harrow rework?

[Luciole77]

is very dependent on the numbers of enemies around to use skills 1 and 2. Harrow is great with weapons that have high loading time like exergis / tigris. I think they should make some modification in these skills to be able to enjoy these weapons better and have better survival with those two skills.

[Melanholic7]

im just kinda sad that his surviveability point is shields, and they are kinda meh,cause armor isnt working with shields 😞 so its very low EHP =( so he is basicaly like 0 armor frame according to his ehp :O which is frustrating for me to have on high levels of threats... but im just a noob,so maybe its just my problems :)

[KennBone]

harrow is perfect wf. the shields are what need a good rework

[Luciole77]

2 minutes ago, davej83 said:

harrow is perfect wf. the shields are what need a good rework

Its not perfect...its a little broken.

Edited January 5, 2019 by Luciole77

[KennBone]

hace 3 minutos, Luciole77 dijo:

Its not perfect...its a little broken.

excuse but atm he´s the wf who sinergy skills in the best way and usefull posible. he can heal, regen shield, heal team, energy regen, para enemies, invicible, crit boost sooo.... it´s all abouth playstyle 

[birdobash]

I dont think harrow needs a complete rework, just some tweaks to his abilities that make it more team friendly. Making it so he has to kill enemies and solely him doesn't really work in a team scenario, so somehow making it so enemies killed by teammates also contributes to his buffs to a lesser extent might work better.

This is mostly the problem with thurible, since its cast time is long even with natural talent, and by the time you use up your energy to convert it to thurible buff all the enemies near you are all dead so you can't regain energy.

[Luciole77]

8 minutes ago, davej83 said:

excuse but atm he´s the wf who sinergy skills in the best way and usefull posible. he can heal, regen shield, heal team, energy regen, para enemies, invicible, crit boost sooo.... it´s all abouth playstyle 

He needs to be good on solo too....not only in a group. My playstyle is solo...so yes...they need to do some rework on skill 1/2

Edited January 5, 2019 by Luciole77

[Elementalos]

Harrow's only real problem is more a systemic one with the way shields work in the current game. Shield bypassing damage, magnetic procs destroying percentages of shields and shields being squishier because armor doesn't work all makes shields in general kind of weak, which sucks for a frame based around shielding.

Also can agree with birdobash up above that Thurible only working on personal kills is frustrating, but at the same time I understand why in its current form it'd be problematic to work on all kills.

That said even despite these issues Harrow is one of the best frames in the game, combining some good defensive utility, CC options with a couple of really nice buffs too. He works really well. 

[GinKenshin]

4 minutes ago, Luciole77 said:

He needs to be good on solo too....not only in a group. My playstyle is solo...so yes...they need to do some rework on skill 1/2

I'm sorry but not every frame should be focused on mastering every and all playstyles. If you play solo then I don't see how the frame or the game is the issue here. Use something else 

And I don't see how him being team oriented (which he isn't per say, just shines more in it) is now making him bad at solo play? Even if there isn't many enemies to cast your 1 on, you can still use your 2 to have decent duration (depending on the modding ofc) which you can heal of off, and let's not forget the immunity of his 4th, so you'll safely get back the shields you lost when you cast your 2 

How will the weapons be more fun exactly? Reload and firerate are already great buffs that make many weapons awesome and more smooth to play with 

 

[-Sentient-]

Harrow needs a rework? No

Harrow needs some tweaks? No

 

[Luciole77]

2 hours ago, -Sentient- said:

Harrow needs a rework? No

Harrow needs some tweaks? No

 

Hello god! How are you?

[-Sentient-]

Just now, Luciole77 said:

Hello god! How are you?

Good and you.

[Stygie]

3 hours ago, Luciole77 said:

is very dependent on the numbers of enemies around to use skills 1 and 2. Harrow is great with weapons that have high loading time like exergis / tigris. I think they should make some modification in these skills to be able to enjoy these weapons better and have better survival with those two skills.

Are you okay brah? Cause im not sure you play Harrow. First ability is a really good cc, second ability promotes constant dps to stay alive and facilitates it too. Thrid ability is to facilitate his entire kit and lat anility is fricking painic button that has zero down sides. Maybe you just dont know how to build him or the sequence of set up it takes to play him

[birdobash]

3 hours ago, -Sentient- said:

Harrow needs a rework? No

Harrow needs some tweaks? N̶o̶ Yes

 

I think you have a typo there

Edited January 6, 2019 by birdobash

[TKDancer]

tweaks that i'd super appreciate:

 

-thurible: pls god make it faster, i know they sped it up a bit after he was released, but this still disrupts gameplay soooo much, or the at very least make him immune to DMG or gain a ton of DR while charging it

-thurible, again: make ally kills grant AT LEAST 25% of the energy gain effect for everyone within the AoE, so that his kit isnt doomed when in a team that kills better than him

-condemn: make it faster and not travel on the ground, make it *fly* in a straight line

 

the only thing that remotely could use a rework is the way that thurible gives energy, that is, to make it give energy on hits instead of kills, tho obviously this would require lower values and a "cooldown" to prevent the ability being completely bonkers on high RoF weapons, but this isnt exactly needed so

[Gurpgork]

4 hours ago, Luciole77 said:

is very dependent on the numbers of enemies around to use skills 1 and 2.

I don’t understand why this is a problem. Condemn CCs enemies and generates a very large number of overshields. You don’t particularly need either of those things if you don’t have a lot of enemies around you. Should it fill your overshields whenever you press the button, regardless of whether you hit something or not? 

[(XBOX)Knight Raime]

On 2019-01-05 at 3:26 PM, Luciole77 said:

He needs to be good on solo too....not only in a group. My playstyle is solo...so yes...they need to do some rework on skill 1/2

He is extremely good solo.  You just haven't found the proper build.

Also I will restate what i've stated before about people wanting all kills to effect thurrible.  If his allies are consistently killing things without his help then they don't need the energy he's giving.  When/if they're out of energy then Harrow can help.  Harrow's main support for his team is his protection/crit change buff.

Though I do wish his pennance buff (rof buff) could be given to allies as well.  Beyond that my only issue with him is that his crit chance buff needs to wear off before you can recast his 4.

[Luciole77]

I still think harrow needs some rework.

[kgabor]

In what content did you use Harrow exactly?

I soloed a lot of Cetus bounties with Harrow and Lanka and had no problems.

Works great in Mot with pugs also, sorties also, ESO too if you use Maiming Strike and your cc.

Just center your build around strength, range, a little duration and Lasting Covenant and it should work for most content without problem.

[(XBOX)Skippy575]

Harrow has (arguably) one of the best kits in terms of synergy with his abilities. He doesn't need a rework at all.

[MickThejaguar]

On 2019-01-05 at 4:26 PM, Luciole77 said:

He needs to be good on solo too....not only in a group.

He's a support frame. Supports aren't meant to be used solo.

[Elementalos]

1 hour ago, MickThejaguar said:

He's a support frame. Supports aren't meant to be used solo.

Even still, he's got some nice on demand defensive options and good gun buffs. He's not going to press a button to wipe rooms but he's hardly helpless on his own either.

[TKDancer]

2 hours ago, (XB1)Skippy575 said:

Harrow has (arguably) one of the best kits in terms of synergy with his abilities.

and that synergy starts to crack the moment a single ally is added into the mix, breaks with 3 as allies killing means no energy from thurible, which makes his "ability cycle" not work properly

On 2019-01-05 at 7:43 PM, -Sentient- said:

Harrow needs some tweaks? No

nah he def needs a bit, tho general improvements to shields would also help a lot

[Andele3025]

AT WORST, harrow just needs to have Warding Thurible (and a augment for Penance) make it so that he doesnt have to do all the work to support allies (Penance augment giving allies in affinity range the lifesteal on cast instead of healing allies based on harrows lifesteal and WT letting allies get energy when they headshot a enemy or something like that).

[JohnLemon123]

Well, this is... surprising.

harrrow is arguably the apotheosis of warframe design, a shining beacon for all other frames to follow. Every part of his kit was given a clear role, and his ''gameplay loop'' of buff juggling and headshot combos has yet to be matched in either complexity or fun. Each and every one of his abilities (even his passive !) cycle into one another, resulting in the crit-worshipping pseudo-support killing machine we now have.

Is he perfect ? Not quite, as his thurible is still dependant on allies not nuking everything in the blink of an eye. But aside from that ? Yup. 

The only warframe that comes even close to him in terms of smooth, seemless synergyzing is nidus, and while nidus is undeniably more powerful, i'll argue that harrow more fun (but that's probably subjective).

On top of that, the ''lasting covenant'' augment turns him into an ungodly red-critting monster, to the point where he might out-damage the mesas and saryns (maybe).

And finally, he did the impossible : he made shields useful, by turning them into a currency. He might not be the best support in the universe, but what he loses in pure supporting potential, he makes up for with raw damage output and decent CC.

As a result, things like ''let's rework harrow'' sound about as sensible as ''let's buff mesa's 4'' or ''let's nerf nyx''. I get that harrow's survivability might get flimsy at times, but come on, he already does so many things !