ranked Solaris United rep to be able to do the new Heists and grind Vox Solaris rep to then take on the Profit Taker spiders thats basically no challenge what so ever. The materials to build the new warframe and get ranked up with Vox Solaris have most problably the worse drop rates ever introduced to Warframe. It's so much faster to farm parts to sell for 5plat a piece to get the new weapons and warframe than it is to play the actual content that provide it for free (Thats even if we take out the build time). But in case you didn't want to do the farm there is also the option to buy some of parts you need to farm to improve the ease of fighting the Giant spider from the market using .. you guessed it more platinum.

It's common sense that MMO's do require grind to get rewards, warframe was a game that many saw that platinum as a pay to progress faster in the game but now it's turning into an outright, pay to progress because the grind is just a "Nope, screw that" But hey you're on console so they'll most likely unscrew themselves before it reaches consoles.

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5 hours ago, Joe_Barbarian said:

Yup actual statistics is "Fake News" 

You claim loyal, but are they really loyal if they are supporting bad game decisions. I've not seen a single post saying "We love these new grind walls keep it up!" It's attitudes like that that drives games into the ground. As long as people keep paying DE will keep releasing "content" like they have where you have to grind to get access to another grind to get a new warframe and weapons.

I've not even touched on the subject of the 2 pain in the rear end to farm Warframes that DE were using to bait people into watching Warframe twitch streamers in the form of twitch drops. Yeah instead of fixing the issue with the farm, lets just band aid the problem and use it as a opportunity to inflate some statistics.

So excuse me chuckling at the term "loyal" when it's more like "suckers"

If you are going to ignore what I post then you shouldn't even bother to respond. You look foolish. Stats are meaningless without proper context and is just apparent manipulation.

Edited by (XB1)Eminem2420
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19 hours ago, Akaruy said:

(except for the Orokin ones, which of course are locked behind "high level" bait)ch

you are dead wrong they are rare, take a drop chance booster with you and you will not need bait if there are hot spots as they only spawn form hot spots

19 hours ago, Akaruy said:

instead of a decent Operator focused syndicate we got Quills 2.0... no, actually Quills 0.5 since now we even lack the mysticism that made the quills intersting in the first place;

yes, it is a Quils chain store.  the thing is many people are very vocal about not wanting more operator.  

20 hours ago, Akaruy said:

In the Vallis it's impossible to spend thirty seconds without someone shooting you. It's like DE is yelling "YOU WILL KILL CORPUS AND LIKE IT!".

learn how to kill them faster then they will be quiet.  the rule it that if they don't get a beacon active they there are no courpus. yes you will have to clear out an area and it will be a bit of a pain at first but on the other hand, these are the first enemies that can truly challenge some of the tankier builds and make you think about what you bring (assuming you don't just take mesa/inaros).  

while you say the bounties are uninspired there are only so many repeatable objectives that can be done in any order, also there are new mechanics at play such as the wanted system which affects enemy: count, type, level, and agro.  by keeping the beacons at tier 2 you will have a steady stream of fodder without minibosses and specialized units.  it is clear what got the most time this time around and it is the enemies.  there is a multitude of new attacks a weapon variations in the new enemy pool.  the thing is while grindy like the rest of the game it is and can still be fun if you let it.  to do so you must learn the quirks of the new systems and how to use them to your advantage.  for example if you want to kill dudes then start by killing bots as this will let the organics place beacons to call in support.  IF you want to fish and chill the opposite is true, bring a sniper and kill the organics then the bot this will prevent t them from raising the alarm.  

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I honestly don't get all the hate the Bounties are getting. Nearly every thread has people hating on them.

Warframe was originally a Corridor Shooter & all the Bounties really are is the same Mission types that we have in the Star Chart except they are in the Open World/Landscape areas.

Both Maps: Mobile Defense, Extermination, Capture, Assassination, & Excavation.

Vallis introduced: Spy, Interception, a form or Defense, a less annoying Rescue, & a lesser Survival.

The only missions that aren't bounties are Defection, HIVE, Survival, Traditional Defense, & Traditional Sabotage.

To be frank...if you hate the Bounties, you hate Warframe.

As for The Quills 2.0

I do agree. Part of the story is how our Operator (Tenno) is growing in power, & etc. It sucks that Fortuna's Quill like Branch is crap but to be honest...lore wise only Teshin, The Sentients (Thanks to Hunhow), The Grineer, maybe Certain Infested Hive Minds, & The Quills know the truth about the Tenno.

Fortuna doesn't need & should even have a Quills branch impo.

Additionally, feedback from PoE was that the Eidolonsnbeing locked behind the Operator & Focus 2.0 was a bitter pill for new players.

Many disagree with me but Operator & Focus are 2 of the more Endgame aspects of Warframe. They are something you'd can't just mod/trade for. You have to earn it, developb/nurture it, & empower it. Overtime The Operator becomes a real force to be reckoned with.

But many dislike how long Operator progression takes.

So DE chose to make the Orbs friendly to all Audiences, essentially omitted Operators (they may as well have just not included them period) from Fortuna & now the content somewhat is lesser for it.

Why the hell a Tenno would reveal themselves to Little Duck is mind boggling.

Corpus don't need to know who we are.

Moving along...

The Fish are uninspired because they are meant to be part of the Terraforming process.

Venus in real life is a barren hellscape.

Personally (and everyone on these forums knows it.) I would have preferred that DE have done a Venus 2.0 for the Star Chart Venus Tileset, and made Orb Vallis a Fiery Hellworld. Ash, Brimstone, Acid rain, eruptions, lakes & rivers of magma, firestorms.

Then if they wanted to get sci-fi....have creatures that thrive in that hostile environment.

Instead DE chose to honor the lazy Tileset that is shared across 75% of the Star Chart ).

Venus, Phobos, Europa, Mars (Corpus missions), Jupiter (Select Missions & Alerts), Neptune, Pluto, & Eris (Select Missions) all share the Venus & Europa tilesets.

As a result made DE made Venus an Iceworld when no one would have cared if they had retconned the old Venus Tilesets.

So DE took a barren fire wasteland which would have awe inspiring & interesting due to the dynamic nature of fire, brimstone, ash, sulfur, & etc. (Just think Mustafar from Star Wars) And covered it in Ice, Coolant, and now due to this...have to invent Genetically created Orokin Creatures (not Natural or Native creatures), as well as create drones, & robots that serve the terraforming process (the fish) because nothing natural to Venus could survive in the polar opposite environment of Venus, nor could any of it's natural life exist in coolant (a giant pool of chemicals).

So to be frank....making Venus an Iceball was a HORRIBLE idea.

Unfortunately it is DE's game & vision. I respect their vision for the art that it is. But I do NOT like how they wasted the only Hellworld in the Solar System.

Edited by (PS4)Zero_029
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7 hours ago, Joe_Barbarian said:

You have to have max ranked Solaris United rep to be able to do the new Heists and grind Vox Solaris rep to then take on the Profit Taker spiders thats basically no challenge what so ever. The materials to build the new warframe and get ranked up with Vox Solaris have most problably the worse drop rates ever introduced to Warframe. It's so much faster to farm parts to sell for 5plat a piece to get the new weapons and warframe than it is to play the actual content that provide it for free (Thats even if we take out the build time). But in case you didn't want to do the farm there is also the option to buy some of parts you need to farm to improve the ease of fighting the Giant spider from the market using .. you guessed it more platinum.

It's common sense that MMO's do require grind to get rewards, warframe was a game that many saw that platinum as a pay to progress faster in the game but now it's turning into an outright, pay to progress because the grind is just a "Nope, screw that" But hey you're on console so they'll most likely unscrew themselves before it reaches consoles.

Yeah, they're little round things that aren't actually toroidal at all as far as I can tell. 

In the few bounties and limited exploration I've done, I managed to pick up a few without realising that I should be interested in picking them up. When I saw that that's what she wanted I checked the wiki and they said, go explore caves or kill enemies in specific locations. I'd not done much of that, but alert level 4, has been happening fairly often because that's the quick way to do those "kill x amount of corpua/reinforcements" bounties. 

And even with a 1% chance, you kill a few hundred enemies and you'll likely have a handful. 

 

So yeah, still a bit confused as to what the issue is. It's as though the complaint is just that some folks only want to blow through the content without actually playing the game. I mean that's what you proposed as the solution was it, paying plat so you can just skip it? 

 

Why do you feel like you need to progress faster? Especially if you aren't really interested in playing the game? 

That makes no sense, friend. 

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5 hours ago, (PS4)Zero_029 said:

Many disagree with me but Operator & Focus are 2 of the more Endgame aspects of Warframe. They are something you'd can't just mod/trade for. You have to earn it, developb/nurture it, & empower it. Overtime The Operator becomes a real force to be reckoned with.

Yeah, that's about right. I noticed the improvement while hunting Eidolons, but it wasn't til I tried levelling a new amp on hydron and realised that my operator didn't have a reason to keep popping back into my frame, that it hit home. 

 

I guess the complaint is that they don't get the instant gratification that they have come to expect, and deeply crave. 

5 hours ago, (PS4)Zero_029 said:

So DE took a barren fire wasteland which would have awe inspiring & interesting due to the dynamic nature of fire, brimstone, ash, sulfur, & etc. 

Minor nit to pick, but brimstone = sulfur. Not much dynamic about it. Especially when you can't smell it. And the extremophiles that would live there are probably bacteria, possibly a few slightly higher organisms like what we find around black smokers, using sulfur instead of oxygen during respiration. And those dynamics you praise.... They are probably a major pain in the butt to create. I suspect that patch on the plains was part of a test run. 

 

 

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5 hours ago, (XB1)Eminem2420 said:

If you are going to ignore what I post then you shouldn't even bother to respond. You look foolish. Stats are meaningless without proper context and is just apparent manipulation.

Why do I have to respond to you? Is there some kind of compulsory must reply to X rule that i'm not aware of? 

I just deemed your post not worthy of a reply from me, the numbers came with context you just overlooked it. 

Also I will apologise in advanced if there is something special about you that I must wavier my ability to post in a thread because it's not a direct reply to you.

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1 hour ago, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:

Yeah, that's about right. I noticed the improvement while hunting Eidolons, but it wasn't til I tried levelling a new amp on hydron and realised that my operator didn't have a reason to keep popping back into my frame, that it hit home.

Well said.

I was always soloing Eidolons but with every 2 or 3 focus upgrades I began to notice small changes.

How quickly I could solo Eidolons, that I could solo Sortie 3 missions without ever returning to my frame (had a glitch during a mobile defense Sortie) made me buckle down & finish all schools. Not just way bounds.

1 hour ago, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:

Minor nit to pick, but brimstone = sulfur. Not much dynamic about it.

Haha. I was saying it for the aesthetic appeal. But you got me.

1 hour ago, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:

And the extremophiles that would live there are probably bacteria,

Realistically yeah. I was (before they unveiled the frozen concepts had become reality) hoping they'd put the sci-fi/space magic wand to things. Living fire, Molten Dogs/Cats, some stuff that makes no sense.

 

1 hour ago, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:

And those dynamics you praise.... They are probably a major pain in the butt to create. I suspect that patch on the plains was part of a test run. 

I'm honestly positive that this is why we got the Venusbthat we have. Ice is easier to do than fire. It's also easier on all systems (PC & console alike) to run.

I guess one could argue we traded Blade soot for White Snow, Orange & red liquid for blue & green liquid, a yellow & Red swirled skybox for the cluster(bleep) skybox we have now. Haha.

Atleast they didn't reuse the Tileset skybox. Nothing bothers me more than Venus missions where I look out a window or up at the sky & see a Gigantic Jupiter in orbit. Haha.

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On 2018-12-22 at 3:12 AM, Joe_Barbarian said:

The run up to November steam charts show there were about 55,000 Weekday to 85,000 Weekend these were the "Content Drought" numbers.

Now First Fortuna weekend peaked at 131,000 players the first week was about 85,000 players.
Second weekend peaked at 106,000 (25,000 player drop in a single week) Weekdays dropped to around 70,000.

This week since Fortuna 2.0 dropped? 85,000 peak to 50,000 low and it's only going to keep haemorrhaging numbers. 

 

 

There's always people that want to downplay these numbers. But it's all we have and while not 100% accurate (for reasons listed already) it still shows a trend.

Of those 50k Id be even more curious to see a breakdown of who actually is going to Fortuna. Cause I'm Not one of them. Im enjoying the game just not the new content.

The trend of gimmicks the last few years causes a spike but it's not sustainable because it's never finished and it rarely gels with the core game. 

- Operators: boring, slow. Grind too slow to keep up with content. Largely used as an energy battery and platinum sink via ever increasing amounts of dev time seemingly being spent on cosmetics. 

- Archwings: too disconnected, handles poorly, grind too separate to keep up with content. Current implementation is concerning with railjack on the way.

- "open world" zones: soul crushing grind. The rewards don't seem worth it. Zones are largely empty and devoid of anything that isn't bounty related. Boss content too heavily linked with operators.

- Umbra: automated frames that encourage more operator usage. A sneak peek into future content - just wait until you have to grind enough Tau resistance and +dmg to sentients before you can actually do the main grind.

Most of their newest ideas aren't universally liked. In fact, I'd even argue that some of these things have had a negative impact for a lot of people. Due to the games piecemeal release nature, people pop back in and decide they don't like where it's going and logout. 

Some people are tired of the side mini game tangent of these additional systems. We've spent countless hours grinding our frames and weapons. I think a lot of people are still waiting to find out why rather than being asked to continue all these sub grinds.

 

 

Edited by IIDMOII
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